Foo - Laptop choices???

For all the geeks out there, I'm looking for a laptop- I will be doing powerpoint presentations, so I'll need something that will wow 'em, plus I have wifi, and since my nephews come to visit, I'd like for them to be able to play their video games on (they are serious gamers). In addition, I'll be downloading pictures from my digital cameras onto the laptop also, and I'll need something where I can burn audio CDs for my aerobics classes, and when I travel, I'd like to be able to watch movies. I would like to have a maximum amount of memory with the ability to expand. I want the laptop to be fast. I would like for it to be light- under 7 pounds. I like a crisp screen too. I would like for it to be ergomatically inclined, and I would like to have a longer battery life- like 8 hours or so. I also want something that's not going to be obsolete in the next year- it sucks when you get something and it upgrades in 2 months. Most definitely, I need an infrared port too, because the stuff I exercise with and train with require that I have the infrared technology to download the information onto the laptop. I definitely want nothing less than a 56k modem, ethernet, and a LAN wireless. I'd like to have Microsoft Windows XP Professional, Norton Antivirus (if possible) as well as the Norton Firewall, and Powerpoint.

What is the difference between a pentium 4 processor and an Intel Pentium M processor? How does that affect the performance of a laptop?

Basically, I see myself on the go and out and about quite a bit, especially internationally, and I'll be married to my laptop. I don't know a lot about computers and that kind of technology. My brother was supposed to help, but every time I call him, he's busy working on his projects, so I was hoping I could get some ideas on what my options are and where I can go to get a good price for a laptop, so if you have an idea of where I can go to buy it, I'd appreciate it too.

Thanks to everyone for any help!

Koffee

The M is for Mobile. You want soemthing with Centrino Technology. The Dell Latitude D500 may be D510 this year is nice. We have about 100 of them where i work and they are abused daily and always stand up to it.

I have an IBM T40 thinkpad that gets beat up on
a daily basis (use as my desktop at work). Really nice
works well with all apps.
couple of co-workers have t23's and they are not
as nice.

Marty

Get this
http://www.apple.com/powerbook/index12.html

And get Keynote, It is only $99 and blows away PowerPoint from ease of use, flexability, and apperance, standpoints basically PP is in no way superior to Keynote, ask the PP users in my wifes grad program that have to give a Presentation after her.

I believe the Powerbook also comes with Ilife, which includes Imovie, a great application that I have used for business presentations which really floor people, they think I am a computer genious (no, just a Mac owner). The presentations I made on Imovie I distributed on DVDs which I burned with I DVD (get the PB with the superdrive and you can burn DVDs). Itunes is great I have not really used any other similar programs to compare it to though, same with IPhoto, but no complaints, I have not used Garage band but it looks awesome. OS X kills XP, no comparison, its faster, more stable and far more consistant. If you get a PB it will be viable for may years to come, I have a 12" PB and an IBM laptop (same RAM the IBM has a faster processer if you are measuring Mhz.) and its like heaven and hell. Go to the apple store on Michigan Ave, see the applications and play with their machines. PBs have inferred and built in wireless, as well as firewire and I believe USB2.

Also if you are a student you can get killer student discounts on software and hardware through your school. The two MS apps you will need are Excell and Word, but they run better on a Mac anyway, Bill Gates said that.

Dont bother with the Macs in 2 months it will be old and unsupported.

Dont bother with the Macs in 2 months it will be old and unsupported.

I also have an Imac that is 6 years old and it works better than my 6 month old Thinkpad. I have heard similar complaints from MS users as well, I find in general that most Mac users are better with Windows than MS users, and most knocks on Macs are born of ignorance.

Last month I installed OSX.3 on my parents 3 year old IMac runs perfect, How well do you think "Longhorn"? will support old hardware???????

i am a sytems admin in a business with 50% Apple (500 machines) and 50% Windows (500 machines) in MY experience PC laptops are more bang for the buck. Apple laptops however hold value better. As far as service goes Dell gives way service because they offer onsite repair. I have a iBook 900, iMac DV 500, Custom Built PC, and a Dell laptop. They have all broken etc. You are better off buying A PC Koffee. Especially if you are using the infared for fitness equipment there is a better chance of finding drivers and software for the Windows Operating System. The rest is easy to find, DVD, CDRW drive nice screen etc. Just make sure you buy a good service plan.

Really go check them out.. They run MS applications better...

Unless you enjoy hearing "sorry they dont make that for the Mac" dont bother.

