Electric Bikes - Thinking about getting an e-bike

Hello all,

I'm thinking about getting e-bike in the spring next year. My reasons for wanting one are fairly simple. I live less than five miles from work each way. If traffic is good, I can get to work by car in 15 minutes or less. If it's not so good, 20 - 30 minutes.

On the other hand, the route I take to get to work has lots of bike paths and side streets, meaning I could probably bypass the heaviest traffic and still get to work in about the same time I could when traffic is running well. And save a fair bit of gas while doing it.

Public transit in my city isn't great, nor is it cheap. Taking the same trip to work by city bus will take at least 25 minutes because of all the stops it makes, plus having to contend with traffic. Ain't no such thing as an express bus in my town. Timings are inconvenient, meaning I would have to take a bus that will get me to work at least 15 minutes before I even need to be there.

The transit authority is talking about creating a bus rapid transit system, but that isn't expected to come into being until 2024, putting the medium-sized Canadian city I live in at least thirty years behind Ottawa, which already has a very well-developed BRT system. Kinda makes me wonder why they're even bothering with BRT if all they're doing is just talking about it now, just waiting for provincial funding to magically appear one day. To have such a system actually in place by their target date, they have to start building it NOW instead of just talking about it.

Hell, the cities of Kitchener, Waterloo and Cambridge are already seriously looking at light rail, while it isn't even on city council's radar where I live, even though my city has almost the same population.

I'm on the horns of a dilemma here. The e-bike world seems like a real minefield. There seems to be a lot of cheap Chinese-made junk out there and lots of dealers selling that cheap Chinese junk who seem to have jumped on the e-bike bandwagon without any real clue about what they're doing. And seemingly little concern about what happens to their customers when they go out of business, for obvious reasons.

I also notice that none of the major bike makers are really getting into e-bikes or promoting them very aggressively. I know that Giant had some electric bikes a few years back and then stopped making them.

Panasonic, a well-known and reliable Japanese brand, also developed an e-bike which they no longer market in North America. Schwinn has supposedly got a couple of interesting models on the way but their release date has been delayed by engineering issues.

I wonder why companies like these - who possess competent engineering staff, are leaving the rapidly growing e-bike market to virtually unknown Chinese firms.

I figure if I'm going to plunk down $1400.00 - $2000.00 for an e-bike, it had bloody well better work right and last me a while.

I have a concern with the scooter-type bikes. For three reasons. First, they are too big to be used safely on bike paths. Second, there seems to be no well-respected manufacturer building them. Third, the Ontario government may ultimately declare them to be low-speed motorcycles, forcing riders to get a motorcycle licence and insurance. In which case I ask, why not just go all the way, save yourself the hassle of the eventual legislative switcheroo and get a gas-powered scooter?

I have a Trek 700 that I could potentially electrify. But then there is the question of who to buy a kit from and who I should get to install it.

The other horn of the dilemma is what to do with my car. Sell it and buy a cheap beater for the winter months and times when I need more range? Or keep it and accept that all that I'll really save by buying an e-bike is a bit of gas and reduce parking costs?

I have found that most people in the ebike field are entrepreneurs and not business people. The field is too new to have complete reliability yet. I would just keep reading forums like this one and endless sphere and others for a while to get an idea on who you can trust and which system will work for you. Check out the carfree forum if you would like to consider getting out from under your car.
It isn't just about saving gas and money, you may also be saving your life with getting your recommended 30 - 45 minutes of excersize every day.

Just FYI, 5 miles is do-able with a regular bike. Going slow, it would take you about 45 minutes. I guess that's longer than you want, and there would be some sweat involved on the way to work, so I'll throw some ideas out.

1) Bionx kit is made in Canada and will enhance your speed and/or lower your effort. Cost is $1100-$1700 U.S. dollars, depending on what you get. The part that I enjoy is the simplicity. I don't know much about motors and batteries and torc, so the user friendly style makes it pretty good for me.

2) I hear and read that Crystallite offers some pretty good electric motors. Similar in quality and price to Bionx, with a few different features.

3) I saw an I-Zip about a month ago that was doing its owner well. He was going just as fast and far as me on my Bionx (15-20 mph for about 10 miles). With that one, you buy the whole bike with motor and battery installed. It's a little over $1000 U.S. dollars. A few models are even less. Do not confuse this bike with the E-Zip, which is much cheaper. I've read some gripes about that one.

