Cyclocross - Scattante XRL Cross Frame

Cross posted to Commuters as that's my purpose for it.

I just recieved my XRL Frame from Performance. $250 before any rebates.

Out of the box it's well packed with dropout spacers in between both the front and rear forks. The carbon fork is zipped tied to the frame. In a seperate box comes the integrated FSA headset and brake cable carrier.

Once I took it out I started looking around. Welds are pretty neat, but larger (~1/4") especially at the botttom bracket.

The main graphics on the frame and fork are under the clearcoat, but the "Made in China", frame size and tubing info are on top and removeable. There are plenty of bosses: Two frame/fender bosses on the rear dropout, rack mounts on the seat stays, threaded brake bridge and chainstay bridge, two bottle cages, fender bosses on the fork with a hole on the crown as well.

The downtube is triangular or teardrop shaped, but the rest of the tubing is round. The cable rounting is mountain style on the top tube, which requires a top pull derailer or a cross pulley and guess what? There's a boss for that, too.

The fork is carbon with an aluminum steerer that sticks up ~6" above the top of the headtube uncut. The finish is smooth with no noticeable inperfections. It's black where it meets the frame and fades to show the natural carbon weave next to the raw aluminum dropouts.

Sorry, no photos for now, or weight. I'll try to add those later.

I'm retiring my '90s Trek 2300 7 tube CF frame and swapping all the gear to this new frame. I'm looking forward to having a go fast that I can switch between my fully rigged LHT for the 16 mile commute.

I have been looking at the XRL frame also. Im planning on building a cyclocross over the winter months. Have you completed and taken the bike for a ride? How did it feel on the road, and off road?

Thanks
Zack

I'm in the middle of building one of these right now for my wife as a "utility" bike. It seems like a nice enough frame, and I got it for wicked cheap since it's discontinued and there are limited sizes remaining.

I don't actually do cyclocross, and if I did I wouldn't use this frame. The top-tube has a bladed/oval shape, with the sharpest edge being on the underside. The exact OPPOSITE of what you want in an actual cyclocross frame.

Banzai, I have no clue why that is a bad thing. Can you explain why the top tube is not a good thing for cyclocross bikes?

The point on the bottom of the top tube makes it painful to shoulder the bike in the traditional CX way.

I see! Thanks for clearing that up for me Cynilkal. While you guys are giving advice what is your opinion on the Nashbar cyclocross frame?

http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=6000130&subcategory=60001176&brand=&sku=15767&storetype=&estoreid=&pagename=Shop%20by%20Subcat%3A%20Frames%2FBikes

Thanks

I see! Thanks for clearing that up for me Cynilkal. While you guys are giving advice what is your opinion on the Nashbar cyclocross frame?

http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=6000130&subcategory=60001176&brand=&sku=15767&storetype=&estoreid=&pagename=Shop%20by%20Subcat%3A%20Frames%2FBikes

Thanks

I use that frame for my utility/commuter bicycle. I LOVE it. Great frame.

By the way, the Scattante XRL frame looks like it's going to work out great...I just wouldn't do actual Cyclocross racing on it due to the top tube shape.

Thanks Banzai. Im planning on building up a bike for the road, gravel paths, and easier off road trails. Im not planning on actually cyclocross racing. So Im looking for opinions on both the scattante xrl cross and the nashbar x aluminum frames!

Thanks again

I'm in the middle of building one of these right now for my wife as a "utility" bike. It seems like a nice enough frame, and I got it for wicked cheap since it's discontinued and there are limited sizes remaining.

I don't actually do cyclocross, and if I did I wouldn't use this frame. The top-tube has a bladed/oval shape, with the sharpest edge being on the underside. The exact OPPOSITE of what you want in an actual cyclocross frame.

My wife has one. Aside from the tt it's an amazing frame (for the money). She did some shouldering with it, and it didn't bother her... it would drive me nuts.

Thanks Banzai. Im planning on building up a bike for the road, gravel paths, and easier off road trails. Im not planning on actually cyclocross racing. So Im looking for opinions on both the scattante xrl cross and the nashbar x aluminum frames!

