Foo - I Love Japan. Do you?

Reminded of this every time I hit up the St. Marks (NYU's artsy Asian women heavenly hangout scene)

NOTE: Not sure if I posted this before...felt like I did, but I don't see it.

Never been there.

Yes.

<--- Avatar is me having fun in Japan. Lots of memories like this :)

Japan was loads of fun! I had lots of great childhood memories there too :D

One of the best vacations I've had. Interesting place to visit.

I haven't been there yet, but the trip's in the works.

vacation spot? sure.
would I live there? hell no.

would I live there? hell no.

Out of curiosity, why? I am still considering this (albeit not as strongly as previously).

Out of curiosity, why? I am still considering this (albeit not as strongly as previously).

living costs (medicare not entirely free for instance), xenophobia, mental stress from society leading to psychosis ie (http://mdn.mainichi.jp/national/news/20080611p2a00m0na019000c.html), north korea, cults like SGI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C5%8Dka_Gakkai_International), political and mass media scum/corruption even worse than USA, flu from china every year, many earthquakes and typhoons, cultural attitudes are not the same as the ones you'd expect from western cultures, overcrowding, national issues that politicians don't have an answer for or they fail to do anything, nationalists which cause more problems than solve.

Other than those, which only have an influence if you live there for a long time, I think it's a way better place since it's peaceful, only the yakuza, police and JDF have guns, not too many gang related turf wars, police are competent and can be relied upon, comedy TV shows are 10 years ahead, small device electronics are 5 years ahead, and you can still get most of your favorite american movies and TV dramas, nice selection of electronics to buy, public transit will get you anywhere, public transit is on time all the time, you can go from a climate like Florida, USA to British Columbia, Canada in much less distance and sea food is always fresh with a ton of variety.

It's just that I find the demerits of Canada to be more attractive than Japan as a place to live.

Out of curiosity, why? I am still considering this (albeit not as strongly as previously).

Well, here's a list of pros and cons, based on what my parents say and what I remember about our stay there:

Pros:
very good social support system; going to the hospital is free/very cheap
Japanese food! You will learn to eat healthier when you're there.
Good public transportation system, not just within cities, but between them (the shinkansen? It rules!)
Everybody walks/bikes everywhere.
Schools are top-notch.
People are generally very, very polite, nice, and helpful.
The cute stuff. You can't beat the Kerokeroppi face masks and Hello Kitty everything.
If you plan to teach, watch out for Kancho. Really.


Cons:
Takai! Zembu takai! (expensive, for those of you who don't know Japanese)
Crowded in some places *coughTokyocough* but if you live in a smaller and less central city, this is not much of a problem.
Even where it's not crowded, big houses are not the norm.
It is not well known, but Japanese people are rather gossipy. They won't do it to your face though, and even if they gossip about you, they'll still generally be polite and nice to you.
It's hard to find foreign food and ingredients in some places, so if you suddenly get the craving for...I dunno, meatloaf or something...be prepared to pay through the nose for it.
Foreigners are looked down upon...it goes like this: Japanese people>Foreigners who speak Japanese>Foreigners who don't speak Japanese
No matter how long you stay there, you will never never never never EVER be a citizen.

Be advised though, this list is based on late 1980's to mid 1990's...lots of things will have changed, but a lot stays the same too.

living costs (medicare not entirely free for instance), xenophobia, mental stress from society leading to psychosis ie (http://mdn.mainichi.jp/national/news/20080611p2a00m0na019000c.html), north korea, cults like SGI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C5%8Dka_Gakkai_International), political and mass media scum/corruption even worse than USA, flu from china every year, many earthquakes and typhoons, cultural attitudes are not the same as the ones you'd expect from western cultures, overcrowding, national issues that politicians don't have an answer for or they fail to do anything, nationalists which cause more problems than solve.

Other than those, which only have an influence if you live there for a long time, I think it's a way better place since it's peaceful, only the yakuza, police and JDF have guns, not too many gang related turf wars, police are competent and can be relied upon, comedy TV shows are 10 years ahead, small device electronics are 5 years ahead, and you can still get most of your favorite american movies and TV dramas, nice selection of electronics to buy, public transit will get you anywhere, public transit is on time all the time, you can go from a climate like Florida, USA to British Columbia, Canada in much less distance and sea food is always fresh with a ton of variety.

