Advocacy & Safety - How come noone rides like this?

From http://www.bikexprt.com/streetsmarts/usa/chapter2a.htm

On a multilane road with narrow lane, ride in the middle of the right lane.

http://www.bikexprt.com/streetsmarts/images/np11topright.gif

In my city 70% of cyclists use the sidewalk, remaining 30% hug the curb/ white line. If this is the right way to ride ( which I think it is ), how come nobody does it?

Because car drivers think they own the road and will voice their displeasure at a bike that they feel is in their way. Staying as far out of the road as possible seems to increase your chance at surviving. I always ride on the sidewalk or next to it, but I also make sure anyone walking on the sidewalk gets the right of way since technically I am not supposed to be on it.

Because car drivers think they own the road and will voice their displeasure at a bike that they feel is in their way. Staying as far out of the road as possible seems to increase your chance at surviving. I always ride on the sidewalk or next to it, but I also make sure anyone walking on the sidewalk gets the right of way since technically I am not supposed to be on it.

As someone on this forum says, 'If you look like prey you will get eaten'. If you ride assertively in your lane, people are not going to mess with you. Of course there is that tiny minority who may still get mad, but such risk is there if you are on the white line or from angry pedestrians on the sidewalk.

Depends on where I am riding, the hwy (101) has a speed limit of 65 mph, no way am I riding like that. The city streets are a different matter, especially when I am making a left hand turn, then I take the lane (left) about a block early and stay there. If I am chugging up a hill I stay as far right as "practical"

Steven

Because it's not the right way to ride ... it's actually illegal.

According to the traffic act in the province where I live, cyclists must ride as far to the right as practicable. Not down the middle of the lane.

Check your laws.

Depends on where I am riding, the hwy (101) has a speed limit of 65 mph, no way am I riding like that.


Why not? How is the alternative of riding as far right as possible safer where every third car is going to buzz you at 65 mph?

Because it's not the right way to ride ... it's actually illegal.

According to the traffic act in the province where I live, cyclists must ride as far to the right as practicable. Not down the middle of the lane.

Check your laws.

I think my laws say the same thing. They need to be changed. But I doubt that will happen given that less than 1% of total cyclists bike this way.

Because most of us ride for enjoyment, exercise, transportation, not to fight some imaginary war against the majority of road users. I can get where I'm going safely, comfortably, enjoyably, and quickly without being in the face of every motorist who overtakes me.

Take the middle of the lane as you show, and every motorist who approaches from the rear has to move into the next lane to overtake you. At best, you force all those motorists to move to the next lane (totally), and if there is already traffic in that lane, you force them to slow to your 15-20mph pace from whatever motor vehicle speed prevails on that particular stretch of road.

In some vicinities, you may be ticketed for not riding as far right as practicable.

Right or wrong, it's not worth it to most cyclists.

You want to spend your riding time fending off motorists to make a statement, go ahead.

Caruso

I moved to a city with bike lanes...which drivers mistake for turning shoulders all the time...then they take right of way and look at you like your the arse. I dunno does not compute I guess. We also cannot legaly take up a lane unless you have a partner and riding side by side..which makes sense I guess.

"taking the lane" as illustrated in the drawing is about as scary as riding in the gutter. I hate bicycling in traffic anyway. If you take the lane, it is only a matter of time before someone not paying attention runs you over.

If you ride the gutter, nearly every car on the road is going to give you a close call as they try to squeeze between you and the cars in the other lane.

All in all, the least scary and probably the safest is "taking the lane". Neither are ideal, but if you ride the gutter, most drivers will take chances trying to squeeze by you and your chances of getting bumped or hit are high.

I think one thing a lot of cyclists here don't consider is the fact that a lot of cyclists are extremely slow it really isn't practical. My wifes mother has taken to biking around but she bikes between 5-10mph. I can't see her taking a lane or trying to use a left turn lane. Instead she rides on a lot of sidewalks where there are no lanes and cross at crosswalks.