4) E-Zip is only a few hundred dollars, has some problems (lead acid batteries, problems with assembly, poor customer service), but is a pretty cheap way to go. Since your commute is so short, it might be OK.

recumelectric said:

>Just FYI, 5 miles is do-able with a regular bike. Going slow, it would take you about 45 minutes. I guess that's longer than you want, and there would be some sweat involved on >the way to work, so I'll throw some ideas out.

One of the reasons why I'm looking at an e-bike is because I have rode a non-electric bike to work and found myself quite sweaty on arrival. I did take a change of clothing with me, but found the time needed to prepare (pack extra clothing, try to wipe off the sweat and then change) made the whole exercise a pain.

On warm summer days, the sweat factor is even more brutal. I'd sooner ride in my regular street clothes and arrive only minimally sweaty.

Then there is the problem of a couple of short but relatively steep grades on the way there that I find hard to negotiate without feeling I'm going to have a flipping heart attack. I am overweight and unfit, so... an electric bike would help me on these spots.

Thanks for the suggestions. The Bionx kit is one possible avenue I'm looking at. It does seem to be well-engineered and thought-out, if a little expensive. It also seems to have a track record and the company which makes it appears to be professional in its approach and well capitalized.

recumelectric said:

>Just FYI, 5 miles is do-able with a regular bike. Going slow, it would take you about 45 minutes. I guess that's longer than you want, and there would be some sweat involved on >the way to work, so I'll throw some ideas out.

One of the reasons why I'm looking at an e-bike is because I have rode a non-electric bike to work and found myself quite sweaty on arrival. I did take a change of clothing with me, but found the time needed to prepare (pack extra clothing, try to wipe off the sweat and then change) made the whole exercise a pain.

On warm summer days, the sweat factor is even more brutal. I'd sooner ride in my regular street clothes and arrive only minimally sweaty.

Then there is the problem of a couple of short but relatively steep grades on the way there that I find hard to negotiate without feeling I'm going to have a flipping heart attack. I am overweight and unfit, so... an electric bike would help me on these spots.

Thanks for the suggestions. The Bionx kit is one possible avenue I'm looking at. It does seem to be well-engineered and thought-out, if a little expensive. It also seems to have a track record and the company which makes it appears to be professional in its approach and well capitalized.
I can really relate to your post.

I too work 5 miles from my home.
The route is hilly and on an unpowered bike, I'm sweaty and exhausted after arriving and gave up on that whole ordeal. I'm overweight also and not in excellent shape.

I bought a Bionx PL350 kit and installed it on my DiamondBack Approach Hybrid which is about 10 years old. I have had the kit installed for just over two months now.

It was a good idea. I have almost 500 miles on the kit and so far, no problems.

It takes me about 15 minutes to get to work, (more downhills), and about 20 minutes, or a little less, to get home, (obviously more uphill).

It's a good work out and although my thighs were pretty sore for about a month or more, the soreness is less now. I use highest assist on most uphills and some regen on the steep downhills to moderate speed without using the brakes. A recent doctor visit, with blood tests, has shown definite health benefits with lower cholesterol and better HDL/LDL ratio. Modest weight lost, (5lbs.-11Kg), without dieting. I also notice I have more energy and strength.

For several weeks we had 90º weather and I was pretty warm and sweaty when I arrived at work, but no where near as bad as on a regular bike. Now, mornings I'm riding in 50º +/- and it's a little chilly, but riding warms you up pretty quickly. Wind chill and watery eyes are still a problem for me.

I ride on main roads, on wide shoulders. The traffic is moving at highway speeds and was very disconcerting at first, but now, I'm used to it. Right turn lanes are the biggest traffic problem because if you're going straight, there is no way to be on the side of the road without being in the way and the right turn drivers are not shy about letting you know you're in the way.

You have to be always on the alert for debris, (some of it quite alarming), on the shoulder of the roads.
I have had 3 flats, but that's because my tires are old and crappy. I have a set of airless tires on order from Nu-teck because I pretty much just go in a straight line. I'll post an update on that scenario after I get the tires and ride with them for a while.

