I just need ONE folding bike

[jur]

At the moment, my garage is cluttered with 7 folding bikes, and 2 more are in the pipeline. I am actively planning to sell two.

Lately I have become disenchanted by the maintenance aspect of too many bikes. I spend a LOT of time tinkering, adjusting, lubing, cleaning, upgrading, patching, pumping, washing, lubing, surfing for upgrades, investigating, manufacturing, drooling, upgrading, staring, lubing, cleaning.... you get the picture. All I need to do is move my bed into the garage.

So I am beginning to lean to the idea of just having one folding bike. I'd like to walk into my garage, grab the bike and be off on my commute / loaded tour / fast road ride / slow pootle / mixed-mode commute / city trip with required compact folding.

The big question is, which one?

I have the following bikes:
8+kg 20" Swift 9sp XT for fast rides and perhaps touring.
16+kg 20" Raleigh Twenty 8sp SA for commuting and perhaps touring.
12kg approx 16" Downtube Mini 8sp SA for fun jaunts and perhaps light touring.
[unknown heavy]kg 16" Da Bike (Dahon Classic) 5sp derailer (getting ready to be sold)
11kg 20" Yeah YRA062 9sp XT (Dahon Helios-like)
12kg approx 20" Eska with NOS 2sp Sachs Torpedo Duomatic (getting ready to be sold)
12kg+ 20" Pacific reach Offroad (SWMBO's)

What I'd like is a fast, light, small folding, bike which can do all of the above. But from experience I know I have to have 2 backup bikes for commuting - it has hapened more than once that 2 bikes were out of action at the same time. So, 3 bikes in total. They have to be fairly equivalent.

* The Swift, although it has a small folded footprint, is still a big-looking object if bagged to be brought on a bus. But it is FAST, easily holding its own among roadies (which is mostly dependent on rider anyway), but has the benefit I don't have to perch it on a roof rack or bike rack to take it to road rides. Just fold and go. The Swift is probably close to being my only bike. But I am a little doubtful about its loaded touring capabilities. How strong is the frame? Can it pack a load? The gearing range would probably have to increase for touring. A Schlumpf bottom bracket is a likely candidate, or alternatively a 9sp iMotion SRAM hub gear. Lamentably, I would lose the current lightness that makes this bike so appreciated on the hills. Or I would have to swap back wheels, chainrings and gear selectors to swap between the 2 options. That's a lot of hassle, something I am looking to avoid in the first place.

* The Raleigh 20, although it is technically a folder, in reality mine doesn't fold except when SWMBO picks me up and it has to go in the back of the Rav4. I wouldn't dream of bringing it on a bus. It is simply too big, clumsy, heavy and unwieldy. It has toured Tasmania but I'm not sure I would do it again - I no longer trust the 8sp SA hub after it broke a planet gear. If this happened in the middle of a loaded tour it couldn't be fixed - the ride would be over.

* The Mini is an absolute fun bike but it couldn't be my only bike. I couldn't take it on fast road rides and even if I did, it's a bit on the heavy side to consider doing the Alpine Classic with it. It folds quite small but lacks positive retention of folded bits. I didn't help folded size that I had put on a long stem to make it fit me nicely. Due to the 8sp SA hub I wouldn't trust it for a serious loaded tour.

* The Da Bike folds *very* small, quite a lot smaller than the Mini, but it needs lighter parts everywhere to turn it into a viable bike - it is extremely heavy. It is in nice condition and has potential but again, it couldn't be my only bike - no fast road riding. It was bought for curiosity value only and is getting prepared to be sold.

* The Yeah YRA062 has been upgraded extensively and is now more like a top of the range Helios, only with a better drive train with ultra-wide gearing range. The upgraded drive train has made it a very versatile bike. It also has the more reliable steel handlepost which I trust more than the better-looking aluminium one. It has done a loaded tour of Tasmania, but it is slightly flexy and I'm not too confident about it lasting a long time if it became my workhorse commuter. I don't see it as my only bike and I am not sure how it would do on a fast road ride.

* The Eska was going to be my workhorse commuter, and with this view I installed a NOS Sachs Torpedo Duomatic 2 speed hub in combination with a Schlumpf bottom bracket. This combination gave 4 very nicely-spaced gears, no cables to the back, a very simple, clean bike. I gave it a properly spaced stem so it fits me. But I commuted with it once only - it has a catastrophically low bottom bracket. On the one commuting trip I had 5 or 6 pedal strikes. Not good. So I removed the Schlumpf bottom bracket again and will attempt to sell it with the new back wheel at a premium. If that fails, I will put the old back wheel in and sell it like that.