The only time I see this a being legal in most places is when there are parked cars to your right and traffic is light. as for me I ride the road as far right as practical and with traffic.

That's a legal lane position here. In a lane too narrow to share that illustration is as far right as practicable. It's a much safer lane position than hugging the curb, and a whole lot safer than riding on the sidewalk.

I may not be right in the middle of the lane under those conditions, but I will be a position that gives me the entire right half of the right lane. In certain situations, I will be in the middle of the lane. Sometimes the left tire track.


316.2065 Bicycle Regulations

(5)(a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:

1. When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.

2. When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.

3. When reasonably necessary to avoid any condition, including, but not limited to, a fixed or moving object, parked or moving vehicle, bicycle, pedestrian, animal, surface hazard, or substandard-width lane, that makes it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge. For the purposes of this subsection, a "substandard-width lane" is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and another vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.

(b) Any person operating a bicycle upon a one-way highway with two or more marked traffic lanes may ride as near the left-hand curb or edge of such roadway as practicable.

All of the "Bicycling Street Smarts" books are an excellent source of information.

I fact, I am a firm believer that multiple, same direction, narrow lanes are the best, and safest, cycling infrastructure. The sub-standard width gives the cyclist the full use of the lane, and motor vehicles have another lane in which to pass.

From http://www.bikexprt.com/streetsmarts/usa/chapter2a.htm

On a multilane road with narrow lane, ride in the middle of the right lane.

http://www.bikexprt.com/streetsmarts/images/np11topright.gif

In my city 70% of cyclists use the sidewalk, remaining 30% hug the curb/ white line. If this is the right way to ride ( which I think it is ), how come nobody does it?

Define "nobody."

I know several people that ride like that... and in a narrow lane, really what other way is there to ride?

All of the "Bicycling Street Smarts" books are an excellent source of information.

I fact, I am a firm believer that multiple, same direction, narrow lanes are the best, and safest, cycling infrastructure. The sub-standard width gives the cyclist the full use of the lane, and motor vehicles have another lane in which to pass.


Which is fine as long as the traffic is light enough to allow that pass. If it isn't, hold onto your heart, 'cause they'll be right up your date, and not happy about it.

Randonneur



Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Canada
Because it's not the right way to ride ... it's actually illegal.

According to the traffic act in the province where I live, cyclists must ride as far to the right as practicable. Not down the middle of the lane.

Check your laws.

know how to intrepret your laws, machka. on a road with a narrow lane, riding 'as far right as practicable' will sometime mean taking up the entire lane. urban conditions often necessitate this.

I suspect 10 percent of drivers fume when they see a bicyclist in the lane even if they aren't affecting the motorist in any way (like if the motorist is coming the other direction) and at least 1 percent behind you are going to honk- bicyclists, we do get no respect!

About 3 or 4 miles of my commute is a road like this. I stay well away from the crub in the right tire track but not in the middle of the lane. There is so much oil nad debris in the center I think it could be dangerous. You can still make it obvious you clearly do not want to share your lane. I would use the L tire track before the middle.

As someone on this forum says, 'If you look like prey you will get eaten'. If you ride assertively in your lane, people are not going to mess with you. Of course there is that tiny minority who may still get mad, but such risk is there if you are on the white line or from angry pedestrians on the sidewalk.

+1

The only time I see this a being legal in most places is when there are parked cars to your right and traffic is light. as for me I ride the road as far right as practical and with traffic.

Yep in GA the law clear states as far right as possible.

I ignore it and when I can I take the lane on curves and at any side streets to avoid "the squeeze" and the "right hook". Sometimes you get caught out and get freight trained by a line of cars. That's when its really scary and most of my commute is a double lane roads like illustrated but curvy in spots. For the most part when traffic is light most drivers will act like that and change lanes. Something about rush hour and all courtesy and safety goes out the window especially if they have a phone in their hand. :(

'If you look like prey you will get eaten'.

