Bicycle Mechanics - My brakes are **** and I am going to pull them off. Is there ANYTHING else I can do?

So coming from MTB I've gotten some great advice here on adjusting to the new style/ratio of braking on a road bike. I've learned how to put them on myself and use the matchbook trick to gingerly toe them in. I've adjusted the cable length, etc. I tried Shimano pads, Kool Stop pads. They are as good as they are going to get.

But they still suck. The best I've been able to get them is to slow me down at low speeds, but high speeds (when I might need them a little more) they slide and then "catch" like a machine gun. If my elbows are relaxed at all, it nearly chucks me over the bars.

So now I've learned to adjust brakes, but I have no idea how to replace them. What do you recommend I replace them with?

Here is a link to my bike, a 2005 Kona Jake cyclocross-like bike: http://www.konaworld.com/shopping_cart/FrontEnd/Products/product_detail.aspx?productid=73&parentid=182

I currently have Avid Shorty 4 cantilever brakes. What can I do??? Can I put discs on them? I'm guessing not.



75290

Headset Aheadset STS
Crankarms TruVativ Elita Triple
Chainrings 28/38/48T
B/B TruVativ ISIS SLLT
Pedals Wellgo Road with clips & straps
Chain Shimano IG-31
Freewheel Shimano Deore 12-25 8 speed
F/D Shimano Sora
R/D Shimano Tiagra
Shifters Shimano Sora
Handlebar Easton OS Road Bar
Stem Easton OS
Grips CU Black
Brakes Avid Shorty 4
Brake Levers Shimano Sora Shimano 105 w/Tektro RX-2
Front hub Shimano Deore
Rear hub Shimano Sora
Seatpost Easton
Seat clamp Kona Clamp
Extras Tektro RX 2.0 add-on brake lever

You're not going to like this suggestion.

Ditch the brifters, go to a v-brake setup with proper levers (Cane Creek SCR-5V) and get barcons?

That is a lot of work, but it should improve the braking.

Check to make sure your rims are clean. Sometimes odd braking problems are some kind of crap on the rims. Might even be a thin skim of oil that you can't see. Clean them.

That's canti's for ya... a good caliper brake will make a word of difference if you're using the bike just on the road. If you're still running the larger tires though, you could have clearance issues with calipers.

You could look at replacing them with Mini-V's as I've heard good things about them - but haven't tried them myself. I'm not sure if they'll work with road levers though - also don't know how much better they are than canti's (just another option):

http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/BR407A03-Tektro+926A+Mini+L-Pull.aspx?sc=FRGL

Disc brakes will require new hubs... and I don't think your rear triangle or fork is set up for them anyway.

FWIW...That brake shudder you're experiencing could be fixed by toeing the pads in slightly (when they contact flat or rear first, you get vibration).

EDIT: Also - use some fine sandpaper on your brake pads to expose fresh pad surface (doesn't take much sanding - several swipes is it)... and make sure the rims are nice and clean (I use fine steel wool on the brake surface from time to time to clean them off).

You could try a little more toe-in (maybe 2 matchbook covers). Also, make sure you're toeing the pads in the right direction (yes I did them backwards once...it was late and I was tired :) ). It sounds like you've already messed around with different straddle cable lengths and different brands of pads. It takes a while for brake pads to break in and stop squealing and chattering, at least for a couple of rides until they need toeing and sanding again :). I suspect some rims are worse than others too depending on the quality of the brake track and possibly the type of alloy, but have no hard evidence for that.

You could also try different cantilevers, such as the Shimano BR550, or a fork-crown-mounted brake cable hanger. Some people claim that having the brake cable stop much closer and more directly coupled to the brake arms creates a shorter mechanical feedback loop which reduces chattering and squeal, but I've never tried it.

You can run a front disc on any 'cross (or other 700c) bike, but you need to replace both the fork and front wheel with disc-compatible ones, so it isn't cheap. And, depending on your tastes, it probably won't look nearly as nice as a slender cantilever fork.

The problem is the design of the short cantis which are by their design very inefficient. Best to replace them with these which really do work and are not too expensive. Tektro CR520 are based on the old Mafac cylclo-cross brake but are a bit more refined in that they allow toeing-in without bending the callipers.

Check out the Tektro website for road/cross calipers that would fit over the tires. I put Tektro R730 calipers on my vintage bike and they work as well as the Chorus levers on my good bike. Also, check out their road levers. They are the same as the Cane Creek SCR5 (they make the CC) and they have the feel of my Chorus levers on the hands. They are very nice for the money ($20 on ebay). They are NOT shifters though, so that could present a problem, I'm not sure about what your setup is.

Quick rundown:

Braking surfaces: File the brake pads and thoroughly clean the rims with alcohol and steel wool. Imagine there's wet paint on both surfaces and get it all off without spreading it.

Components: Check the brake arms for play, throw a five on your studs and snug them up if they're loose.

Toe in: If you have flexible studs/arms/pads you may need more than you have

Mechanical advantage: Look at the flat parts of the canti arms (around where the pad gear attaches) these surfaces should be parallel to the wheel or slightly flared out when the brake pads contact the rim. You don't want them going past parallel to the wheel or you will loose power. Essentially, the wider the arms are apart when the pads contact the rim, the stronger the brake. You don't want them like this / \. Make them like | | or slightly \ /

Mechanical advantage II: Look the the brake while in line with the bike (that is, look at the front brake from the front of the bike, eyes at brake level.) The brake shoe posts should be pointing up towards the rim slightly as the brake contacts the rim.

If you have patience left, try these. Otherwise, new brakeset, but keep in mind, if the new best brakeset isn't adjusted as I've described, you might just have the same issue. Enjoy! (?)

Brad

You have done all you can do. Now try a visit to the local bike shop mechanic, -much cheaper than throwing parts at it.

Just a long shot but along with the rest of the stuff look at the wheel sidewalls. If the bike has a lot of miles on it and the rims are worn to a hollow shape then the pads will tend to grab just like you are saying. I've had that on two of my commuter bikes when the brake areas on the rims had worn quite hollow. If they are worn badly then it will be a pretty big part of your problem. The only fix is new rims grafted onto the hubs and spokes.

The other things are certainly important but I was amazed at how much less "grabby" my two bikes suddenly were with the new rims and new (flat faced) brake pads. And that was with V brakes which I know are less grabby than high mechanical advantage cantis.

And if you're trying to shove a flat faced pad into a hollowed rim face then that'll be part of the trouble. They won't grab much at first due to the small contact area but when you force them they'll jam on the sides of the hollow and really wedge in there.

You could look at replacing them with Mini-V's as I've heard good things about them - but haven't tried them myself. I'm not sure if they'll work with road levers though - also don't know how much better they are than canti's (just another option):

What good things have you heard about Mini-V's?

On every road bike that I've messed with that had them it has been necessary to loosen the barrel adjuster, and readjust it afterward, just to open the brakes for a wheel change. Major PITA.

I HATE Mini-V's.

What good things have you heard about Mini-V's?


Stopping power compared to canti's like avid shorty's... that's about it.

Those bar-top brake levers also act as cable stops, so you gotta make sure they are tightly clamped to the handlebars. I would recommend you check and/or replace the cables and cable stops before you start replacing calipers.

Put on some decent pads!