Thanks again

Well, like I said, I built up the Nashbar X frame. It's a great "do everything" bike. I commute on it on "laundry days". I raced it in the partially off road "Adventure Race" that the base sponsors. (2nd place!)

It's not the lightest, but it's light enough. It has lots of attach points, and the geometry is good for long rides.

Some "gotchas" are the 135mm rear hub spacing. That gives you more options to use with the disc tabs, but you'll likely need to build your own wheels if you want to run 700c. I run Deore disc hubs with Mavic A317 Disc hubs, self built.

The frame is STIFF. So ride 32mm width tires; you'll be happier that way.

I also got Nashbar's carbon fork to go with it. Not to save weight really, because it's a tank of a fork...mostly because it looked nice, and all the steel disc forks looked ugly.

I'm partway through the build of the Scattante frame. It's coming along really nicely, and the fork is actually pretty light considering how overbuilt it is for purposes of CX. Mrs Banzai is really excited about it.

I'm partway through the build of the Scattante frame. It's coming along really nicely, and the fork is actually pretty light considering how overbuilt it is for purposes of CX. Mrs Banzai is really excited about it.

Overbuilt is right! Mine feels like a freakin' mountain bike sometimes.

FWIW, this year's model does NOT have an ovalized TT. I would totally race 'cross on mine. I will admit that I have a bit of self-consciousness about the name, though...

Overbuilt is right! Mine feels like a freakin' mountain bike sometimes.

FWIW, this year's model does NOT have an ovalized TT. I would totally race 'cross on mine. I will admit that I have a bit of self-consciousness about the name, though...

Interesting. I just looked at the website, and it appears that they have TWO models on there...one with and one without an ovalized TT. Interestingly enough, the ovalized TT is now more expensive.

Non-ovalized: $260 (http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=25729&subcategory_ID=3020)

Ovalized: $330 (http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=23579&subcategory_ID=3020)

Can anyone post pictures of their builds?

Overbuilt is right! Mine feels like a freakin' mountain bike sometimes.

So it's not so good on the road? I've been thinking about buying one and transferring the parts from my Gunnar, which is a little too small.

So it's not so good on the road? I've been thinking about buying one and transferring the parts from my Gunnar, which is a little too small.


Well, think about bikes in a simple, un-influenced way for a second. Really all we're talking about is geometry. The cockpit can be setup so you are positioned like you would on your road bike, and you are in similar relation to your wheels, too (give or take a few half-degrees and mm). Bottom line is that if you were blind, you could probably feel like you were riding your road bike.

It's as good on the road as anything. It's just overbuilt, with super sturdy tubing and welds, and looks a little "thick" to the eye (which is an aesthetic thing). I kind of think 'cross bikes with cantis have a certain non-roadie look that's hard to express anyways, and the Scat just takes it a bit further. It's burly tubing, and burly carbon on the fork, too.

Compared to my super lightweight alu C'dale with flimsy carbon fork and calipers it really does look like a drop bar mountain bike.

But, I was riding with a leg shaver guy, full team kit and a ti Independent Fabrications with full Campy Record and making him feel like a wannabe ;) Seriously, not to brag, but just to show that the name on your bike and the aesthetics aren't all there is.

I have mine even more mtb rigged with an XTR rear mech and 11-33 rear cluster. No triple, prefer the compact double, but it's still a mean mountain pass machine! So, yeah, if I had fat tires on it then I would essentially have a drop bar mtb. Oh yeah, one more thing that makes it more mtb than 'cross bike is the compact geometry. More than the ovalized top tube, the compact geometry is annoying for carrying on your shoulder.

This is all to say I think the Scat makes an AWESOME commuter frame, and it's perfect for multi-use riding dirt roads, some light singletrack, and longer paved rides, too. And it's hella-light, to make it all awesome. And hey, that's why I have a superlight roadie in the stable, too :thumb:

I'm still in the middle of my build. I had to order a bottom bracket and the first shop screwed that up (yea for the LBS). The fork has a preliminary cut for the steerer and about four or five inches of spacers on it untill I ride it and try the positioning out.