AMEN. That sums it up pretty good. Own your Lane!

As someone on this forum says, 'If you look like prey you will get eaten'. If you ride assertively in your lane, people are not going to mess with you. Of course there is that tiny minority who may still get mad, but such risk is there if you are on the white line or from angry pedestrians on the sidewalk.

And there is a tiny minority of bicyclists who actually believe that incessant posturing and sloganeering forms an impervious shield about them when cycling in real traffic, just like in the pleasant drawings/diagrams in their well thumbed books and pamphlets.

Many of us ride exactly like that where the right lane is not wide enough to safely share.

In my opinion, the take or share decision is a cyclist responsibility since it so much more difficult for motor traffic to determine the safe option. Likewise, we are responsible for making our decision clear by our lane position. Personally, I also accept responsibility for my choice of routes.

Because it's not the right way to ride ... it's actually illegal.

According to the traffic act in the province where I live, cyclists must ride as far to the right as practicable. Not down the middle of the lane.

Check your laws.
If the lane is too narrow for the bike and car to share, then the middle of the lane IS as far right as practicable. It is actually legal.

The reason almost no one rides like that is because they either don't know they are allowed to, (and should for their own safety) or they allow motorists to intimidate them into an unsafe riding position.

Like you, I (and area motorists) practically never see any rider not in the gutter or on the side walk. Even so, holding the entire lane when appropriate still works well when I do it. Contrary to what some think, drivers will not run you over just because you're in front of them. Even the ones who do get upset, still almost always pass me safely.

i'm somebody, i ride assertively, and claim a lane as needed - right tire area. (VB- "ride like this"!)

i rode almost 90 miles (85.5 dst) so far this week in club (1) and commuting (3) events. my commuter is full with right/left-front and rear Pannier sets, a handlebar bag, rack pack, flag, and myself. like a peacock, i consider all of my vehiclar bicycle's size and colors help in the identification of needed safe (shared) areas. behave predictably!

it appears, for the most part, drivers around here have an understanding of how to share.

there are, as always, many many more hurtles to work on for bicycle/pedestrian inclusion!

If you ride assertively in your lane, people are not going to mess with you.

How, may I ask, do you "ride assertively" on a bike vs. 3000-5000 pound vehicles. I like to enjoy myself, not worry about getting run over.

And there is a tiny minority of bicyclists who actually believe that incessant posturing and sloganeering forms an impervious shield about them when cycling in real traffic, just like in the pleasant drawings/diagrams in their well thumbed books and pamphlets.

And how, pray tell, would you ride in a lane too narrow to share... such as the typical older (thus narrow) urban street lined with parked cars. Bear in mind that the illustration shows an empty lane running parallel that any other traffic could use. No sidewalks are shown, no shoulder is shown... so these alternatives may not be available. Alternative streets may also not be available (a situation that readily exists in my 1950s neighborhood, which is surrounded by canyons)

Please tell us your magic sir. How do you ride such streets?

I take the lane when necessary. Mainly on 30-35 mph streets that look exactly like the diagram. I've been squished into the gutter to many times to not ride like this and riding the sidewalk is slow. Take the lane when necessary, move over when possible.

Practicable doesn not mean the same as possible. Practicable is given because it allows cyclists to decide what is safe and what is not.

How, may I ask, do you "ride assertively" on a bike vs. 3000-5000 pound vehicles. I like to enjoy myself, not worry about getting run over.

To me, riding assertively means riding with confident body language, not hesitating to take the lane when I need to, and not being tentative when interacting with cars. If you're tentative, motorists will walk all over you. If you're assertive, things work out much better.

I ride mainly in busy city streets in Boston, and riding assertively is a must.

urban road and traffic conditions that necessitate an assertive bicyclist is part of the core problem affecting ridership and rider safety in the USA

- roads that appear unsafe quell ridership,
-conditions that encourage curbhugging decrease safety,
and lack of riders fuel motorists' discrimination against bikes as transportation.

