Fifty Plus (50+) - Looks like I'm in the market for wheels...

So I brought my Roubaix home a couple of weeks ago after a 2,000 mile tuneup. The wrench said he could true a badly out of true rear wheel but warned I might need new wheels if he was unsuccessful.

Well, he claimed success and I paid my $65 for the tune up and off I went. I haven't had a lot of opportunity to ride since then (travel, etc.) but it's become clear that the wheel is NOT trued (or has come out of true again) and there is a definite wobble. So maybe I need a new wheel after all.

Aside from wondering what portion of the $65 I should ask they put towards the purchase of a new wheel (if any -- am I being unreasonable believing that my $65 was largely wasted?), I could use a recommendation from y'all about wheels.

And, do I need to replace both at the same time, even though the front wheel appears good to go?

The bike is a 2007 Specialized Roubaix.

I don't want to break the bank.

Just replace the rear one but go online to find a builder that you can afford. Or failing that- just go to an online shop and buy what you can afford.

The wheelbuilder will do a better job though.

Any properly built and carefully tensioned wheel with mid-grade or better parts and at least 32 spokes should be fine. Avoid radial lacing and other fads -- good ol' 3X all around is strong and sturdy.

I recommend a wheel or wheels built with at least 32 standard double butted spokes. Those fancy schmancy boutique wheels that are standard equipment on new bikes just don't cut the mustard.

But, hey, that's me.:50:

Welcome back, we missed you.

These are the ones I got after pulling the Open Sports off of mine. I couldn't keep them true foe the life of me. I did learn how to work on wheels though.

http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=37
Ask for Chris, good luck.

I would like to think that the LBS guy took the time to do more than tweak a couple of spokes.

When I get a new premade set of wheels either on their own or with a new bike I start with stress relieving them ala Sheldon's method but using a couple of big peices of wood dowel instead of left hand cranks. I then bring any loose spokes up to tension or bring really tight ones down so there's a decent match. Only then do I true the wheel and then raise the tension in small steps up to where it should be truing repeatedly as I go along with a couple of more stress relieving runs along the way. By the time all this is done they pretty much ARE handbuilt and I find I get very few issues with them over the long haul.

If your LBS guy didn't do all this then it's no wonder your machine builts went out of whack again. And they would continue to go out of whack until they manage to stress relieve themselves over time. Now if he did all this then there really is something wrong but I can't believe that this level of bike would come with rims or spokes that are that cheezy.

Two bikes, two sets of wheels, thousands and thousands of miles - and no adjustments for me. Bontrager SL's on my Trek and Ksyrium SSC SL's on my Scott. Both sets are perfectly true. I ride year round on broken asphalt, chip/seal, dirt, gravel, etc.

a "badly out of true wheel" does not sound like the result of a machine built wheel. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's probably the result of hitting things with the wheel. I've trued some wheels that the owner didn't want to replace, they end up with low/high tension spots and there really is nothing a mechanic can do about it. Put yourself in the lbs guy's place, a bent up mis-tensioned wheel is no fun to work on. Now OP wants him to donate his labor too. "Maybe I can true it" means "I'm doing this because you want me to, not because it's a good idea."

Okay, I get the point about the wrench. He did his best. I'm good with that.

I will say, however, I haven't ridden more that about 15 miles since the tune up. And, to the best of my recall, I haven't ridden over anything other than smooth pavement. Could be wrong, but it would be a great coincidence.

So it still comes down to choosing a new wheel. And I did a google search for wheelbuilders in San Diego, but found no one so far. We do have a plethora of LBS's, however, so I can ask around.

Where as I can offer no intelligent advise towards wheel purchasing, I have
had plenty of practice of late at "making lemonade from lemons". I can't help
but to see an opportunity here for you. After you solve your wheel search
dilemna, be sure to save your old wheel. Buy a good spoke wrench and
get to work on that wheel. You've an opportunity here to pick up some
wheel trueing/building experience. Just a thought of course.

We do have a plethora of LBS's, however, so I can ask around.

Many LBS upgrade wheels on bikes from new. Those wheels are sometimes not too bad and they will sell them off cheap. So Ask around- get the specs of the wheel and price and come back to us here for info. We will be able to tell you if it is a decent wheel at a fair price- so get asking.

Good point on the damage aspect. I hadn't thought of that angle.