If they don't work, I'll definitely get some Armadillo tires.

Lastly, if you're like me, I have to tell you that if you rely on the electric too much, you will have very limited range. I'm 220lbs, and at full assist the range is about 15 miles depending on terrain. If you put forth a good effort, without killing yourself, I'm sure you could do better than 20 miles by using less assist and doing some regen on the downhills.

Hope my input helps. I say go for it.

oops.

recumelectric said:

>Just FYI, 5 miles is do-able with a regular bike. Going slow, it would take you about 45 minutes. I guess that's longer than you want, and there would be some sweat involved on >the way to work, so I'll throw some ideas out.

One of the reasons why I'm looking at an e-bike is because I have rode a non-electric bike to work and found myself quite sweaty on arrival. I did take a change of clothing with me, but found the time needed to prepare (pack extra clothing, try to wipe off the sweat and then change) made the whole exercise a pain.

On warm summer days, the sweat factor is even more brutal. I'd sooner ride in my regular street clothes and arrive only minimally sweaty.

.

I'm not dissin' ya. The reason for my motor was to eliminate the morning sweat factor.

If I only had 5 miles, I would probably use a cheaper motor system or put my bike on public transportation. I used to put my bike on the bus in the mornings and totally eliminate the morning sweat factor. Then I'd pedal back home for the workout. That was when my commute was 5 miles or less and I had a good bus route working for me.

These days (in which the commute is about 10 miles and bus would take an hour and a half) called for the motor. Unfortunately, I've gotten addicted to the speed, which I can control with more pedaling, and I'm still ending up sweaty in the morning. Fortunately, the motor power allows me to haul more stuff, like fresh clothes.

One good feature to Bionx is that you can just get it started and then use the throttle all the way to work. You won't go as fast, but there is no sweat at all. I'm not sure about the others, but I think some of the others will let you ride in the mornings on throttle alone.

If you really want to get an ebike get the BionX kit, it's the best.
you wont need to recharge your batteries.

but as many other said 5 miles is a piece of cake.
yes it does get sweatie, and you feel light you might get a freaking heart attack, but that is just now.
once you get used to it, and get more fit, both will become less of an hassle.

when i first started biking to commute, the first 2 weeks was brutal, but after a month, and specially 2 month down the road, it was a piece of cake, my daily round trip commute is 13miles

i need to pass by 2 steep hills, and over a very dangerous busy highway over pass.... etc

so i always pack a set of clothing with me on mondays, and bring back home the dirty cloths on fridays
always keep a set of suit, and nice shiny shoes at work, for when we need to meet with clients.
we just change at the public washroom at work.



recumelectric said:

>Just FYI, 5 miles is do-able with a regular bike. Going slow, it would take you about 45 minutes. I guess that's longer than you want, and there would be some sweat involved on >the way to work, so I'll throw some ideas out.

One of the reasons why I'm looking at an e-bike is because I have rode a non-electric bike to work and found myself quite sweaty on arrival. I did take a change of clothing with me, but found the time needed to prepare (pack extra clothing, try to wipe off the sweat and then change) made the whole exercise a pain.

On warm summer days, the sweat factor is even more brutal. I'd sooner ride in my regular street clothes and arrive only minimally sweaty.

Then there is the problem of a couple of short but relatively steep grades on the way there that I find hard to negotiate without feeling I'm going to have a flipping heart attack. I am overweight and unfit, so... an electric bike would help me on these spots.

Thanks for the suggestions. The Bionx kit is one possible avenue I'm looking at. It does seem to be well-engineered and thought-out, if a little expensive. It also seems to have a track record and the company which makes it appears to be professional in its approach and well capitalized.

as many other said 5 miles is a piece of cake.
yes it does get sweatie, and you feel light you might get a freaking heart attack, but that is just now.
once you get used to it, and get more fit, both will become less of an hassle.

Not everyone with a moderate commute will find it "a piece of cake". My temperament does not allow me to ride slowly, especially on narrow streets with traffic. My commute of only 1.87 miles (each way) with a little hill was like a twice-daily race without a warm up. My knees always hurt, and there no doubt that I suffered from overtraining that impaired my riding performance and affected my weekend fun. And that was when I was young and fit.

