Foo - Forgiveness

Forgivness is a funny thing, isn't it?

So, I received an email the other day from "the ex's (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=442338)" sister, saying "I really hope someday you can forgive him for whatever he has done, I really miss you being part of the family, and I know he misses you, too." etc... I didn't write back, and don't intend to.

I understand where she is coming from. After all, I lost a great second family and a few friends in the process. She and I were pretty close, but that's just the way it goes when decisions like that have to be made.

However, I've been thinking a lot lately (even before that email) I wish I could find forgiveness. Not so I could take him back, but to make peace with myself. I'm tired of being angry.

"Holding anger is a poison...It eats you from inside...We think that by hating someone we hurt them...But hatred is a curved blade...and the harm we do to others...we also do to ourselves... "

...anyone have some advice to share, maybe a story on how you found forgiveness?

Hoo boy.

Basically what it comes down to: It has a lot to do with inner peace.

Why has your relationship with her diminished because of your separation? Are the two inclusive of each other? You know, you don't have to like Bill in order to like Suzy, even tho Suzy likes Bill. :)

You can't force it. True forgiveness can only happen when you let go of the anger. If it's not something you can let go of now, then you can't really forgive him. It may not be something you can ever let go of. That's ok. Some things you can't forgive. Don't dwell, but keep it in your mind, and when or if the day comes when you've let that anger go, then forgive him, but don't do it before.

Funny thing about a grudge, we feel as if we're entitled to it...like it's a prize for being the wronged one.

"But who's still aching now?
Who's tired of her own voice?
Who is it weighing down
With no gift from time of said healing..."

Stacey, you are right, but the forgiveness doesn't have anything to do with my friendship with his sister though. Honestly, for my own well-being, its best to move on.

The struggle I have is that he is scheduled for deployment (army/infantry) in early 2009. I just wish I could find that forgivness... you never know what might happen.

Stacey, you are right, but the forgiveness doesn't have anything to do with my friendship with his sister though. Honestly, for my own well-being, its best to move on.

The struggle I have is that he is scheduled for deployment (army/infantry) in early 2009. I just wish I could find that forgivness... you never know what might happen.

Sorry but this sounds like you are being played for a guilt trip.

Just take it one day at a time. If you were hurt by him, it can take quite a while to heal, before you can let go. The ironic thing is, letting go, really helps the healing process.

So I guess it just comes down to time. But I do have to admit- letting go of all that toxic anger and hurt, and forgiving someone, really does feel good- but as UA said, it isn't going to happen until you are ready.

Stacey, you are right, but the forgiveness doesn't have anything to do with my friendship with his sister though. Honestly, for my own well-being, its best to move on.

The struggle I have is that he is scheduled for deployment (army/infantry) in early 2009. I just wish I could find that forgivness... you never know what might happen.

Don't try to push it. If you do, forgiving someone doesn't mean anything. It's only to make them feel better. It has to come naturally.

Stacey, you are right, but the forgiveness doesn't have anything to do with my friendship with his sister though. Honestly, for my own well-being, its best to move on.

The struggle I have is that he is scheduled for deployment (army/infantry) in early 2009. I just wish I could find that forgivness... you never know what might happen.

That, only you can resolve with yourself. Can't tell you how, it just happens because you want it to.

ourselves... "[/I][/COLOR]

...anyone have some advice to share, maybe a story on how you found forgiveness?

time and distance. Helps a lot.
And forgiveness does not mean returning things to the way they were.

^^^^


Often I find forgiveness by realizing how much better my life is, still, in comparison to others out there. Isnt that what its about at the end of the day?

Sorry but this sounds like you are being played for a guilt trip.
perhaps. deployment or not, I'm still not talking to the guy.
but, I do know for a fact his unit is scheduled to deploy (upcoming election, etc may change that- but there's still a chance he'd be headed overseas elsewhere).

you all are right- forgiveness will happen when/if it happens. I can't exactly put a deadline on it.

