Tandem Cycling - Raleigh Tandem Wheel Replacement

Hi All...

We have a Raleigh Tandem 2002 SC model with 26" wheels that has done more than its fair share of work including fully loaded touring. Because the frame is the same as the Raleigh Road Tandem (made in the same year) we want to upgrade the wheels to 700c and add some caliper brakes. We are looking at Velocity Dyads although the hubs are an issue in Australia. Velocity do an 'own brand' hub but we're not exactly sure what it is. Our question is how do we know whether we have 140mm spacing or 145mm spacing? Surely this is very difficult to measure. Is it centre to centre, inside to inside etc? 5mm is not much to play with. Any help would be most appreciated. Our dream of a Comotion has gone down the gurgler with the global financial crisis and the drop in the Ozzie $.

Thanks
Sue & Evan

My recollection is that it is the over-locknut distance (outside of the locknut on the hub, to the outside of the other locknut on the hub), so the inside edges of the dropouts should be almost exactly the same as the nominal hub size. I wonder if you are pretty sure a 700C wheel with a road tire will fit in the fork and the back of the frame, so that the brake pads will line up with the rim and the top of the tire will not rub on the fork crown and/or stay bridges? Some advice from a bike shop might come in handy. If I had to measure the hub size, I would use dial calipers (about $30 American last time I checked, for the tolerably good made in China variety) to measure the distance between the inside edges of the dropouts.

I have tried to consider the merits of 26" v 700C diameters with all other things being equal, and my conclusion was that the difference was slightly less than the difference between an 11T and a 12T cog for a high gear. In other words, if a 12T is your high gear now and one more gear would get you to where you want to be, you might only need to change all or part of your cassette.

If the Comotion is now slightly out of reach, I would recommend a Bushnell, with longer-than-normal bottom bracket spacing to get more room for the stoker.

If your 26 inch is actually 650C you might consider triathlon minded wheels/tires as a decent narrow selection can be found there. If your tandem 26 inch is actually 650B as I have seen on other Raleighs then you can fit 700c wheels/tires but the brake surface on the rim will be 19mm (or maybe it's 17mm) further out in which case your rim brakes won't inherently line up. For fit you can try a road wheel, and remember to check the brakes. A shop should be able to advise if you bring in the bike. While I use calipers, if you remove the rear wheel (assuming it comes out smoothly) then you should be able to measure from the inside to inside of the rear dropouts by sliding in a ruler.

... Our question is how do we know whether we have 140mm spacing or 145mm spacing? Surely this is very difficult to measure. Is it centre to centre, inside to inside etc? 5mm is not much to play with. ....

If you are asking about the frame, then it is inside measurement or clearance. Since you mention that it is difficult to measure, you may be asking about the hub. I am sure there are easier ways but I would remove the quick release, introduce a piece of wire or rod, measure the length end to end, and then subtract the the length between the ends and the locknuts.

If your frame is steel you can cold set it and change it from 140 to 145 with little effort

Why don't you have a look at an Avanti Tandem. It is a "hybrid" road tandem with road frame geometry and 700C wheels but straight handlebars. Also I know the Pinnerello distributor in NZ brought in 5 of the 2008 Pinerello tandems earlier this year. Not sure if all have sold, but I have seen at least 3 on various rides. I think they were going for around $6000NZ. Send Paul an email @ http://www.bicyclerepairs.co.nz/news.htm as he knows the local Pinno distro well (Tell him Jason on the Red Trek Tandem sent yah). Personally I looked at one as an upgrade to my 2005 T2000, but it was not any better.

Alternativly keep an eye on www.trademe.co.nz (http://www.trademe.co.nz) (or Trademe / ebay AU) as you will find occasionally a nice road tandem comes up for sale (recently saw a co-motion). This is where we got our Trek T2000. However, it is not often that a nice road tandem in NZ comes up for sale (as most of us can't bear to part with our bikes due to the cost of replacing them), but it seems the odd one crops up every so often. And it won't cost you the earth to fly over and get it :D

Thanks for the replies. They are very helpful.