* Reach Offroad is not mine, so I don't have a say in the matter anyway, but it wouldn't qualify as my only bike as its fold is simply too large. In this respect it is like the Raleigh 20: Yes it can fold but would you? I haven't tried to pack it into a suitcase but a time that I will actually need to, is nearing. I expect difficulty. Other than that, with different fast light tyres and shedding some weight here and there it could be a fast road rider. It's triathlon-winning sibling uses the same frame.

So I am looking at what the market can offer and I suppose the Birdy 20" is a strong contender. It can be made fairly light weight, it can be fast, it has reputation as suitable for touring and I have no doubts in that direction, it folds reasonably small and might be suitable for everyday commuting.

A Bike Friday can be fast and light and tour but does not fold so well, unless if we are considering the tikit. But the tikit lacks high enough gearing for fast riding and lack a touring setup. A Schlumpf bottom bracket seems like a good idea for improving the gear range but BF do not endorse this idea on a tikit as they haven't tried it. So I'm not so sure about the tikit any more.

Any others that may fit the bill?

One of the most serious hurdles I face is to say goodbye to my much-loved bikes to make room for The One.

[Speedo]

Man, I've read a lot of crazy stuff on Bike Forums, but this just takes the cake. Just re-read what you wrote! It's an excuse to do what? Why, to buy another folder of course!!

What you need to do is take a little vacation from the upgrades and the maintenance. It's clear from your posts that you spend a lot of time on the bikes. I mean, I was shocked to read that the Xootr is no longer a fixie; it's now a 9 speed. Leave the the tools and the catalogs alone for a while. Whenever you feel the itch, go for a ride, or take Mrs. Jur out for dinner and a movie. Just enjoy the fleet for a while.

Seriously, the search for the one perfect folder is fruitless. But even an imperfect bike, if you take the time to enjoy it, can bring you a lot of pleasure.

Speedo

[stevegor]

Jur,

I HAVE THE ANSWER.....if you would kindly donate your unwanted bikes, namely The Swift, Pacific Reach and the R20 to the........"Make STEVEGOR very happy FUND", I'm sure your generosity will be greatly appreciated...thank you and goodnight.




PS: Bike Friday NWT looks nice or maybe a birdy.....or a......man are you sick, mate.

[pm124]

Yes, sounds like a complex justification to buy the expensive 20" Birdy. But hey, whatever works! ;-)

By the way, you could also build up some 20" wheels for the Swift with more spokes and throw on some thick tires, an 11-34 cassette, and a smaller chainring on the front for touring.

When I'm getting the consumerist urge, I just procrastinate on http://www.adbusters.org/ or the Church of Stop Shopping: http://www.revbilly.com/ .

[energyandair]

For one bike to do it all I would go with a Birdy. I'm not sure why you would need the 20" wheels though.
A back up bike for your commute could be anything that will be suitable for the commute.
Why do you need two back up commute bikes? If you really want to cut back, a Birdy, the Swift some spare cwheels and a few spare parts would cover you for everything. Two Birdys would simplify the parts issue but be a more expensive route.
David

[energyandair]

Jur
Check your mail ASAP
David

[energyandair]

Well it looks as though somone got a hell of a deal.
I think that with a few parts this might turn into a couple of Birdys for very little money. http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160254661936&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:AU:1123

David

[jur]

I was aware of that deal, have been watching it, thanks for the heads up anyway. I would certainly have gotten those, I was willing to pay at least $500 or a fair bit more than that. Problem pick up only, in a city 900km away. Not feasible. This happens terribly often in Melbourne: Bikes that I REALLY want/need are in other cities with no possibility to get a hold of it. Cycling is VERY popular in Melbourne so deals like that haven't happened here. Not since I started looking. They're always in bloody Queensland.

[energyandair]

For that price I would think about flying Melbourne to Sydney and back!
Still, it would take at least a day to do it.
David

[jur]

Flying... why that didn't even enter my pea-sized brain... flying fares are dirt cheap these days, under$50... of course you'd still need to pack them.

[bokes]

Jur I thought your post was interesting, your story sounds quite similar to mine. I trimmed my collection from 7 to 3 for the same reasons, spending more time tinkering, upgrading, cleaning,... than I did riding the darn things. Now I have 1 road bike, 1 on/off road touring bike, and 1 folder, and I'm much happier! I just roll my eyes every time I hear someone say the best number of bikes to own is = current # + 1

If I had your requirements I'd go for the tikit. I know a lot of people love the Birdy, but I didn't care for it. I don't like rear suspension (maybe the one I test rode was set for too soft, quite bouncy), and I thought it was awkward to fold, almost having to lift the bike in the air with one hand, lean forward, and use the other hand to fold the front fork. Perhaps some owners would say it gets easier with practice.

