Over reaction to a perceived threat

[chewa]

I was discussing my recent contretemps involving a cab driver (see Sweaty guys in tights thread) with a neighbour and said how I'd sworn at the cab driver when he tried to overtake me on the inside while we were both turning right.

My neighbour said I had inflamed the situation by swearing and that's what led to the continued argument. He had had a similar situation a few weeks ago when driving his car when he moved out of lane slightly when cornering and a motorcyclist swore and gesticulated at him.

he isn't a cyclist and I said that while driving I may have reacted more calmly, he couldn't judge because the reaction one makes is subjective. The reason i swore and got aggressive immediately is that :

a) cyclists who ride a lot (and I do 4000 plus miles a year) have to put up with careless unobservant drivers all the time,

b) the main reason is the perceived threat is higher when you have a close call on a bike (motor or push), as when you get clipped by a car in another car generally only damage to the car results, but if you get clipped on a bike, 90% of the time, it hurts.

He disagreed.

I am aware that I react more quickly when riding either my motorbike or my pushbike. Am I a hothead road rager.?:confused:

Comments?

[Harry]

Couldn't agree more...
However
It does hurt when you get a bang!
It's easier to use a big mouth to waffle rubbish about being calm!
It is a fact that personalities change when the chap is behind a steering wheel.
What I have found best is that if you make the jest you should review the situation rapidly, i.e. make sure you can get out of the way fast. If I am confrontes by a guy face to face I can live with that but being chased by a madman in a car is another story.

Keep cool
r

[velocipedio]

Originally posted by chewa
I am aware that I react more quickly when riding either my motorbike or my pushbike. Am I a hothead road rager.?:confused:
Nope. The motoring primate [thanks, Chris!] has, among many others, two great disadvantages. For one thing, his vision is greatly limited by the structure of his noxious vehicle; secondly, he is essentially deaf while driving. I thik you have internalized a reflex to yess, and consequently to swear, just so he'll hear you. The other thing is that, while riding, your senses are particularly acute, you have a high level of adrenaline in your bloodstream and your liver is releasing glycogen by the bucket. In exerting yourself, you are essentially experiencing the effects of the fight or flight impulse. In effect, you have your dander up. That's biochemistry, it's not you.

[cyclezealot]

Well then, what about when the motorized primate- screams at us at 25 milles an hour. They think their swearing or verbal tounts have any receptive capacity to the eardrum of the cyclists. Wind and surrounding noise. The sound quality at the local KFC speaker system has better sound recepetive capacity. Personally, I find the use of the extended finger to be necessary from time to time. Really stupid actions by the motoring primate, does ocassionally require a response.

[wabbit]

It annoys the crap out of me when idiot motorists hurl abuse at you and make rude gestures, but do they roll down their window or do they hear you? No! One shmuck once did that, gesturing at me to use the bike path. Of course, I couldn't explain to him that the reason I wasn't on the bike path was because it's crowded with all kind of obstacles and I was going to be turning onto another road in a block or so. Or in another case, because if I want to turn onto my street I have to stop and cut across the traffic at my own risk. But no, you don't get a chance to explain that in a civil way, and why should I have to justify myself? I'm not endangering you, I'm not stopping you, it's just that I'm not on a bike path. So I don't bother, and go on my way. Sometimes I'll say the following, (although the filter might bleep these out):

Ah, suck it raw!

**** the **** out of my %%%% you ****wad!

Eat my f**ts!

They can't hear, right?

[ljbike]

Someone once said, "Be kind to your enemies, they hate it." Basically I see all motorists as my enemy, therefore I try to be nice to them.
They rarely appreciate my efforts; so I smile and wave and give them the bird salute.
...and if words are called for, I can swear with the best of them.

To answer your particular question about being a road rager. Probably
...but you've a got lot of company.

[John E]

I try to be courteous to all other road users, but I do yell warnings out of self-defense (cagers are deaf when the windows are rolled up), and I do try to make sure they realize which of their actions put me in danger. When I am driving a car, I find that I get frustrated with other motorists, rather than with bicyclists or pedestrians, even when the latter are doing stupid things.

When someone honks at me while I am cycling, I generally just hold my lane position; I obstruct traffic flow only if I have no other safe option, such as a wide curb lane, road shoulder, or bike lane.

[velocipedio]

A couple of weeks ago, I was on a ride with one other guy. We were going along Lakeshore road in Pointe Claire. The road [which runs along the shore of a lake -- go figger] is classed as a "scenic route" and the speed limit is set at 30 km/h. Let me say that I have NEVER seen a car move at less than 40 km/h on this road.

On this occasion, we were breaking the speed limit, cruising at 37 km/h. A car zipped by us at AT LEAST 50 km/h [that is, 20 km/h over the limit]. As he passed, the driver, who had rolled-down his window, gave us the finger and yelled "get off the ****ing road!"

Henry and I decide to catch him -- this wasmade easier by the fact that he pulled into a condo project parking lot about 500m down the road. We pulled up beside him and knocked on his window -- the man was probably in his early 70s.

Henry: [In a civil voice] Sir, what was that all about?

Driver: You were in my lane. Get off the road!