It just sucks being angry, and is totally not my style! :mad:

Anger is a choice, just let it go. Seriously, if you realize how much pain/discomfort the anger causes you, even though it's righteous...if you just let it slip away and refuse to hold on to it you'll be freeing yourself. As SIU said, it's all about inner peace.

anger comes from hurt.
When the hurt is gone, the anger will fade.
maybe he has apologised, FWIW, and maybe you have accepted, also FWIW.
time and distance.

On the other hand, one doesn't have to forgive to let go of a lot of anger.

When it comes to anger, I (being religious) turn to prayer.

Many others I know who are not religious turn to meditation.

Its almost like it gives your mind/spirit/whatever you want to call it, a chance to put all the pieces where they belong. IMHO, much of what causes anger is all of those mottled, frustrated thoughts not having the right place in your mind. Take the time to let yourself relax, and naturally let yourself put things in their place, and the anger will start to go away.

Now that was way too philosophical for me for the day.. but I hope it helps! :)

time heals all wounds.
Don't rush it. Its a process you have to go through, and its unique to each person.

I love the way Buddha said it: Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned.

It just sucks being angry, and is totally not my style! :mad:

Bike it out!

Wise man once say:
"You can't help what happen to you, but only you can make yourself miserable"

Okay, personal story here. My father died back in 1999 from cancer. He and I had a lot of issues. A LOT of issues. He and my mom divorced when I was about thirteen. He left her with a lot of debt and went on to a number of failed business ventures. Didn't pay the child support, etc. Then went off, re-married and started a brand new family, including two sons.

My dad and I made some kind of peace on his deathbed, but it wasn't complete. Far from it, as a matter of fact. It was good enough to allow me to say goodbye, but I had a lot of lingering anger a year later. (And I've got the shrink bills to prove it.) It was anger that I felt I couldn't express and that I had lost the chance to express to my father the day he got sick.

The advice I got was to write. It's always been an outlet for me. Anyway, the words put on paper were venomous; really nasty. I said a lot of things there that I probably couldn't have said to my father's face. The point is, that the purpose of expressing that anger isn't to punish, correct, or even communicate to the person your angry at. It's to communicate with yourself. It's to acknowlege that anger and get it out. You don't need to forgive him as much as you need to forgive you. Forgive yourself for being taken advantage of, forgive yourself for being in a bad relationship, and forgive yourself for being angry about all those things. It's not for him. He doesn't need to know about it or hear about it.

Good luck.

bluebottle- wonderful advice, thanks for sharing. glad to hear you are finding your peace.

You don't need to forgive him as much as you need to forgive you. Forgive yourself for being taken advantage of, forgive yourself for being in a bad relationship, and forgive yourself for being angry about all those things. It's not for him. He doesn't need to know about it or hear about it.

Good luck.

((hugs)) :o

Personally I've always found it easier to forgive someone than to be angry with them. I wouldn't presume to speak for you, but I've found that my own anger in such situations to be a mask for hurt. Once I identify why I'm hurting I can work on healing that and move forward.

I consider forgiving and forgetting to be two different things. Maybe he is confusing the two. Just because you forgive him, doesn't mean everything is better and you can have some kind of friendship or relationship. I forgave an ex-gf and feel I could be polite if I bumped into her, but I'm not going to initiate any contact w/ her or hang out with her again.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/417LVC2P7cL.jpg

i stopped holding onto anger and it's been 2 months...I'm quite happy this summer to be honest!

Stacey, you are right, but the forgiveness doesn't have anything to do with my friendship with his sister though. Honestly, for my own well-being, its best to move on.

The struggle I have is that he is scheduled for deployment (army/infantry) in early 2009. I just wish I could find that forgivness... you never know what might happen.

Forgiveness doesn't mean you have to talk to him, be his friend, or even think about him. It just means you've released the fury in your soul you've been gripping on to.

I think it's less about forgiveness and more just about letting go of the anger. You don't have to forgive him. But you do have to let go of the anger and move on with your life. Don't dwell on the past. Just keep moving forward and keep your eye on the happier things in your life.