[jur]

Jur,

I HAVE THE ANSWER.....if you would kindly donate your unwanted bikes, namely The Swift, Pacific Reach and the R20 to the........"Make STEVEGOR very happy FUND", I'm sure your generosity will be greatly appreciated...thank you and goodnight.
Ah, but how would Mrs Stevegor feel about more bikes entering her houshold??

[Sammyboy]

Hmmm. Sounds like you need the Birdy, and for two backup bikes..... Well, would the Birdy replace the Swift for fast road work? If so, then the Mini (for a little tiny bike), and the R20 (for a big, heavy bike). You could always rebuild the R20 with a Nexus 8 or an iMotion 9 if you're leery of the XRF8 now, then the Raleigh would be a feasible tourer too.

[OldiesONfoldies]

Jur, I hope my wife doesnt read your post or I may have to join the "TYF Club" :)

TYF - Trim Yr Foldies Club

[Tovar]

Jur,


Actually I am also looking for this perfect bike, but it's very difficult to achieve. I started last year with my first folder, was a single speed with backpedal brake, was like a kid's bike, but had fenders and rack.
I paid $40can used sold it for $50, this year, then I got my second one a Compact (dahon made) 6 speeds, was nice but I didn't like the long handle post (wasn't telescopic type), I paid $100can sold it for $200, then few weeks ago I got my Downtube 8FS (2008 model), after reading a lot here about pros and cons, (and looking to my budget also..), well I didn't like that doesn't have fenders, racks and kickstand, but actually this guy already solved all those for touring:

http://www.downtube.com/Folding_Bike_Forum/read.php?4,153

and and then I read about mauna kea bike, I think Downtube has a great potential to fit custom anything than any other bike around.

You have three *perhaps touring bike*, so clearly your choice is between touring and commuting, so that's would need a small > for commuting, light weight > for commuting, strong frame> for touring, modified > for wanted gears ( like mauna kea bike or maybe with a dualdrive) folder.

But two **broken** Birdy's something wrong with those.. I don't think is a good idea buy broken bikes.

A spare bike should be something like the Downtube mini.

Regards

[James H Haury]

:fred:Regarding the Tikit. Alternate gearing options are available if recollection serves me.

[Bacciagalupe]

Maybe you ought to change the title of the thread, to "I just need THREE folding bikes...."

You should keep in mind that while you can find one bike to do all of these tasks, you won't find a bike that excels at all of these tasks. The rider position and geometry to do fast rides, for example, is very different than what you want for touring and commuting. You also don't want to bog down a fast bike with racks, fenders and wide tires.

Since you're going to keep 3 bikes anyway, and if budget is not an issue:

- stick to 406 wheels, just to standardize repairs, tires, tubes and parts.
- keep the Swift as your fast bike, and second commuter backup.
- consider a Bike Friday New World Tourist with an SRAM DualDrive for touring, slow recreational rides and first commuting backup. Get fenders, wide low-pressure bullet-proof tires, rack(s).
- pick one of your existing bikes as your primary commuter bike, add fenders and a rear rack.
- sell the rest and/or strip some of them for spare parts.

[rhm]

Jur,
I don't read every post on this forum, and when I do, I probably don't read as closely as I could (I am, after all, at work). Had someone asked me, I could have told them that you have a Swift, a R20, and a Downtube Mini. Those are the ones you talk about here, and those are the ones I'd keep.
I don't know about a Bike Friday or a Birdy. But I do think you need a Moulton.
Rudi

[LittlePixel]

I thought you were buying that Tikit?
I think you should narrow it down to three not one, and get rid of the ones that tug your soul the least.
IE Don't ditch the Twenty! :)

[stevegor]

Ah, but how would Mrs Stevegor feel about more bikes entering her houshold??


Well Jur, it's like this...currently in my shed there are at least 16 bikes and quite a few frames, wheels etc
so if I got a few more, Mrs Stevegor would continue saying to me, "Bikes, bikes bikes...it's all about the bikes"......."Yes Dear".


FWIW, IMHO....For yourself, keep the Swift and the R20, and get a BF NWT, and for SWMBO keep the Reach, sell the Yeah.

