Recumbent - Wooden LWB recumbent

Okay, I built the long-wheelbase (63.5 inches) wooden recumbent bike designed by James Robinson of San Angelo, TX. I did this because when I rode recumbent bicycles in 2001, I found the long-wheelbase recumbent with underseat steering by far the most comfortable of the three recumbents I rode. And I'm living in poverty so building a recumbent was more reasonable than paying the dealer 1500 dollars for the long-wheel-base recumbent.

I don't have a camera because mine was stolen when I was living in Massachusetts during the autumn of 2000. However, a correspondent said she'd send me one next week. If she does, then I'll take photos of my bike.


This is my first recumbent bike. It took me 20 to 25 hours of riding it on level ground to get the "feel" for it. Now I can quite comfortably move on it except when climbing hills.

The following link describes some problems I had with getting the bike working well:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?p=7132289#post7132289
These problems are associated with my using parts from discarded mountain bikes and a freebie road bike for the working mechanical components. So far, the only new part I've used is one road bike chain. I needed about two and a half chains to make the recumbent, as it's a rear-wheel drive.

I don't enjoy working as a bike mechanic. I only enjoy riding. So I am hoping this weekend solves the last serious problem. I look forward to riding the bike as opposed to building it, adjusting it, etc.

This past week I started following the century training schedule listed here: http://www.kintera.org/htmlcontent.asp?cid=54755
So far my longest is the twelve mile ride.

If anybody else in central PA is interesting in training for a century ride, by all means contact me.

Today I biked 30 miles on my 'bent, averaging 14 mph. It's hilly where I biked, although the hills are not more than 50-100 feet vertically. There was a west wind. Unfortunately, this meant a headwind ascending the steepest hills through a canyon, with a venturi. So I dismounted on the three steepest hills, after reaching a spot I picked out from a distance. That's what slowed me down. Man, did I hit high speed downhill! Still got passed by a professional bicyclist on an upright though. I also hit some rough pavement going downhill in tenth gear. The bike feels really solid. I like it a lot.

we need pics to appreciate it, man.

we need pics to appreciate it, man.


Sounds great though, eh?

I just remembered my uncle had a digital camera before he died. Maybe my aunt still has it. I will ask to borrow it next time I talk to her.

I rode 12 miles today. This was the first time I attained my target speed of 17 mph (average). I cranked it up two hills without stopping that I walked up two days ago. YAY!

Glad you are having fun...feels good to see the improvement, that is doing more than we have done before. > continue to enjoy

You don't have a camera because yours was stolen eight years ago? Dude, it's time to move on. You can get a functional digital camera for cheap these days. Here's one for $10:

http://www.buy.com/retail/Product.asp?sku=202749701&adid=17737&SearchEngine=Guidester&Type=DF&Keyword=202749701&Category=Elec&GSID=34847630&GSESID=g2rphz55n0iunjb1scepi3is&GSCID=1

Yes, please send pictures. Likely the most direct way would be to show up at any big ride and let everyone else take and post them somewhere for you. <G>

Well, I biked 52.5 miles on my wooden recumbent today. Still avoid hills like the plague. I'm getting better on them though. I tied my cap under my chin with a shoelace to keep it from blowing off when I go downhill fast.

Guess I better get a frame pump.

You don't have a camera because yours was stolen eight years ago? Dude, it's time to move on. You can get a functional digital camera for cheap these days. Here's one for $10:

http://www.buy.com/retail/Product.asp?sku=202749701&adid=17737&SearchEngine=Guidester&Type=DF&Keyword=202749701&Category=Elec&GSID=34847630&GSESID=g2rphz55n0iunjb1scepi3is&GSCID=1

I've heard that a lot of public libraries now have digital cameras that they lend out. What a great idea.

No cameras at the library. Good idea, though. First, I gotta paint the bike. Anybody have experience painting wood with oil-based paint? What technique should I use to get a good finish with oil-based paint?

I'm getting better (more perseverance) at ascending hills. Yesterday, I walked up the steep part of the first hill. But I pedalled up all the rest of the hills, even the one I knew to be steep. But I cheated -- I ascended it from the opposite direction, which is a shallower ascent. The descent was worth it! Slower uphill, faster downhill. Also, I couldn't use my smaller chainwheel yesterday because my front derailler wouldn't downshift. I'll fix that before riding today.

Well, I biked 42 miles on a gorgeous sunny afternoon. I can only sit on this bike for 2.5 hours. By then, the seat is really pushing into the small of my back and I gotta get off it and stand up and stretch my back.