Henry: You should know that we have as much legal right to be there as you do.

Driver: The roads are for cars.

Henry: You may believe that, but I suggest you reread the highway code. IN any event, you had no reason to be rude and abusive. We'd like an apology.

Driver: Get away from my car. I'll call the cops.

Me: [Perhaps in a slightly heated tone] I should point out that you were at least 20 km/h over the speed limit. We'd like you to call the cops, so we could tell them all about that.

Driver: You want trouble, I'll give you trouble -- I'll kill you.

Henry: [Noting that this was a 70ish man threatening violence against two pretty fit cyclists half his age] If you want to step out of the car and try, that's your decision, but I wouldn't advise it, sir.

Driver: [Producing darts] I'll get you [makes as if to throw one at Henry].

Henry: I suggest you think very careful about what you're threatening to do.

Me: [Tugging at Henry's sleeve] It's okay, I have his license plate number.

Henry: [As we leave] HEY! I don't EVER want to see you on my road again.

We leave.

[LittleBigMan]

Overreaction to a perceived threat?

1) The threat is real.

2) It may not be overreaction, but the normal human response to the threat of imminent danger (like perhaps, death and dismemberment.)

3) How would a car-driver react if a huge truck squeezed them off the road? Hm?

4) When will the authorities begin to protect citizens from road dangers by enforcing proper road behavior (obeying speed limits, etc.?)

5) I am much more relaxed and free on my bike than when I drive, though I admit I jump out of my skin when startled (re: Velocipedio's first point about being "pumped.")

6) It's always better not to verbally abuse people, but why is it so common on the road, though uncommon "face to face?"

:confused:

[Chris L]

Originally posted by Pete Clark
3) How would a car-driver react if a huge truck squeezed them off the road? Hm?

Now that is one that I would like to see!

Originally posted by Pete Clark

4) When will the authorities begin to protect citizens from road dangers by enforcing proper road behavior (obeying speed limits, etc.?)

Hmmm. I think I might send a few letters to a few government officials in the near future (I have abundant spare time at the moment) outlining reasons to support a zero-tolerance policy on being a dickhead (formerly known as "road rage"). Suggestions please folks!

Originally posted by Pete Clark

5) I am much more relaxed and free on my bike than when I drive, though I admit I jump out of my skin when startled (re: Velocipedio's first point about being "pumped.")

On today's 135km ride (yeah, I know, I'm a slacker) I got abused a couple of times. The thing is, while it annoyed me at first, I just rode harder for a while to calm down. The motoring primates who hurled the abuse were probably upset for ages after the exchange.

Originally posted by Pete Clark

6) It's always better not to verbally abuse people, but why is it so common on the road, though uncommon "face to face?"


One word answer "Gutlessness". It's easier when your surrounded by 500kg of smogbox than when you don't have that protection.

In saying all that, I generally avoid shouting abuse at them. I get abuse and other crap often (I ride over 15,000 km/year) and I've learned to just ignore it. On the rare occasion it gets to me, I say things quietly (no point yelling at someone who probably can't hear or understand you). I like "shove it until it bleeds!" and "get a job, ya' bludger!" (good for the young surfie types common around here).

Velocipedio -- loved the bit about "I have his licence plate #"! I wonder if he was wearing the brown underpants that day. I remember someone who tried that on me a couple of years ago, I noticed they turned down a dead-end street. I thought of following them home and shouting "I know where you live!". In the end, I simply decided they weren't worth the trouble.

[LightBoy]

Originally posted by ljbike
Someone once said, "Be kind to your enemies, they hate it." Basically I see all motorists as my enemy, therefore I try to be nice to them.
They rarely appreciate my efforts; so I smile and wave and give them the bird salute.


I think you've got something here! At the very least, he'll drive away thinking, "Wait...do I know that guy?" He'll spend the rest of the day trying to convince himself that it was not his boss or his neighbor that he flipped off.



Oh, and a technical point: the action of raising one's middle finger in an obscene gesture is called flipping someone off. Flip. Not flick. Flip.

This is also known as flipping the bird (much like the "bird salute" that ljbike uses). You flip the bird. You do not flick the bird. That is something entirely different. I knew a couple of guys that flicked the bird in high school, but they grew out of it.

I don't know where this new phrase of flicking someone off came from, but it sounds silly. It's flip. Trust me.



Of course, none of this really matters in my case anyway. As the cold has come in, I have taken to wearing PI lobster claws. Because of my lack of a middle finger, I can neither flip nor flip (whatever that means) anyone off.

[Chris L]

Originally posted by LightBoy
Because of my lack of a middle finger, I can neither flip nor flip (whatever that means) anyone off.

So which flip is that exactly, and what happened to 'flick'? This is a strange mistake for the 'netiquette' police to make ;)

[LightBoy]

Originally posted by Chris L


So which flip is that exactly, and what happened to 'flick'? This is a strange mistake for the 'netiquette' police to make ;)


AAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!

As always, I can count on my stupid mistakes being aprehended. Thank you Chris.

Of course, now I am left with the question of whether or not to fix it. If I fix it, the original post will make sense, bit not these. I think I'll leave it as it is.

