Professional Cycling For the Fans - Why do the French suck this year?

Or every year for that matter?

I actually did a search on this forum and it hasn't been discussed for a while.

You have to go way down in the standing before you find a Frenchman. If you go to the bottom of the standings, and you see them clustered.

Are demographics catching up with them? The native French don't reproduce that well, and the Muslim youth that are becoming the new majority don't seem to have embraced the sport of cycling.

But they sure seem to suck at their own race.

The gracious host always allows the guests to win

They're in a bit of a slump lately. It'll come around some day and the Spanish will go through a rough period.

seems to me they're doing better than in the last few years. the versus gang is always pointing out that the breaks are full of french guys. okay, they don't win, but you never used to see 'em at all. some think it's because the french teams (besides cofidis) had cleaned up and were always coming in behind doped teams

One stage win already. I think Dessel is good for one later on too.

http://tour-de-france.velonews.com/files/images/dumoulinwins.jpg

They'll go all out on Bastille Day, then their loaf is shot.

Suck? This is the best I've seen from the French in quite a while. Hell even froze over for one day!

The French used to dominate the TdF but that was many many many moons ago. Realistically, they have no chance for the Yellow nor the Green jersey. That leaves Polka Dot or stage wins. At least they've been active contesting for breakaways and such. There probably isn't a French rider who's a serious contender for the overall for ... what ... the next five years? Weird, but true.

The French used to dominate the TdF but that was many many many moons ago. Realistically, they have no chance for the Yellow nor the Green jersey. That leaves Polka Dot or stage wins. At least they've been active contesting for breakaways and such. There probably isn't a French rider who's a serious contender for the overall for ... what ... the next five years? Weird, but true.

Exactly. And why?

Exactly. And why?

I'll ignore the idiotic tone of this post and give a sincere reply.

could be many reasons, but my opinion is that it could be related to: 1)antiquated training/development methodology for young and junior cycling programs vs. those in other countries where cycling is a major sport (spain, italy, belgium, etc.). 2) the French riders on French teams are not doping. 3)a snowball effect, the absence of a great French GT contender to emulate, along with great footballers (zidan, henry, et. al.) in recent generation has good athletes pursuing other sports.

I would say that the French riders and teams are having a great tour though, they've been all over the front of the race, have been very aggressive in animating each stage, and have a stage win to their credit. By those criteria, you could ask the question why do the Americans suck this year, no stage wins and only 1 aggressive breakaway stage with representation.

I'll ignore the idiotic tone of this post and give a sincere reply.

could be many reasons, but my opinion is that it could be related to: 1)antiquated training/development methodology for young and junior cycling programs vs. those in other countries where cycling is a major sport (spain, italy, belgium, etc.). 2) the French riders on French teams are not doping. 3)a snowball effect, the absence of a great French GT contender to emulate, along with great footballers (zidan, henry, et. al.) in recent generation has good athletes pursuing other sports.

I would say that the French riders and teams are having a great tour though, they've been all over the front of the race, have been very aggressive in animating each stage, and have a stage win to their credit. By those criteria, you could ask the question why do the Americans suck this year, no stage wins and only 1 aggressive breakaway stage with representation.

I'll avoid your challenge to my manhood and respond: there are four American riders in the tour this year. Four. And the best one was excluded by a French ruling committee. There are more French riders in the bottom ten then there are Americans in the whole tour.

The French and other western Europeans have been committing demographic suicide for decades, with their low birth rates and reliance on immigrants who do not share their love of cycling. I'm wondering if it's catching up with them.

And you're telling me that hosting the greatest sporting event in the world is not motivation enough to generate an occasional GC top ten finisher?

I'll avoid your challenge to my manhood and respond: there are four American riders in the tour this year. Four. And the best one was excluded by a French ruling committee. There are more French riders in the bottom ten then there are Americans in the whole tour.

The French and other western Europeans have been committing demographic suicide for decades, with their low birth rates and reliance on immigrants who do not share their love of cycling. I'm wondering if it's catching up with them.

And you're telling me that hosting the greatest sporting event in the world is not motivation enough to generate an occasional GC top ten finisher?

I'll ignore the idiotic tone of who authored this post

It is the Curse of Fat Greggy! Until a Frenchman sacrifices himself for his team leader as Greg did in 85 no Frenchman will ever win the Tour.

The demographics in France aren't much different than they are in Belgium, Spain or Italy. Or the UK, which AFAIK has never produced a Tour winner.

Not to mention that 3 top contenders (Kirchen & the Schleck bros) are from Luxembourg (population: 500k).

Or that 12 of the last 23 years were dominated by two riders: Indurain (SP) and Armstrong (US). Plus Lemond took 3. Before them, Hinault (FR) won 5 Tours.

