Advocacy & Safety - New one for me...

Here's a new one for me:

Two lane country road 35mph, I have a left turn coming up. Some traffic behind me; in the lane, I'm somewhere between the right wheel track and the white line of the edge of the road. A few cars pass, I take the lane, i.e. move over into the left wheel track in the lane, in preparation for the turn, signal the turn... and get passed on the left by a pickup truck less than a split second before I actually turned. As in, I had committed to the turn before I even knew they were passing and barely missed actually running into them. It could very easily turned into something real nasty if I'd decided to cut the turn a little sharper a little sooner. Did everything right, still nearly got creamed.

Didn't get enough of a chance to get their license plate number.

Mitigating factors--no mirror on that particular bike.

Reason #46 why I don't ride two lane country roads. Too many people who try things they wouldn't try in town with witnesses.

I agree a mirror may have put you on alert, but, even riding with one, I don't have the habit of checking left rear before turning. Glad you lived to write about this one!

Reason #46 why I don't ride two lane country roads. Too many people who try things they wouldn't try in town with witnesses.

Some of us have no choice...

I have had the same thing happen to me when I have been driving my truck. I live on a narrow 2 lane road and my drive is midway into a passing zone. The last clown that tried to pass a string of cars when someone was turning left into our private road ended up under my wife's uncle's large loaded gravel truck and got a ride by ambulance to the nearby hospital. There are idiots loose on the roads everywhere, city or country.

You can take every precaution in the world but you can't account or plan for total stupidity. Witness the number of people that get killed or injured every year by going around active train crossing gates...

Aaron:)

Heck I would never have done that. You're a braver person than me. Turning left off a two lane road with no shoulders when there's traffic is like crossing the street.

Pickup truck is an idiot. If he didn't know you were making a turn he should not have passed in an intersection. If he did know you were going to make a turn then, well, he's still an idiot.

Heck I would never have done that. You're a braver person than me. Turning left off a two lane road with no shoulders when there's traffic is like crossing the street.

Pickup truck is an idiot. If he didn't know you were making a turn he should not have passed in an intersection. If he did know you were going to make a turn then, well, he's still an idiot.

****ing pickup drivers (for the most part they are imbeciles), my group and I nearly got creamed by some moron who decided to pass us after the 5 of us Signaled a left turn and began making it. He ended up slamming on his brakes since we were pretty much through the turn, he did not honk nor do any other aggressive maneuvers afterward which was odd. Passing at an intersection is dangerous enough...and if there is a group of cyclists in the middle of a lane with their left arms out at the intersection...it means stay the hell back. It would've really pissed me off if I or anybody I was with was hit today.

In this scenario, the intelligence of the driver in relation to the type of vehicle is not relevant. I had this happen once about two years ago with a small coupe. Same scenario, two lane road, they passed after I signaled my left turn.

Under FL law, if I (or Wahoonc's wife's uncle) had been hit in the turn, I would have been at fault for turning in front of a passing vehicle.


316.122 Vehicle turning left.--The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left within an intersection or into an alley, private road, or driveway shall yield the right-of-way to any vehicle approaching from the opposite direction, or vehicles lawfully passing on the left of the turning vehicle, which is within the intersection or so close thereto as to constitute an immediate hazard. A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a moving violation as provided in chapter 318.

****ing pickup drivers (for the most part they are imbeciles), my group and I nearly got creamed by some moron who decided to pass us after the 5 of us Signaled a left turn and began making it. He ended up slamming on his brakes since we were pretty much through the turn, he did not honk nor do any other aggressive maneuvers afterward which was odd. Passing at an intersection is dangerous enough...and if there is a group of cyclists in the middle of a lane with their left arms out at the intersection...it means stay the hell back. It would've really pissed me off if I or anybody I was with was hit today.

It probably scared the piss out of him. Maybe made stupid move without thinking and was a bit embarrassed by it.

Just because you do everything right doesn't mean everyone else will.
Get a mirror AND do a head check before you do anything that involves changing your position on the road. You can't prevent stupid, but you can be prepared for it if you are aware of what is going on around you and planning for Murphy.

Always look. I've had someone do that while I was in my car, signalling a left turn on a residential road.