[Lalato]

Jur, sounds like you need to talk to that guy that is making the "Ultimate Folding Bike". ;)

Seriously though... I'm sure you've seen the Speeding Tikit. If Bike Friday can do that with a Tikit, I'm sure they can customize to your needs too. That said... those Birdy's look pretty sweet. LOL

--sam

[trueno92]

jur, ur nuts, 7 bikes?

i'll gladly purchase the schumph bottom bracket for a princely sum to assist you in pairing down your options :D

[PhotoByBike]

Sounds to me like you want a Downtube 9FS. :)

[Sammyboy]

7? That's nothing. At the last count I had over 20 bikes....

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a322/Samuelw72/DSC00243.jpg

[Dynocoaster]

Wake up Jur , it was just a bad dream. Your bikes are all safe and sound in the garage.

[14R]

Sell them all and buy a Brompton. You will be slightly frustrated with your decision 20% of the time, extremely happy with your decision 80% of the time.

[folder fanatic]

.....So I am beginning to lean to the idea of just having one folding bike. I'd like to walk into my garage, grab the bike and be off on my commute / loaded tour / fast road ride / slow pootle / mixed-mode commute / city trip with required compact folding.

The big question is, which one?.....What I'd like is a fast, light, small folding, bike which can do all of the above. But from experience I know I have to have 2 backup bikes for commuting - it has hapened more than once that 2 bikes were out of action at the same time. So, 3 bikes in total. They have to be fairly equivalent.

* The Swift, although it has a small folded footprint, is still a big-looking object if bagged to be brought on a bus. But it is FAST, easily holding its own among roadies (which is mostly dependent on rider anyway), but has the benefit I don't have to perch it on a roof rack or bike rack to take it to road rides. Just fold and go. The Swift is probably close to being my only bike. But I am a little doubtful about its loaded touring capabilities. How strong is the frame? Can it pack a load? The gearing range would probably have to increase for touring. A Schlumpf bottom bracket is a likely candidate, or alternatively a 9sp iMotion SRAM hub gear. Lamentably, I would lose the current lightness that makes this bike so appreciated on the hills. Or I would have to swap back wheels, chainrings and gear selectors to swap between the 2 options. That's a lot of hassle, something I am looking to avoid in the first place.

* The Raleigh 20, although it is technically a folder, in reality mine doesn't fold except when SWMBO picks me up and it has to go in the back of the Rav4. I wouldn't dream of bringing it on a bus. It is simply too big, clumsy, heavy and unwieldy. It has toured Tasmania but I'm not sure I would do it again - I no longer trust the 8sp SA hub after it broke a planet gear. If this happened in the middle of a loaded tour it couldn't be fixed - the ride would be over.

* The Mini is an absolute fun bike but it couldn't be my only bike. I couldn't take it on fast road rides and even if I did, it's a bit on the heavy side to consider doing the Alpine Classic with it. It folds quite small but lacks positive retention of folded bits. I didn't help folded size that I had put on a long stem to make it fit me nicely. Due to the 8sp SA hub I wouldn't trust it for a serious loaded tour.

* The Da Bike folds *very* small, quite a lot smaller than the Mini, but it needs lighter parts everywhere to turn it into a viable bike - it is extremely heavy. It is in nice condition and has potential but again, it couldn't be my only bike - no fast road riding. It was bought for curiosity value only and is getting prepared to be sold.

* The Yeah YRA062 has been upgraded extensively and is now more like a top of the range Helios, only with a better drive train with ultra-wide gearing range. The upgraded drive train has made it a very versatile bike. It also has the more reliable steel handlepost which I trust more than the better-looking aluminium one. It has done a loaded tour of Tasmania, but it is slightly flexy and I'm not too confident about it lasting a long time if it became my workhorse commuter. I don't see it as my only bike and I am not sure how it would do on a fast road ride.

* The Eska was going to be my workhorse commuter, and with this view I installed a NOS Sachs Torpedo Duomatic 2 speed hub in combination with a Schlumpf bottom bracket. This combination gave 4 very nicely-spaced gears, no cables to the back, a very simple, clean bike. I gave it a properly spaced stem so it fits me. But I commuted with it once only - it has a catastrophically low bottom bracket. On the one commuting trip I had 5 or 6 pedal strikes. Not good. So I removed the Schlumpf bottom bracket again and will attempt to sell it with the new back wheel at a premium. If that fails, I will put the old back wheel in and sell it like that.

* Reach Offroad is not mine, so I don't have a say in the matter anyway, but it wouldn't qualify as my only bike as its fold is simply too large. In this respect it is like the Raleigh 20: Yes it can fold but would you? I haven't tried to pack it into a suitcase but a time that I will actually need to, is nearing. I expect difficulty. Other than that, with different fast light tyres and shedding some weight here and there it could be a fast road rider. It's triathlon-winning sibling uses the same frame.