No cameras at the library. Good idea, though. First, I gotta paint the bike. Anybody have experience painting wood with oil-based paint? What technique should I use to get a good finish with oil-based paint?

What kind of paint? I've used rustoleum, from home depot, the kind you brush on, with good results. You should probably use a primer, but I didn't. The first coat soaks in, but after a couple coats there will be enough paint on and in the grain that you can wet sand it down to a satin finish so smooth that no one will know it's wood. The paint has to cover all the wood, so the wood doesn't soak up water while you're sanding. Use a very fine sandpaper; start with 320, then 600, and finish up with 1000 or finer (get that at an auto supply store). The paint has to be really dry before you sand it. If you sand through the paint (easier than you think) stop and put on a couple more coats of paint, let it dry thoroughly before you go back to sanding. In the end you can buff it with soft cotton cloth. Spray a clear topcoat over that if you want.

Thanks for the info., rhm.

Is everyone on this thread just putting the rest of us on?

A wooden bike?

Really???

Is everyone on this thread just putting the rest of us on?

A wooden bike?

Really???

There are many out there, of multitudinouis designs. Heck, They even make them out of bamboo now. I saw a couple wooden tricycles last year that were some of the most gorgeous bikes I'd ever seen.

There are many out there, of multitudinouis designs. Heck, They even make them out of bamboo now. I saw a couple wooden tricycles last year that were some of the most gorgeous bikes I'd ever seen. http://www.calfeedesign.com/bamboo.htm

http://www.woodbike.com/pages/1/index.htm

I'll be darned. Once I shifted paradigms and read the designer came up with the wooden frame idea, it made sense.

Pretty cool, in fact.

No cameras at the library. Good idea, though. First, I gotta paint the bike. Anybody have experience painting wood with oil-based paint? What technique should I use to get a good finish with oil-based paint?

First - don't paint it if you have some really nice looking wood.

Second - what kind of wood did you use to build this bike?

PICTURES!!! I'd really love to see some picture of this bike - sounds pretty neat to me.

Michael

No, it's not special wood -- just plain 2x4 softwood with some pieces of quarter inch plywood to strengthen the joints.
See the "Long Wheel Base" photo at http://mysite.verizon.net/res88kr1/
No, this isn't a hoax. I really built the wooden bike and am riding it. And yes, I am glad that I did.

not the one on the other web site.

No, it's not special wood -- just plain 2x4 softwood with some pieces of quarter inch plywood to strengthen the joints.

Bummer - I'm a wood worker and seeing that people have built bikes out of wood, just kind of makes it a lot more interesting to build my own. Of course I'd like to build a tricycle recumbent to start with - but perhaps building just the bike you have to figure things out and play with the idea. I'd really like to build a tandem tricycle recumbent after seeing the price for one.

Great - something else to build....

schu777,
The bike is plenty strong, even hitting potholes at high speed.
I"d encourage you to build a tandem tricycle wooden recumbent if so inclined. Heck, my recumbent has a chain 2.5 times as long as that on an upright bike. I have never seen a tandem tricycle recumbent built of wood. That doesn't mean it can't be done. Maybe you could be the first.

LWB

Yeah - I've got a VERY basic idea of what it would look like- lots of things to consider. I think the first thing is I'll order the plans that you posted about - build that recumbent from parts of a cheap mountain bike that I get from CraigsList. From there, I'll plan to build a single recumbent tricycle to get some things figured out. I think the most difficult part of a tricycle is getting the wheels lined up and steering built into them.

Well - it's a dream right now - hopefully I can do it. I'm pretty sure I'd do some type of laminate of wood - I think with the bends I'm thinking of, I'd have to do 1/8" thickness, which means MANY pieces to do it - although I might be able to do 1/4" thick pieces if the angle will allow for it, but doubt it.

Michael

..

Well, I built my recumbent using wood, epoxy, and parts from two discarded junk mountain bikes, a bought chain, and the 3-piece crank and deraillers from an upright roadbike. So it can be done. The biggest question is what do you want - two wheels in front or two wheels in back?
check out this webpage:
http://www.recumbents.com/wisil/whatsup.htm

I rode 48 miles yesterday, in 86F sunny weather. I don't know if I can ride this bike 100 miles. After about two and half hours on that seat, I have to get up, stretch, and walk around. Part of my motivation riding long distance is to lose weight. Maybe that will help. I have the back of an office chair that collapsed. Maybe I'll figure out how to mount that to the wooden post.