It's either impatience or incompetence, or a combination. Either way, keep your head on a swivel.

Az

Even though I wear a mirror, I always do a head check before signaling and establishing myself into the lane for a left turn. Then when I get into the lane, I keep signaling as long as possible and stay to the left so as to give as clear indication as to my intentions. Then keep an eye out for morons like you witnessed.

"316.122 Vehicle turning left.--The driver of a vehicle intending to turn to the left within an intersection or into an alley, private road, or driveway shall yield the right-of-way to any vehicle approaching from the opposite direction, or vehicles lawfully passing on the left of the turning vehicle, which is within the intersection or so close thereto as to constitute an immediate hazard. A violation of this section is a noncriminal traffic infraction, punishable as a moving violation as provided in chapter 318."

That is stupid... It has got to be one of the dumbest most poorly written laws I've ever heard of.

I face this exact scenario every day on my commute. I've come to the conclusion that it's best to wait for a big clearing before commiting to the turn. Yes, that means not taking the lane and possibly even pulling off the road to wait. It's happend to me twice now and i'm not going to chance the third. Of course i'm riding on 50mph country lanes with no shoulder.

I face this exact scenario every day on my commute. I've come to the conclusion that it's best to wait for a big clearing before commiting to the turn. Yes, that means not taking the lane and possibly even pulling off the road to wait. It's happend to me twice now and i'm not going to chance the third. Of course i'm riding on 50mph country lanes with no shoulder.

Hey, there ain't no shame in timing traffic to make your turn safer...including slowing down (LORD FORBID!) and letting some of the overtaking (and oncoming) traffic pass so you can just ease into the turn smoother than cow slobber. It's called being smarter than a Brussels sprout. ;)

Always look. I've had someone do that while I was in my car, signalling a left turn on a residential road.

It's either impatience or incompetence, or a combination. Either way, keep your head on a swivel.

Az

this happened to a friend of mine while he was in a car as well except he was hit by the passing car while making the turn.

The insurance company found him partially responsible because he should have looked behind to make sure it was clear as well as making sure it was clear of oncoming traffic in the front before he made his turn.

this happened to a friend of mine while he was in a car as well except he was hit by the passing car while making the turn.

The insurance company found him partially responsible because he should have looked behind to make sure it was clear as well as making sure it was clear of oncoming traffic in the front before he made his turn.

Uh, yeah, look behind for a car travelling down the street the wrong way? Who would think that could happen.

Hey, there ain't no shame in timing traffic to make your turn safer...including slowing down (LORD FORBID!) and letting some of the overtaking (and oncoming) traffic pass so you can just ease into the turn smoother than cow slobber. It's called being smarter than a Brussels sprout. ;)

Gotta agree there... even on our urban roads some of those Brussels Sprouts behind the wheel leave a lot to be desired.

On my 50MPH local arterials, I work to time things so I make my lefts well behind the bunch.

OK, to clarify a few more things:

If I didn't ride two lane country roads without shoulders, I wouldn't be commuting. In fact, I couldn't leave my driveway.

There are plenty of pickup trucks in our area and the moron to vehicle ratio is actually pretty even between pickups and non-pickups. I'm not bashing pickups here--the last time we were nearly right hooked was a subaru wagon. Stupid doesn't seem to discriminate by vehicle type. It was merely the type of vehicle that passed me.

The stretch of road in question is a double yellow, no passing zone, and cars usually don't pass other cars on that stretch even with slow traffic. No problems with cars stopping behind me and waiting for the turn when I'm on my motorctycle, either. Point of fact: we have pulled into the right turn and done an immediate U to wait at the stop sign until traffic passes if it's really bad. This didn't seem to be one of those situations.

I head checked, let a vehicle pass, there was at least... maybe ten or so car lengths to the next vehicle. It was my final headcheck that might have saved me in the last split second and also the reason I wasn't quite quick enough to get the plate after they passed.

Just an idiot driver doing their thing, I guess. Moral is as others pointed out: you can be doing everything (or even just most things) right and still have a close encounter with the clueless.

You can take every precaution in the world but you can't account or plan for total stupidity. Witness the number of people that get killed or injured every year by going around active train crossing gates...