And it's not the damage that didn't happen since it was trued. It could just as easily be the echo of some earlier damage that knocked it out of true in the first place during your first 2000 kms.

Sometimes the damage can't be traced. I remember on one of my regular commuters that one day the rear was wobbling a little. Could feel it through the saddle and my feet. So that night I went to true it but it was a dent in the two clincher beads from hitting something. And as if that wasn't bad enough it had caused two small bucklings of the rim two spokes to either side of the hit area.

The weird thing is that I could not remember a single case of hitting anything at all hard enough to do something like that. It's still a puzzle but I can only chalk it up to the old Mavic CXP12's being really cheezy alloy to buckle so easily.

Any LBS can get Quality Wheelhouse wheels through QBP. They are handbuilt in Miami and are very well made. You only need a rear wheel. I would get one with Mavic Open Pro rims, Ultegra hubs and 32 double butted DT Competition spokes. Or for a few dollars more, get a local builder to build something similar.

My favorite wheel is the Mavic Ksyrium SLC as mentioned before - don't own a piar but would if I had the extra cash. I do have a set of Ksyrium Equippes on my Simoncini - no matter what the naysayers say it is a strong great riding wheel at a great price. I have ridden 4 centurys on them so far and have probably 3K miles on them with no problems - got the set on ebay. My Tarmac has the Easton Orion II on it - these also seem quite good - less weight than the Equipes and a good ride but more expensive - for this bike I wanted the SLC's but could not justify them. Ebay is a good place to get wheel - I bought both sets there.

My favorite wheel is the Mavic Ksyrium SLC as mentioned before - don't own a piar but would if I had the extra cash. I do have a set of Ksyrium Equippes on my Simoncini - no matter what the naysayers say it is a strong great riding wheel at a great price. I have ridden 4 centurys on them so far and have probably 3K miles on them with no problems - got the set on ebay. My Tarmac has the Easton Orion II on it - these also seem quite good - less weight than the Equipes and a good ride but more expensive - for this bike I wanted the SLC's but could not justify them. Ebay is a good place to get wheel - I bought both sets there.

Krysiums may be a bit above DG's Pricing restraints- But I have a pair of Mavic Aksiums that I keep as spares. In comparison to OM wheels- these are pretty good. Bit heavy but they are also strong and in fact over here they are a popular wheel for Cyclocross so must be durable. In fact-DG- They may be an alternative to getting a wheel handbuilt- which really should be your next stage on upgrading your bike.

Krysiums may be a bit above DG's Pricing restraints- But I have a pair of Mavic Aksiums that I keep as spares. In comparison to OM wheels- these are pretty good. Bit heavy but they are also strong and in fact over here they are a popular wheel for Cyclocross so must be durable. In fact-DG- They may be an alternative to getting a wheel handbuilt- which really should be your next stage on upgrading your bike.

Got me Equipes for $200 - for both wheels - there are several on ebay now.

Your front wheel is good to go if you think it's good to go. Front wheels generally lead longer lives than rear wheels.

Before you buy a new one though, Check out Blacksmith Bicycles (http://www.mybikesite.com/shops/openshop.cgi?loc=socal&lbs=sd__65) at 5555 Santa Fe St. They do great wheelbuilding and may be able to fix your wheel where Adams was not. They helped me when my Bianchi Eros back wheel sprung itself catastrophically 2 weeks after I bought the bike.

For wheels to remain true the key factor outside of a possible damaged rim is spoke tension. They should be tensioned toward the high end of what the rim manufacturer recommends for that particular rim. Truing can only be considered as a temporary fix if low to average spoke tension is used and wheel is not damaged by hitting something too hard.

These are the ones I got after pulling the Open Sports off of mine. I couldn't keep them true foe the life of me. I did learn how to work on wheels though.

http://www.bicyclewheelwarehouse.com/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=37
Ask for Chris, good luck.

This wheel looks like a great deal. Treated with a good tensioning and truing procedure they should be as good as some custom wheels costing three times as much. Certain some major custom builders are building with the same parts!

Road Fan

Wheels don't have to have 32 spokes to stay true. I've got 10,000 miles on my 24R/20F Velocity Deep Vs, which have required no truing other than once after a high speed encounter with some RR tracks (the flat-both-tires-dent-the-rims kind of encounter). My new wheels, Neuvation M28 Aero 3's are coming up on 1K miles and are still as dead true as they were out of the box. I'm 235 lbs., BTW. The Neuvations set me back just over $300 with ceramic bearings.