Anyway, the first half of the ride was very enjoyable. The last half was also pleasant, except for having to stop every 45 minutes to an hour to stretch my back. Then it became unpleasant. The final straw was running out of water on the other side of town.

I think I also need to learn to bank steeply while turning -- going around a street corner, for example. The only way I can do this on streets is to keep up speed in turns and practice on roads I know.

Your having to walk hills and the compromises one has to make in riding compared to a DF to ride a bent finally made me decide not to buy or ride one.

Your having to walk hills and the compromises one has to make in riding compared to a DF to ride a bent finally made me decide not to buy or ride one.

Dude, you're blaming the entire genre because an out of shape guy on a homemade wooden bent made with parts from junker mountain bikes has problems on hills? Wow! I guess all those people walking up the hills at Hilly Hundred as I pass them at 20+ mph prove that DFs can't climb, either. :roflmao2:

There are compromises to be made, though. Unbelievably, some folks actually miss standing up and squirming around on the bike while they're riding. And most recumbents are made for comfort not speed. You should definitely stick to your uprights if you're happy with them.

You ain't blazin' up many big long hillls at 20mph, Lance. Maybe some short rollers where you have a lot of speed up from preceding downhill. Yeah you probably passed a lot of old ladies, and 80 year old Freds with asthma.

You're the guy that gave me advice about starting on hills, saying you've started on your bent on a full 8% grade. I asked one of our very strong local bent racers about that, and it gave him quite a chuckle. You're superhuman, dude.

I'm not blaming anyone. Just stating the obvious - bents are a pain in the arse on hills. You have to plan ahead for a stop on a hill. That's the advice I got from almost every experienced bent rider except you. They get better at it, but no matter the experience those 'ole physical limitations Sir Isaac Newton style due to gravity come into play, and causes more problems on a bent that can never be completely overcome to the extent they can on a df. Because of the difficulty with hills and the inability to stand and use weight as leverage on hills, I decided to stay away from a bent. That was decision I made after researching it a great deal, soliciting input on several forums, and riding up a 4% hill that's 500 yards long many many times on a loaner LWB from LBS over a three day period. I was just a phone call away from placing order with LBS - but after all my research and riding one a lot over a 3 day period I just said no. I'm a great climber (well, was as in past tense unless my back improves) on a df - on a bent it's just sooooo much more difficult for mere mortals. That was my conclusion. Out of shape guy on a homemade wooden bent made with parts from junker mountain bikes having problems on hills after a lot of riding just confirmed my decision. And - I don't think he's that outta shape - he's putting in some significant mileage and long rides and still having difficulty. I think it's more the vehicle not the engine in his case. You putting him down is insulting and you should be ashamed. I think the guys doing great and I have enjoyed reading about his build and his rides and his progress.

Man, BF has so many exaggerated egos it gets tiring. I guess all that hot air helps you climb large sustained hills on your bent at a sustained 20mph. Right.

In my experience (515 miles on paved roads) my bent is slower going up hills and faster coming down hills. I think I'd do better going up hills if I had more than ten gears (could use a couple of granny gears), but I don't so I live with it.

My bent is homemade from junk, so don't base any conclusions about bents in general on my experiences.

I think it's cool you built a bike and are enjoying it! At least you DID something. To make a decision to not even test ride a bent based on what you hear about, without ever experiencing it....THAT'S crazy. I went and test rode about 20 and bought one. Couldn't make it up a hill at first but now cruise up and down with no problem. I don't care for uprights at all anymore but I don't go over to their forums and hack on them either! I don't like asparagus but don't criticize those who do. Let the guy enjoy his ride.

You ain't blazin' up many big long hillls at 20mph, Lance. Maybe some short rollers where you have a lot of speed up from preceding downhill. Yeah you probably passed a lot of old ladies, and 80 year old Freds with asthma.

You're the guy that gave me advice about starting on hills, saying you've started on your bent on a full 8% grade. I asked one of our very strong local bent racers about that, and it gave him quite a chuckle. You're superhuman, dude.