So I am looking at what the market can offer and I suppose the Birdy 20" is a strong contender. It can be made fairly light weight, it can be fast, it has reputation as suitable for touring and I have no doubts in that direction, it folds reasonably small and might be suitable for everyday commuting.

A Bike Friday can be fast and light and tour but does not fold so well, unless if we are considering the tikit. But the tikit lacks high enough gearing for fast riding and lack a touring setup. A Schlumpf bottom bracket seems like a good idea for improving the gear range but BF do not endorse this idea on a tikit as they haven't tried it. So I'm not so sure about the tikit any more.

Any others that may fit the bill?


One of the most serious hurdles I face is to say goodbye to my much-loved bikes to make room for The One.

Due to space limitations, I am limited to 3, maybe 4 bikes since they "live" with me in the house (no sheds or garages here). So I thought along the lines of where you are thinking now even before I bought my first folder (Boardwalk Modified S1). I used a "cookie cutter" approuch by which I selected bikes on a list I drew up with the parts/features that I wanted in any given bike at the time of purchase or soon after. Each bike is expected to stand on it's own 2 wheels and "pull it's own weight". They back up each other (for example if one is in the shop for repairs, the others are fine for most everything I want it to). I could drop down to just one even with just the ones I have now, but I guess my needs are not the same as yours are. All of my bikes primary reason for being is emergency transport 24/7 when other forms of transport could be spotty at best-nonexistent at worse.

You on the other hand, appear to be more of an serious cyclist that just loves to ride for the sheer pleasure of riding with the added benefits of transportation or health improvement. You are really into bike in genreral, folders in particular. So I think that because of your serious participation as a fine art does make your decision very hard on you-and might be limiting at the very least. The Birdy is considered to be a high performance bike that folds (not partial separate) up in a nice neat package. I think that this is a bike to strongly consider as far as performance riding.

Now my own suggestion (even if it is not the perfect performance one). I am with 14R. Buy a Brompton. I never regretted my choice (and my mother loves the way it "hides" in the cupboard.) It can be carried & stored most anywhere. The ride is the best I ever experienced in a folder. I have 3 folders, but the Brompton is the best all around folder for most anything thrown at it!

[invisiblehand]

:fred:Regarding the Tikit. Alternate gearing options are available if recollection serves me.

They talk about a tikit with a front derailer here ...

http://www.bikefriday.com/tikit/robspinkone

... someone like Jur will have to use one of those recumbent front derailers (??microshift??) for chainrings of 60 teeth.

[Diode100]

If I had to pick three bikes to have, I would keep the Swift & the Mini from your existing fleet, & add a Birdy, I think that would just about cover all your recreational/ transport bases. Then you could think about a new project for yourself, because i definetely get the sense from your posts that for you bikes are about more than just cycling - so maybe when, down to a mere three bikes, and with time on your hands from fettling & cleaning duties, you'll be able to sit down quietly and draw up the basic spec for the Jur Mk 1 Advanced Folding Bicycle, you know, the one where no owner compromises are required !

[CrimsonEclipse]

Sell most (all?) of your folders and get a fully decked out Brompton Ti with the fastest and
lightest components.

Or wait for the Brommie looking Dahon and hope it doesn't have too many bugs.

(Bromton is calling me)

CE

[SesameCrunch]

I vote with LittlePixel and Crimson Eclipse for the high-end Brompton.

It comes closest to the versatility you're looking for.
- Light enough that when you remove the rack, kickstand and other extraneous stuff, you could ride pretty fast with it.
- Proven record for touring
- Winner in transportability

Yup, that would be it if I had to make the decision for only one bike.

I need to reduce my fleet too.... :o

[Dynocoaster]

I would like to go to two bikes in the future. First bike would be the Brompton or Tikit. I would leave this bike stock. The second bike will be a Downtube 8HN and that will be the bike that gets modified. This way I will have a 16" and a 20".

[BruceMetras]

Jur, sounds like you envision a bonus on the horizon...:lol:.. given your criteria, the one bike that stands out would be a dual drive Birdy (or Schlumpf equipped) .. solid frame, lightish as stock, lots of gear inches, comfortable for the long haul, front and rear racks available, gets fairly compact pretty easily, and a proven design... only thing, they are becoming quite pricey (as I'm sure you're aware)... I've got a Silver (dual drive) and it has become my bike of choice for ferry hopping to the city, general around town gofer errands, and short 10mile hops etc.... if Birdy didn't exist, the Tikit with a Schlumpf would be at the top of my list... your Helios/Yeah with a Schlumpf would be a great back-up (meeting most of your criteria) and easily changing complections with simply changing wheels/tires.. I know, I would be hard pressed to get rid of my Schlumpf XX..