I though i heard it all.....
"Really go check them out.. They run MS applications better..."

Price em out a Dell with Mac specs WILL be more expensive and not have near the software. Just go to the Mac store and check it out its worth the trip even if you get a widoze box, oh yeah Mac got the best marks for service and reliability according to consumer reports.

i swear you love disagreeing with me temp1

Dell gives way service
Dell sucks...go for something nice, like a Toshiba laptop.
FYI - Dell OEMs their laptops from Acer

Toshiba laptops are the biggest pieces of **** on the market. get a clue.

THere are worse. They are among the crap.

i swear you love disagreeing with me temp1

On this point we are brothers:



Toshiba laptops are the biggest pieces of **** on the market. get a clue.

Before my rents had a Mac they had a Toshiba desktop, it never worked, the guy who sold it to them could not get it to work, never again a Toshiba!

Here is another point we see eye to eye on... Sort of

Unless you enjoy hearing "sorry they dont make that for the Mac" dont bother.

That used to be the case, and still is with a lot of business software, case in point MAS90/MAS200 (the sole reason I have a PC), other than that I have been able to find every thing I want.

You can run Virtual PC and that solves your argument :D


Dude

Thats pointless. By the time you buy the mac and the software why bother. If you dont need a mac to begin with or already have one it's pointless.

You can run AppleWorks and it gives you everything office does but better.
The Mac will work on any network and you don't need special drivers for anything.

You can run Quicken, Intuit QuickBooks, PalmDeskTop, all the current games and the machine will stay running... It's about finding what meets your needs and so many people just go for price when in the long run you end up paying more.... I still am going to suggest the Mac because on a day to day basis the OS is much better.... iCal alone kicks anything that MS can come up with...

Thats pointless. By the time you buy the mac and the software why bother. If you dont need a mac to begin with or already have one it's pointless.

Agreeing so much is starting to get booring! Virtual PC works, but it is s l o w.

Back to recruting
http://www.apple.com/switch/

iCal alone kicks anything that MS can come up with...

Don't forget Safari, Ilife suite, Keynote, Mail, Final Cut, Isync (the PB comes with Bluetooth), Shake, Fontbook, Expose', a superior graphics converter, Sherlock, and some free add ins, Omni outliner, and Omni Graffle.

Ever have problems installing drivers? With a Mac throw away the disc, just plug it in and it works.

Excell and Word are better than Appleworks IMO, but they work seamlessly on a Mac. Appleworks can read Office docs, as well as save docs in word and excell, but watch out a PC is not smart enough to put a .doc or whatever after the doument's name to open it. There are also some formating issues.

Toshiba laptops are the biggest pieces of **** on the market. get a clue.
Get a clue...witty. I have had my Toshiba since 99 - not a single problem. But I guess Dell's are like that also, until you power them up.
I would think someone of your stature (Network Support) would have something more to say on this. Sounds like someone has a case of "Nick Burns"

Wanna see something cool? Check out a 15" or 17" PowerBook, the letters on the keys light up through fiber optics when the computer sences a dimming of the ambiant lighting.

Koff, you can find alot of great notebooks that will do what your looking for, however, none will be made for travel. I don't know if that is a risk you would want to take if you plan on taking the notebook with you via bicycle.

My choice? The Panasonic Toughbook 29 (http://www.panasonic.com/computer/toughbook/learn_more_tb29.asp)

It's a some what slower machine, the the toughbook series is made to last. This would be the machine i would take for any time of extended travel. Unless you get to your destination in a BMW and hand carry the laptop to your corporate desk.

Koff, you can find alot of great notebooks that will do what your looking for, however, none will be made for travel. I don't know if that is a risk you would want to take if you plan on taking the notebook with you via bicycle.

My choice? The Panasonic Toughbook 29 (http://www.panasonic.com/computer/toughbook/learn_more_tb29.asp)

It's a some what slower machine, the the toughbook series is made to last. This would be the machine i would take for any time of extended travel. Unless you get to your destination in a BMW and hand carry the laptop to your corporate desk.