It's just that I find the demerits of Canada to be more attractive than Japan as a place to live.

well ... you live in canada ... no brainer why you would not move to japan

Really interesting...

Is it true that foreigners (particularly those that don't speak Japanese) are treated like gold while visiting, but are treated pretty badly when their stay is longer??

Really interesting...

Is it true that foreigners (particularly those that don't speak Japanese) are treated like gold while visiting, but are treated pretty badly when their stay is longer??

Well...think of it like those Latino people here who don't speak English even if they've been here a long time. They find it harder to assimilate, to communicate, etc. Same over there, but more so.

Hai!

Hai!

http://lollost815.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/oh-hai-by-kali.jpg

Pros:

Japanese food! You will learn to eat healthier when you're there.
Translation: Meat is prohibitively expensive.

Good public transportation system, not just within cities, but between them (the shinkansen? It rules!)
Translation: Noone can afford a car and a place to park it.

Everybody walks/bikes everywhere.
Translation: Noone can afford a car and a place to park it.

Schools are top-notch.
Translation: Your kid will have no childhood; he will be studying 24/7.

People are generally very, very polite, nice, and helpful.
Translation: People won't look at you when they speak to you.

The cute stuff. You can't beat the Kerokeroppi face masks and Hello Kitty everything.
Translation: Everything is sooo saccharine.

If you plan to teach, watch out for Kancho. Really.
Translation: With all the time they spend studying, the Japanese never have a chance to learn to behave as adults.

Well, I mostly prefer the Japanese women, but to each his own.
I don't like living in an American city, so it's likely I wouldn't live in a Japanese city either. Most cities have congestion problems, and I'd rather avoid them, even at the expense of a bit of added distance.

Pros:

Japanese food! You will learn to eat healthier when you're there.
Translation: Meat is prohibitively expensive.

Good public transportation system, not just within cities, but between them (the shinkansen? It rules!)
Translation: Noone can afford a car and a place to park it.

Everybody walks/bikes everywhere.
Translation: Noone can afford a car and a place to park it.

Schools are top-notch.
Translation: Your kid will have no childhood; he will be studying 24/7.

People are generally very, very polite, nice, and helpful.
Translation: People won't look at you when they speak to you.

The cute stuff. You can't beat the Kerokeroppi face masks and Hello Kitty everything.
Translation: Everything is sooo saccharine.

If you plan to teach, watch out for Kancho. Really.
Translation: With all the time they spend studying, the Japanese never have a chance to learn to behave as adults.

Oops, Kancho should've been under the cons...:lol:

But well, everything is personal. I see those things as good, you see them as bad. YMMV

edit: I had an awesome childhood in Japan--it's a myth that they study 24/7 and they have no fun.

I have zero problem with individual Japanese. Most that I've met I've liked very much, and I've met others I do not care for. Pretty much the same as with any other group of people.

But as a society . . . . Let's not forget that these are the folks who brought us the **** of Nanking, "Comfort Women," the Bataan Death March, and using live civilians and captured soldiers for bayonet practice and other tortures. These were not isolated incidents, they were official policy.

Let's also not forget that the Japanese have actively refused to face up to any of these perversions ever since. (The Germans have done far, far more to come to grips with their Nazi past.) As of about five years ago, Japanese high school history text books devoted about one sentence to Pearl Harbor, nothing to Nanking or other abuses in China -- and pages to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They are still trying to teach their their children that Japan is the victim of WWII instead one of the aggressors in it. There are millions of Chinese, British, American, Dutch, Korean, Australian, New Zealander, French, Vietnamese, Burmese, Cambodian, Laotion and other peoples who would beg to differ - assuming they survived the treatment they received to still have a voice.

Japanese society is still racist and misogynistic in a way that the average American would find both embarrassing and repulsive. There is a tremendous amoount about Japan and its people to admire. There is also plenty that is, at best, unsavory.

