I just finished watching Y Tu Mama Tambien. Ugh, what a lame movie. I just don't understand what all the fuss is about. The movie is OK but it isn't the masterpiece that reviewers made it out to be. It isn't even useful as a spanish language study tool because all the dialogue is foul language and mexican slang. Neither of which will help me as a student of the language.

El Mariachi is another mexican film with cheezy acting and dialogue but at least I enjoyed watching that one.

I just bought The Crime of Padre Amaro on eBay. I hope it is a better than Y Tu Mama Tambien.

Aimee and Jaguar is an EXCELLENT german film. The movie is set in Berlin in the last days of world war 2. And there is a bicycle scene toward the end of the film. Mostly Martha was another really good german film. Even though I am not a student of german (at least not yet) I still want to see both of these again.

I liked La Femme Nikita- a french film about a female drug dealer that gets caught and then recruited to be an assassin for the french secret service. The American remake with Bridget Fonda was terrible.

And of course, Amelie was so good I bought the DVD and watched it at least a dozen times!! Great film!

Sometimes I like German movies, Das Boot, Europa Europa, Nasferatu, and Run Lola Run. Actually I love German movies.

Sometimes I like German movies, Das Boot, Europa Europa, Nasferatu, and Run Lola Run. Actually I love German movies.

I bought Run Lola Run on eBay but it hasn't arrived yet.

Why are foreign films so much better than hollywood films? Is it because they don't rely on special effects and car crashes every 3 minutes to keep my attention? Or is it because the characters are better developed? Or is it because Hollywood is so bad that ANYTHING seems better by comparison?

We only see the best of the best from the rest of the world, we get to see all of our crap, it would be different if we only saw the 5 best Hollywood movies eash year. Example, go see Monster, its a muther of a movie

Just because a movie is foreign, doesn't mean it's a masterpiece. The thing I've noticed is that when movies are raved and raved about, I'll go see them and... yeah?So? This applies to hollywood movies even more- most of them are just mediocre. If they get lukewarm reviews, they're bad and if they get bad reviews, they're not worth the time out of your life.

However, even mediocre foreign movies are still better than mediocre american movies, but it doesn't mean it's not disappointing. Often I will see a foreign movie that everyone raves about and it's the same thing, yeah so? But once in a while I'll stumble upon a foreign film that no one mentions or is a few years old, and it'll be wonderful.

Have you seen The City of Lost Children or Delicatessen?

Have you seen The City of Lost Children or Delicatessen?

Not yet but both are on my list.

I would watch Deli first, its a nice warm up to TCOLC, both are insane, I'm kind of jelous, experiencing these movies for the first time is something you'll remember.

Have you seen The City of Lost Children or Delicatessen?

Brilliant! Hard to believe that same director (Jean-Pierre Jeunet) allowed himself to be swallowed and then spit back up by the Hollywood Machine while making ALIEN: Resurrection, an awkward hash of a movie. He redeemed himself with Amelie, but I hope he's never again tempted to make another American film.

I think you'll be pleased with Padre Amaro. Not the easiest film to watch, but compelling filmmaking. If you enjoy it, seek out City of God.

Although I've seen my share of crappy foreign films (most recently, The Spanish Apartment), I'd say they're my preferred movie-going choice as they're usually smaller, more personal films that don't come with all the weight of big Hollywood budgets, directors and stars that create big box-office expectations that, in turn, creates a need to churn out safe, homogeonized product that will please as broad a ticket-buying audience as possible.

The best movie I saw last year was Man on the Train (now available on dvd), a French film about two strangers' transformation as they become unlikely friends. And don't miss The Triplets of Belleville if it happens to find its way to your burg!

And good call on Jeunet RobCat. It seems to be one of the crazy ironies of the movie industry that talented, visionary directors can toil from independent project to independent project with barely any budget but great critical acclaim, then the Hollywood machine finally discovers them and they get attached to some big-money piece of dreck. They finally get some money to play with, but their artistic integrity gets sold down the river. I fear Kevin Smith may be the next casualty, as the trailer for his Bennifer studio pic, Jersey Girl, makes it look like some kinda schmaltzy milkdud pap.

Check out American Movie, funny, it feels like a foreign film.

Red, White, and Blue are three great French films you should check out.

Blue is one of my favorite movies! The "tri-colore" trilogy is based on the french flag (liberty, equality, fraternity)

Kieslowski's "Decalouge" is equally brilliant (10-part)

Luc Besson's La Femme Nikita, Leon and Big Blue. All great.

Gotta have a cycling theme so Triplets of Belville must be in this thread!

Brilliant American director- PT Anderson's "Magnolia" Holy crap that movie blows me away.