I don't remember completely, but I think the downtube is the teardrop shaped tube, not the top tube. The top tube was round.

Pics maybe in the coming week? I'll have to stop on my commute through the burbs in order to find a white garage door, though...

I'm psyched to read all of your posts about what a great commuter frame this is. I just got my build back from the LBS, and although I haven't had a chance to ride it yet, it's really a great looking bike. A bit heavy, but that's not really a big consideration for the uses I have intended for it.

I bought it specifically for commuting and riding the dirt roads around my home and it sounds from everyone on this thread that it was a good choice. I got the frame and fork (delivered) for $219.00 from Performance and swapped over an Ultegra gruppo from my old road bike and I ended up with a complete bike for less than $400.00.

I don't know if I'll ever do a cross race, but I have it if that ever comes to pass.

Hope everyone else's builds work out well.

BTA2

Any idea how big a tire the Scattante frame can take?

Thanks,

Eric

I emailed Performance, they gave 35 as a reply. However, tires larger than 28 won't clear the brakes upfront on removal without deflation, according to some users.

I'm not getting every bodies complaints about this frame being a tank. I pulled mine apart to strip the frame and the weight was very comparable to much higher priced frames at 3.4 lbs for the 57cm frame and the fork was a surprising 650g with the steerer cut. My bike is 19 lbs even as shown.

I got one of these and built it up this summer. I've got it running a 1x8 setup, and I'm pretty happy with it ride-wise. I've been commuting with it on-and-off (between my track bike and this), and it's handled well for that. First cross race (ever) this week, will report back if need be. Mine is the round TT version.

I'm not getting every bodies complaints about this frame being a tank. I pulled mine apart to strip the frame and the weight was very comparable to much higher priced frames at 3.4 lbs for the 57cm frame and the fork was a surprising 650g with the steerer cut. My bike is 19 lbs even as shown.

For me weight is no issue...heck, I've had true MTB frames that weigh less than that! The tank-ishness is just the aesthetic, the look, and yours has it too. Like I said, ride it blind and you'd think you were on a roadie.

Of course, my road frameset weighs in at 2.8 lbs, so there is some discrepancy, but more is going to come from the components than the frameset. Wheels, heavy rings and cassettes, heavy tires, etc...all add up to 19 lbs when a lightweight, flimsy roadie can clock in at 15.

Whaddaya think?

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_0011.JPG

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_008.JPG

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_007.JPG

Whaddaya think?

Climbhoser? The Climbhoser from telemarktips.com??

:thumb:Nice bike :thumb:

Climbhoser? The Climbhoser from telemarktips.com??

Big part of the reason I've kept this moniker for 10 years is because no one else seems to use it :D

Wanna buy a bike?

I just picked up an XRL a few weeks back. I built it up with nothing but the finest in lightweight components and/or whatever I had lying around in my spare parts bin.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y105/seat_boy/Scattanteside.jpg

It has some nice features. The rear dropout has double eyelets for racks and fenders:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y105/seat_boy/Scattanterrdropout.jpg

The carbon fork has room for a fattish tire, but you can't remove the wheel without deflating the tire. That sucks:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y105/seat_boy/Scattantefork.jpg

There's probably enough room in the back for a 38mm tire, that's a 34mm I have in there now:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y105/seat_boy/Scattanterrclearance.jpg


Overall, it's a pretty nice frame. It feels light and stiff. Maybe too stiff to my steel loving body, but it would be a decent frame if I ever get off my rear and actually raced. I'm not crazy about the huge, triangular downtube. Doesn't everyone want the cliche of "laterally stiff, yet vertically compliant?" The way this is shaped, it turns out to be "laterally compliant, yet vertically stiff." Although that compliance is pretty much theoretical.

Eric

Whaddaya think?

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_0011.JPG

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_008.JPG

http://www.telemarktips.com/photopost/data/500/Family_Pictures_007.JPG

V-brakes with drop levers?

How did you work this particular trick without the universe flying apart at 6000 miles per minute.

