Road Cycling - Riding with a Racing Animal.

A nephew of amember of my biking group -joined the group for the Ride at Palm Springs..A century..He did it in five hours.
NOthing against racing animals..But wow..This guy is so strong he keeps breaking his bike. The torque/stress he puts on the bike when he sprints.
He keeps breaking chains, hubs, spokes, wheels. Bike is just a couple years old..Replaced $750 wheels once. He can stress out his frame, I am told when he sprints.
Is this just showing off? Is this how strong racers ride? Some say he tries to mimic the antics of Floyd Landis.
Is such riding worth the stress on your bike..Guess, pro's bikes only last one season.? Don't think this guy has that much money to go through bikes that quickly. Breaking chains...Think that unsafe? Do you ride like that.?
Guess, I would be proud to if it wern't unsafe..

well, i'm not sure, but here are my comments:

(i'm a sprint/power rider) and most of my recent experience is from MTB racing, but there the forces are often even higher (steep hills, lots of sprinting, etc)

i DO break more chains and deraileurs than most of my riding and racing buddies (i probably break a chain about 5 times a year but also this is mountain biking where the chain is subject to dirt and mud and i ride a 3x9 system and shift A LOT)... i think part of it is b/c i crank with more force and tend to run bigger gears and spin less than others, but also has to with style - i shift kind of "agressive" and i think this also stresses the system more...

as to breaking other stuff:
* deraileurs: in general i think you break a deraileur by poor shifting or improper maintenance/adjustment, not excessive force
* wheels should have very little to do with power - i think weight would be more of anissue. otherwise if he is not avoiding potholes or bunny-hopping or whatever

sure, you CAN break a crank or bend something, but if this guy is using 105 or higher (ultegra, dura-ace, campy) - i mean this stuff is designed for high forces - so i don't think it should be happening that much

i replace my drivetrain once a year, brakes MANY times and need major service once a year on my rear shock and once every 2 years on my fork -- but this is MTBing and i ride 6000+kms on the MTB... on my road bike which sees fewer miles i "break" a rear wheel maybe once a year from potholes and bunny-hopping and what-not - anyhow, maybe someone else has a different opinion, but i just don't see POWER/STRENGTH being that much of a factor in breaking bike components (why should power affect the wheel durability?)

I would take a serious look at the LBS that he goes to.

I doubt that the reason all this stuff is breaking is because of his power.

In all the pro bunch sprints I've seen, I can't ever recall seeing a chain, wheel, hub or frame break.

His uncles says when he sprints, he sort of does a wheelie on a road bike. He is about 6'2" and 200 pounds. Most recent damage was to a bottom bracket.

I would take a serious look at the LBS that he goes to.

I doubt that the reason all this stuff is breaking is because of his power.

In all the pro bunch sprints I've seen, I can't ever recall seeing a chain, wheel, hub or frame break.

true, I have never seen these things happen... except in crashes..

Perhaps he's using the "not so good" components.. that's why it keeps breaking...

I have never seen a broken 105 crank. A bent chainring maybe.. but not because of power.. its bad shifting..

Or, just maybe... he's that strong!!!

Is he buying his components out of the back of a van that shows up in his neighborhood once in a while?

He's obviously big and strong, but there are a lot of pro sprinters who are as big and 100 times stronger.

I can't see him literally breaking things because of his "power". There is a limit to how much stress he can put on a bike. He weighs 200 lbs so even standing he has a max of 200 lbs of force there. Now if he is breaking things, it is probably something else he is doing to the bike.

I have known some very large and very strong riders and none of them talked about breaking up bikes - quite the contrary. I have known people who were considerably larger at lean weight then your guy. Shoot, I am a big guy myself and although I can go through light wheels like popcorn, I don't have problems with frames, cranks, deraillers, bottom brackets, etc etc.

I can't see him literally breaking things because of his "power". There is a limit to how much stress he can put on a bike. He weighs 200 lbs so even standing he has a max of 200 lbs of force there. Now if he is breaking things, it is probably something else he is doing to the bike.

Not really. By using the muscles in your arms and trunk to pull up on the handlebars while using the muscles in your legs and butt to push down on the pedal in addition to your body weight, you can put a lot more power to the pedal than just your body weight.

Ever seen world class track riders? Those guys are monsters who generate enormous amounts of power. I can't recall ever seeing them break things.

Sure, they have to replace their bikes after a while due to the incredible stress put on the frames but these are pro track riders, not Joe Blow from Topeka.