Cipo- good pick. City of God. hoo-ya.

i'll second that about the Juenet films. 'Delicatessen is a classic.

In the UK, BBC4 ran a series of 'World Cinema' culminating in a vote for best film of 2003. 'Belleville Rendezvous' (Triplettes of Belleville)
won.

At the same time another channel screened 'Amores Perros'; a Mexican film from 2000, which is a slant on the 'boy and his dog' theme. Definitely worth a look.

The bicycle theme cannot be complete without a mention of 'Bicycle Theives', (1948, Vitorio De Sica) - still one of the best films ever made.

Barbet Schroeder's "More" and "La Valle (Obscured By Clouds)" are both cool movies that Pink Floyd did the soundtrack for.

"The Closet" is a good French comedy.

Best foreign films (from my DVD collection):

Amelie
Central Station
Chocolat
Cinema Paradiso (one of my all-time favorites)
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon
das Boot
Life is Beautiful
Like Water for Chocolate
Run Lola Run
The Third Man

Other good ones I've seen and also recommend:
Talk to Her
All About my Mother
Grand Illusion
The Closet
La Cage aux Folles
Princess Mononoke
Secrets & Lies
Whale Rider

Why are foreign films so much better than hollywood films?

Hollywood is an industry, it's designed to maximize profits. Similar to top 40 music, it's designed to appeal (no matter how shallowly) to the most people in order to bring in the most revenue.

But it's not foreign vs. Hollywood. There are some american films that are truly great. I like well-paced ("slow paced" to people used to Hollywood movies), subtle, dialog driven dramas or comedies (often with little or no plot). Some of my favorites from recent years:

Spring Forward
You Can Count on Me
Ghost Dog: The Way of the Samurai
Lone Star

I'm a huge fan of Whit Stillman films. Barcelona being the best, IMO.

Bottle Rocket is a brilliant comedy, a gem that too many people have never heard of.

The Coen Brothers have some classics (Raising Arizona, The Big Lebowski, many more)

Jon Favreu's "Swingers" and "Made" were both excellent comedies.

"In the Company of Men" is brilliant, if you have the stomach for it.

Let's see, what else. A lot of low budget flicks that were almost great (or at least acheive greatness at points), like "Jesus' Son" and "The Dangerous Lives of Altar Boys".

And then there's indy documentaries like Buena Vista Social Club, Brother's Keeper, ...

On the topic of good films, what to you, makes a film good? Is it the plot, the dialog, the characters, the cinematography, or just an over all feel of the movie? For some of you I'm sure its more than just one item, but is there one aspect that stands out to you?

Often I'll find myself really liking a film for technical reasons. An domestic example of this for me is Out of Sight. While not the best movie ever made, there are just things about the way the director used color, the camera work, and other little subtle things I notice. Perhaps I applaud these because I used to devlop and print my own film, so I had respect for some of the elements I noticed from traditional photography.

A good film is art, and therefore very difficult to describe. Best I can do is that it communicates something interesting, altering or inspiring to you, and it communicates it in a better way than other, more direct means of communication might.

Sometimes this is done through cinematography, sometimes dialog, sometimes atmosphere, usually a mix of all of the above. Depends on the subject, the message, a lot of different things.

Hollywood is an industry, it's designed to maximize profits. Similar to top 40 music, it's designed to appeal (no matter how shallowly) to the most people in order to bring in the most revenue.

But it's not foreign vs. Hollywood. There are some american films that are truly great. I like well-paced ("slow paced" to people used to Hollywood movies), subtle, dialog driven dramas or comedies (often with little or no plot). Some of my favorites from recent years:

Spring Forward
You Can Count on Me
Ghost Dog: The Way of the Samurai
Lone Star

I'm a huge fan of Whit Stillman films. Barcelona being the best, IMO.

Bottle Rocket is a brilliant comedy, a gem that too many people have never heard of.

The Coen Brothers have some classics (Raising Arizona, The Big Lebowski, many more)

Jon Favreu's "Swingers" and "Made" were both excellent comedies.

"In the Company of Men" is brilliant, if you have the stomach for it.

Let's see, what else. A lot of low budget flicks that were almost great (or at least acheive greatness at points), like "Jesus' Son" and "The Dangerous Lives of Altar Boys".

And then there's indy documentaries like Buena Vista Social Club, Brother's Keeper, ...

Sounds like you like INDEPENDENT films. Some of those you listed are independent- not in the Hollywood system.
For example, all Jarmusch films are independently financed by european investors - including Ghost Dog. He is an American but I would catagorize him as an independent since he works outside the system.

Sounds like you like INDEPENDENT films. Some of those you listed are independent- not in the Hollywood system.