I'm not blaming anyone. Just stating the obvious - bents are a pain in the arse on hills. You have to plan ahead for a stop on a hill. That's the advice I got from almost every experienced bent rider except you. They get better at it, but no matter the experience those 'ole physical limitations Sir Isaac Newton style due to gravity come into play, and causes more problems on a bent that can never be completely overcome to the extent they can on a df. Because of the difficulty with hills and the inability to stand and use weight as leverage on hills, I decided to stay away from a bent. That was decision I made after researching it a great deal, soliciting input on several forums, and riding up a 4% hill that's 500 yards long many many times on a loaner LWB from LBS over a three day period. I was just a phone call away from placing order with LBS - but after all my research and riding one a lot over a 3 day period I just said no. I'm a great climber (well, was as in past tense unless my back improves) on a df - on a bent it's just sooooo much more difficult for mere mortals. That was my conclusion. Out of shape guy on a homemade wooden bent made with parts from junker mountain bikes having problems on hills after a lot of riding just confirmed my decision. And - I don't think he's that outta shape - he's putting in some significant mileage and long rides and still having difficulty. I think it's more the vehicle not the engine in his case. You putting him down is insulting and you should be ashamed. I think the guys doing great and I have enjoyed reading about his build and his rides and his progress.

Man, BF has so many exaggerated egos it gets tiring. I guess all that hot air helps you climb large sustained hills on your bent at a sustained 20mph. Right.
Good grief.
Hills can be a challenge for most folks on any kind of bike. But no reason for a reasonably fit bent rider using appropriate equipment to plan on stopping for a rest going up a hill. My bent experience on Hilly Hundred hills the last 2 years has been that I pass lots of folks walkin' their DF's up the hills. I'm not going real fast, but it's not a problem to get up the hills. That's based on two-and-a-half years of bent riding, not three days.

...I asked one of our very strong local bent racers about that, and it gave him quite a chuckle.
...
Man, BF has so many exaggerated egos it gets tiring. I guess all that hot air helps you climb large sustained hills on your bent at a sustained 20mph. Right.

Did I say anything about a sustained climb? In fact, at HH there are lots of short and steep ones. I've often said I'm not a mountain goat; I was an average climber on my old road bike and I'm an average climber on my bents. But I can still beat lots of my DF-riding peers on climbs because I'm going faster when I start the climbs, and it takes even the strong DF riders a while to make up the lost ground at a 2-4 mph closing speed (worst case.) Starting a climb with the uprights is a loser's game - the bent rider gives up any advantage and gets nothing in return. As far as starting on hills goes, if your strong local bent racer friend can't do it, maybe you should consider changing your grading scale. If I can do it, just about anybody should be able to.

Saying you've decided against getting a 'bent isn't a Bad Thing(tm); but it seems a bit trollish to cite the OP's experiences with his homemade wooden bent as your justification.

Is everyone on this thread just putting the rest of us on?

A wooden bike?

Really???


I built this one out of black bamboo
A bamboo bent is on the drawing board, and a double top tube is currently on the jig (need some parts like the fork before I finish it).

Search the Utility forum for my thread (my internet connection is running so slow right now it's maddening to find anything.

You can keep climbing any steep hill as long as you can switch to a low enough gear to keep up your cadence. However, I only have ten speeds and quickly switch into first gear on steep uphills.

When you run out of low gears, the other technique is to zig-zag either within your lane or within the roadwidth, depending on traffic. Sometimes this makes your path shallow enough that you can keep up your cadence. While doing this tonight, I realized upright bikers have this as an advantage over me. Why?

Someone made the analogy of balancing an upright bike being like balancing a book upright with its bottom edge on your horizontal palm. If the book starts leaning to the left, you have to move your palm to the left to counteract the lean before it gets out of control. In like fashion, upright bikers stay upright by leaning left or right. Of course, leaning left or right also initiates a turn if you turn the front wheel.

Since your bike's pivot point is where the tires touch the pavement, the higher your center-of-gravity is above the pavement, the more quickly you can lean in this fashion. You can consider your center-of-gravity to be at your belly-button. So the higher your belly button is off the road, the more quickly you can twitch into or out of a turn. (My seat is only 23.75 inches off the pavement. My belly button is probably another 6 or 8 inches above that.) If I were riding an upright bike, my belly button would be higher than if I were standing on the ground. So this makes it easier for upright bikes to do the zig-zag back and forth maneuver I described.

So a bike's performance and handling depend on a lot of different variables. One can always make a general statement, like, for example, the shorter your wheelbase, the smaller your turning radius, all other factors being equal. But in real life, the catch is that all other factors aren't equal. They differ too!

I think that is why most people just say to ride different bikes and see which you like best. I did that, and discovered that underseat steering was the most comfortable for me.