Universal cycles online wheel building rocks. I had them build a set of touring wheels to my specs and they are fantastic and it was only like 170 bucks for what I wanted. Great job of custom building.

What kind of wheel are we talking about? If it's a standard type wheel, it might just need to be respoked, or just retensioned. If it doesn't have any flat spots or dents, you, (your builder) can take out all the spokes and see if it's sprung. If it lays flat, it can be rebuilt with just spokes.
Take it from a guy who has destroyed many wheels, the right builder makes a huge difference.
There is such a difference in the ability of guys to build and correctly tension a wheel. You have to find the right guy.

So I brought my Roubaix home a couple of weeks ago after a 2,000 mile tuneup. The wrench said he could true a badly out of true rear wheel but warned I might need new wheels if he was unsuccessful.
...
And, do I need to replace both at the same time, even though the front wheel appears good to go?
The bike is a 2007 Specialized Roubaix.
I don't want to break the bank.

If your Roubaix is equipped somewhat similar to mine, it came with Alex wheels (mine are 298r), which have reviews across the board. Froma personal perspective, this set is holding up quite well and taking my abuse OK. However I did have another set, one series higher, which went out of true after 100 mi and have never stayed in true for more than a day or so.
I'd replace the set, if the rear is now cooked.
As for 32 spoke rims using ribar... you can go with a traditional wheel and rim , but they may not be any more sturdy than a well made modern design wheel. I was also leary of low spoke count wheels, but after quite a few thousand miles (close to 30K mi.) on a few modern sets (ritchey OCR, Velomax, those Alex 298s and Shimano - the ritcheys are getting the highest ride mileage), I'm a believer of modern rims and low spoke count wheels. Good modern rims are just that good!
Unless you;re really super hard on wheels (never lighten the saddle when you run over holes and high seams) a 24 to 28 spoke rear on a modern wheel is prolly as bulletproof as old-style 32.
Its really all in the wheel/rim design, quality and build.
Now you don;t have to spend big bucks to get a decent set. The ritchey OCRs I luv were under $300 for both, new. Velomax and Shimano also make nice wheelsets in around the $260 to $300 range (retail). And I'm sure there are others out there of good value - Easton ??? (the velomax use Easton rims...) Rolfs have a great reputation. Don;t know much about the Trek supplied wheelsets.
Or you can spend a little more and get a custom built wheel from a reputable builder.
When it comes to 700c clinchers, the modern wheels are quite nice.
Mavic, of course, makes some topflight wheels, but I've hear mixed reviews about the low end (not by price) Aksiums. Work OK, however those who've tried to use them as day-in-day-out training wheels haven't gotten any reasonable mileage out of them before they went out (local riders comments...)

best of luck

was fun coming back onto BF for the day...

some funny threads out there in 50+ land... ;-)

Unless riders post their weight, power production, riding style, mileage, maintenance routine and road conditions, IMHO, it is impossible to know if their experience, no matter how factually presented or well intended applies to your situation.

I ride on Bontrager, Easton, Zipp and HED and produce at least as much or more power than others. I have no problems. I have friends and training partners who are much stronger than I who ride on various brand name wheelsets with no problems. Now, I know a racer who is a clyde who destroys wheels and is constantly truing them. This is one area where YMMV dramatically.

The fact that it is a rear wheel leads me to believe you may have hit a pot hole and possibly at your weight (your a big strong guy), it was more than the wheel could take. You may have to go the clydesdale wheel route which you can buy or have someone build one to spec. Did the Adams do the truing or did you take it somewhere else? Good luck.

Did the Adams do the truing or did you take it somewhere else? Good luck.

No, I took it to the place I bought it, which is also a fine place, Bicycle Warehouse, in Pacific Beach. I will probably take it back there tomorrow and see what they suggest.

Unless riders post their weight, power production, riding style, mileage, maintenance routine and road conditions, IMHO, it is impossible to know if their experience, no matter how factually presented or well intended applies to your situation.

I ride on Bontrager, Easton, Zipp and HED and produce at least as much or more power than others. I have no problems. I have friends and training partners who are much stronger than I who ride on various brand name wheelsets with no problems. Now, I know a racer who is a clyde who destroys wheels and is constantly truing them. This is one area where YMMV dramatically.