I will make up my mind about individual Japanese as I meet them. I have every confidence that I will find most to be enjoyable people, as has been the case up to now. You'll excuse me, however, if I keep a weather eye on the Japanese nation.

Fun to visit and at 5'8" I can finally feel tall

Pros:

The cute stuff. You can't beat the Kerokeroppi face masks and Hello Kitty everything.


Not everyone would consider that a pro...I hate seeing hello kitty stuff everywhere here (we have a LARGE contingent of Japaneses people visiting for ski season/prolonged stay) I couldn't image it in a place where people actually like it.

Like most places on earth, I would love to visit but would likely not want to live there.

I've asked all of the Asian women I've dated why Asian women love Hello Kitty so much, and I have yet to get an answer.

A long time ago when I was young and stupid (still young, but not as stupid), my first girlfriend was Filipino, but I just assumed that she was like most Asian women I knew at the time and got her a Hello Kitty wallet as a gift.

She hated it, but used it anyway. Cracked on me for that ever since.

I really liked my 11 months there (Okinawa serving with the Marines).

Even though I was in an area that had every right to be anti-American, or at least cautious of Americans, and I didn't know hardly any Japanese, I found it easier to get around and get along than in some unfamiliar American areas.

There were cultural differences I had to be aware of, and I suspect that there were other cultural issues where I was an ugly American, and simply plowed over their sensibilities, but not nearly as much as some of the other servicemen I saw there.

I was out walking through a town with another Marine once, and he went into a small market and asked the owner to trade his warm beer for a cold one, without compensating the owner, or buying anything in the store. The store owner did so... I felt embarrassed, and I know it hurt the image of Americans. I now wish I had stepped in and bought something at the store as a courtesy to make up for it, but I was dumb myself and just felt shame instead of acting.

Oh well, anyway, I agree, as an American, I would find it hard to live there, but it was fun for my short visits when I was away from the base. I did live a little way off base.

I've asked all of the Asian women I've dated why Asian women love Hello Kitty so much, and I have yet to get an answer.

A long time ago when I was young and stupid (still young, but not as stupid), my first girlfriend was Filipino, but I just assumed that she was like most Asian women I knew at the time and got her a Hello Kitty wallet as a gift.

She hated it, but used it anyway. Cracked on me for that ever since.

I uh...my name is Nekohime and I'm a Hello Kitty addict.:o Well, not really, but I like her a lot even if she's so farking pink. It has to do with the fact that she's a cat. And kawaii. Her cheeks are so squishable. :thumb::lol:

Pass me a James Patterson love novel. I almost had a chick flick moment. :twitchy:

I have zero problem with individual Japanese. Most that I've met I've liked very much, and I've met others I do not care for. Pretty much the same as with any other group of people.

But as a society . . . . Let's not forget that these are the folks who brought us the **** of Nanking, "Comfort Women," the Bataan Death March, and using live civilians and captured soldiers for bayonet practice and other tortures. These were not isolated incidents, they were official policy.

Let's also not forget that the Japanese have actively refused to face up to any of these perversions ever since. (The Germans have done far, far more to come to grips with their Nazi past.) As of about five years ago, Japanese high school history text books devoted about one sentence to Pearl Harbor, nothing to Nanking or other abuses in China -- and pages to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They are still trying to teach their their children that Japan is the victim of WWII instead one of the aggressors in it. There are millions of Chinese, British, American, Dutch, Korean, Australian, New Zealander, French, Vietnamese, Burmese, Cambodian, Laotion and other peoples who would beg to differ - assuming they survived the treatment they received to still have a voice.

Japanese society is still racist and misogynistic in a way that the average American would find both embarrassing and repulsive. There is a tremendous amoount about Japan and its people to admire. There is also plenty that is, at best, unsavory.

I will make up my mind about individual Japanese as I meet them. I have every confidence that I will find most to be enjoyable people, as has been the case up to now. You'll excuse me, however, if I keep a weather eye on the Japanese nation.

It's run by nationalistic old men who have no idea what the current young generation is like.

The history text book thing wasn't nation wide, in fact it made headlines on national news with some integrity, saying it was a mockery of Japan as it stands now.
Apologizing to the victims of Nanking, China... Too much political turmoil, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. Apologizing to a highly nationalistic, brain washed country like China... Sadly, it'll only turn into appeasement. I still think it's better to try your hardest and fail than not try at all.
Japan is as misogynistic as America is homophobic, that is to say, it's not nationwide.

See, like I said, nationalist scum that cause more problems than solve.

Two things I would like to say.
"The crimes of your ancestors are not the crimes of their children."
"Do not feed your hatred into your children, your hatred will be with them forever."

Lived in Iwakuni for a year.. enjoyed it for that year but I was very ready to get out of there at the end. I think those before me have got it pretty much dead right. I have never met a more polite racist bunch of folks.

I was out walking through a town with another Marine once, and he went into a small market and asked the owner to trade his warm beer for a cold one, without compensating the owner, or buying anything in the store. The store owner did so... I felt embarrassed, and I know it hurt the image of Americans.

Does anyone do this in America either? I've never heard of such a thing, and I would consider it rude if I ever saw it, even if the person did buy something else.

The cute stuff. Hello Kitty everything.

but that’s because you’re a cat princess.:D:D

I’ve been mostly in Japan for over a year and a half now and really like it. Friendly and tolerant people (my being fluent in Japanese now helps a great deal and I find if you treat people with kindness and respect you get it back), great healthy food, great jazz clubs, a fun and strange club scene in Tokyo, typical bike messenger culture that’s interesting to interact with at times, the world’s best handmade art paper makers, an amazing art culture (from ancient to contemporary) and beautiful old shrines and temples that give you a strong sense of wonderful spiritualism. Walking, biking, buses and trains can very easily be the norm for quickly getting around.

I spent most my weekends the first spring/summer bike touring by myself all over Japan. Beautiful scenery, lots of eye orgasms, and never any problems. Riding all day and finding an unexpected hot springs to soak in is a great pleasure. There are powerful breaks to surf in Chiba and Kyushu has great hiking, bike touring and secluded beaches with consistent breaks to surf. In the winter there are lots of good skiing areas. At Zao you can night ski and then soak in one of many secluded natural hot springs.

it can be expensive if you’re not careful but I’m frugal and get along just fine. Learn at least some of the language and people, like everywhere, will really appreciate the effort and be helpful.

Sometimes it rains too much for me…but I’m from Southern Cal



Two things I would like to say.
"The crimes of your ancestors are not the crimes of their children."
"Do not feed your hatred into your children, your hatred will be with them forever."
true

I took Japanese at the Japan Society here in New York last summer. Was intent on doing it again, but my commute makes that impossible, and my money's going straight to my new bike.

I do have the textbooks, and I do remember some phrases to get by. Forgot most of my ひらがな and カタカナ though, and don't even get me started on 感じ...

I am a Hamakko.

Few things I remember while growing up:
-placing stones on trolly tracks
-the corner okonomiyaki-ya
-playing kick the can at the otera
-looting a home completely destroyed by a landslide
-the old man with the kami-shibai
-bon-odori
-Led Zeppelin at the Budoukan
-etc...

I am a Hamakko.

Few things I remember while growing up:
-placing stones on trolly tracks
-the corner okonomiyaki-ya
-playing kick the can at the otera
-looting a home completely destroyed by a landslide
-the old man with the kami-shibai
-bon-odori
-Led Zeppelin at the Budoukan
-etc...

Okonomiyaki! But my favorite food related memories were the yakitori lady who had a streetside stand near our apartment, and the yaki-imo guy who carried a cart full of steaming yams around during fall and winter. Mmmm, cravings...

Ah...childhood memories... Didja have to go through shichi-go-san? My mum made me and my lil sis do it (I was shichi, she was san). I remember sitting still for hours and crying while a lady did my hair (she was pulling, dammit!!), and complaining about having to pose for portraits. But it was so fun being dressed up in the shrine!

Okonomiyaki for the win! Though greasy like no other, it's pretty amazing stuff. My boy Eric made some of that with some special fried chicken (the batter was special; don't remember what it was made of), and it was amazing.