Yeah, that's exactly what I was trying to say. The choice was being made like it was between Hollywood and foreign films. I was trying to make the point that there are a lot of films that are American that aren't Hollywood (i.e. "independent") or in the grey area (independent production with major distribution).

To me, Hollywood films are foreign films ;) I do like the domestic product. The Castle, and The Dish spring immediately to mind. I'm not sure if it went o.s. but another neat little Aussie comedy of late is Crackerjack.

btw, City of Lost Children is one of my alltime favourites. Is it on DVD? THe copy I taped off SBS is getting worn out.

Then there's that three part New Zealand production that I thought was quite enjoyable.

Not all Hollywood films are necessarily dreck either. I like sci fi, and films like K-Pax and Gattaca set a high benchmark in quality sci-fi film making.

Ooops. That was a bit ot. Ok - good foreign sci-fi - gotta make a vote for Cube. (Does Canadian count as foreign?)

Here are a few of my prefered foreign films:
tops: The big Blue - gorgeous film
also like once were warriors brutal film but very
well done.
Priscilla queen of the desert funny, quirky, camp
and totally ripped off by To Julie newmar from wong foo
or whatever that was called.
K-Pax, sci fi? not sure bout that but I loved the flick.
5th element now that was good sci fi (and foreign to boot with all that foreign language) :D

Marty

Dang! Forgotten in previous posts:

Yojimbo
Seven Samurai
Zatoichi
Taboo
Wicked City
Akira
Ninja Scroll

just a few I though worthy of mention

Akiro Kurisawa's Dreams and

two of Polanski's movies; Tess and Cul de Sac

Tess is a great historical drama, while Dreams is a conceptual piece.

...I fear Kevin Smith may be the next casualty, as the trailer for his Bennifer studio pic, Jersey Girl, makes it look like some kinda schmaltzy milkdud pap.

Good Grief, I hope not! I have yet to see Mall Rats and Dogma but Smith's other films are low-brow masterpieces. It would surely be a pity if he let himself be assimilated. I'll assume for now that his irreverence is immune. Fingers crossed.

Check out American Movie, funny, it feels like a foreign film.

That one was a jaw-dropper. Loved it! A friend told me a few months ago that he saw a copy of Coven ("It's 'KOH-ven!") at Movie Madness here in Portland, but I never remember to look for it.

Priscilla queen of the desert funny, quirky, camp


That's a classic.

Ooops. That was a bit ot. Ok - good foreign sci-fi - gotta make a vote for Cube. (Does Canadian count as foreign?)

Ah, Canadian. Some great (although bleak and depressing) ones by Atom Egoyan, like Sweet Hereafter and Felicia's Journey.

i'll second that about the Juenet films. 'Delicatessen is a classic.

In the UK, BBC4 ran a series of 'World Cinema' culminating in a vote for best film of 2003. 'Belleville Rendezvous' (Triplettes of Belleville)
won.

At the same time another channel screened 'Amores Perros'; a Mexican film from 2000, which is a slant on the 'boy and his dog' theme. Definitely worth a look.

The bicycle theme cannot be complete without a mention of 'Bicycle Theives', (1948, Vitorio De Sica) - still one of the best films ever made.

Excellent choices Neil, though I found Delicattessen a bit dark.

Subway, taxi and Taxi 2 a bit lighter fare.

love the avatar by the way. You an Oor Wullie fan?

I saw Solas today. The story is a little depressing but I enjoyed the movie. And the spanish is clear with not too much slang so I can use it as a study tool (unlike Y Tu Mama Tambien). This one I will watch many times.

(Does Canadian count as foreign?)

Of course, you are right. Technically, Canadian film is foreign to both of us since you are in Oz and I am in USA. But if canadiam film is as bad as canadian beer I am sure I don't want it :-)

I love Japanese films, especially those of Ozu, from the 50s and 60s. They aren't easy to find but sometimes you can catch them on tv. They are just exquisite. Also I recommend the films of Luis Bunuel, or Pasolini. He directed a version of "the gospel according to St Matthew" which was one of the best foreign films I've ever seen.

As for what makes a good film. I remember Roger Ebert saying that a good movie is never depressing, no matter what it's about. Bad movies are depressing. It's so true. Even if a good movie is about the Holocaust, it'll be sad but not depressing. You won't feel like you wasted two hours out of your life. I remember sitting and sobbing after "The Garden of the Finzi-Continis" or "Europa Europa", both of which were about the holocaust, but they were too good to be depressing.

Depressing is watching someone play chess with
Death (the grim reaper) for what seems like an eternity
(ok it was only 6 or 7 hours long). :D

Marty

There also used to be a lot of german movies I remember seeing on tv late at night. They all seemed to be depressing, and everyone in them died. Of course, considering their not-so-distant history (most of these movies seemed to be made in the 70s), it's not surprising that they'd make movies where everyone died. Guess what- everyone did die!

