Advocacy & Safety - Slowly Pulling Up to Cars at Stop Light

Do any of you all ever experience this? You see a red light ahead and there are cars stopped at it. You don't want to clip out so you significantly slow down a good distance back and just creep up to the car in front hoping the light will change before you have to stop. I do this all of the time.

Here is what I am coming to. Cars behind me have gotten really mad because I am not right up on the car in front of me. I am like, that car is stopped, so what does it matter how far back I am?!?!?! When the light changes, I will take off. It's like they are hurrying to stop!

Yeah, I do the same thing. However, given the length of time Queensland traffic lights take to change, usually end up unclipping at least one foot (often both). It buggers up the Average Speed reading on my computer most of the time, but so be it. I have no intention of riding flat out only to have to slam on the brakes at a set of lights. Although interestingly, it's one of the few things around here that doesn't seem to upset drivers.

This one way of fitting intervals into your commute. However I haven't found that it bothers the motorists, because most of the streets with lights are wide enough for the cars to pass me if they want.

I do that same, but doing so led to my first fall from failing to unclip. The lady first in line at the light just sat there. Her attention directed towards something she was reading. The experience, however, has not really changed my habits.

I also do the slowing thing. Panic stops can often result in a "departure from verticle stability" for cyclists. Drivers don't seem to understand this because simply applying the brakes at the last minute in a car moving straight usually doesn't conclude with the vehicle in a rubber-side up condition. There is a general theory I hold that for the most part, motorists don't comprehend the concept of disimilar vehicular characteristics. They perceive every other vehicle on the road to behave just like theirs. This explains why the numbnut in the BMW is willing to cut in front of an 18-wheel semi tractor-trailer on the expressway and brake-check it while expecting 20 tons of truck to come to a complete stop in the same 150 feet as his little 3,000 lbs. sports sedan.

People are in a hurry to get to work(m-F) and they are not thinking clearly .The other two days they are simply in a hurry. It is not logical or courteous but it is reality. What worries me are people on the phone while driving. :(

I have done the same thing for years in my car, saves fuel and brake pads.
Some drivers must think they are sprinting for bonus points though, just to be ahead of me.

. Cars behind me have gotten really mad because I am not right up on the car in front of me.

I've heard that often as well.

Traffic law here says there is no passing on the right for anyone except under certain conditions (like in a one lane road where a car is waiting to turn left) so I find it hypocritical for a motorist to complain that a cyclist is passing on the right illegally when the cars do the same.

Our advocacy group wrote this guideline:


Passing on the right

Passing vehicles on the right between intersections, especially in
congested city traffic, is a topic of debate, even in the courts.

Under appropriate circumstances, case law suggests that cyclists
should be able to legally pass slower moving traffic on the right where
the curb lane is wide, provided they are cautious.

Most often it is best to shoulder check, move into the middle of the
lane and line up with the rest of traffic. This will also prevent motorists
from making a right turn into you as you enter an intersection.

When cycling in narrow-lane traffic where many motorists attempt to
squeeze past you before each traffic light, some cycling instructors
suggest the following:

Rather than moving up to the first car, which will likely re-pass the
cyclist, it may be more strategic for the cyclist to place themselves
only as far up the line as the last cars likely to make the next green
light.

It is legal to pass on the right:
* when you are in a bike lane; or
* when the vehicle is turning left or indicating a left turn.

When NOT to pass on the right:
* when traffic is moving;
* when there is a street, driveway or parking spot
a car can turn into; or
* when there is less than 1.5 m between traffic and the curb.

Cars behind me have gotten really mad because I am not right up on the car in front of me. I am like, that car is stopped, so what does it matter how far back I am?!?!?! When the light changes, I will take off. It's like they are hurrying to stop!

I find this driver behavior very odd. I see this when driving also - people will literally race to the end of a line of stopped vehicles.

When riding, I practice the same method of slowing you describe and I've had autos race around me, then immediately jam on the brakes. Recently, one fellow nearly skidded entirely through an intersection and hit another vehicle because the road was wet. I don't know why people are impatient to come to a stop - it's like that extra 6 feet of distance they gain is REALLY important to them.

But, I see crazy and scary things every week, and I've yet to figure any of it out, or attribute any cause to it other than people are weird when out on the road. Anyway, I don't worry too much about how impatient people behind me get because I really don't care - well, as long as they don't endanger me in the process.

I have done the same thing for years in my car, saves fuel and brake pads.
Some drivers must think they are sprinting for bonus points though, just to be ahead of me.

YES!!! Someone else who does this! I do it for the same reasons! I also practice this on my bicycle rides.

I also slow down long before I get to the last car in the line at a stop light. Its not just to avoid unclipping, althoug that is part of it.

Ever since I was rear ended in my car a few years back by some idiot who was playing with his tape deck and didn't notice that I was stopped at the stop light, I have been fearful of the same thing happening while on a bike. I don't think slowing down early will do anything to cause the distracted driver to notice me, but at least I won't be caught in a vice between the car in back and the one in front.