I then learned that it's not good to drink any beer when a) riding your bike and when b) your stomach is empty and c) you're with a ton of people in a crowded apartment. Keeping up a conversation that night was really interesting, but I didn't get drunk :)

Sorry I can't share the finer moments of old throwbacks in Japan. I can share with you some lovely stories of being a poor lil kid in Brooklyn though!

Actually, the corner okonomiyaki-ya was a toy/hobby shop with a single grill and table tucked away at the corner of the shop.
The mobile ramen guy pulling the cart and blowing that horn in the middle of the night used to creep me out.

And of course, how can I forget the yaki-imo......same old guy doing his thing year after year.

it's variable, but based on my 6 visits to Yokohama and Tokyo...

the ramen and udon noodles are amazing

the unagi is unbelievable

the people are incredibly courteous and honest

you don't have to worry about crime (too much)

you can buy anything in multiple colors, sizes, etc.

but...

it takes forever to get anywhere distant

the rainy season has horrible humidity...

One of my favorite little memories of things not found in the states...

I could go down back allies and feel like I was in the middle of nowhere and find vending machines with things I never saw in vending machines here like batteries or drinks... and not just soft drinks, but unusual (to me) juices. My favorite was a mandarin orange drink with little tear drop shaped pieces of pulp in it, it was a drink you could chug, but to enjoy it you had to chew it to burst the little pockets of pulp for full effect.

I have found similar drinks in the states in ethnic sections of markets, but they just don't seem as good as the ones I got in Japan.

I have also in the past few years started to see a few vending machines with some juices etc here, but never a randomly placed one like I saw there.

Does anyone do this in America either? I've never heard of such a thing, and I would consider it rude if I ever saw it, even if the person did buy something else.

I have to admit it is the first and last time I had ever seen anyone do anything like that...

Exchanging a cold beer for a warm beer is something I would have never considered. In fact, I am more the sort, that if I had a warm beer, I would probably find someone with an ice chest and give it to them, since I wouldn't want to carry it around... of course, I have never been much of a beer drinker anyeway.

Well, I mostly prefer the Japanese women, but to each his own.
I don't like living in an American city, so it's likely I wouldn't live in a Japanese city either. Most cities have congestion problems, and I'd rather avoid them, even at the expense of a bit of added distance.

that's another reason! assless asians! blich!

One of my favorite little memories of things not found in the states...

I could go down back allies and feel like I was in the middle of nowhere and find vending machines with things I never saw in vending machines here like batteries or drinks... and not just soft drinks, but unusual (to me) juices. My favorite was a mandarin orange drink with little tear drop shaped pieces of pulp in it, it was a drink you could chug, but to enjoy it you had to chew it to burst the little pockets of pulp for full effect.

I have found similar drinks in the states in ethnic sections of markets, but they just don't seem as good as the ones I got in Japan.

I have also in the past few years started to see a few vending machines with some juices etc here, but never a randomly placed one like I saw there.

Yes! Pulpy C!!! (and variations thereof) :beer:

I used to wander around Tokyo as a kid, just walking from vending machine to vending machine looking for new drinks. Some of my best discoveries included one called "Shpla!" (on the Almond corner in Roppongi) and "Sparkl'g Beatnic" (either in Nakameguro or Ochanomizu... can't quite remember). As I wandered around looking for vending machines, I would discover really cool neighbourhoods and areas that I wouldn't have otherwise found. A strange hobby, but it was really fun to explore, and even as a kid I never had to worry about wandering through a city of 20+ million. :)

I'm sure it would be different visiting there for fun, but in general I haven't enjoyed going there for work. Unfortunately, at least in the business world, it is still quite a racist and sexist society.

I also pretty much starve there as it is virtually impossible to find anything vegetarian besides fruit.

I'm sure it would be different visiting there for fun, but in general I haven't enjoyed going there for work. Unfortunately, at least in the business world, it is still quite a racist and sexist society.

I also pretty much starve there as it is virtually impossible to find anything vegetarian besides fruit.

There are lots of good macrobiotic, vegetarian and vegan restaurants in Japan.