If he was wrong, he needs to be right. It is not your responsibility to forgive him, it's his responsibility make things right as best he can, only once this happens do you need to forgive him.

Your anger is a separate issue and overcoming it will come from within you, not from anything having to do with your relationship with him, but with recognizing what you are outside of that relationship and working to make that the best it can be. When you feel angry at whatever he did, try to channel that energy into your personal goals, into being a better you. When you mourn the loss of the friends and family that were a part of that relationship, channel your energy into strengthening the relationships you have with other friends and family. The best way to stop being angry is to work to make yourself a better person than the angry you.

Give it some time. Time heals all.

As i read on this thread and from personal experience: find happiness with yourself first and then ammend broken ties/bridges and close chapters that are just water under the bridges.

Good luck

I'm actually still friendly with the ex, we've gone back to where we were in the first place - friends. Although I must say I did not have any contact with him for a year because I was so mad at him.

I get invited by his parents and aunt to different functions still.

Time certainly heals. In order to let go of anger, you must be clear/sure what exactly your angry about. Live in the present also, the more you dwell on the past, the more it affects you. I agree with everyone here though, that you have to find that inner calm, that inner happiness first.

BTW...for what it's worth...the email from the ex's sister, sounds like a classic guilt trip e-mail.

I know this is not going to add to the advice that you want or need but, artifice, I totally know what you're going through.

Hang in there girl. <hug>

Time certainly heals. In order to let go of anger, you must be clear/sure what exactly your angry about. Live in the present also, the more you dwell on the past, the more it affects you. I agree with everyone here though, that you have to find that inner calm, that inner happiness first.

Bravo! I agree 100%.

If you dwell on the past you will not be able to move forward in your life.

http://bp3.blogger.com/_QwbS82Olj98/R1Aa-aOk1qI/AAAAAAAAAEQ/9AMxBvwVXK0/s320/bridge.jpg


and move on.

Yeah, what everyone else said.

I find the most frustrating people are the ones who can't understand what they did wrong or can't understand that there are other legitimate points of view; those who are narcissistic and can't empathize with what others are going through because they are so self-involved.

That being said, it's ultimately all about you. You can decide to forgive and also decide that the healthiest thing for you is to not communicate with him or his family/friends anymore. The imminent deployment and contact from his sister are guilt trips you don't have to take. It's not selfish to conclude that the best thing for you is to cease communication.

Time will heal all. Sometimes it helps to put your anger/negative feelings into some kind of creative outlet. Write down your thoughts, paint a picture, draw, poetry, etc. I find that the physical act of transferring the negative "energy" out of myself and into something else to be very healing.

Hmmm maybe that's why I never write happy songs...

I tend to not forgive unless someone either asks for it and/or proves that they have taken steps to fix the consequences of their actions. I expect no less when asking for forgiveness.

I do let go of my anger, though. Used to be through fencing, now through cycling. I sweat out my anger...

I think it's important not to let yesterday consume too much of today, so it's important to come to your conclusions about things, and move on. I don't call it forgiveness, just an acknowledgment of the lessons learned. Make your decisions, then go ahead and go back to living without need to think them over again. If you're still unsettled on the topic that's bothering you, then you haven't given yourself a good enough conclusion about it, and need to address it.

Forgiveness reminds me of the old Christian thing of how the church ruled over the peasantry back in the day. They threatened them with all manner of torture and eternal fire until they atoned for their sins in various ways profitable to the church. "And she's buying the stairway to heaven" is based on history. Forgiveness doesn't really have a functional use in today's society.

Another country heard from. :)

Bike it out!

Yeah! And post more pictures. ;)

I guess it all depends on how you define forgiveness. For me , I look at everything as a lesson, and when there is anger involved the lesson and knowing I am able to grow as a person as a result of a relationship or an incident always dissapates the anger quite quickly. I may also be a sap, but I can't for the life of me hold a grudge against anyone. Smack me in the face, and I'll take you for coffee the next day, no harm done.