V-brakes with drop levers?

How did you work this particular trick without the universe flying apart at 6000 miles per minute.

Those particular levers are the Tektro RL520/Cane Creek Drop V, designed to work with linear pull brakes.

I used to have something similar in the DiaCompe 287v, but wasn't ever satisfied with their performance. I wonder if the Tektro/CC works better?

We now resume your regularly scheduled universal implosion, already in progress.

My Tektros work fine with V brakes. Not so well with my rear canti brake, though, but I expected that.

they're Cane Creek Drop-Vs. I had some trouble with airbomb.com ordering the Tektros and since they are also beyond bikes the nice guy on the phone sent them from beyond bikes and took the difference from airbomb. I wonder how that'll look to an accountant!

They work great. Most powerful braking I've ever had from a rim brake with drop bars, by far. Work just as well as my MTB levers, in fact, albeit with slightly fewer adjustments. They are also the comfiest hoods I've ever used. Weird, but they just fit my hand right.

i bought one last year and raced it all season with no problems, sure the pointy TT is slightly annoying but in practice its hardly an issue.

the paint was uuuuglllyyyyy though so i stripped both of mine and had em done up in team colors.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3123/2878269797_bdbeec0557_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3214/2865402126_0206f141cc_b.jpg

The carbon fork has room for a fattish tire, but you can't remove the wheel without deflating the tire. That sucks:
I have the same fork and I only have that problem because of my brakes. I don't see how you'd have that problem with V's.

The pink/black paintjob is great!

What can I say, it is definitely a problem. It's a pretty normal combination: MA3 rim with a Hutchinson Acrobat 37mm (nominal, actually 34mm) tire. I have to deflate the tire quite a bit to get the wheel out, and even then it takes a good whack to get it loose. My brake pads aren't unusually thick or anything.


I have the same fork and I only have that problem because of my brakes. I don't see how you'd have that problem with V's.

anyone weigh their scattante frame and fork combo?

What can I say, it is definitely a problem. It's a pretty normal combination: MA3 rim with a Hutchinson Acrobat 37mm (nominal, actually 34mm) tire. I have to deflate the tire quite a bit to get the wheel out, and even then it takes a good whack to get it loose. My brake pads aren't unusually thick or anything.Maybe I'm just not understanding... where is it hanging up? On my bike the tire gets hung up by the brake pads when you try to pull the wheel out.

With V-brakes you can just pull the noodle out of the first arm, and that lets both brake arms swing well free of the tire. That's why I'm saying I can't imagine a problem with V's.

Maybe I'm just not understanding... where is it hanging up? On my bike the tire gets hung up by the brake pads when you try to pull the wheel out.

With V-brakes you can just pull the noodle out of the first arm, and that lets both brake arms swing well free of the tire. That's why I'm saying I can't imagine a problem with V's.

Yes, but your Vs will only swing open as wide as the fork will allow. Even though this fork is wide enough for 35mm tires and then some, they are relatively narrow. My Vs open just as wide as any cantilever (my cantis have quick-pulls) and on this bike it's just not that wide. I have to deflate wide tires, too. In fact, it was a pretty close scrape with 28mm tires!

...I don't actually do cyclocross, and if I did I wouldn't use this frame. The top-tube has a bladed/oval shape, with the sharpest edge being on the underside. The exact OPPOSITE of what you want in an actual cyclocross frame.

Not an issue in practice. I've raced four races on the Scattante frame now (with the teardrop TT), and if you are doing the shouldering correctly (i.e. lifting the bike by the downtube, setting it gently down, high on your shoulder on the neck/back muscle and not on your actual shoulder bone), there is no problem at all.

At the beginning of the season, I was doing it incorrectly (raising the bike by the TT, shoving my elbow through the triangle, dropping it low on my shoulder onto the bone, and putting my arm over the bike handlebars, thus having the bike too far forward, resting on my shoulder bone, and adding the weight of my arm to that of the bike) and had a bruise on my shoulder. After a clinic where I learned to do it correctly; no problems whatsoever. In all of the four races, I've had to shoulder the bike once or twice a lap for 5-7 laps a race and I've had no issues with shoulder bruising. The only bruise I got from shouldering the bike, ironically, is on my forearm. While running up the runups, I must be hugging the downtube too tight.