The fact that it is a rear wheel leads me to believe you may have hit a pot hole and possibly at your weight (your a big strong guy), it was more than the wheel could take. You may have to go the clydesdale wheel route which you can buy or have someone build one to spec. Did the Adams do the truing or did you take it somewhere else? Good luck.

Hermes,

You are absolutely right - the wheel is where the rubber meets the road and if you don't know the abuse factor you cannot assess the data. In my case last summer I was 175, this summer it's more like 165. Since I don't measure power I can't tell you but I am a B class rider working an keeping up with the A class. My rides frequently have railroad tracks to cross at speed, frost heaves/cracks and roots pushing up in the pavement and the occasional pot hole which I mostly avoid. All this on stock factory wheels with no problems so far (knock on wood). I hope this gives DG a better data point.

I cannot fathom how a relatively new (and according to DG whom I trust to tell the truth) unabused wheel could go so badly out of round that a qualified mechanic would say it was un-trueable. Even more, I don't understand how that same mechanic could charge $65 to attempt and fail to successfully true that wheel. At the very least, the price seems way out of line (high even for success). Just my 2cents worth.


Note: wheels can be abused more by carrying the bike on its side in the back of a car than you could believe. Banging a wheel sideways while putting it in or out is outside of the normal design parameters.

If you still work and don't have a lot of time dealing with custom wheel builders, then stick with what works now, what's easiest to service practically anywhere, what's going to fit your weight and riding style.

If it was my bike (and it's not) I'd acquire a pair of 32 spoke Ultegra/Open Pros.

They're not the lightest or the most aero or the most anything. What they are is an excellent quality, general purpose, wheelset. Even after all these years they are still the standard to which other wheels are compared.

I cannot fathom how a relatively new (and according to DG whom I trust to tell the truth) unabused wheel could go so badly out of round that a qualified mechanic would say it was un-trueable. Even more, I don't understand how that same mechanic could charge $65 to attempt and fail to successfully true that wheel. At the very least, the price seems way out of line (high even for success). Just my 2cents worth.

I believe DG said they charged him $65 for a tuneup, not for just fixing the wheel. The LBS I use generally charges $45 for a tuneup, but that would not include extensive wheel truing or retensioning.

Did he explain WHY you needed a new wheel? Hub, cracks-in-rim, dinged sidewall, etc. Might indicate a better fix than buying a new wheel or give a clue to riding style stresses-- or, as pointed out above, could have just been one catastrophic event.

FWIW, I've used hand-built Open Pro's and machine-made OP's from Performance. The hand built held their initial truing longer and the Performance were cheaper. Otherwise, things have remained good for both over many miles.

Note: wheels can be abused more by carrying the bike on its side in the back of a car than you could believe. Banging a wheel sideways while putting it in or out is outside of the normal design parameters.

So true - I wrecked a wheel like that - also could not be trued by a guy who has a rep of being one of the best wheel builder in the NE. Thats when I bought the Mavic Equipes.

I believe DG said they charged him $65 for a tuneup, not for just fixing the wheel. The LBS I use generally charges $45 for a tuneup, but that would not include extensive wheel truing or retensioning.

You are correct..............I withdraw my claim of price gouging. $20 for anything mechanic related isn't bad.

As I'm reading this I'm thinking that I must have incredible luck with wheels. I'm currently riding 2 different pairs, Campy Ventos, which are 24/27 f/r, and Velomax (now Easton) Tempests, which are 18/24 f/r. I crashed the Tempest front wheel hard, squarely into a car at over 20mph, and cracked the frame and fork, and my wrists, but it only broke a couple of spokes and was easy to true once I replaced them. I still ride this wheel. The rear is completely without any wobble. The Ventos are as true as the day I bought them 4 years ago now. I weigh about 160-175 depending on how much beer I'm drinking, and I ride in NYC, which has some pretty bad streets.

Maybe I'm lucky in having 2 pair of bombproof wheels.

DG, There are several models of Roubaix and I don't know which one you have. However, I would recommend similarly to what several others have: Ultegra hubs, Velocity Aerohead rims (symetrical on the front, off/center on the rear) and DT Swiss spokes 2.0/1.5 except 2.0/1.8 on the rear drive side, 36 spokes, 3x. This gives you a strong, comfortable wheel that is easy to keep true. Also, I have found a lot fewer problems with wider tires: Either 25mm or 28mm especially in the fall and winter when there are lots of rocks and stuff on the road.