I like the drivers that never really stop at a red light, but slowly clrawl their vehicles at a red light. I just don't get it, as that pratice is hell on brake pads/shoes.

I do this too and I don't think drivers care about it. If you're in the middle of the lane and crawling, then I can see why they get mad. How do you know the drivers are mad because you do this? They honk?

I do this too and I don't think drivers care about it. If you're in the middle of the lane and crawling, then I can see why they get mad. How do you know the drivers are mad because you do this? They honk?


Honks, shouts, or tears around and then comes to a sudden stop, while still waiting for the light to change.

I, too, slow before the last car in line at a red light whether on my bicycle or in my truck.

The drivers that surge ahead just to wait amaze me. Reminds me of the old saying, "Hurry up and wait."

Oh, well, no accounting for people that don't ride bicycles. They must have a screw loose or something.

The drivers that surge ahead just to wait amaze me. Reminds me of the old saying, "Hurry up and wait."

Oh, well, no accounting for people that don't ride bicycles. They must have a screw loose or something.

How right you are about both things!!!

I actually do the opposite - I keep hammering until just about the last possible moment, then hit the brakes and clip out. I'm not skidding to a stop or anything but I do come to a stop fairly quickly. I've done it both ways but my avg. speed readout gets messed up doing the long slow down bit.

I actually do the opposite - I keep hammering until just about the last possible moment, then hit the brakes and clip out. I'm not skidding to a stop or anything but I do come to a stop fairly quickly. I've done it both ways but my avg. speed readout gets messed up doing the long slow down bit.

Yep, that's the trade-off

Question: Was the purpose of this thread to try and understand this behaviour or to simply pat ourselves on the back about the stupid habits of automobile drivers? While on the surface a lot of car driver behaviour seems pointlessly stupid (and a lot of it in fact is), it doesn't seem very productive to exacerbate the "us and them" mentality by simply sitting in a circle telling each other they're all idiots.

Granted, a lot of them ARE idiots. I'm not going to discount the understandable frustration we cyclists experience at the hands of testosterone-fulled morons with lead feet and SUV drivers with power complexes. Sometimes I think I'd enjoy cycling a lot more if I had a morning star in one hand. But it seems to me a bit like the pot calling the kettle black. We berate car drivers for not understanding that bikes ride differently, but don't want to try to understand the different mentality involved in driving a car. So here's my admittedly weak swiss-cheese theory:

For a cyclist, slowing down and stopping require the same amount of concentration and energy. It can even be more fun slowing to a crawl. But when driving a car, going slow can feel tedious, and when you know you're coming to a stop you'd rather just get to the stop so you can sit there twiddling your thumbs, no concentration or energy required. When driving a car, all the "effort" we're talking about is just a question of putting your foot on one or the other pedal. But when that's all your journey consists of it gets exaggerated and becomes a big deal. Pathetic, I know.

Yes, this difference is very marginal. But it can be enough to change our respective riding/driving habits. In most cases it's not enough to make a difference, but that mentality in the mind of a speed-freak or impatient driver can result in the ridiculous behaviour we see.

Before you go ranting and raving, remember:
1. I do the same thing as a cyclist, and see nothing wrong with it
2. I agree that drivers who do the stuff you've all said *are* very immature, and they don't have a clue how silly their actions are.
3. Trying to understand why people do this does not mean I accept or agree with it.

Is there anything we can do about it? No, I don't think so, because drivers who let that mentality grow so much as to actually change their driving pattern and become aggressive and impatient cannot be helped by anything we do. But there's my two cents, for what it's worth.

I'm not having a go at anyone. I'm a cyclist myself and hate many habits of car drivers. I just thought I'd point out that it would be better to at least *try* to understand what the hell makes people behave like that.

Stay the hell out of traffic lane.

Stay the hell out of traffic lane.

What a stupid comment, especialy from a fellow cyclist! He has every right to take up the whole "traffic lane" when coming to an intersection. It is the only safe way to make turns etc. I get in the traffic lane a lot. I do it when I want to be seen and respected by motorist. I pay taxes for those roads too.

Do you even ride in traffic shokhead?

Not if i can fricken avoid it. What the hell do i want to be in traffic with the cars for.

Do any of you all ever experience this? You see a red light ahead and there are cars stopped at it. You don't want to clip out so you significantly slow down a good distance back and just creep up to the car in front hoping the light will change before you have to stop.
Yes. In fact, it's changed the way I drive. When I'm driving and see a red light, I try to roll up slowly to meet traffic as it starts flowing again. It's really smarter.

The only problem I've had with motorists when I'm bicycling this way is that they rush around me to get in front of me at the light, ruining any chance of my timing it right. So sometimes I have to scrap the idea of rolling up slowly.

Do any of you all ever experience this? You see a red light ahead and there are cars stopped at it. You don't want to clip out so you significantly slow down a good distance back and just creep up to the car in front hoping the light will change before you have to stop. I do this all of the time.

...