You call it stupidity; I call it Darwinism in action. ;)

Uh, yeah, look behind for a car travelling down the street the wrong way? Who would think that could happen.

anytime anyone is going to make a move, it's up to the mover to be sure the way is clear.

Just because someone isn't supposed to do something, doesn't mean they won't.

people should be aware of just what is where, and where whatever is, where it can move to

2 lane country road manouvre witnessed yesterday:

25mph road, series of roller hills with nice blind valleys between the hilltops.
I'm doing 30+ coming down one hill, car behind me is waiting to pass until I slow down on the following uphill.
Car approaching from behind him is doing at least 45mph, doesn't slow down when the guy pulls out to pass me, and instead swings into the shoulder of the far lane to pass both of us while cresting the hill.

I was crossing my fingers for no oncoming traffic, because the resultant shrapnel would have killed me on the spot.

I had the same thing happen a month or so ago. I was turning left into my alley and when I had already started turning, an idiot driving an SUV decided to pass me on the left at about 45 mph (in a 25 zone). Her rationale, "I didn't want to have to wait for you." I fear for her kids who were in the car, learning that it's ok to try to kill someone on a bike if they make you wait 5 seconds.

I was trying to find reference to the 3 foot rule in Colorado law and ran across this gem---can you believe it?

b) A person riding a bicycle intending to turn left shall approach the turn as closely as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway. After proceeding across the intersecting roadway to the far corner of the curb or intersection of the roadway edges, the bicyclist shall stop, as much as practicable, out of the way of traffic. After stopping, the bicyclist shall yield to any traffic proceeding in either direction along the roadway the bicyclist had been using. After yielding and complying with any official traffic control device or police officer regulating traffic on the highway along which he intends to proceed, the bicyclist may proceed in the new direction.

Actually I do this on the busier highways and complex intersections.

I was trying to find reference to the 3 foot rule in Colorado law and ran across this gem---can you believe it?

b) A person riding a bicycle intending to turn left shall approach the turn as closely as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway. After proceeding across the intersecting roadway to the far corner of the curb or intersection of the roadway edges, the bicyclist shall stop, as much as practicable, out of the way of traffic. After stopping, the bicyclist shall yield to any traffic proceeding in either direction along the roadway the bicyclist had been using. After yielding and complying with any official traffic control device or police officer regulating traffic on the highway along which he intends to proceed, the bicyclist may proceed in the new direction.

Maybe you should quote the rest of the law? If I recall correctly that's just one option for turning left.


(a) A person riding a bicycle intending to turn left shall follow a course described in sections 42-4-901 (1), 42-4-903, and 42-4-1007 or may make a left turn in the manner prescribed in paragraph (b) of this subsection (8).
(b) A person riding a bicycle intending to turn left shall approach the turn as closely as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway. After proceeding across the intersecting roadway to the far corner of the curb or intersection of the roadway edges, the bicyclist shall stop, as much as practicable, out of the way of traffic. After stopping, the bicyclist shall yield to any traffic proceeding in either direction along the roadway that the bicyclist had been using. After yielding and complying with any official traffic control device or police officer regulating traffic on the highway along which the bicyclist intends to proceed, the bicyclist may proceed in the new direction.
(c) Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraphs (a) and (b) of this subsection (8), the transportation commission and local authorities in their respective jurisdictions may cause official traffic control devices to be placed on roadways and thereby require and direct that a specific course be traveled.
(b) Left turns. The driver of a vehicle intending to turn left shall approach the turn in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of travel of such vehicle. Whenever practicable, the left turn shall be made to the left of the center of the intersection so as to leave the intersection or other location in the extreme left-hand lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the same direction as such vehicle on the roadway being entered.


Turning movements and required signals.

(1) No person shall turn a vehicle at an intersection unless the vehicle is in proper position upon the roadway as required in section 42-4-901, or turn a vehicle to enter a private road or driveway, or otherwise turn a vehicle from a direct course or move right or left upon a roadway unless and until such movement can be made with reasonable safety and then only after giving an appropriate signal in the manner provided in sections 42-4-608 and 42-4-609.

