Advocacy & Safety - Liability and Next Steps...

Hi.
Last night I hit a big patch of Ice (on Chambers St, right before Church St going towards City Hall). It looked like a fire hydrant had leaked on the street and froze in our lovely 19F NYC weather. I would say it was close to 50 ft long and 5 ft wide. Pretty thick too.
Of course I saw it at the last possible second and miserably fell. In my fall I hit the car on my left (I was riding between the car and the sidewalk).

People on the scene were amazing. There were like 10 people checking on me to see if I was OK. It took me a few seconds to realize what had happened; but I got up and am happy to report that my bike and I are OK.

In my fall it appears I did some minor damage to the car on my left. The driver and I exchanged phone numbers and I went on my way.
I spotted a police car a few block up later and went to notify him of the Ice patch. When I explained what happened to the policeman , he told me that I was not liable for the damages done to the car; per NYC law, I was considered in the same category as a pedestrian. If the driver wanted to report the incident, this would count against him, as hitting me.

The driver called me today and said he got estimates for the repair in the $300 range.

I am confused... what should I do next? Notify my insurance? Will they pay although I am not liable ?

Any rider going towards the Brooklyn Bridge through Chambers St... be careful, the ice patch is still there!...

NYCommuter.

I think you should support the motorist in making a claim against NYC fire dept in not carrying out proper maintenance of their hydrants. Also ask your insurance agent for advice.

I had something similar happen in NC. I had dropped back behind our group to take off a hat under my helmet and in trying to catch up to them I tried to bunny hop over two sets of railroad tracks. I landed on the last rail and my bike flew out from under me. A car immediately ran over my bike causing about $1000 in damage to my bike. The driver waited until I got up, apparently saw I wasn't dead and continued on his way. I felt I was to blame because this wouldn't have happened if I'd have not been so stuuupid. :rolleyes:

However, I was told that NC law was on my side. I don't know this for a fact, but I was told the driver of a vehicle is required by law to provide sufficient room when passing the cyclist. I've since read that NC law actually says the passing motorist has to provide a minimum of two feet of space between themselves and the vehicle (bicycle) they are passing. You may check to see if the law in NY is similar.

To finish my story on the night of my fall I went on my first date with a lady I'd met through some mutual friends. Me with road rash all over my arm and leg that I tried vainly to hide. Nine years later we're still married.

I think you should support the motorist in making a claim against NYC fire dept in not carrying out proper maintenance of their hydrants. Also ask your insurance agent for advice.

Agreed. Sounds to me like the council or whomever is responsible for maintaining public facilities are liable on this one. It wasn't really the driver's fault.

Trying to make a claim against the city for a $300 repair sounds like a lesson in futility to me. It will surely take more than $300 worth of both your, and the other guy's time to pursue this avenue.

Since patches of ice are not uncommon in 19 F weather, why not offer to split the difference with the guy. If he doesn't want to go for that, then he can waste his time taking you to small claims court and risk not getting anything.

Getting your insurance involved for a $300 claim is probably also a waste of time.

Trying to make a claim against the city for a $300 repair sounds like a lesson in futility to me. It will surely take more than $300 worth of both your, and the other guy's time to pursue this avenue.


Not so fast, supcom. I am a supervisor for a waterworks department and depending on circumstances, this looks like a payable claim to me. If the NYC waterworks dept (Fire departments just use fire hydrants, they don't maintain them), was aware of the leak I think your're entitled to the $300. There are many times we get called about small leaks, investigate and decide to repair the next day. In winter, we tend to repair them asap, but occasionally we'll call the roads people to keep the area sanded or salted to prevent mishaps such as yours until the leak can be repaired.

I'd say it's worth a phone call, anyways. Call first, but the claim has to be in writing.

I think this is what they call an accident. Since the $300 probably does not meet the guy's insurance deductible, He is out of luck (or more precisely $300).

Three hundred dollars of auto-body damage must be a miniscule amount. Can you even notice it at 10 paces ?

I would not even spend any more time worrying over it.

Dan

Not so fast, supcom. I am a supervisor for a waterworks department and depending on circumstances, this looks like a payable claim to me. If the NYC waterworks dept (Fire departments just use fire hydrants, they don't maintain them), was aware of the leak I think your're entitled to the $300. There are many times we get called about small leaks, investigate and decide to repair the next day. In winter, we tend to repair them asap, but occasionally we'll call the roads people to keep the area sanded or salted to prevent mishaps such as yours until the leak can be repaired.

I'd say it's worth a phone call, anyways. Call first, but the claim has to be in writing.

My bet is that if you call the city expecting them to pay up, you will get a real quick introduction to a little ditty they like to call "governmental immunity."

Here is an update: I contacted my renter's insurance. Talking to the claim adjuster, he felt I was liable and decided to send the driver a check.
This does seem fair to me, after all, the driver was just stopped in traffic, waiting for a green light when I fell on his car....

Not sure what to make of the liability issue.... who is liable here?
- The police officer said the city is not liable for the ice on the street. Furthermore, he claims that I am considered to be in the "non-motorist" category and therefore the driver is the one liable.
- The claim adjuster argues that if this case went to court, a judge would side with the driver. That is why he decided to pay.

This is behind me now, but it may help others in a more serious situation.

Glad to hear it worked out.

I guess there were two forces at play. Legal liability and moral liability. You damaged his car and did the right thing by offering to fix it.

It seems to me that a person stopped at a traffic signal is not doing anything to make them liable for an accident.

So if an accident occurs, that would seem to leave the moving entity as liable. I suppose we could blame God, but try to get His insurance to pay up!

Vehicle operators are expected to stay alert to conditions like snow and ice and if they hit someone as a result, they are probably liable. Of course, the investigating officer may decide not to issue a ticket because he does not consider the person to have made violation. However, liability is a civil thing and as such it is different.

It is not over yet. I am very concerned that NYC Commuter's insurance company will boost his premiums significantly to cover their loss.

It is not over yet. I am very concerned that NYC Commuter's insurance company will boost his premiums significantly to cover their loss.

I think this is the case with most insurance claims generally.