Depends on where I am riding, the hwy (101) has a speed limit of 65 mph, no way am I riding like that. The city streets are a different matter, especially when I am making a left hand turn, then I take the lane (left) about a block early and stay there. If I am chugging up a hill I stay as far right as "practical"

Steven

WHY ARE YOU ON THE HIGHWAY! In toronto thats illegal!

To me, riding assertively means riding with confident body language, not hesitating to take the lane when I need to, and not being tentative when interacting with cars. If you're tentative, motorists will walk all over you. If you're assertive, things work out much better.

I ride mainly in busy city streets in Boston, and riding assertively is a must.

While I don't disagree with ride "assertively..." there are two issues that can really screw that up... one is when assertive cyclist meets assertive motorist. (or worse, "aggressive" motorist)

The other issue is when motorists mistake "polite" for "wimpy." We seem to have lost courtesy in this country, as everyone "assertively" works on their self esteem.

I do everyday

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5oz68pMWoM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvhon7TkwtA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNYSvFc50qA

WHY ARE YOU ON THE HIGHWAY! In toronto thats illegal!

Check a map... a highway may not be limited access, and in fact may be the only way to some locations.

These definitions and rules tend to vary from country to country and location to location.

I understand in Maryland for instance cyclists are not permitted on certain highways, where as in other places highways are perfectly legal to use, but freeways or interstates may be off limits (with exceptions) to cyclists.

And of course the real catch is that "highway" is often defined in law as any road.

Do you have "farm highways" or "rural highways" in Ontario? Looking at the map, I suspect roads such as 404 and 407 are off limits to cyclists, but I suspect that the use of 7, 48, and 12 may be OK.

And how, pray tell, would you ride in a lane too narrow to share... such as the typical older (thus narrow) urban street lined with parked cars. Bear in mind that the illustration shows an empty lane running parallel that any other traffic could use. No sidewalks are shown, no shoulder is shown... so these alternatives may not be available. Alternative streets may also not be available (a situation that readily exists in my 1950s neighborhood, which is surrounded by canyons)

Please tell us your magic sir. How do you ride such streets?

And no other traffic is shown, nor any parked cars. In fact such an idealized street as in the the diagram doesn't look like any of the urban streets that I commuted on daily in Philadelphia for five years. Those streets had constant traffic in all lanes, including passing (of both cars and cyclists) from the right parking/bus lane if the motorists thought they could squeeze in and beat the slowpoke across the intersection.

My point is that urban cycling is hardly as simple as spouting "take the lane" or "stay off sidewalks" or "never ever ride in a door zone" or "be assertive" mantras, and drawing over simplified schematics.

That diagram exactly describes a stretch of my commute past the local mall. The traffic is not completely bumper to bumper, but it is fairly plentiful. Maine law includes the narrow lane exception to the ride to the right rule, as others have quoted, so it is perfectly legal here. I will admit that I don't take the exact center in that section, but I do ride around 2-3' out from the edge, especially because the edge has a lot of bad pavement and drain grates. So cars don't have to pull completely into the next lane to pass me, but they do have to pull out a little. And guess what - they do! I also hold my place the center of the lane at red lights, with no problems.

Granted, I ride faster than your average beginner, although I'm no racer. But I think more important than speed is riding a straight line. Of course someone who can't ride a straight line is going to have trouble riding as shown in this situation, and will get a lot of motorists ticked off. But I don't think the 8-10 MPH difference between a beginner and me is that significant if both are riding a straight line. Besides, the red lights are frequent enough in my case that the cars don't have time to get up to a really high speed between them. (They aren't timed to keep cars moving, an advantage for cyclists!)