I kinda like "Seven Samurai" and "Yojimbo", classic Kurosawa samurai flicks.

Two sentimental French movies I like are "My Father's Glory" and "My Mother's Castle", viewed in that order. Based on the memoirs of French Film maker Marcel Pagnol, they're touching stories of growing up in turn-of-the-(last)century France.

Werner Herzog and whacko Klaus Kinski made some great movies together. My faves are "Aguirre: Wrath Of God", and "Fitzcarraldo". There's also a documentary about the stormy relationship between the two, worth watching.

The Sergio Leone spaghetti westerns are lots of fun.

I watched Y Tu Mama Tambien again last night. It was better the second time - at least this time, having already seen the ending, I understood the female character's motives. But the narrator is still annoying.

Although I've seen my share of crappy foreign films (most recently, The Spanish Apartment), ...
Bummer. The Spanish Apartment is bad? Darn. I am trying to collect all of Audrey Tautou's movies. Amelie and Venus Beauty Institute are both excellent.

The best movie I saw last year was Man on the Train (now available on dvd), a French film about two strangers' transformation as they become unlikely friends...

Yep, I saw that one just the other night. But I don't understand the ending. Did they really switch places? Or did they just imagine it while they lay there dying?

The Spanish Apartment is bad? Darn. I am trying to collect all of Audrey Tautou's movies.

I didn't much care for it. Audrey Tautou is barely in it. If you didn't catch Dirty Pretty Things during its theatrical run, be sure to check it out when it hits dvd in March; it's her first English-speaking role and it's a very good movie.

Or did they just imagine it while they lay there dying?

That's the way I interpreted it.

Some great picks!
I love Ozu, sublime. Tokyo Story is as relavent now as it was back then, maybe more so now with Baby Boomers coming of age and dealing with their parents.

Herzog--Balthazar is brilliant, I don't have any other words.

Kurosawa has been brilliantly ripped off by Sergio Leone, George Lucas and a host of others but Kurosawa is the original. Most of his films are favorites.

I also love the spagetti westerns. Once Upon a time in America is great.
On the western theme, Unforgiven and Tombstone.

I saw "Like Water For Chocolate" last night and it was a REALLY good film. You gotta see this one.

Like previous posters let me recommend Kurosawa's "The Seven Samurai". It's a great adventure movie (perhap's the greatest) and like other great adventure films (The Treasure of the Sierra Madre or The Wild Bunch) it is driven by the characters.
Also:
Jean Cocteau: "Beauty and the Beast", "Orpheus"
Tartovsky (sp?): "Solaris"

Like previous posters let me recommend Kurosawa's "The Seven Samurai". It's a great adventure movie (perhap's the greatest) and like other great adventure films (The Treasure of the Sierra Madre or The Wild Bunch) it is driven by the characters.


Yeah. After seeing "artsy" Kurosawa films like Ran and even Rashoman I was slightly surprised how accessible it is. I highly recommend it, don't be scared away by it's length or assuming it's going to be a slow, cerebral art film. It's really a lot of fun to watch.

Not all Hollywood films are necessarily dreck either. I like sci fi, and films like K-Pax and Gattaca set a high benchmark in quality sci-fi film making.

Check out Event Horizon, I loved it.

Here's an interesting double bill that gets behind some of the rhetoric of the past few years:

Osama, the first film from Afghanistan since the fall of the Taliban, a frightening look at the daily lives of ordinary people under that regime.

In This World, Michael Winterbottom's DV road movie that follows a pair of young Afghan refugees seeking a better life in London

I tend to really be into Asian films - mostly out of China, Hong Kong (and as far as cinema goes, it's a separate entity from China), Japan, and South Korea. In general terms, Kurosawa was the man, and for contemporary stuff it's all about SABU and Wong Kar-Wai as far as directors are concerned. For cinematographers, I am utterly obsessed with Christopher Doyle and Kazuto Sato. Also minorly infatuated with anything Takeshi Kitano touches.

Specifically, I highly recommend Hero as DP'd by Chris Doyle, as well as Monday and Drive, both of which were Sato/SABU collaborations. And while I have no idea who directed it at the moment, there's a film out there called Dragon Heat that I absolutely adore. Just about the most postmodern film ever made, I figure.

What about Jean de Florette and Manon des Sources. So, I know possibly most overlpayed foreign films ever, but what about the music, I just love that theme tune...

Foreign Flicks???

Ursula Andress
Catherine Deneuve
and Charo, twice.

sorry, can't miss a celeb jeopardy reference

I've thought of some more foreign ladies i've snogged...