Last but not least, there really isn't all that much special about growing up in a certain country. The US is a cycling backwater but is still able to produce a handful of top-notch riders (or at least tour winners :)).

So it's probably a mix: who's talented, who's getting the right training & nutrition, who's motivated, who has the right tactics, who is dedicating the resources, who's really got what it takes to do a long stage race, who's on the right team.

The demographics in France aren't much different than they are in Belgium, Spain or Italy. Or the UK, which AFAIK has never produced a Tour winner.

Not to mention that 3 top contenders (Kirchen & the Schleck bros) are from Luxembourg (population: 500k).

Or that 12 of the last 23 years were dominated by two riders: Indurain (SP) and Armstrong (US). Plus Lemond took 3. Before them, Hinault (FR) won 5 Tours.

Last but not least, there really isn't all that much special about growing up in a certain country. The US is a cycling backwater but is still able to produce a handful of top-notch riders (or at least tour winners :)).

So it's probably a mix: who's talented, who's getting the right training & nutrition, who's motivated, who has the right tactics, who is dedicating the resources, who's really got what it takes to do a long stage race, who's on the right team.

good answer.

Actually to be fair to France it seems the world changed all of a sudden at elast as far as the TDF goes. 1985 and before the GC was dominated by France Italy and Belgium with Spain getting a mention. Since then the big 3 have a total of 1 win between them with the GC being dominated by riders from countries that rarely won before 1985, excect that Spain has decent representation on both sides of this split.


The demographics in France aren't much different than they are in Belgium, Spain or Italy. Or the UK, which AFAIK has never produced a Tour winner.

Not to mention that 3 top contenders (Kirchen & the Schleck bros) are from Luxembourg (population: 500k).

Or that 12 of the last 23 years were dominated by two riders: Indurain (SP) and Armstrong (US). Plus Lemond took 3. Before them, Hinault (FR) won 5 Tours.

Last but not least, there really isn't all that much special about growing up in a certain country. The US is a cycling backwater but is still able to produce a handful of top-notch riders (or at least tour winners :)).

So it's probably a mix: who's talented, who's getting the right training & nutrition, who's motivated, who has the right tactics, who is dedicating the resources, who's really got what it takes to do a long stage race, who's on the right team.

I'll ignore the idiotic tone of who authored this post

Your invective did not constitute a rational or reasonable answer. It was consistent with the bellowing of an ideologue.

I read the more considered answers with interest. I question the French's inability to adopt new training techniques or nutritional standards. Surely they are as capable of figuring that stuff out as anyone else.

Perhaps the answer is more Yogi Berra-esque: "I ain't in no slump -- I just ain't hittin'". The French are doing fine, they're just not winning?

But I had no idea the mere question would incite such a hateful response.

Maybe there is a shortage of chemists and crooked doctors in France.

More seriously, France has become a nation of cars lovers and a driving society, just like the U.S. and the rest of the western countries, and more so than some. While the Tour itself still generates a lot of interest, and the Classics too, it's not really a cycling society anymore, in the sense that young boys and girls don't really grow up dreaming of cycling. They dream of football.

Frankly, I think that most of the cyclotouristes you would encounter in France are probably North Americans or Japanese. You know the "French fit" that gets talked about here, and the 650B-equipped randonneuses and the constructeur bikes? I think Americans and Canadians probably know more about those than the French at this point. In fact, I don't think I've ever even heard of a "French fit" in France.

I heard recently that there are almost as many "full-figured" women in Paris as there are in N.Y.C. I've never been to either so I wouldn't know.

America has done a really great job of exporting their obesity. I think we're second in obesity figures now, behind Australia. Not meant as a smug observation, more as the consequences of vast prosperity.

As for the French, maybe the "not doping" idea does have some merit. They really haven't been really great since the Festina scandal. Even just counting Moreau and Virenque, that's huge. Maybe, among all the other reasons, they are a little bit cleaner because of that. Virenque certainly wasn't the same, and I really don't think you can blame it all on the suspension he eventually served.

It's too bad, it'd be fun to mock a frenchman in yellow. Childish and purely out of jealousy, but sometimes the lobbed softball of a joke opening MUST be hit. :)

America has done a really great job of exporting their obesity.

:lol:

And I'm sure we forced y'all to stuff your pie holes too

:roflmao2:

what exactly happened to moreau? i guess he's 35 or 36...but yikes, so is piepoli! no word on exactly what got moreau to blow a gasket so early...

I heard recently that there are almost as many "full-figured" women in Paris as there are in N.Y.C. I've never been to either so I wouldn't know.

I'd agree to that, but NYC is not representative of US obesity rates. Compare Paris to Houston and you get a whole different perspective.