The exception to this speed-matters-less theory might be the ability to get up to speed quickly when the light changes. I have developed a pretty quick start and I do think it helps, because I'm not holding up the person behind me that much while I hold the center of the lane to at least the middle of the intersection before trending right again.

ILTB, you didn't answer the question. And when would it ever be appropriate to ride in the door zone?

And there is a tiny minority of bicyclists who actually believe that incessant posturing and sloganeering forms an impervious shield about them when cycling in real traffic, just like in the pleasant drawings/diagrams in their well thumbed books and pamphlets.

A pithy slogan can sum up a simple concept far better than any Wall Of Words ever did.

Because it's not the right way to ride ... it's actually illegal.

According to the traffic act in the province where I live, cyclists must ride as far to the right as practicable. Not down the middle of the lane.

Check your laws.
Most "as far to the right as practicable" laws have an exception if the lane is not wide enough to share safely. Regardless of explicit exemptions, if a lane is not wide enough that a car could pass me in the lane with three feet clearance, then as far as practicable becomes the middle of the lane. Otherwise drivers will try to pass me too closely, and that's hardly practicable.

Examples:
Florida: A bicyclist may leave the right-most portion of the road in the following situations: when passing, making a left turn, to avoid road hazards, or when a lane is too narrow for a bicycle and a car to share safely

Ontario: the government even publishes a cycling skills booklet saying

In urban areas where a curb lane is too narrow to share safely with a motorist, it is legal to take the whole lane by riding in the centre of it.
(http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/pubs/cycling/section3.0.shtml)

But if there is a dual carriage way, as in the example, the lanes will very likely be wide enough to accommodate both car and bicycle ... especially in my part of the world where the law I referred to comes from.

As far to the right as practicable means riding as close to the curb or edge of the road as you can and still be able to pedal the bicycle without running into road grates, gravel, etc. Should you encounter such hazards, you are allowed to move toward the middle of the lanes.

Interestingly, the law here also states that motorized vehicles should ride as close to the center line as practicable.

Most "as far to the right as practicable" laws have an exception if the lane is not wide enough to share safely. Regardless of explicit exemptions, if a lane is not wide enough that a car could pass me in the lane with three feet clearance, then as far as practicable becomes the middle of the lane. Otherwise drivers will try to pass me too closely, and that's hardly practicable.


I've found that you don't need to ride anywhere near the centre of the lane to do that though. About a metre from the lane edge is far enough. If you do get buzzed at that distance, though, I would recommend moving further into the lane rather than out of it.

Another handy traffic riding tip, is to not get too fazed about getting buzzed; it's bound to happen sooner or later, no matter how 'VC' you ride. The worst thing to do is panic, and lose your line.

Which is fine as long as the traffic is light enough to allow that pass. If it isn't, hold onto your heart, 'cause they'll be right up your date, and not happy about it.

My safety comes before anyone's convenience including my own. In a sub-standard width lane, this lane position is much safer than inviting close passing by hugging the curb and risking getting side-swiped. The only other viable alternative is choosing another route, if there is one available that is not the same scenario.

Whether "they" are happy about it is not a factor worth consideration.

My safety comes before anyone's convenience including my own. In a sub-standard width lane, this lane position is much safer than inviting close passing by hugging the curb and risking getting side-swiped. The only other viable alternative is choosing another route, if there is one available that is not the same scenario.

Whether "they" are happy about it is not a factor worth consideration.

Did I say otherwise?

That diagram exactly describes a stretch of my commute past the local mall. The traffic is not completely bumper to bumper, but it is fairly plentiful. Maine law includes the narrow lane exception to the ride to the right rule, as others have quoted, so it is perfectly legal here. I will admit that I don't take the exact center in that section, but I do ride around 2-3' out from the edge, especially because the edge has a lot of bad pavement and drain grates. So cars don't have to pull completely into the next lane to pass me, but they do have to pull out a little. And guess what - they do! I also hold my place the center of the lane at red lights, with no problems.