A nephew of amember of my biking group -joined the group for the Ride at Palm Springs..A century..He did it in five hours.
NOthing against racing animals..But wow..This guy is so strong he keeps breaking his bike. The torque/stress he puts on the bike when he sprints.
He keeps breaking chains, hubs, spokes, wheels. Bike is just a couple years old..Replaced $750 wheels once. He can stress out his frame, I am told when he sprints.
Is this just showing off? Is this how strong racers ride? Some say he tries to mimic the antics of Floyd Landis.
Is such riding worth the stress on your bike..Guess, pro's bikes only last one season.? Don't think this guy has that much money to go through bikes that quickly. Breaking chains...Think that unsafe? Do you ride like that.?
Guess, I would be proud to if it wern't unsafe..

Uh....maybe it is not a fast course then if he did it in 5 hours. There are certain courses which are very difficult and it might take him over 6 hours. Seems pretty average to me. I'm approaching the 4 hour mark now for doing centuries on group rides like that, only I'm doing it solo. Sure my bike is faster than upright bikes, but I've seen plenty of guys do 5 hour centuries. I'm 200 lbs and my personal solo best was 4 hours 13 min 26 seconds. This was nonstop riding ........meaning no stops whatsoever. I've got a buddy who did a solo 3 hour 36 min century. 5 hours is pretty good however. I came across a rider on the hancock horizontal this year who was actually able to hang with me the whole route. It turned out he is the owner of Devinci Tandems and used to be a pro track sprinter. There were moments when we were trying to drop each other where just the two of us were approaching speeds of 38mph on the flats. Me being on a lowracer and him on an upright giant carbon......... I would say he is the stronger rider. Amazing he could hang with me for that distance.

Don't know if he or his uncle would blame his stregnth on on his broken parts, such as his wheels. But his uncle comments upon how he stresses a frame with his stregnth..The guy is fascinated by Landiss' tricks. That would seem to be a little rough on wheels for starters. Like Landiss' this Pat does a lot of mountain biking also.

I have broken a couple chains mountain biking (8 speed - 1 Shimano IG, and 1 Sram). It is dangerous, it can put you over the handlebars. Close, but not quite for me.

I have also blown out two freewheels. The ratchet pawls broke during a climb. I use LX freewheels, not XT as they seem to be stronger. I also blew the bearings out of a bottom bracket. However, these parts take high torque and lasted a reasonable amount of time before breaking.

The wheels and spokes are probably a weight issue more than power.

The deraileur breaking? I have mangled a couple on sticks and stumps. Breaking due to power? I can't imagine it.

I thought it was typical for high power racers to break frames every couple of seasons. We've got a few guys here who race/train 20K miles plus per year, and they seem to go through frames pretty quickly. Ti, Al, steel, they crack them all with enough power and miles.

When Cannondale posts the disclaimer about CAAD 7 life in their warranty manual, these are the guys they're talking to.

I have a friend that rides like nobody's business. He used to ride up from the south suburbs to visit me on his bike- it would take him under an hour to get that 30 miles knocked out. He was incredible. He was also really poor, and he lived in a pretty bad hood, and on top of that, he only had this Schwinn mountain bike. He would constantly run through chains, and his wheels were so out of true from riding it hurt to look at him ride. But he still would ride, and he was so fast I just couldn't believe it until I saw it for myself. He lives to ride, and he recently moved to Hawaii, so he gets good riding 365/7/24.

I really think it's possible to break frames and chains if you ride that much. Of course, I think it's just as much due to the lack of proper and regular maintenance as it is to riding as much as these kinds of freaks of nature type people ride. ;)

Koffee

I have a friend that rides like nobody's business. He used to ride up from the south suburbs to visit me on his bike- it would take him under an hour to get that 30 miles knocked out. He was incredible. He was also really poor, and he lived in a pretty bad hood, and on top of that, he only had this Schwinn mountain bike. He would constantly run through chains, and his wheels were so out of true from riding it hurt to look at him ride. But he still would ride, and he was so fast I just couldn't believe it until I saw it for myself. He lives to ride, and he recently moved to Hawaii, so he gets good riding 365/7/24.

I really think it's possible to break frames and chains if you ride that much. Of course, I think it's just as much due to the lack of proper and regular maintenance as it is to riding as much as these kinds of freaks of nature type people ride. ;)

Koffee



He was averaging over 30 mph on an old wobbly mountain bike?

Sure he can finish a century two hours ahead of his friends. What fun is that? I'll take him on matching him Guiness for Guiness. We'll see who falls first! :D

Jim

I have never heard of bottom brackets, frames, chaines, etc being broke.. The only thing I have broke or heard of things being broke were spokes. I am not saying my power or anyone elses power broke spokes, it could have been as said before "cheaper quality products". Tho I did think my spokes and wheel sets were good quality.

Yep, he sure was. I think people have to see it to believe it. I don't know what's up with him, but he has the endurance of a horse, and he's just really strong. I actually thought about buying him a bike at one point, but then he got his HVAC certification and moved to Hawaii, so he makes good money now and got a new mountain bike.