Unfortunately we have multiple issues with the bike. Basically the original wheels are cactus. The rear was replaced 12 months ago with a Velocity Cliffhanger. Whilst the rim has held up, the hub is already on its way out. The front wheel is the original and is completely cactus. In addition, we need to replace the rear cassette - we are currently running 8 speed Deore. We can do this with a straight swap to 8 speed Deore XT. We also wanted to replaced the cranks and chainrings but this is far more complicated as it is almost impossible to get tandem sets in Australia. The earliest we could have something here is 6-8 weeks at a cost of almost $1000 with the exchange rates. Therefore, we thought we'd leave the chainrings and just replace the rear cassette. Along with some lighter more durable wheels and hubs, we are hoping to get another 12 months out of the bike and keep up with the roadies. We ride around 200kms a week including quite hilly roads so we need something durable.

The Raleigh frame is the same for the road version so 700C wheels definitely fit. We would have to change to caliper brakes but the frame is already drilled for them so it shouldn't be a problem. We will check further with our bikeshop though just to be sure.

We have made enquiries about the Avanti tandem but nobody seems to be able to tell us whether it is strong enough for touring. At $3500 AUD we thought the Cannondale road tandem at $3000 AUD was better value as the frame has a lifetime guarantee. We've been looking at the Cannondale, Trek and Avanti but the stoker compartments all seem very small. Although we are a small team, 168cm tall and around 65 kgs each, it seems nobody makes a medium/medium frame. The problem is to get the frame to fit the captain, it is generally too small for the stoker. The Comotion has a much more generous stoker compartment which is why we have tended to sway in that direction.

We are at frustration point as basically we can't ride our tandem very far because of the front wheel and rear cassette. We've been mucked around by our LBS for the past 4-6 weeks!

I can speak with reasonably good authority on the Avanti Uno Duo

1. The Uno Duo is from the same family as the Avanti Blade (commuting/touring bikes), so you should have no problems here

2. Where did you get your Raleigh? All Raleigh bikes sold new in NZ and Aus are designed and manufactured by Avanti (shhh big secret :D) who have licensed the use of the brand name from Raleigh. To my knowledge the Raleigh tandems sold in NZ and Aus are NOT designed to take 700C wheels. (yes there may be enough clearance etc, but the brake pads will not be aligned correctly and there could be safety issues).

3. We ride a Trek T2000 Med/Small (2005 model and have had it for over 2 years). I am 174cm and my wife 169cm. Initially we thought it was too small too (but the selling price was a bargain - near new from a bike shop owner who tried it when his Cannondale broke, but he decided the Trek's handling was too different from the Cannondale and Cannondale replaced his frame).

However once we did a proper fit, the bike fits us perfectly (you will be surprised by the time you put the seats up to the right height and adjust the stems how much space you do have). Trust me 12,000kms later we have no qualms with the fit.

Avanti do have a Large/Med frame as well for the Uno Duo. I know the designer and his wife took the prototype Uno Duo around Lake Taupo a few years back with some "modifications" - he had road bars and shifters put on - so it can be done.

I agree on the availability of Tandem stuff down this way. When we bought the Trek, we did lose the original Bontrager wheels to the first owner as he liked them over the Cannondale ones. Luckly last year when the exchange rate was great we got a brand new pair of Bontrager Tandem racelights off ebay for a bargain and they are an amazing set of race wheels, vs the 36 spoke pair the shop owner built for us.
We have also replaced the front fork with a new model Bontrager Carbon Tandem one used on the 2007 Trek T2000 and the handling has changed dramatically (much better for cornering at speed as the rake is smaller) - another ebay bargain :)

Real shame Trek have decided to stop producing Tandems as we were going to upgrade next year (although the Excahnge rate might have put a stop to that too). Probably the next bike will be a Co-motion, but we will save up heaps and make a trip up to the States to check out both the Co-motions and Santana's and buy one up there.