I'm with Joe on this one. I have not been very impressed with any of the laptops out on the market today save the truly ruggedised ones like the Toughbooks. But then again I tend to beat up my hardware. Several years ago at a previous employer, I used to have the predecessor to the Toughbook 29, a Panasonic CF-25mkII (aka Toughbook 25... before they started the Toughbook name-branding) and that thing was a tank. Of course it was fairly heavy too. Because we need a laptop that ran some flavour of unix and I was fairly knowledgable on that subject, I was asked to spec a laptop for our group which did a lot of travelling. So before ordering them, I asked Panasonic for a demo unit. They sent me one in the mail. As soon as I got it, I asked them if I could do some durability testing. I told them I intended to take it out to the parking lot and run it over with my Jeep. They said, "go ahead". So I loaded BSD/OS onto it, fired up an mp3 player so that it began reading from the drive. Then I promptly headed out my office to the parking lot. On the way out, I rolled it down a few steps in the staircase. Once outside, I put it on the ground in the parking lot behind the wheels of my Jeep and with the music still playing, backed over it. Then I stuck the Jeep in drive and ran over it again. I repeated this three times. The case was slightly marred and scratched (although it was a demo unit and came to me with its own share of scratches) but nothing broke and everything performed flawlessly. I had vmstat running continuously in another window to monitor disk activity too and saw no hiccups, no ATA retries or anything like that. During the course of owning the CF-25, I managed to drop it several times from desk height onto hard concrete, spilled orange juice all over the keyboard which I then washed off in a sink by sticking it under a faucet and used it as a height booster to stand on when I needed a few extra inches to grab something off the top shelf.

The biggest downside to the Toughbook 29 is that it's expensive. A fully configured unit will run you around $5,000. For a cheaper but slightly less rugged alternative, I would recommend the Panasonic T2 or W2 . They're also much lighter and thinner (under 3lbs. and approx 1" thick) but they are still fully magnesium encased in a water-resistant chassis with shock-resistant components. And they're more competatively priced at around $2,000.

Get a clue...witty. I have had my Toshiba since 99 - not a single problem. But I guess Dell's are like that also, until you power them up.
I would think someone of your stature (Network Support) would have something more to say on this. Sounds like someone has a case of "Nick Burns"

who the hell is Nick Burns


You have a toshiba laptop that is good and hasnt died, one single freaking laptop so they must be the greatest laptops ever.

who the hell is Nick Burns
The help desk guy on a SNL skit, in many cases accurate and absolutly hysterical.

Also the new G4 PBs don't have ir recievers built in, it was the G3s, sorry for the misinfo.

As far as ruggedness, we take ours everywhere, including bikes, its not been a problem. I have a friend with a 17" Powerbook that has been beat to hell, dents all over it, I think he crushed it under the front seat of his car, its been dropped etc, etc, it works fine, if your concerned make sure your home owners/renters/ or special computer insurance covers it.

I also dropped my thinkpad on a flight of stairs once (in a padded case) still works the same as it always did. I know these are just case studies, but for what its worth...

I have only ever owned MACs but even I am about to buy a PC laptop for home use. The main reason is that the Polar HRM software is PC only with no MAC version scheduled to be made anytime soon. And it won't work under Virtual PC. I can get an Acer desknote (not really a laptop) with 17 inch screen for $3,300AUD, the price of the MAC 17 inch is $5,500AUD. Seems like the dark side has finally won me over.

CHEERS.

Mark

I have only ever owned MACs but even I am about to buy a PC laptop for home use. The main reason is that the Polar HRM software is PC only with no MAC version scheduled to be made anytime soon. And it won't work under Virtual PC. I can get an Acer desknote (not really a laptop) with 17 inch screen for $3,300AUD, the price of the MAC 17 inch is $5,500AUD. Seems like the dark side has finally won me over.

Have you checked out HRM Reader X (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/15617&vid=58887)?

...and since my nephews come to visit, I'd like for them to be able to play their video games on (they are serious gamers)...

Right there pretty much rules out an Apple laptop. I won't get into which brand to buy as I know very little about laptops, but I can tell you as a gamer that while the MacOS is starting to see more games released for it, it still pales in comparison to the number of games released for Windows.

You have a toshiba laptop that is good and hasnt died, one single freaking laptop so they must be the greatest laptops ever.
Yes, you are correct. The Dell Spell is starting to wear off...

i'm quite pleased with my new dell inspiron 1100. it's not very flashy, but it came with a great 15" xga screen, dvd-cdr, 40 gb hard drive and 512 mb of ram and a 2.4 ghz p4. dell is selling that for us$1049.

likes: pretty zippy processor, great screen, excellent price, came with a very nice case [though i use a backpack most of the time]. nice looking. the battery is amazing. i have run it on battery, working the whole time [no sleep] for 4.5 hours. good, if not super sound.

dislikes: at 7.25 lbs, it's a bit porky.

indifferent to me, but you might like to know: no floppy drive. no parallel prt [usb only]. no firewire. the ram is shared partly with the video, so the video is a bit slower than some people might like. doesn't bother me; i watch dvds on it all the time.

i am no power user. i use my laptop for writing [a whole lot of writing], database management [for my research] and communications, and this model suits my needs perfectly.

http://img.dell.com/images/global/products/inspn/1100_front_314.jpg

Dont bother with the Macs in 2 months it will be old and unsupported.

That is funny, considering that PC technology out-excels Mac technology (mainly to accommodate for all padding that MS puts in their software).

I get to work with both. The only advantage I see with XP is that it is more stable than previous Windows operating systems, and it comes with tons of diagnostic tools to troubleshoot all the problems you are going to have. This way, at least you know why your computer sucks.

Macs aren't perfect. However, it looks like an iBook is right up your alley. I run a G4 700MHz eMac 512 MB RAM with all the bells and whistles and it equals the performance of my Dell Pentium 4 2.6GHz 1 GB RAM with Windows XP Professional. In many cases, it outperforms the PC.

Don't get me wrong, PCs aren't THAT bad. If you go with one, I'd go with an IBM or Dell. They cost more, but worth it. Don't get a HP or Compaq. I had an HP and they stiffed me on the warranty.

You can run AppleWorks and it gives you everything office does but better.
The Mac will work on any network and you don't need special drivers for anything.

You can run Quicken, Intuit QuickBooks, PalmDeskTop, all the current games and the machine will stay running... It's about finding what meets your needs and so many people just go for price when in the long run you end up paying more.... I still am going to suggest the Mac because on a day to day basis the OS is much better.... iCal alone kicks anything that MS can come up with...

I'll have to disagree a bit. AppleWorks is the equivalent of Microsoft Works, which basically means that it sucks. Appleworks can only open the most basic of MS Word and Excel files. I have MS Office for Mac and it kicks the pants off of Appleworks.

Plus, the Mac will not work on any network. Sometimes, it is due to the ignorance or stubborness of ISPs. If you try to hook it up to a Windows Active Directory network, chances are that the network administrators did not make the necessary changes to accommodate for Macs.

In addition, I really don't think that iCal is all that. Don't get me wrong, it is a great program that comes at no additional charge to Mac users, but Entourage and Outlook do the same thing, and then some. I think for iCal to be great, they should integrate it with Mac mail. Hopefully, that is to come.

BTW, the spam filter on the Mac mail program rocks. Anything better you will have to pay for.

GAMES? If your nephews are serious gamers, chances are that no reasonably priced laptop is going to satisfy their game crave, Mac or PC. PCs do have more games though, they may just not perform as well on a laptop. A gaming laptop will cost you thousands more. Save the money, get a low-mid end laptop, and buy a PS2 or something.

Overall, if I were to buy something for you, I'd still get an iBook or Powerbook. But if you try really hard, you can still be happy with a PC.

That is funny, considering that PC technology out-excels Mac technology (mainly to accommodate for all padding that MS puts in their software).

I wouldn't say this is the case. You have to first define "out-excels". Maybe if you mean "Excel" as in the spreadsheet software then you can make a definitive claim but even there one could argue. Generally speaking, if you look at the fundamental components in both platforms [Mac and Intel], you'll find similar hardware. Many of the name-brand notebooks use the same components as the Apple notebooks and vice versa. The difference is in what happens when the manufacturer gets ahold of the base hardware. Macs do posess better hardware/software integration. It looks like they payed a lot more attention to the OS in terms of hardware support when they wrote the drivers. This is of course easier for Apple to do being that they have control over the hardware tweaking. Suspend/resume features and performance on the Apple notebooks seem to be far superior to any Intel based ones I've seen.

