Road Bike Racing - ethics/tactics question number 5 (or is it 6?)

You're in a break, you're winded, you take a break and sit in.

Everyone is fine with it, apart from one guy.

That guy starts shouting, you tell him to STFU and ride.

Once you start working again, you notice that chatterbox is sitting on too long, and once he takes his pull, he flicks his arm immediately.

You tell him, in no uncertain terms, that the flick is premature. You then hound him. He tells you to STFU, but eventually takes proper pulls.

Is trash talking an acceptable form of communication, and after the race, is it a case of 'what happens in the break, stays in the break'?

Trash talking is fine, even encouraged...especially for those who don't #$*&ing take their pull.

Hmm....what happens in the break stays in the break? Good question.

Too much talking, I'm going back to the pack to save my energy for when we reel you wind bags in.

Perfectly legitimate strategy for Cat 4 where breaks almost never succeed anyway.

i think it stays in break. 3 weeks ago in a break, one guy could/wouldn't pull through in our paceline. my friend on rival team gave him earful re: be the group or ***** off. the dude didn't ( it appeared) have the fitness to be there. we tried gapping him, he somehow latched back on. he was finally dropped 5 miles from finish. it's never personal, it just slows the break down.
the only time i might say something afterwards might be in a 6 man rotation and dude skips pulls altogether for half the race but then sprints and snags a podium, and that would a casual "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice.." kinda thing.

Too much talking, I'm going back to the pack to save my energy for when we reel you wind bags in.

Perfectly legitimate strategy for Cat 4 where breaks almost never succeed anyway.

maybe in cali. that cat 4 RR strategy would fail in Ohio 8 or 9 out of 10 times, at least this year

maybe in cali. that cat 4 RR strategy would fail in Ohio 8 or 9 out of 10 times, at least this year
Makes sense, since we have almost no road races here in So Cal. :(

Makes sense, since we have almost no road races here in So Cal. :(

sucks to be you. :D

sucks to be you. :D

Florida's had a dry spell of road races this year too. :(

Florida's had a dry spell of road races this year too. :(

yeah well, who would want to live in florida, other than senior citizens, or lunatic right wing cuban exiles? ;)

You are duty-bound to harangue the other riders in the break to get them to work. Call them "ladies". Question their ancestry. Whip them like a leased Pontiac. Whatever it takes, really.

But you always find them after the race and smooth things over.

And for the record, this is E.Q.#5.

You are duty-bound to harangue the other riders in the break to get them to work. Call them "ladies". Question their ancestry. Whip them like a leased Pontiac. Whatever it takes, really.

But you always find them after the race and smooth things over.

i didn't bother to smooth things over with the kid. he shouldn't been there anyway. :D

I suppose it depends on how serious the trash talking gets, and how long it lasts, and if it achieved the desired result. It's not really a black and white issue, with a yes or no answer.

All that being said, I say Yes it's acceptable, and Yes what happened should stay on the road. :P

Hm, I prefer non-verbal communication. Pop them off the break if they're not working.

You are duty-bound to harangue the other riders in the break to get them to work. Call them "ladies". Question their ancestry. Whip them like a leased Pontiac. Whatever it takes, really.

But you always find them after the race and smooth things over.

yep.

verbal motivation goes 2 ways. If you're the one being verbally motivated, make sure you respond on your own terms.

IMO - what goes on during the race, should stay in the race. Make peace afterwards, you'll probably cross paths again.

I've been in a break with a guy giving me a hard time one day, then we're in a break together the next day working like we're wearing the same kit. It all stays in the break.

Hey, yelling is all about psychology, which is a big part of racing. It keeps everyone honest and you can also use it to your advantage to "cheat". For example, if you can convince a guy (usually a noob) he's being a klingon and not doing any work and he falls for it, more power to you.

A variation on the psychology thing is to pant like a dog so everyone thinks you are dying. They are much less likely to cane you into pulling and you can get a rest, especially right before the final sprint, with the added advantage that people think you are wasted and you won't be marked for the final sprint.

Dont have a problem at all with trash talk. The more he yells the more I gap him off the back, every pull.

Hey, yelling is all about psychology, which is a big part of racing.

I will buy you a beer.


... pant like a dog so everyone thinks you are dying.... people think you are wasted and you won't be marked for the final sprint.

Go see Ethics Question #1. They were ready to shoot people for doing this, and other old school things.

Trash talk; Water, duck. Water, duck.

No need to apologize.

I disagree about questioning either the gender or lineage of people as part of trash talk. Keep it about the race. You'll probably see each other again soon so, if it didn't get personal, it can work itself out on the road. No biggie.

Hm, I prefer non-verbal communication. Pop them off the break if they're not working.

I'm not really into yapping a lot in breaks. I do my work and concentrate on my race. If someone is f******** that up by dogging it I tend to give them the benefit of the doubt for at least a couple of pulls (if they're even pulling through at all): a guy could be gassed -- which should be evident on his face; he could have bridged up to the break and therefore have earned some time to sit in; he could have a sprinter back in the pack and he's just covering the break and trying to slow it down.

I find if you treat a guy with respect you tend to get it in return. So if a guy is really not gassed or covering the break then I just ask him straight up "what's going on, you tired?" You'll usually get an honest response or shame him into doing more work. The negative way only creates acrimony, less cooperation, less opportunity for the break, and an ongoing feud at the rest of your local races. Remember sometime in the future you might be gassed and need time in the break to sit in. Tit for tat. If a guy really is f******* around and not working then absolutely, put him in the wind repeatedly, and if that doesn't work then pop him off the back. Lots of ways to do that. Trash talking only makes you look like an ass and gives you a bad rep in the long run.

When are you guys gonna learn that there is no such thing as ethics when it comes to a human contest. If it's not in the rules, it's "ethical."

I'm all for some good natured poking in the ribs. If either side is taking it too seriously then there's an issue.

You're in a break, you're winded, you take a break and sit in.

Everyone is fine with it, apart from one guy.

That guy starts shouting, you tell him to STFU and ride.

Once you start working again, you notice that chatterbox is sitting on too long, and once he takes his pull, he flicks his arm immediately.

You tell him, in no uncertain terms, that the flick is premature. You then hound him. He tells you to STFU, but eventually takes proper pulls.

Is trash talking an acceptable form of communication, and after the race, is it a case of 'what happens in the break, stays in the break'?

Acceptable. Doesn't stay in the break.

Is trash talking an acceptable form of communication(?)

It is a form of bullying. It works well against the weak, but can backfire against the strong.


And after the race, is it a case of 'what happens in the break, stays in the break'?

My Gawd YES! A successful break may require some very strange "bedfellows". There can be repercussions "down the road", so to speak. ;)