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1076/876259099_8457882b55.jpg

[feijai]

Regarding the Tikit. Alternate gearing options are available if recollection serves me

The Express Tikit (http://www.bikefriday.com/node/6109) has a Capreo casette, which will give you up to 94 gear inches on the standard front chainring. Not cheap tho.

The Travel Tikit (http://www.bikefriday.com/node/6108) has an SRAM dual-drive with 24 gears, which should probably provide better still. Also not cheap.

[kb5ql]

The Express Tikit (http://www.bikefriday.com/node/6109) has a Capreo casette, which will give you up to 94 gear inches on the standard front chainring. Not cheap tho.

The Travel Tikit (http://www.bikefriday.com/node/6108) has an SRAM dual-drive with 24 gears, which should probably provide better still. Also not cheap.

I was going to say Capreo as well on the Tikit. I'm looking at that as well if/when they decide to release a version w/ front derailleur as they are hinting at for next year:

http://www.bikefriday.com/roundup08

The bikefriday's also come with that neat trailer package that allows you to drag along your stuff. Works great on my Pocket Rocket. I'm looking at this b/c I may need to start multi-modal commuting again. Having that bag quickly go over the top is a neat selling point.

[Urbanis]

Jur, I hear your agony and I want to practice a little tough love to help you better achieve your vision.

My concerns:

1. Is this really an exercise in narrowing your bike collection or an excuse to buy a new bike?

2. Do you really need three commuter bicycles? Why not just one? Can you take mass transit if it's out of service for a day getting repaired by you or your local bike shop?

As others have mentioned, there is no "perfect" folding bike out there that will give you everything you want (speed, comfort, ruggedness, a quick and compact fold). So I'd urge you to resist the siren call of consumerism, be kind to the Earth's resources, and pick from what you already have. Then you can use the money--and the space you've freed up from selling your other bikes--for something else that you might enjoy.

The suggestions that struck me as most sensible are the two-bike solutions: an ultra-compact folder for commuting and combining with mass transit, and a larger more rugged folder for touring and fast rides. It sounds to me like keeping the Mini and the Swift is your best bet. The nice thing about having two bikes is it gives you both a back-up and guest bike if a friend is visiting. But if a Brompton (or some other bicycle) can reasonably meet all your needs, I'd be tempted to go that route for the simplicity of the one-bike solution, even though it involves acquiring a new bike.

[invisiblehand]

Jur,

Did you get the expected answer? As an "old-timer" in the forum I am sure that you must have seen this (http://homepage.mac.com/lenrubin/PhotoAlbum1.html).

If you truly wanted to go with one bike, then I assume you would be willing to spend a good deal of money on it. Although I suspect that despite the falling US dollar, you don't have the cohones (death wish?) to ask Mrs. Jur for a $10-15K folding bike.

Personally, a Brompton fits me poorly without significant modification ... although definitely much less than the cost of the ultimate folding bike. I need a little more reach and leg extension relative to the standard seat post. But with a few thousand dollars, given what Steve Parry does, I presume that you could get something more than acceptable.

In my mind, that leaves the Birdy or BF tikit as the real contenders if multimode transportation is part of the equation. I enjoy my Mini; but it would not be my only bike with reasonable modifications. I have never ridden the tikit. But from my limited experience, I can see how the Birdy could perform quite well under certain circumstances. Note that Black Dog bicycles does sell the older stem post that takes an ahead stem for the Birdy.

Soooooo if this is a real exercise, then I would go test ride that Birdy and tikit for an extended period then decide whether to buy cheap and build precisely what you want or pay someone else to build it for me.

[StuAff]

Jur, surely the question should be 'how many bikes do I want'?
If you're going for a new bike to solve this, how about a Dahon Mu SL modded with DualDrive? Would be about 10 kg, huge gear range (my XP with similar derailleur setup gives about 22-125"). Simple quick fold, plenty strong enough for touring etc. And darn quick, even with an extra kilo on top of the base weight. I think the '08 Jetstream XP (if you could get it in Oz) would be a bit heavy for your preference (12 kg with pedals), but would be a very smooth ride and meet all your other requirements too.

[CrimsonEclipse]

One Folder to rule them all,
One Folder to find them,
One Folder to bring them all
and in the darkness bind them.

CE

my....MY PRECIOUSSsss...

[mrbrown]

Foldlander: There can NEVER be just ONE!

[Mr. Smith]

:fred:Regarding the Tikit. Alternate gearing options are available if recollection serves me.