The comment should read, "Because of my lack of a middle finger, I can neither flip nor flick..." It doesn't, because I am a putz.

Of course, this shouldn't surprise anybody. :)

[Richard D]

I'm trying very hard to smile nicely at stupid/agressive motorists I'm finding it does occasionally provoke a look of guilt, however it's hard and I did gesture obscenely when a driver tried to persuade me to use a dangerous bike path...

I try to be good it does generally seem to work better...

Richard

[LightBoy]

While out taking advantage of the unseasonably warm December, I encountered more than fair share of people that didn't think I should be there. My biggest mistake was probably riding through downtown right after the Vikings game, since downtown is usually a pretty sticky plae to ride anyway, and this time it was really, REALLY crowded (67,000 people all leaving the same building at the same time, and headed for the same freeways!).

I twice gave someone a good thump on their hood when they were edging me off the road, within a mile of eachother. No gersture of any kind was needed though. The looks on their faces were priceless.
(I also saw a driver waiting to cross at an intersection. There were two peds crossing to his right, and he was looking left and edging forward. He almost hit the guys, one's swift kick to the car's bumper got the man's attention. They exchanges words, but I didn't hear them. I'm betting that's pay-per-view materiel though - "Stupid motorist vs. Drunken football fans, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday!!!"

Earlier on the same ride, somewhere in that great void between Minneapolis and St Paul, a woman in a large pick-up truck honked at me from behind. Granted, I was going slower than the 30 mph limit, but I was on the shoulder, a full 3 feet off of her lane. She was screaming something as she sped by, and since her voice was muffled by her smog box, I could only assume it to be a challenge. I did the only logical thing - I kicked it into the big ring and caught up with her. When I pulled up beside her at a traffic light, I flashed a big friendly grin and waved. I think she was less than pleased.

And people wonder why I love this...

Ha!

[Chris L]

I got tailgated for about 2km this morning. Obviously there is someone out there with too much time on their hands.

[chewa]

Originally posted by latakiahaze
I'm trying very hard to smile nicely at stupid/agressive motorists I'm finding it does occasionally provoke a look of guilt, however it's hard and I did gesture obscenely when a driver tried to persuade me to use a dangerous bike path...

I try to be good it does generally seem to work better...

Richard

I know what you mean, and I try too, but find that I don't have a "fight or flight " reaction when I get an adrenaline rush following a near accident. I'm one of the unfortunates who has a "fight, flight and swear like a f*****g trooper" reaction :)

[chewa]

As an update for those interested. I've had 2 letters from the council. the first said they had investigated my contretemps with the taxi driver by asking for his side of things. Not surprisingly, his view differed from mine!, so they weren't going to take it further.

i replied by asking if they had spoken to the witness. they said they'd check.

This morning I got a letter confirming they had spoken to the witness and that the matter was now being referred to a formal hearing at which I and the taxi driver would attend.

the worrying thing is that they say my identity will be made known to him. Should i be scared?

[JonR]

Originally posted by chewa

the worrying thing is that they say my identity will be made known to him. Should i be scared?
I can see why you might be scared, but it won't do any good, so try not to be, and remember that you're doing the correct thing here. Sometimes people do have changes of heart, so maybe at the hearing the taxi driver will suddenly see the error of his ways (though in all likelihood he knew that error even while he was committing it).

[Richard D]

Originally posted by chewa


the worrying thing is that they say my identity will be made known to him. Should i be scared?

No, just go along wearing your kilt :)

Richard

[chewa]

Yeah that's the idea. let him insult me now. Where's my woad?

By the way, why did it take 6 weeks for me to get my kilt, but Robbie Wiliams got 4 made at the same shop overnight!!!!

[JonR]

Originally posted by chewa
Yeah that's the idea. let him insult me now. Where's my woad?

By the way, why did it take 6 weeks for me to get my kilt, but Robbie Wiliams got 4 made at the same shop overnight!!!!
They took extra care with yours because you're not just a flashy soon-to-be-forgotten celeb but a real person. ;)

[John E]

Originally posted by Richard D
No, just go along wearing your kilt.

Clan tartans -- the original gang colours!

[bikehard700]

I have had motorists make a right(U.S. rules), just ahead of my path, to which I "T-boned" the rear quarter panel, and didn't stop till I hit the pavement, upside down. I have had things thrown at me from the windows of passing motorists.
I have had dogs barking from the windows and pick-up truck beds... and the ones I jesture ALWAYS... the motorists who think it is a good thing to blast the horn 3 feet from behind you, as a warning they are about to pass.
Over reactive towards agressive motorists... not possible.:mad:

I jesture and swear from behind the wheel at agressive motorists as well... but never at the brother/sisterhood of fellow cyclist, unless of coarse they are riding on the wrong side of the rode, at night without lights, weaving through traffic, skipping re lights and stop signs, and any other action which depicts an ignorant and dangerous light on said brother/sisterhood.:irritated

My other car is a Cannondale.:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

[aerobat]

I wouldn't be too worried chewa, remember, he's probably thinking the same thing!

What I would do, is write everything down, so in the heat of the moment, you will be consistent and accurate in your account of what happened.

Good luck :thumbup: