We want to get Lisa a car for commuting to Walnut Creek and back ~45 daily miles on Hwy 24 and 580. Which do you think would work?

http://www.trustmymechanic.com/auto-repair/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/2007-mini-cooper-s-f-3-4.jpg

Mini Cooper: 29 combined MPG.

http://www.autoclub.com.au/uploaded_images/smart-fortwo-passion-2007-746438.jpghttp://www.channel4.com/4car/media/100-greatest/03-large/105-smart-fortwo.jpg

Smart ForTwo: 33/41 City/Hwy MPG.

The Smart puts a smile on my face every time one whizzes by. I'm guessing the Mini is the more practical of the two, though. Then again, if you already have a practical car for carrying a bit of stuff, that's not much of an issue.

Yeah, we already have our Toyota Matrix which can fit the tandem if need be.

Our ultimate goal here is to get a daily driver for her, while we keep a 'Touring car' for longer trips. We are thinking trading the ol' Matrix in for a new AWD Matrix sometime down the road.

Test drive the Smartcar to see if you can deal with the goofy transmission. It's an automated manual, and by all reports so far mixes the worst of manuals with the worst of automatics with none of the benefits of either.

The Mini is a very fun car to drive, but that may not matter much if you're just using it to commute.

JB

You can fit 2 full sized road bikes inside a Toyota Prius.

We are planning a test drive of the Smart this weekend.

We're also trying to stay under $20k on the msrp, which is really close on the Mini. I also looked at the Toyota Yaris, but I'm not taken by the ugly Echo-ish design at all.

I don't know, I almost kind of like the two-door Yaris despite the face not even a mother could love. You could buy a Yaris and have several thousand left over. :)

You might look into used Minis, as well. I'm sure it'd be a lot easier to fit into your budget that way, and you might even get a higher-zoot model for what you'd pay for a newer base model.

My friend has a Smart, and he says it's a blast in town, but not very pleasant on the highway. You might want to spend more than just a few minutes on the highway during your test drive, though the salesperson will try to dissuade you from that.

Personally, I'm a Honda fan - and the Fit seems like a great compromise between small enough to get good gas mileage and big enough to do things real cars do. The Scions also seem to fit in that category.

JB

The Smart is not really a highway car. It's great in the city but reports I heard and read say it's pretty dismal on the road in respect to comfort and ride quality. I would also question its resistance to impact from the big SUVs out there, although crash reports are quite good.
The Mini is more expensive but sounds a lot of fun.

This site seems to have decent reviews:

http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm?Vehicle=2008_Smart_Fortwo&ReviewID=3914
http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm?Vehicle=2007_Mini_Cooper&ReviewID=2565
http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm?Vehicle=2007_Honda_Fit&ReviewID=2405

JB

45 miles? Come on...
Howz about....

http://www.orbea-usa.com/smallpic/Diva_main_blue.jpg

http://powersports.honda.com/assets/images/model/c028_029_030_031_photos_all/scooters/2007/Elite_80/LargeHoriz/Elite_80_red.jpg

:)

How about a Toyota Corolla? All she needs is a radio and A/C.

We're going for unusual. ;) Although we will probably test drive a Fit as well. Thanks for that suggestion!

Also look at the Nissan Versa, Chevy Aveo, Scion Xd

I just got a Honda cbr 600 and I'm hooked! 45 mpg, no sitting in traffic (splitting lanes), and your a carpool during commute hours...
paid around 7k used for an 06, not to mention that its faster than hell...
Plus, being a cyclist, she'll already be able to look down road for hazards and have some common sense about being aware of cars.

I just got one of these-

http://www.egmcartech.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/2009_pontiac_vibe_official_image001.jpg

45 miles? Come on...
Howz about....

http://www.orbea-usa.com/smallpic/Diva_main_blue.jpg

Srsly. + http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/26/Bart-logo.svg/190px-Bart-logo.svg.png

I'd lean towards the Mini, if only because I'm not sure how comfortable the Smart car will be in that wonderful slow creep hwy 24 traffic I see regularly. Too bad about the mileage though -- not reaching for a Prius yet?

I would say the Honda Fit.

or BART ;)

All the cool kids are driving the Cooper. :)

I'd love to have the Smart, but I think it's a bit of a gimmick still. I'd go for the mini. My contribution:

http://www.conti.net/albums/germany/IMG_5171.sized.jpg

We want to get Lisa a car for commuting to Walnut Creek and back ~45 daily miles on Hwy 24 and 580. Which do you think would work?


I know a guy with a SMART car and my sister has a Mini. They both love them. They are for different jobs, though. The SMART is more for running around town (he has another 'big' car for long distance duty), but the Mini is pretty much good to go anywhere. If you're going 20-25 miles one way, then the SMART would probably be OK, but don't plan on going on any long trips in it. You'll go bonkers.

Can you fit a regular road bike in a Mini or Smart? I know you can fit a bike in a Yaris or a Fit. And you can fit 2 bikes in a Prius (wheels off).

Honda Fits are HUGE inside. The tests I have read say that they are also actually fun to drive and suprisingly sporty. The Smart cars can barely carry a couple bags of groceries and the reviews I have read say that they handle very poorly and don't even get that good gas mileage.

Mazda 3 wagons are also good small bike haulers. I have a Mazdaspeed 3 which is similar to the regular 3 but with a turbo motor. It's quite fast but even the regular non-turbo 3 is pretty good. I can put my road bike in the back laid down flat with just the front wheel removed.

[quote=reidconti;7028667]I'd love to have the Smart, but I think it's a bit of a gimmick still.

Actually no gimmick. They have been in Europe for years where there's a lot more to choose from.

My $.02:
For Practicality & Fun Factor: The Smart Car.
For Zippiness & Cool Factor: The Mini.

I am parting with my Suby WRX soon (:() and will replace it with an 09 Honda Fit. I love my Subaru.... but 91 octane and so-so mpg is killing me. I am getting pretty excited about the FIT. Even found some bike transport options both inside and out.

Get the Mini.

I own a Mini Cooper S, and would definiltey recommend the Mini over the Smart in the highway commuting role.

That being said, neither is really ideally suited to long-distance commuting. The Smart is oriented towards the urban runabout role and is punishing as a highway car. Also my opinion is that it is a very poor value. The Mini is a better highway car, but absolute reliability and low maintenance costs are critical in a commuter and Minis just aren't as good in these regards as Japanese cars - don't forget that the Mini is a BMW with BMW reliability and maintenance costs. I love mine, but it's my casual sports car, not my daily driver. Minis (and the Smart) also have a limited dealer network.

IMHO, the pick of the litter in this category is the Honda Fit, although these are very hard to find right now (although probably no worse than a Mini). Or if the commute involves significant stop-and-go, a Prius, which is going to return an easy 15 mpg better in this sort of traffic. The Fit is a very entertaining car to drive; the Prius is an appliance, albeit a very good one. Mazda 3's are great small cars too, but they're in the next size class up and the Mazdaspeed with the turbo motor is really hard on gas.

The Fit is just about to be replaced with a new model which is much improved. Ideally, I'd wait and buy the new Fit in 6-8 months from a dealer willing to commit to MSRP without gouging.

BTW, the picture at the start of the thread is a Mini Cooper S, not the regular Cooper. With typical options, these run in the $25K-$30K range - far from cheap. Mini options are terribly overpriced too. For the commuter role, I'd get the regular Cooper and be careful with the options sheet. The Fit would probably be an easy $5K cheaper.

- Mark

Actually no gimmick. They have been in Europe for years where there's a lot more to choose from.


I'm aware of that.

My point was that it's more of a toy car than a Mini/Fit/etc. It's too little car for too much money, relative to other small cars. It's cool as a fashion statement, or if you exclusively drive it in an urban environment. I'm a small car lover, and would love to have one, but recognize that a Fit or Mini suits most people's needs far better.

I suggest checking www.consumerreports.com. The free version has a summary on each vehicle.

I liked the Mini ever since I saw Italian Job and Charlize Theron driving one.:thumb:

http://www.conti.net/albums/germany/IMG_5171.sized.jpg
That is so awesome! :thumb:

We'll go test drive a few cars over the next couple of weeks and see what she likes. It is for her, after all. I'd love to get a Smart. You guys are right, though, the tech support area is important, and I'm not too impressed with BMW service (at least not for a 3-series owner and friend of mine).

Thanks! :) Saw it in Berlin a number of years ago, and I just had to take a picture. It was shortly after the Mini came out in the US, and I was just amused to see them parked so close together, especially with nothing else nearby on that side of the street.

As for the Mini, well, I can't speak to Mini dealers, but I'm a diehard BMW fan and we buy their cars DESPITE the service, not BECAUSE of it. I'm not sure why it's so hard to figure out how to treat customers well. Fortunately I can't afford to buy new, so I never have to deal with a dealer.. and neither of my cars ever saw a shop :)

Here's a bonus picture. In this location in France, you're allowed to park on the center island. It is very wide -- too wide, really, for just one car, but not quite wide enough for 2 cars to park.. unless they're Smarts.

http://www.conti.net/ljpix/bmwcca/smartx2.jpg

That's what the Smart has been created for; city parking.

That's what the Smart has been created for; city parking.Sometimes they're created for other things (http://youtube.com/watch?v=cV4HdsDZX6c). ;)

And for even other (http://youtube.com/watch?v=MDU5BU_qSJU&feature=related) things. ;)

While we're talking about 'Fit'ting things ... Love this one (http://youtube.com/watch?v=NkjZtfgqC2w&feature=related). ;)

Personally I'll take the original Mini with a busa motor/rwd "kit" from zcars

http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYp_pYnjr4Y&feature=related

The original was a fun car to drive, too bad the transmission was so crappy.

How about a Toyota Corolla? All she needs is a radio and A/C.

The Corolla gets almost the same mileage as the smart car and has a back seat and a trunk. I think the new ones are in the same price range. I don't get the smart car at all? My friend got 40 mpg on his last long highway trip in his Corolla. My 1995 Corolla gets 31 mpg around town (automatic). Old, old, news. It's easy to get a road bike in the back seat without getting the seat dirty if you remove the front wheel.

A lot of Smarts have been sold in Germany. It took a long while to get it over here because the gas tank--which was in the frame in the original design--couldn't be sold here because US regulations were not written to accommodate such a departure from standard car-building practices.

The Smart was designed by Swatch--you can change the fenders to match your attire. The wheelbase is very short, which compromises freeway comfort. However, it has plenty of leg room inside.

You can fit 2 full sized road bikes inside a Toyota Prius.

That would be my choice also. The Prius gets MUCH better fuel economy that those listed, and it's a mid-sized auto.

... Brad

I would only buy a smart car for exclusive driving and parking in San Francisco. There are so many tiny parking spaces in between buildings that a standard car can't fit but the smart car would. I heard it's illegal now to park the car sideways headlights pointing towards center of road.

The Honda Fit is a great looking car. There are a couple I see in the parking lot at work everyday and the interior is quite spacious as Eric mentioned above.

We're going for unusual. ;) Although we will probably test drive a Fit as well. Thanks for that suggestion!

Oh, you want unusual! Too bad they don't still sell this (http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/features/0308scc_renault_r5_turbo_2/index.html).

JB

That woulda been a definite candidate. :D