Granted, I ride faster than your average beginner, although I'm no racer. But I think more important than speed is riding a straight line. Of course someone who can't ride a straight line is going to have trouble riding as shown in this situation, and will get a lot of motorists ticked off. But I don't think the 8-10 MPH difference between a beginner and me is that significant if both are riding a straight line. Besides, the red lights are frequent enough in my case that the cars don't have time to get up to a really high speed between them. (They aren't timed to keep cars moving, an advantage for cyclists!)

The exception to this speed-matters-less theory might be the ability to get up to speed quickly when the light changes. I have developed a pretty quick start and I do think it helps, because I'm not holding up the person behind me that much while I hold the center of the lane to at least the middle of the intersection before trending right again.

ILTB, you didn't answer the question. And when would it ever be appropriate to ride in the door zone?

You first wrote that the diagram "exactly describes a stretch of my commute", then the rest of the post "admits" and lists the numerous significant differences and exceptions in your commute and technique from the diagram. What a laff!

I ride where it is best for me and that includes careful riding in door zones when that is a better alternative IMO than riding the available alternatives - usually all lanes full, busy city traffic. I prefer sensible riding based on my evaluation of the situation, rather than complying with dogmatic one right way solutions proffered on the Internet and pamphlets by self styled know-it-alls and/or VC disciples.

I will 'take the lane' if there is no other option (nice shoulder/breakdown lane/bike lane) and I can generally do 60 to 70% or more of the posted speed limit. For example, I don't have an issue doing it on a 30mph road but would not do it on a 55-65mph road.

I will 'take the lane' if there is no other option (nice shoulder/breakdown lane/bike lane) and I can generally do 60 to 70% or more of the posted speed limit. For example, I don't have an issue doing it on a 30mph road but would not do it on a 55-65mph road.

I was thinking about relative speed last week while my bike was busted. I dont think drivers can tell if we are going 20 or 25 unless they are stuck behind us for a long time. Then it does not matter. I do try to stay off roads the speed limit is over 45mph.

I won't take the lane on a 40mph or more road. The closing speed between what I can ride and what the cars are coming up on me at is just too much for me to feel comfortable.

In that 25-35 mph speed limit area where I can sustain 20mph, I don't think the closing speed is dangerous for me. I have areas like that on my commute and I take the lane as needed. I also have a mirror, though, and I do watch my behind.

You first wrote that the diagram "exactly describes a stretch of my commute", then the rest of the post "admits" and lists the numerous significant differences and exceptions in your commute and technique from the diagram. What a laff!

I ride where it is best for me and that includes careful riding in door zones when that is a better alternative IMO than riding the available alternatives - usually all lanes full, busy city traffic. I prefer sensible riding based on my evaluation of the situation, rather than complying with dogmatic one right way solutions proffered on the Internet and pamphlets by self styled know-it-alls and/or VC disciples.

OK you've danced around the question, so here it is directly... Do you ever take the lane? Is there any circumstance in which you ride so left as to consider it "taking the lane?"

OK you've danced around the question, so here it is directly... Do you ever take the lane? Is there any circumstance in which you ride so left as to consider it "taking the lane?"

Yes. There are a couple of places the lane is not wide enough for me and a car. The cars try to squeeze in it with me if I stay too far right. I stay in the R tire track most of the time, intentionally not getting r enough to give the illusion I want company. so the answer is yes, take the lane, if it is safer for everyone.

i DO ride like that unless i can't keep up with traffic, but where i ride, it never gets above 30 or 35 : /

I was taught decades ago to keep inside a two-foot-wide area at the right edge of the road, and have never seen a good reason to change.

I'd rather have cars passing me closely than stacking up in a long line behind me. If they're going to pass on a narrow two-lane road where they have to partially cross the yellow center line, I want to give them as much room as possible so they don't have to swing any farther into the opposing traffic's lane than absolutely necessary.