Watch Green Gear Cycles closely. They will be expanding on the tikit and are rumored to be creating a version with a Rohloff hub in the near future that would make it just about the best folding bike ever. They're up to something...

Birdy Rohloff looks amazing, too, but once again... North America (Jur, I realize that's not an issue for you) has crappy Birdy distribution and old models. The Birdy chain seems to fall off a lot, though I only have small experiences with it. Any owners care to comment?

[Simple Simon]

Great thread ! I feel your pain Jur - yep its a real pain to have to look after 7 bikes (whether all yours, or families). Have you got a powered compressor for tyre pumping ? and a bike maintenance stand ? super tidy, find anything workshop ? I wish !

Why not seal the less used ones in bin bags and store out of the way, in roof ?
In a sort of escrow - then if you have not missed them after a year sell or donate them. Its a tough call to have 'one bike for all' and why this forum is so fun and will go on ad infinitum. Heresy - but you could always go back to 3, by wheel size - Off road - 26" , On Road - 700c, Multimodal - 16".

[rhm]

2. Do you really need three commuter bicycles? Why not just one? Can you take mass transit if it's out of service for a day getting repaired by you or your local bike shop?


I know this question was directed at Jur, but....
Yes, a committed bicycle commuter needs two or three complete and reliable bicycles suitable for commuting, with their tires pumped up and ready to go in the morning. You often don't have time for bicycle maintenance in the hours between getting home one day and leaving the next; and even if you did, tires can go flat and all kinds of things can go wrong overnight. If I go out to the shed at 5:35 and find my bike isn't ridable, I have to wake up my wife and have her drive me to the station... I've already missed one train... and she has to pick me up that evening... total, 30 miles on the car, close to an hour out of her day, and so on. It's an option, and one I'm glad to have; but a better option is having a spare bike or two.

[jur]

Yes, a committed bicycle commuter needs two or three complete and reliable bicycles suitable for commuting, with their tires pumped up and ready to go in the morning. You often don't have time for bicycle maintenance in the hours between getting home one day and leaving the next; and even if you did, tires can go flat and all kinds of things can go wrong overnight. If I go out to the shed at 5:35 and find my bike isn't ridable, I have to wake up my wife and have her drive me to the station... I've already missed one train... and she has to pick me up that evening... total, 30 miles on the car, close to an hour out of her day, and so on. It's an option, and one I'm glad to have; but a better option is having a spare bike or two.
+1

It's happened to me more than once that a bike broke something serious (eg R20's bottom bracket wore out, another time its hub broke a gear, and my Mini's handlepost broke off some time ago, each time side-lining the bike for quite a while) so that puts pressure on the 2 remaining bikes. Then something trivial like a puncture on a day when you don't have much time can take another bike out of action, leaving you to rely on the last one.

It's been a few times I had remarked to SWMBO that you need 3 bikes for commuting full-time, each of those times when 2 bikes were out of action. It is quite remarkable how much wear and tear there is in commuting.

So I suppose I confess that despite the list, I only have 3 bikes in regular use. The Yeah hasn't seen any action since the Reach Offroad entered the stable. I have got it prepared to take a Schlumpf Speed Drive to give it an ultra-wide gear range. We spoke about that one and have agreed to keep it as a backup for the children/visitors.

PS I must say, this thread is giving me huge encouragement! :love: I'm getting SWMBO to read the whole thing.

3 bikes have emerged from all the discussion:

* tikit with Capreo - for this one I actually have been negotiating with Lynette Chiang (galfromdownunder) to buy the one she is demo-ing over here. But she keeps extending her tour and I wonder at this stage what happens next...? That one is the Express, a light-weight Capreo version with H-bars, shower cap, racks and mudguards fitted and included. See it in their new catalog, I think their list price is $1490. I would get it for a lot less plus those goodies thrown in. Vik has a pic or 2 on his blog of the Gal with that tikit. That particular one is the hyperfold version.

* Birdy with Schlumpf, probably 20" version, but now we are talking budget problems.

* Brompton, as above.

After seeing Rob English's pink tikit I am renewing interest in the tikit. But I have never liked the idea of the Capreo - too proprietary plus small gears reduce efficiency - or am I scared of nothing?

[gringo_gus]

that is really sad news that I gotta get something else to standby my merc for the commute... (not)
DT mini here I come...

[OldiesONfoldies]

+1

It's happened to me more than once that a bike broke something serious (eg R20's bottom bracket wore out, another time its hub broke a gear, and my Mini's handlepost broke off some time ago, each time side-lining the bike for quite a while) so that puts pressure on the 2 remaining bikes. Then something trivial like a puncture on a day when you don't have much time can take another bike out of action, leaving you to rely on the last one.