Yes, but your Vs will only swing open as wide as the fork will allow. Even though this fork is wide enough for 35mm tires and then some, they are relatively narrow. My Vs open just as wide as any cantilever (my cantis have quick-pulls) and on this bike it's just not that wide. I have to deflate wide tires, too. In fact, it was a pretty close scrape with 28mm tires!
gotcha, thanks.

I built mine up and am not happy with it at all. I used Tektro's cross cantis (CR720) and have a massive shudder in the front fork. When I grab the brake the bars are nearly shuddered out of my hands. I thought this would just be a break-in/adjustment issue and decided to clean the rims and pads, but to no avail. After that I put Koolstops in front with the same result. You can actually watch the fork flex front and back when you brake. There's nothing too out of the ordinary with the wheels or levers, either: Mavic Ksyriums with Conti Contact 28s and Ultegra STIs with Cane Creek interupters. The pads were toe'd properly and the rear stock pad did just fine. It may be just too much power for a plastic fork. I took it apart this afternoon and am returning it to the store this week. This is pretty disappointing. I liked the ride pretty well otherwise and it looked sharp as mess with my setup. The only thing I can think of that might be a problem is that I have a bunch of steerer tube out to keep the bars high and comfy. The other builds here have theirs down close to the headset with Locust running a similar brake setup sans interupters.

If it helps, I'm about to install a fork mounted cable stop and 720's to combat fork shudder. as I understand it, shudder can be caused by the flexing in the steer tube and the fork and moving the stop will reduce that. This is why mini V's tend to work better.

Also, make sure your headset is adjusted properly.

The pads were toe'd properlyApparently not.

Before giving up, I would try two things:
1) More toe-in. I mean, lots of toe-in. Failing that...
2) Tektro mini-V brakes.

Some people claim that a fork-mounted cable hanger is less susceptible to shudder, which might actually make some sense.

The integrated headset came with a cable hanger which acts as a top spacer, which I used. The headset was shop installed and was snug. I also tried three or four other toe-in settings ranging from very little to substantially greater than I normally would use along with a change in pads with no change in the problem. I'm not going to buy another set of brakes, though. That's pushing my wallet & patience. It's already disassembled and ready to be returned. I don't feel comfortable with that much visible flex along the fork leg while braking. Shrug.

I don't feel comfortable with that much visible flex along the fork leg while braking. Shrug.I think that pretty much comes with the territory with carbon forks. A bit of flex is even considered a selling point. I think you'll see more and more people running V's or mini-V's on their front, because canti brake squeal seems endemic to light carbon forks.

For myself, I never had brake squeal problems until I swapped my steel fork for a carbon. Right now I have a workable solution (mini-V), and have lifted over a pound from the rig, but still think about moving back to the steel (or maybe aluminum? hard to find these days).

My 54 cm 1 x 9 weighs in at 21lbs. I have a total of $600 into it.

Here's what I found:

Front fork Vibration -
Lots of vibration. Lost some of it when I went to a different front wheel with a smoother brake surface. I have old school LX canti's up front and have tried many different toe-in and pad settings to no avail.

Front fork Clearance -
Only by running old school canti's am I able to get the front wheel out without deflating the tire. I won't run Avids or V-brakes because they don't open far enough. Bad design. I am going to buy a different fork.

Brake cable hanger -
The factory one slips over the steer tube. I found that it could slip around the tube and change the brake adjustment side to side. I replaced it with one that clamps around the steer tube.

Pointy top tube -
Bad design that was fixed this year. Doesn't bother me the way I carry the bike.

Geometry -
Not much to say. I get a bunch of toe overlap on my 54. Was NOT expecting this, but its not the worst thing.

Overall -
Its my favorite bike. No worries bashing it around. Gets more miles than anything else. Lots of fun beating dudes on high dollar stuff.

-Z