You're looking at it backwards. Actually, the higher the CG, the more slowly tilts (and potential falls) occur...this gives you more time to react and correct for any disturbance to your balance.

. . . pedal and the bike moves up the hill : )
pedal harder ; ) the bike will move FASTER!

this is a silly argument, there are so many factors to account for, it's not even funny.

You're looking at it backwards. Actually, the higher the CG, the more slowly tilts (and potential falls) occur...this gives you more time to react and correct for any disturbance to your balance.

Could this be ? Not sure. If true, that would explain why the flying Wallendas stacked themselves three people high for walking the tightrope. But if you hit a guardrail post alongside the highway while biking at 20 miles per hour, the higher you are above the pavement, the longer it would take to hit the ground. Which supports your claim.

LWB_guy,
Do any of these photos look like your LWB?

On steep climbs, upright riders can stand, which lets them incorporate upper body and back into pushing the pedals. When the going gets extremely steep, it also lets them push the pedals at a very slow rate - I've done as low at 20 rpm on steep hills with my upright. Can't do that while seated on a bent!

Generally, you're better off concentrating on your slow-speed balance rather than zig-zagging up the hill. The LWB has a large turning radius and balancing in a turn at low speed just doubles your difficulties.

gldrgidr, The third picture (the one with the guy on it) is my bike. The only difference between the one in the picture and mine is that my handgrips are below the main wooden beam -- the one that runs fore/aft. (USS)

Thank you for the hill-climbing advice, BlazingPedals.

So far I've ridden my recumbent 636 miles. I still like it. I still enjoy riding it. I love the look on some people's faces when they see me riding down the highway.

The only problem is the seat starts hurting my back after I sit in the seat for 2.5 hours. Other than that, the bike is comfortable. In my garage is one of those cheap made-in-China plastic & metal office chairs. The back broke off. I've been sitting on the seatbottom, which moves up and down. I am thinking about putting that seatback on my recumbent to see if it's more comfortable for long rides.

I am getting pretty good at climbing hills during the first half of a multi-hour ride. During the second half, though, I am more inclined to dismount and push it uphill. Part of this inclination is because of the problem I mentioned with a soreback after 2.5 hours.

On steep climbs, upright riders can stand, which lets them incorporate upper body and back into pushing the pedals. When the going gets extremely steep, it also lets them push the pedals at a very slow rate - I've done as low at 20 rpm on steep hills with my upright. Can't do that while seated on a bent!

Generally, you're better off concentrating on your slow-speed balance rather than zig-zagging up the hill. The LWB has a large turning radius and balancing in a turn at low speed just doubles your difficulties.

Here is a link with some conversations about power pedaling on an Easyracers bike, straight from Fast Freddy himself (photos of him too). As he says, it may not work for everybody, but it might be worth giving it a try.

http://www.easyracers.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2710

~Roger

Thanks for the post, Roger.
I looked at the Easyracer photos to which you linked. I don't think the techniques described apply because the bike's geometry is different.
Specifically,
(1) My crank is not below the seat. The middle of my crank is an inch above the bottom of my seat.
(2) I have USS. My handgrips are about 7 inches below the bottom of my seat.

Hence, I doubt the described techniques apply to my bike.
If I'm wrong, tell me.

Starting on a hill still puzzles me. Like on a group ride and a stop sign on an uphill.

I went ahead and, instead of Rans Stratus LE, I bought a Litespeed in a larger size to change my riding position. But back pain still there, so I'm back looking at Rans, but those uphill starts on a bent are still a puzzle to me. Even the strongest local bent rider tells me yeah they just don't work and can't really be done well. I just hate the idea of riding a bike like a bent where ya have to like plan ahead for everything. On my regular bike I just ride it. Do you ever get to point on a bent where you just ride and don't worry or plan so much?

Starting on a hill still puzzles me. Like on a group ride and a stop sign on an uphill.

I went ahead and, instead of Rans Stratus LE, I bought a Litespeed in a larger size to change my riding position. But back pain still there, so I'm back looking at Rans, but those uphill starts on a bent are still a puzzle to me. Even the strongest local bent rider tells me yeah they just don't work and can't really be done well. I just hate the idea of riding a bike like a bent where ya have to like plan ahead for everything. On my regular bike I just ride it. Do you ever get to point on a bent where you just ride and don't worry or plan so much?
Yes, you get to that point. Took me a month or so to get to where starting out uphill from a dead stop was not a problem. That was about two and a half years ago on a CLWB. No problem with my new bent, a SWB, either.