It's been a few times I had remarked to SWMBO that you need 3 bikes for commuting full-time, each of those times when 2 bikes were out of action. It is quite remarkable how much wear and tear there is in commuting.

So I suppose I confess that despite the list, I only have 3 bikes in regular use. The Yeah hasn't seen any action since the Reach Offroad entered the stable. I have got it prepared to take a Schlumpf Speed Drive to give it an ultra-wide gear range. We spoke about that one and have agreed to keep it as a backup for the children/visitors.

PS I must say, this thread is giving me huge encouragement! :love: I'm getting SWMBO to read the whole thing.

3 bikes have emerged from all the discussion:

* tikit with Capreo - for this one I actually have been negotiating with Lynette Chiang (galfromdownunder) to buy the one she is demo-ing over here. But she keeps extending her tour and I wonder at this stage what happens next...? That one is the Express, a light-weight Capreo version with H-bars, shower cap, racks and mudguards fitted and included. See it in their new catalog, I think their list price is $1490. I would get it for a lot less plus those goodies thrown in. Vik has a pic or 2 on his blog of the Gal with that tikit. That particular one is the hyperfold version.

* Birdy with Schlumpf, probably 20" version, but now we are talking budget problems.

* Brompton, as above.

After seeing Rob English's pink tikit I am renewing interest in the tikit. But I have never liked the idea of the Capreo - too proprietary plus small gears reduce efficiency - or am I scared of nothing?

This one?

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l260/oldiesonfoldies/Tikitlynettes.jpg

[bykerouac]

Sorry Jur, I honestly think you can't do it. Even if you're able to pare down your stable to one bike, I bet that a year or so after that you'll have several bikes again :thumb: Anyway, I'm with several others here, get a high end Brommie and modify it heavily.

[Urbanis]

Hi, rhm, thanks for explaining the three-bike requirement. It sounds like you and Jur are living in places that are not as transit-rich as where I am? I have subway stops both at my apartment and office, so I'm never stuck if my bike (or myself) is out of commission or the weather is foul. In fact, I often will ride the subway one way and ride my bike for the return.

In any case, if having three bikes is a requirement, Jur, doesn't that kill this entire discussion?

[invisiblehand]

Personally, I think that a commuter in a bike friendly environment -- no snow or freezing rain -- can rely on two bikes with a very high degree of confidence. Even with one bike, as long as you keep track of mileage and do regular maintenance, the bike will be very reliable.

Things get hairy if there are some days you want to carry a lot of stuff while others you want to do a multimode commute and sometimes you have snow and/or ice. Then having more bikes with particular characteristics is really helpful.

After seeing Rob English's pink tikit I am renewing interest in the tikit. But I have never liked the idea of the Capreo - too proprietary plus small gears reduce efficiency - or am I scared of nothing?

I understand the trepidation. The hub is fairly standard; i.e., you can rebuild/overhaul the hub. The cassette is what I would be more worried about. I bought two extra cassettes and starting with the next cassette, I think that changing the chain at a higher rate will extend the cassette's life considerably. This is an attractive option since 9-speed chains are much cheaper now.

I waited a little too long with the present cassette. It is still functional but there is a teeny bit of slipage in my favorite gear that only occurs when I am at a full stop and try to take off with vigor.

As for efficiency, it is pretty difficult for me to assess whether there is any significant loss. I don't notice anything that I can identify as being the consequence of the cogs with 9 or 10 teeth.

[alhedges]

If I were getting 3 folders, I think would get 3 quite different bikes. For unsupported touring, I would get a BF NWT with DualDrive (basically, this is what I have for touring and bike camping). It will carry a huge amount of weight using regular rear panniers and regular front panniers - I have no idea how much more it would carry if you added the trailer. It's not the bike I would use if I were constantly folding/unfolding - but at 90 secs to (conservatively) fold and bag, it's useful in a lot of situations. Also, for touring purposes the speed of the fold doesn't matter much, as you will still have to remove all of your panniers and handlebar bags before you can fold anyway.

The second bike I would get is a Brompton. It shines at folding compactly and is a good bike to have if you are using public transport, especially multiple times in the same day. Also, they are just so fun to fold. Since I already have the 24 speeds on the NWT, I would probably tend to just get a 3-spd Brompton, since it seems simpler. But I suppose that depends on your particular terrain.

The third bike I would get would be something between the BF tourer and the Brompton. You already have a Swift, so that might work; a Tikit would also work well. To split the difference between the B and the BF, I would probably get something with no front derailleur and 8 or 9 gears in back..