When in car I coast up to a light 99% of the time, since I am in local traffic and have an idea of just how long the light is going to be. It does make cars pull close to you from behind, and the reason is simple: since your brake lights are not on to inform them that you are slowing down, it becomes hard to gauge exactly what is going on. Depending on factors such as weight, # of cylinders, idle RPMs, etc, even if the guy behind you takes HIS foot off the gas too, he may still crawl up your ass a bit. It would be nice to have 'slowing down lights' instead of (or in addition to) 'brake lights.'

With a bike, which doesn't have even brake lights the situation is more complicated. It is the main reason why I so rarely enter the main lane of traffic, and have always felt as a cyclist I was a 2ndary vehicle on the road. (the lack of turn signals is the other) When I approach a red light I ride as steadily toward the intersection as possible. Depending on what appears to be safest I will dismount and walk thru the interesction in its crosswalk, or ride thru when then light turns green. I don't use toe clips or whatever so 'getting out my clips' was never an issue.

roughstuff

Not if i can fricken avoid it. What the hell do i want to be in traffic with the cars for.


You just answered my question. When you do a lot of road riding you have to get in traffic sometimes.

If you're riding in the lane and crawl up to the next car in order to remain clipped, the driver behind has every right to get mad. Such behavior is rude and just plain stupid. If you want to be seen as a vehicule, behave like one. Don't crawl, just slow down normally. Be predictable.

If you're riding at the far right, then the driver is stupid. He can simply pass you. On the other hand, even if you're crawling on the far right, remember that you might not look sure-footed in the motorist's eye.

If you're riding in the lane and crawl up to the next car in order to remain clipped, the driver behind has every right to get mad. Such behavior is rude and just plain stupid. If you want to be seen as a vehicule, behave like one. Don't crawl, just slow down normally. Be predictable.

If you're riding at the far right, then the driver is stupid. He can simply pass you. On the other hand, even if you're crawling on the far right, remember that you might not look sure-footed in the motorist's eye.


Well, if its a red light. The driver isnt going to be going anywhere would he? Ill take the lane and crawl. Once the light changes, then ill move off and to the side, to all him to pass.

Yes. In fact, it's changed the way I drive. When I'm driving and see a red light, I try to roll up slowly to meet traffic as it starts flowing again. It's really smarter.

The only problem I've had with motorists when I'm bicycling this way is that they rush around me to get in front of me at the light, ruining any chance of my timing it right. So sometimes I have to scrap the idea of rolling up slowly.

I do the same thing when I drive my car too. It's funny, they don't get so upset and tear around me in the car when I do it, so what's the difference?

If you're riding in the lane and crawl up to the next car in order to remain clipped, the driver behind has every right to get mad. Such behavior is rude and just plain stupid. If you want to be seen as a vehicule, behave like one. Don't crawl, just slow down normally. Be predictable.

If you're riding at the far right, then the driver is stupid. He can simply pass you. On the other hand, even if you're crawling on the far right, remember that you might not look sure-footed in the motorist's eye.

Then I guess I am also rude when I drive my car!!!!

Not if i can fricken avoid it. What the hell do i want to be in traffic with the cars for.

Because in most cases it's the only way to actually go anywhere. I can't ride a trainer to work.

If you're riding in the lane and crawl up to the next car in order to remain clipped, the driver behind has every right to get mad. Such behavior is rude and just plain stupid.

Why? The driver behind you isn't going anywhere until the light changes regardless. I say, if they want to give themselves unnecessary stress levels and get mad over something that doesn't even delay them for a second, let them. It's their problem -- not mine.

Because in most cases it's the only way to actually go anywhere. I can't ride a trainer to work.

And plus, bicycle trails are too slow when you are averaging more than 20 mph!

Yeah, but your clips are your problem, not theirs.

There's nothing wrong in slowing down hoping to catch the green light, most people do that, but there's a difference between slowing down gradually and crawling. Remember that drivers are not used to bike, especially those riding in the lane. And as Roughstuff said, bikes don't have break lights so it makes bikes more difficult to predict. Don't slow down too slow too quickly and signal your intentions.

Because in most cases it's the only way to actually go anywhere. I can't ride a trainer to work.

I can... but I work from home. :D

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/images/cycling/trainer/Image6.jpg

Yeah, but your clips are your problem, not theirs.

Exactly, so I'll deal with it as I see fit.


There's nothing wrong in slowing down hoping to catch the green light, most people do that, but there's a difference between slowing down gradually and crawling.

I'm aware of this, which is why I often start to slow down well in advance of the light if I don't think it's going to turn green before I get there (believe me, Queensland traffic lights really do take forever to change). As I related earlier in this post, it's one of the very few things around here that doesn't seem to upset drivers.

When you do a lot of road riding you have to get in traffic sometimes. When you do a lot of road riding, you are traffic.

Because in most cases it's the only way to actually go anywhere. I can't ride a trainer to work.


I can... but I work from home. :D

Dude, where's your helmet?

:D

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/images/cycling/trainer/Image6.jpg

Dude, where's your helmet?

:D

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/images/cycling/trainer/Image6.jpg

Can't you see that I was on the final climb to the finish? :D