(2) A signal of intention to turn right or left shall be given continuously during not less than the last one hundred feet traveled by the vehicle before turning in urban or metropolitan areas and shall be given continuously for at least two hundred feet on all four-lane highways and other highways where the prima facie or posted speed limit is more than forty miles per hour. Such signals shall be given regardless of existing weather conditions.

(3) No person shall stop or suddenly decrease the speed of a vehicle without first giving an appropriate signal in the manner provided in sections 42-4-608 and 42-4-609 to the driver of any vehicle immediately to the rear when there is opportunity to give such signal.

(4) The signals provided for in section 42-4-608 (2) shall be used to indicate an intention to turn, change lanes, or start from a parked position and shall not be flashed on one side only on a parked or disabled vehicle or flashed as a courtesy or "do pass" signal to operators of other vehicles approaching from the rear.


Driving on roadways laned for traffic.

(1) Whenever any roadway has been divided into two or more clearly marked lanes for traffic, the following rules in addition to all others consistent with this section shall apply:

(a) A vehicle shall be driven as nearly as practicable entirely within a single lane and shall not be moved from such lane until the driver has first ascertained that such movement can be made with safety.

(b) Upon a roadway which is divided into three lanes and provides for two-way movement of traffic, a vehicle shall not be driven in the center lane except when overtaking and passing another vehicle traveling in the same direction where the roadway is clearly visible and such center lane is clear of traffic within a safe distance, or in preparation for a left turn, or where such center lane is at the time allocated exclusively to the traffic moving in the direction the vehicle is proceeding and is designated by official traffic control devices to give notice of such allocation. Under no condition shall an attempt be made to pass upon the shoulder or any portion of the roadway remaining to the right of the indicated right-hand traffic lane.

(c) Official traffic control devices may be erected directing specified traffic to use a designated lane or designating those lanes to be used by traffic moving in a particular direction regardless of the center of the roadway, and drivers of vehicles shall obey the directions of every such device.

(d) Official traffic control devices may be installed prohibiting the changing of lanes on sections of roadway, and drivers of vehicles shall obey the directions of every such device.

... that's just one option for turning left.

from: http://www.bikesense.bc.ca/ch4.htm

Making a left turn
There are two main ways of making a left turn on a bicycle.

a) As a vehicle: As you approach the intersection, look over your left shoulder for traffic, signal your turn, and when clear, move over to the left side of the lane (on a two-lane road), or into the left lane or the centre-turn lane (1). You should be positioned so cars going straight through cannot pass you on your left. Yield to oncoming traffic before turning. If you are riding in a bike lane, or on a road with several lanes, you need to look and signal each time you change lanes. Never make a left turn from the right side of the road, even if you are in a bike lane.

b) Perimeter style: Proceed straight through the intersection on the right. Then stop, make a 90 degree left turn, and either walk your bicycle in the crosswalk (2), or proceed as if you were coming from the right (3). If there is a signal, wait for the green or WALK signal before crossing. Yield to pedestrians in the crosswalk. You must dismount and walk your bicycle when in a crosswalk.

On rural or high-speed roads, you should time your left turn so that you can complete the whole turn at once without compromising your safety. You do not want to get caught in the middle of high-speed traffic. If necessary, slow down or stop on the right edge of the road and wait until you get a large enough gap in traffic to make your turn safely. If the traffic is too heavy without a sufficient gap, continue on to the nearest intersection and do a perimeter or pedestrian turn.

http://www.bikesense.bc.ca/images/pg16traffic.jpg

*actually I think Bike Sense made a typo. 2 should be 3 and 3 should be 2.

****ing pickup drivers (for the most part they are imbeciles), my group and I nearly got creamed by some moron who decided to pass us after the 5 of us Signaled a left turn and began making it. He ended up slamming on his brakes since we were pretty much through the turn, he did not honk nor do any other aggressive maneuvers afterward which was odd. Passing at an intersection is dangerous enough...and if there is a group of cyclists in the middle of a lane with their left arms out at the intersection...it means stay the hell back. It would've really pissed me off if I or anybody I was with was hit today.

So if I loan you my pickup truck (say, to move some of your stuff), does that make you an imbecile, too?

did you signal?
I might have left the signal on if you were on the left track your arm could reach out pretty far.