He used to ride from the suburbs into Chicago, then turn around and ride south all the way to Joliet and Kankakee, IL. The only reason why he'd stop is because he had to get home. That's about it.

Koffee

Throwing the B.S. flag.

I refuse to believe this guy spins along at 110 rpm in his 44x12, on wobbly, knobby tired wheels, sitting upright, through traffic, having to slow for turns, lights etc and somehow manages to beat the hour record set by Eddy Merckx in 1972, (Broken by Chris Boardman by only 11 meters once they took away his TT bike)

Plus he would have beat Ullrich for the stage 12 time trial win in last years tour.

It was all downhill. With a 50 mph wind at his back and a semi in front of him.

Good call on the B.S. flag.

It was all downhill. With a 50 mph wind at his back and a semi in front of him.

Good call on the B.S. flag.
When our group rides return from Palomar Mtn., a 5 mile downhill ride into Pauma valley, really gets the wheels turning. Not me..The hands hurt from 5 miles of braking.
Usually the winds are in your face. But those adventurism types. Let it rip. I clock downhills with braking at 35-40 range, when I let up on the braking.
SOme of these guys go for the gusto..I am sure they must be near 50 mph...If only the prevailing winds were from the east, they might not be able to stop until they hit the Pacific.
But, these riders complain that trucks get in their way, slowing them down..I am in disbelief.

Throwing the B.S. flag.

I refuse to believe this guy spins along at 110 rpm in his 44x12, on wobbly, knobby tired wheels, sitting upright, through traffic, having to slow for turns, lights etc and somehow manages to beat the hour record set by Eddy Merckx in 1972, (Broken by Chris Boardman by only 11 meters once they took away his TT bike)

Plus he would have beat Ullrich for the stage 12 time trial win in last years tour.

That is nothing. I was talking to a mechanic in a bike shop. He claimed that he and 3 other guys rode 160 miles in 4 hours and that was with stops for water, food and to relieve themselves :D . Gosh, I wonder how fast these guys could have gone if they were in a hurry? :p

Note, your sarcasm reader should be off scale.

There is no way that guy could average 30 miles in one hour on a mountain bike or these 4 guys could do 160 miles in 4 hours. It is just wishful thinking.

I do not believe that there are people out there who with no particular training can outperform the top pro cyclists who turn in their performances often under nearly perfect conditions and only after years of rigorous training.

I thought it was typical for high power racers to break frames every couple of seasons. We've got a few guys here who race/train 20K miles plus per year, and they seem to go through frames pretty quickly. Ti, Al, steel, they crack them all with enough power and miles.
i'm not an expert here, but if you start talking about pros, then some of them for certain races (like say time trails) use REALLY light bikes and components. since they have the money to burn and the support of the manufacturers who want to field-test their products, they can really push the limit on reducing weight. usually this stuff is custom built for a rider with all kinds of Ti and Carbon and Kevlar and what-not to save weight - so say some Joe at 200lbs gets ahold of an ultra-light frame or wheel specially built for Tyler Hamilton (and it happens to fit) and he doesn't maintain it like the pros do, then i think you could have MAJOR problems.

otherwise, i agree with most of the posters: maintenance and riding style have more to do with it than power

i would recomend that he 1) if not already, he learns a little more about maintenance and 2) maybe think about the LBS/mechanic and maybe switch and 3) if he has the choice between "normal" components and ultra-light he should go with the normal --- this is more relevant to mountain biking, but there are many bike products designed for the average 160lb racer that even from the manufacturer are not recommended/warrantied for heaveier riders (eg. Speedplay Frog ti pedals, various suspension forks like the SID Team i think, lightweight bars and stuff). furthermore, many frame manufacuters do not recommen/warranty their frame when ridden for Downhill or jumping or big drops (a 10' drop REALLY stresses a frame) note that almost all of this is WEIGHT not power related, but in road cycling the bike takes less "beating" from elements/drops so rider weight is less crucial - even at 165lbs there are some things i won't use (like the Ti pedals or super-light forks) but for my girlfriend at 108lbs they're good choices.

I'm just talking about regular lightweight road race frames here, either major brand or custom. Racers that compete at the CAT I/II level, 20K miles plus a year with a lot of max output climbing and 1000W sprinting in the big gears do break their sub 3 lb frames in a couple of years. It's just a small part of the price of competing.

The major brands know this of course. They exclude fatigue damage or "wearout" from their Lifetime Warranties so they don't have to provide a lifetime supply of frames to these racers.

I have a friend that has owns a bike shop and has wrenched there for years, and is also a racer of some regional notoriety. Even tho' he weighs less than 200 lbs (I'm thinking somewhere around 170-180), he has a 1200+ watt sprint and definitely cannot use the lightest wheels out there.