If you want to commute every day and efficiently improve your fitness, you must be able to do the ride at a recovery pace on rest days. That means riding below 85% of lactate threshold, a rate of perceived exertion described as "very, very light". Higher intensity riding should be limited 3-4 days/week for optimum improvement, and much of that (at least for someone starting out) at the easy ("very light") extensive endurance level of exertion. Worse yet, I find commuting pushes me into the intensive endurance zone just below lactate threshold - a zone which is hard work, yet poor at promoting gains in either strength or cardiovascular fitness.

Fundamentally, pushing a regular bike up the same few hills on the same course day after day is a poor training plan. Incorporating an ebike into the commute will make it more fun, and allow you to come up with a better fitness plan, even something as simple as switching to a regular bike for your commute twice a week could do the trick.

I don't know nuthin' 'bout no lactate thresh-hold...and please don't explain it to me, because I have read a little and do know know that I have not the time, discipline, money, or energy to mess around with that. If I'm pumped, I ride hard. If I'm tired I don't ride so hard.

That being said, I totally understand the OP's reasons for wanting an electirc bike. He/she's got sweat issues and the ride to work is mostly uphill. Plus, there is an obesity factor. I can relate to all 3 of the scenarios, and I get the reason for the E-bike. I also read somewhere that E-bike riders go out more often, which improves their fitness more than the typical bicycle owner, who leaves a bike hanging in the garage most of the time.

I do believe that the commute will get easier and easier with time for the OP, and he/she will find less need for the motor. In fact, he/she may want to eliminate it entirely in a year or so. Then again, the motor may still serve a purpose on longer rides. I suggested one super low-end option (the E-Zip) for the same reason I suggest cheaper bikes to newer commuters; in the process of riding the cheapie, they discover what they really want and can make an informed purchase later.

OP. please don't go away mad. Stay here and tell us what you bought.

I agree with the last two posts and think most people get the gist of what needs to happen.
If you just turn off the electric assist you have a regular bike, albeit a heavy one, but then again you could use assist level one or two to compensate for the added weight of the motor.
I find the electric motor has made it possible for me to ride more and get more exercise that I otherwise wouldn't have bothered with.
I'm 5'10" and 220 pounds, most of it around the belly. Two months ago, I was inching my way to 230 pounds. Now, I'm going in the right direction and I've also ridden in some very chilly weather. Full blown winter weather remains to be seen, what I do there.
Also, go for the Bionx with the litium Ion battery. Don't spend good money after bad.
You want to ride and I have no doubt you'll use the Bionx, as I am doing now. Even with the electric assist, if you have hills and are as heavy as me, the hills will be a bit of a challenge and you quickly realize that you can't just throttle your way in and have any power left for the ride home.
Good luck.

I also read somewhere that E-bike riders go out more often, which improves their fitness more than the typical bicycle owner, who leaves a bike hanging in the garage most of the time.

ding! ding! ding! We have a winner! Isn't that reason enough to encourage ebikes to people interested in them?

But you are missing (or ignoring) a crucial point: Working hard every day to push a bicycle is a poor strategy for gaining fitness. That doesn't mean you won't improve, just that you'll work harder, have less fun, and the gains will come more slowly. To me, that makes an ebike a no-brainer, even for short commutes.

I have years of experience bicycle commuting, and accept the fact that I just can't ride slowly while commuting. Maybe you can ride with "very light" effort, but not me. A daily commute on a regular bicycle harms my fitness by interfering with recovery and contributing to overuse injury. Incorporating an ebike into my lifestyle has not merely allowed me to use it for shopping, picking up my son from school, etc., but has resulted in an increase in the amount of time I spend on my regular bicycles, where I am stronger and having more fun.

Honestly, I find the notion of outgrowing an ebike confusing and silly. They are so useful and practical that I just don't get it.

I live less than five miles from work each way.

Seems like a regular bike could work for you. The electric motor might be nice if you have hills and need a boost. Otherwise it might not be as helpful as you think. I would consider the smaller mopeds, the gov probably will not consider them a motorcycle.

I would also worry about theft, an ebike, unlike a gas powered scooter would be easy to lift and toss in the back of a car. The ebike could be profitabkly stripped for parts.

Will an ebike work in the Canadian winter?

Might be worth a look:
http://solexin.free.fr/us/mechanics/products/index.html