Now forgiveness, that's something different all together. I usually equate forgiveness with a remorse shown by another party. But what if they don't have or show remorse? I was in a relationship once with someone - learned lots of lessons. Have I forgiven this person for events? Well, they since they don't have any remorse for any of their actions, and effect of their actions on others around them. Isn't that remorse required for forgiveness? I have closure and and able to move on, but given what's happened, I can't see myself ever becoming more than passing aquaintences with this person. Not so much because of things that happened between us, but moreso being able to look back a little more objectively and see the actions of this person on others without being blinded by the relationship between the two of us.

Sorry - not sure if that helps at all.

However, I've been thinking a lot lately (even before that email) I wish I could find forgiveness. Not so I could take him back, but to make peace with myself. I'm tired of being angry.
Two things came to mind as I read this thread. One is that you need your life back -- if you can't get a grip on your anger, your ex (who isn't even around) is exerting way too much control over you.

I might be reading too much into this, but I think the emphasis I'm seeing on forgiveness is misplaced. Anger and a need to forgive come from a sense of being wronged and a need to make things right.

You gotta come to terms with the fact that some things will never be right and that's OK. It doesn't matter who did what or should have done what. The real question is what you should do given that things are what they are.

This guy belongs in your past as a fading memory. Letting go requires you to not worry about what he does or what rewards/punishments he encounters in life. Since you cannot change these things, thinking about them is a recipe for frustration. You need to just focus on yourself.

It seems kind of harsh to not even respond at all to the sister who was a good friend. What about at least a brief reply thanking her for her note and telling her you feel uncomfortable talking to her for the moment but will be in touch in a few months?

EDIT - I see in the other thread he has been trying to contact you. If her email might be part of his strategy to reconnect, I guess it makes sense not to respond.

...anyone have some advice to share, maybe a story on how you found forgiveness?

I never really forgave my ex, I just stopped talking to her one day.

It took a while but I was eventually able to celebrate two things: 1) I no longer have to drag around a major liability, 2) I learned a few lessons along the way, 3) at the end of the day, I'm not crazy like she is.

I never really forgave my ex, I just stopped talking to her one day.

It took a while but I was eventually able to celebrate two things: 1) I no longer have to drag around a major liability, 2) I learned a few lessons along the way, 3) at the end of the day, I'm not crazy like she is.

hmmm.... so you met my first wife?:p

This happened a few years ago. My daughter broke up with her then future husband due to things she couldnt deal with, we were all VERY, VERY close, we were family. After the break up everyone but my daughter (she told us it would never be the same) treid to keep the feeling going but it went sour right away. After a few failed attempts we just stopped. In the end my daughter was right.

I never really forgave my ex, I just stopped talking to her one day.

It took a while but I was eventually able to celebrate two things: 1) I no longer have to drag around a major liability, 2) I learned a few lessons along the way, 3) at the end of the day, I'm not crazy like she is.

Ummmm, thats three things :o Hey! One more thing to celebrate! :lol: ;)

This happened a few years ago. My daughter broke up with her then future husband due to things she couldnt deal with, we were all VERY, VERY close, we were family. After the break up everyone but my daughter (she told us it would never be the same) treid to keep the feeling going but it went sour right away. After a few failed attempts we just stopped. In the end my daughter was right.

yeah, it's just too hard. My original in-laws really liked me, and were much angrier at their daughter, but in the end, it was too awkward. You can't stay close.

It seems kind of harsh to not even respond at all to the sister who was a good friend. What about at least a brief reply thanking her for her note and telling her you feel uncomfortable talking to her for the moment but will be in touch in a few months?

EDIT - I see in the other thread he has been trying to contact you. If her email might be part of his strategy to reconnect, I guess it makes sense not to respond.

Nah...she doesn't owe it to the sister to respond. Harsh, yeah, but why string it out by saying, I'll call you in a couple months. Sounds like bad mojo, just make a clean cut and be done with it.