Another major difference is of course the processor and processor-support chipset. From a technical standpoint, the PowerPC architecture is by far the more scalable and superior design but from a practical standpoint where Moore's Law can certainly be applied as a factour to the economics of the situation, it makes little difference in terms of performance although as you've rightly pointed out, Microsoft has managed to reverse-compensate for that effect to a somewhat alarming degree. ;)

Many of the "power users" I know have recently switched to Macs or have been using them since the beginning. I myself have stuck with Intel-based notebooks but I'm running the same core portion of the OS that Macs running OSX are using, FreeBSD. I would have no qualms about moving over to Macs except that I do sometimes get in and want to muck with the OS source and my notebook machines are supplied by my company which has standardised on Intel based platforms. If I had my way, I'd be lugging around one of those new SPARC based laptops running Solaris 9 so I could be binary compatible with my desktop machine. FWIW, I've currently got a fairly low end IBM T30 that's a year old and running FreeBSD-5.2-CURRENT (also triple-booting with WindowsXP and Linux as alternate OSes). I spend most of my time in FreeBSD and can do practically everything in it (plus more) than with Windows. All my office application needs are supported by OpenOffice and everything else has unix equivalents that I prefer anyways. The only exception is when I have to use Visio. Even then, instead of rebooting into Windows, I usually run vmware (in FreeBSD's Linux binary compatibility mode) and then run Windows inside it much like Mac users would run Virtual PC. The real advantage there is that when Windows takes a dive, it only takes out the vmware session and not my entire OS. :)

For the most part, OSes are a matter of personal preference. I prefer the unix environment, many others prefer Windows, some prefer MacOS and there may even be some out there that want to see a laptop running Control Data's CyberNOS/VE. :D

Koffee Brown, like buying bikes and many other consumer items, pick what feels comfortable and is in your budget. Try out a few different brands and types. It's fine and recommended that you hear other people's opinions and experiences but what's right for somone else may not be right for you and only you will know. Good luck.

Hey Koffee. This is going to be long, so I'll tell you the 1st 3 paragraphs are just opinions and observations.

One of my college jobs is fixing simple computer problems in the dorms. I see a lot of Toshibas, and Dells. I got tired of fixing Toshibas pretty quickly. They always seem to develop funny software quirks or just stop working, and the included recovery tools are limited and not terribly easy to use for anything short of reformatting. In all fairness, some of the problems may arise due to Toshiba's target audience: clueless rich students and management types with a freaky knack for messing things up and who don't have a clue what Ctrl-Alt-Del does.

Dells have, for the most part been quite a bit better. The included recovery CD is fairly useful (I still prefer a 98 boot disk) and the components are mostly high quality. They also offer good support if you don't call after business hours, in which case you will probably get someone who doesn't speak much english. They stand by their computers. One student got a bad hard drive, and they replaced the whole system. I personally use a Dell desktop that works great for me. Plus, their website makes it real easy to spec out a system exactly as you want. On the downside, the laptops seem to run a little warm.

Beyond that, I know a few people who own IBM laptops, but I've never had to help them out. Maybe that's just because people who buy $3000 computers usually have a clue what they're doing, and maybe it's because they're really as good as the owner's claim they are. Probably both.

For your specific questions:

Definitely get XP Professional.

Pentium M's are designed for laptops. They use less power and run cooler. I don't know about performance, but they're supposed to perform better in laptops than P4's.

Norton Internet Security Suite includes the antivirus and firewall programs

Ethernet is standard and 56k modem usually is. For wireless, many come with built in, although I still prefer the card type. T-Mobile and I think Sprint actually make cellular modems, although that's different from WiFi. I believe infrared ports are still standard.

CD-burners are the most common option, and the upgrade to one that will also play DVD's doesn't cost much.

I'd be careful about letting nephews play video games. It'll be hard to get them away from your computer! If you let them install newer games for when they visit, you'll want a system with a decent graphics chip. Most gamers swear by ATI rather than NVidia

You know what, this is really long. I would personally start by going to dell.com and custominzing a laptop there with your preferences (simply because Dell's website is the easiest to use). Then shop the other brands and compare to see if one offers something better.

Enough of the Mac-IBM war guys

Thanks to everyone who contributed. I got a laptop:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=37041&sku=L250-4054

It's an HP, and I'm very satisfied with my choice so far. When it gets here, we'll see how well it performs.

Koffee

Thanks to everyone who contributed. I got a laptop:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=37041&sku=L250-4054

It's an HP, and I'm very satisfied with my choice so far. When it gets here, we'll see how well it performs.

Koffee



Weight & Dimensions
Height: 1.6"
Width: 15.6"
Depth: 11"
Weight: 9.3 lbs


That is one huge laptop. Also It appears to be one of the few that has a number pad. Looks nice though, esp the graphics card, your relatives might be able to play games afterall. Enjoy your new laptop.

--Jason K.

Best laptop my fathers when I was 5 years old.

I have an IBM Thinkpad T40. Haven't had any problems at all with it. I'm not sure how well it works with any Microsoft products as I only run Linux and FreeBSD.