There are actually lots of good guide books. I got this (book) (http://www.childrenofthecarrot.info/) among others at one of the Junkudo bookstores in Kyoto when I first got here. It helped at first when I would go to Tokyo and wanted a restaurant. I eat fish but also stay vegetarian for awhile at times ( M’s a vegetarian) with no problems finding all I could ever want somewhere close. It just took a little time to find where things were. You can always come to Kyoto and M and I will fix you a great vegetarian meal.:)

I know the male thing you’re talking about. The company we partnered with is run by a wise and respected woman though and that helps a lot.

Sweet local just picked loquats are great to find on a country weekend ride.:)

Natsukashii! I was an AET English teacher there for 2 yrs (1996-8) in a technical high school. I'd say pretty much all the pros and cons people mentioned are true to some extent.

Have you ever seen those takoyaki videos? Takoyaki song: http://youtube.com/watch?v=ic_MxDRRNn4 I have been thinking about getting a takoyaki maker for years!

Also, I don't know how widespread it was (or if it is still done) but in the village I lived in on Okinawa in 1980/81, in the morning and evening a loudspeaker would broadcast a man's voice... obviously recorded, as it was the same two routines (one in the morning, and one in the evening) that seemed to be the morning and evening exercises for the residents... I forget now what time it came on, but I worked swing shift on base most of my time there, so I usually awoke to the sounds of the morning exercise/wakeup audio...

Only a few minutes, and I don't really recall if it was played on the weekends or not. And I only occasionally heard the evening "broadcast" since I was at work in the evening... so maybe it was only during the week.

Did you guys know that Gamera is a friend to small children?

There are lots of good macrobiotic, vegetarian and vegan restaurants in Japan.

There are actually lots of good guide books. I got this (book) (http://www.childrenofthecarrot.info/) among others at one of the Junkudo bookstores in Kyoto when I first got here. It helped at first when I would go to Tokyo and wanted a restaurant. I eat fish but also stay vegetarian for awhile at times ( M’s a vegetarian) with no problems finding all I could ever want somewhere close. It just took a little time to find where things were. You can always come to Kyoto and M and I will fix you a great vegetarian meal.:)

I know the male thing you’re talking about. The company we partnered with is run by a wise and respected woman though and that helps a lot.

Sweet local just picked loquats are great to find on a country weekend ride.:)

Thanks kaotikgrl, that's a really nice offer. :)

I'm not scheduled to go back anytime soon, but I'll PM you if I find myself heading there.

And yes, I realize that there are a fair number of vegan restaurants when you get to Kyoto and other areas outside of the main business districts, but unfortunately I usually have to go to business dinners with colleagues and customers, and typically only in the big business districts in Tokyo or Osaka. It's hard even conveying the idea of a vegan diet to them. And since I can't read ingredient labels in Japanese, I can't even buy much food in a store, which is what I would typically do in Europe.

I think those before me have got it pretty much dead right. I have never met a more polite racist bunch of folks.


You ain't never been to GA then, huh?:)

You ain't never been to GA then, huh?:)

At least they would still consider you a citizen if you were born there, though.

At least they would still consider you a citizen if you were born there, though.


Good point. I was just promoting our polite and fair antibellum society, Mr. Weeks.


Have a good day now, hear?:)

now you have to have a 36.6 inch or less waist to live there. :p on them. i'm probably healthier than most of 'em with my 42 incher.

Yes! Pulpy C!!! (and variations thereof) :beer:

I used to wander around Tokyo as a kid, just walking from vending machine to vending machine looking for new drinks. Some of my best discoveries included one called "Shpla!" (on the Almond corner in Roppongi) and "Sparkl'g Beatnic" (either in Nakameguro or Ochanomizu... can't quite remember). As I wandered around looking for vending machines, I would discover really cool neighbourhoods and areas that I wouldn't have otherwise found. A strange hobby, but it was really fun to explore, and even as a kid I never had to worry about wandering through a city of 20+ million. :)

My hobby was going around the vending machines looking for spare change. I almost always found them in the beer vending machines. All those drunk men forgetting their change. :lol: