Road Cycling - are we getting suckered by tire prices?

Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)

Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)

When's the last time you saw kevlar in a car tire?

-mark

Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)

Yes, we are getting gouged, its all marketing.

I don't know about that.
Given the significantly smaller contact area,
our precarious position on the bike etc. I'd rather
pay more for a quality tire.
BTW tubular tires are much more than $40 or $50,
some go for over $100. I ride mid-priced tubulars about
$60 each and they are worth the price.

Marty

There are clear performance requirement differences between a automobile tyre and a bicycle tyre. Trying to debate the relative "worth" of a bicycle tyre in this forum as compared to a car tyre will quickly decay into the usual uninformed peeing contest. Based on objective shared knowledge about the intrinsic value of the tyre ingredients, load bearing requirements, frictional heating,
rotational speed ratings, treadwear, traction ratings, expected and guaranteed mileage, it is difficult to justify, at least on these parameters, the price that you and pay for a bicycle tyre.

I don't think so. A lot of what goes into the price of a tire is the research and development costs it took to make it. These little buggers can be very complex works of engineering when you think about it. To me, the main difference between a high end bike tire and it's automotive counterpart is only the volume of materials it takes to make it. Not the brain power it took to develop it.

55/Rad

Your joking right. When you consider the amount of force and what a auto tire is asked to do in relation to a bike tire. Hmm, average rider weight versus couple ton vehicle. Cornering forces, speed limitations, braking forces, terrain variables, temp variables, life span. No comparison. How much Kevlar is actually used in a bike tire? When you are talking volume, they are getting it for pennies. Size of manufacturing plant for auto v. bike tire. If you want a apple to apple comparison how about motorcycles v. bikes. Near the same price but same issues exist. When is the last time you cornered on a bicycle at the speeds the street bike does...routinely....

Face it the cycling industry is doing a bike jacking at each purchase. Why? because they can.

DAve


I don't think so. A lot of what goes into the price of a tire is the research and development costs it took to make it. These little buggers can be very complex works of engineering when you think about it. To me, the main difference between a high end bike tire and it's automotive counterpart is only the volume of materials it takes to make it. Not the brain power it took to develop it.

55/Rad

How many bike tires do they sell?

Now compare that to the number of automotive tires sold.

The economies of scale needed to offset the development and tooling costs of the low production bicyle tire account for a large portion of the higher cost.

A study conducted by Consumer Reports found that people who complain about the price of gas per gallon, would soon stop complaining if they were to consider the price they would pay for crazy glue (per gallon). Yes, we are getting stiffed on the price of tires. Things will never change until we understand who truly has the power$$$.

Cheers

Automobile tires don't hold 100+ psi of pressure....

Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)

My gag point is at $30.00 per tire. I'm willing to pay up to that much for the exact tire that I want. If the tire that I want costs more than $30.00, I'll compromise and get something different - usually for a lot less.

Automobile tires don't hold 100+ psi of pressure....

Now that's a brilliant piece of news!!

Now that's a brilliant piece of news!!

actually it is.

Try putting in 100psi in a car tire and see how long it lasts.

P.S. I suggest standing WAY back when you do it.

Car tires are not as tough and durable as a bike tire is. In relation to what they are each doing.

When's the last time you saw kevlar in a car tire?

-mark

When's the last time you rode a steel belted bike tire? Talk about a workout!

i tihnk its more about S&D than R&D... biking is a wayyy smaller market. but its just my conjecture, and just about as (in)valid as anybody else's here.

personally though i wouldnt pay 35$+ per tire.. thats just ridiculous. my friend bought some 50$ vredesteins.. :rolleyes:

horrible diminishing returns...

Plain and simple, cycling is not a cheap sport!

With frames cost between 1K and 2K, why is it a suprise that tires cost $50?

Many online retailers offer 10-20% off, that the time to purchase these items.

Shop around and you will se there are many online retailers that offer pretty good prices.

Yes, bike tires are too expensive, and so is half of the stuff for bikes. It is the people who get caught up in the latest techno craze that get gouged. Anyway, I wait until tires go on sale and buy a bunch of sets.

You want to talk about getting ripped off, how about bicycle brake pads?!?!?!?! Not very much material there and I doubt there is a whole ton of R&D going into the standard brake pad material, and they still cost about as much as a set of front automobile disk brakes cost.

I don't think so. A lot of what goes into the price of a tire is the research and development costs it took to make it. These little buggers can be very complex works of engineering when you think about it. To me, the main difference between a high end bike tire and it's automotive counterpart is only the volume of materials it takes to make it. Not the brain power it took to develop it.

55/Rad

Wow "they" really have you where they want you....... They cost what they do because they cost what they do; I don't question it. It's our sport, our love, our passion, and hobby and to me it's worth it, and that dosen't come cheap; I don't think I'd want it to.

Original question of the thread is, "are we getting suckered". The answer is YES, because all of you snoby idiots keep on buying them.

Actually the tyre prices are too high because not enough "snobby idiots" are buying them.

As others have suggested, it's called economics. The price the manufacturer / wholesaler / distributor / retailer will ask for a given tire is tied to what the consumer is willing to pay to get it. Until such time as cyclists refuse to pay $40 for a bicycle tire there will be $40 bicycle tires. And, manufacturers will continue to move production to places that reduce their material and/or labor costs without passing those savings along to buyers.

It's the way things work.

Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)

You are getting gouged only if your willing to pay the prices. I'm happy with the middle of the spectrum. I save my nickles up and splurge during the winter months when they are on sale or I can get a coupon offer. It's not like they are gonna go bad hanging in the basement.

Granted, I'm not Racer X or a weight weenie.

Boys - if you think you are getting suckered, then buy cheaper tires - they are out there for $10. I agree it's stupid to put $200 Pirelli's on your mom's minivan. If your bike is the performance equivalent of a Saturn, then spend accordingly.

55/Rad

No your not getting suckered. Several things are dead on here. Economy of scale is a big, big part, another big part is R&D and materials, these tires are light, light, light. Compare a motorcycle tire's price all you want, but don't forget to compare the weight. Cars and motorcycles have big motors to push heavy, relatively inefficient tires around, one of the reasons they can run 35 psi tires. The previous poster was right, build an automobile tire to hold 125psi and see what it costs. While a bike tire may cost near what some car tires cost, they don't cost near what performance car tires cost, compare apples to apples folks. Why do some of you always think everyone in business is trying to rip you off? Don't like the price of tires, go build your own, go sell your own and undercut everyone else and you'll be rich!!! :D

There are cheap tires out there if you want them. Heck, you can go to WalMart and for the price of two really nice tires, get an entire bike.


Sometimes I look at bike tire prices and think -- for $20 more, I could just about buy a cheap tire for my *car*.

But, you are comparing a high perfomance racing bike tire to a bottom of the line pasanger car tire. A rear tire for a Viper is $400.00, that is not mounted or balanced, and a really good online price.

Makes $45 for a racing tire look sweet.

If you want a apple to apple comparison how about motorcycles v. bikes. Near the same price but same issues exist. When is the last time you cornered on a bicycle at the speeds the street bike does...routinely....

Face it the cycling industry is doing a bike jacking at each purchase. Why? because they can.

DAve

Not to be argumentative, I don't know of any motorcycle tire that cost as little as a bicycle tire. As a member of a motorcycle organization, The Ironbutt Association, which is dedicated to riding motorcycles long distances I've bought more than my share of motorcycle tires. Recently I've been paying about $200 per tire. I'm getting about 8000 miles out of the rear and 12000 out of the front. With everything I ask these tires to do I'm not complaining.

Just bought last January, a new set of Michellin Pro Race 700x23 for $45.00 a piece, and i don't regret spending that amount of money for my Prince

thats what we get for being in a sport full of rich white people, kinda like skiing

thats what we get for being in a sport full of rich white people, kinda like skiing

That's a crock, Continental Sport 1000 700X23 right now at Performance are $8.99 each. If you want high performance equipment you have to pay for it, doesn't have anything to do with what color someone is or how much they make.

Of course we're being gouged, that is what a hobby is all about-gouging the hobbiest. You use car tires VS bike tires, well cars are mostly a necessity and there is a tire shop on every corner and that generates competition which helps keep tire prices down. With bikes you don't have a tire shop on every corner so the market a much slimmer thus the higher prices. And don't give us crap about high pressure bike technology vs low tech low pressure car tires, that's a very bad arguement; just try to sustain 75mph on a bike tire with outside tempertures in the 80's. And the kevlar in a car tire was equally absurd, most car tires today have steel belts that are far superior to warding off flats than any bike tire could ever dream of doing. And Viper tires may cost $400 each but who cares if you can afford a Viper? The same is true with bikes, if you can afford a $12,000 Colnago F1 bike who cares how much you have to spend on tires!

But there are plenty of bicycle tires on the market for around $30 that are decent tires and there are even decent tires under $20 . Try here for good deals:

http://www.biketiresdirect.com/

http://www.bicycletires.com/tek9.asp?pg=tireselections

First a reply to folks who think it doesn't matter if your treads are reversed- ask a performance car specialist if he will reverse the tread directions.
NOT!
Buy a bad tread design or implement a bad surface\ to contact and YOU ARE DOWN!@ whatever speed.

Some tires are garbage, if you only ride 10-15 mph whatever.

ride seriously- buy the good stuff, you are contact with the ground and yes, traction is important.
Gravity is a harsh mistress.

The other input I can see is durability as cheap rubber compounds are less UV stable etc and I've seen treads rip off mtb tires and cracks around dimples with age.

'cause you're are on a BIKE doesn't mean DISREGARD rubber manufacturers implementations.

Buy new tires per year?
A good one can last 4.

Added note, don't forget the painted white crosswalk lines need to be run over with the bike in a vertical position, these paint lines are seriosly slick with a little morning dew.
-Know what I mean?
Yow! Like I'm sliding full on, digging my h-bars into the tarmack so I don't dent
some ladies Beamer- (she was sweet and asked if all was O.K)
whatever.

Are the tire makers taking advantage of a group willing to easily part with money (since bikes are pretty much a luxury item)? Or is there something in their construction that really makes them worth that much??

(and I know of course there are tires I can buy for $10, but I know there are lots of people buying $40-$50 tires too.)[/QUOTE]
I have always been bugged by the fact that bike tires can cost more than car tires and rarely do they last more than about 3500 miles. I even heard an uninformed sales person say bike tires are not expected to last more than 500 miles...(Overheard, Customer complaint about tire lasting less than 1,000 miles)
I just try to stock up when they are on sale...Often can find sales with bike tires 35% off.
Are we being ripped off. I think so..Still, safety and durability can not be undersold.

That's a crock, Continental Sport 1000 700X23 right now at Performance are $8.99 each. If you want high performance equipment you have to pay for it, doesn't have anything to do with what color someone is or how much they make.

To say marketers don't extend the profit margin for so called 'luxury items.'? Well, in that case..I totally disagree.
Rich white people tend to consume more of the luxury goods than other ethnic groupings. The unfortunate fact is bikes are not totally captive to rich white people...
Many ride bikes for totally ulititarian purposes. Like going to work when you can't afford a car. And many can't afford to buy more than $350 bikes, as opposed to $6,500 bikes.
And rarely am I lucky enough to find a bike tire for less than $35, even on sale...
Unless you buy some basic tire that goes flat for so much as traversing over a dandelleon seed pod.

Well for all of you who are convinced that you are being gouged by the price of various bike stuff, well go on out there and manufacture bike stuff and sell it for a "fair price". If the gouging is occuring , then you should be able to way undercut the current market and still make a big profit!!

The question is "why hasn't someone done this already"? If there is lots of money to be made undercutting the current people, why hasn't someone done it?

The thing is, it obviously isn't as easy as it looks.

Now, the person was complaining out bicycle tires. Now there are quite a few bike tire manufacturers. No one has anything approaching a monopoly. I would think that if the profit margins were excessive, someone would have lowered the prices long ago in order to grab market share. That has not happened.

Now cheap bike tires are out there. You can get $10 tires. Of course, if you want a high performance tire, you have to pay. Those things are pretty complex and built to high levels of quality and quality costs money whether it is knives, bikes, cars, paint, paintings, tile, or anything else you can think of.

Well for all of you who are convinced that you are being gouged by the price of various bike stuff, well go on out there and manufacture bike stuff and sell it for a "fair price". If the gouging is occuring , then you should be able to way undercut the current market and still make a big profit!!

The question is "why hasn't someone done this already"? If there is lots of money to be made undercutting the current people, why hasn't someone done it?

The thing is, it obviously isn't as easy as it looks.

Now, the person was complaining out bicycle tires. Now there are quite a few bike tire manufacturers. No one has anything approaching a monopoly. I would think that if the profit margins were excessive, someone would have lowered the prices long ago in order to grab market share. That has not happened.

Now cheap bike tires are out there. You can get $10 tires. Of course, if you want a high performance tire, you have to pay. Those things are pretty complex and built to high levels of quality and quality costs money whether it is knives, bikes, cars, paint, paintings, tile, or anything else you can think of.

I guess I have to agree, many bike tires are built with a high degree of quality. $10 tires often are not. Yes, I insist on quality. That does not go to say, I think we are being ripped off. The price versus overhead on almost everything is outrageous.
As to so many manufacturers in competition..I just do not buy that fact as automatic. Oh, maybe there are more bike tire manufacturers than say computer manufacturers...But, one might be surprised when one finds who owns what.
It is not about competition anymore, but ownership of your competitor...Remember all the hostile buyouts. Think that a thing of the past. I don't.

Honestly, I believe it comes down to sales volume...it probably does cost less to produce a $50-$100 bike tire than we can imagine...but consider what they invest in the manufacturing process...they put LARGE amounts of money on the line with hopes that if/when they produce a good run of tires that 1) they did their homework and they work, 2) they market it right and you find out how good they are and 3) you actually fork over the dough...

Keep in mind, most of the time the tires have to go thru ONE or TWO other retailers before you get em'...their cost is typically half of what retail is...so there's two sets of mouths to feed before you put air in em'...

It's the same way with car/motorcycle/trucks/lawnmowers...it takes a major investment to produce these tires...and when you consider the number of buying customers, sometimes the risk isn't worth it if the profit isn't there...how many Viper buyers are there in the world needing new tires every year??

Sure, they could lower the price once they've covered their intial set-up, but why? If they do, they lose research money...they can't make a better tire if they don't have the dough...

Good example....Maxxis...here's a company that was relatively unknown years ago...I learned about em' when they did go-kart tires for my neighbors...Now they're big in mountain bikes...But they set a good price for a quality product and have CONTINUED to reinvest in the business...

So sure, $40 - $50 - $100 is high, but so are stable platform shocks, titanium frames, and carbon fiber seatposts, but it's the price of technology and advancement...if you don't want the latest and greatest, don't buy it...like it's been stated already, there's plenty of great stuff out there for $10-$20...but consider what it may have cost when it came out...

Just buy the fricken tires and ride.

Goofy thread.....Look at it this way, if Walmart starts selling Jamis and Felts (for example) the price is going to be about 40-50% less....but with NO service. But that's mass marketing for ya. But look at what happens next.....millions (yes folks, millions) of new riders hit the road and suddenly it ain't safe to clip in. Forget worrying about cagers; the newbies will be putting each other in the hospital by the thousand. One last thought, take a look at who is driving the flash cars and moving into designer homes. It ain't bike shop owners. You don't open a bike shop expecting to get rich, hell, a lot of them are closing. This is a great way of life, enjoy it.

What the market will bear....

"Being gouged" is a subjective opinion based on a variety of assumptions and economic conditions that are unique to each individual.

Example - some people think $50 for a Michelin Pro-Race is fair and others think it's gouging. What if it were $30? Or $100? The pendulum of the number of people thinking those prices were fair or not would swing heavily but never 100% to one side.


...Rich white people tend to consume more of the luxury goods than other ethnic groupings.

What research study proved that rich white people spend proportionately more on luxury items than their equally rich non-white counterparts? This statement is erroneous and irresponsible in that it implies that the color of one's skin affects that person's spending habits as it pertains to luxury items.

Rich is rich. if you have it, you probably spend it. It doesn't matter what color your skin is. It's that way here in the states as well as world over.

55/Rad

i've had this thought before. bike tires are silly expensive. i'm still waiting for the $45 set of tires that will last 60K miles.

that being said, i'll keep shelling out the money because i don't really have a choice. we're being hosed, but what are you going to do about it? i'm going to take it, because that's what i have to do. oh well.

i've had this thought before. bike tires are silly expensive. i'm still waiting for the $45 set of tires that will last 60K miles.

that being said, i'll keep shelling out the money because i don't really have a choice. we're being hosed, but what are you going to do about it? i'm going to take it, because that's what i have to do. oh well.
See, this is the issue here. People say they don't have a choice and that they are feeling "gouged". But we do have a choice. Stop buying $50 tires every season and start buying $12 tires. It's that simple.

What's that? The $12 tires aren't performance matched to our $2000 bikes? Or even our $700 one? Well, shame on us for not fully factoring the REAL cost of ownership when we bought our Ferrari.

Excuse me, the Walmart Tire manager called - the Countach is finished and ready to be picked up.

55/Rad

The only reason for the grousing here, is the comparsion to car tires.. Some of us just find buying bike tires that are more expensive than car tires to be too much.
As to costs of set up...Bike tire technology does not change that much.They use the same old mold year after year, change production from expensive Thailand to inexpensive China. Factories are now planned so they can be wisked to new facilities with a weeks notice, in order to find the cheapest labor force.Haiti was too expensive to make softballs at 0.17 cents an hour over Asia..
When was the last time your bike tire said made in Akron with union labor..
We are screwed with about everything we buy. Companies are now ruthless in appreciation of a loyal labor force. But, we just have to accept it because their is nothing we can do about it.
Why consumer loyalities to any U.S. company anymore beats the hell out of me....Most U.S. companies in their incorporation licenses are ashamed of U.S. origination.
Most have changed and now say 'an international company.'
They do not do this for innovation, but instead a 240% return on investment over lets say a 12% return. My bike tires now mostly say made in China...I imagine Taiwan is too expensive.

Please help me find companies making a 240% return on their investment as I have a few dollars set aside and I'd love to invest in an opportunity like that.
If you are unwilling to compare apples to apples what is the point in this debate?
If you are riding any bike over $1000 the equivalent motor vehicle would be $50,000+. There are no $50 tires for Ferrari, or Corvette for that matter.

Hey! They could stick us the way tire dealers do...
charge extra for valves and stems, service contracts for balance and rotation. Never mind bike tires, you're gettin' screwed with car tires!

There are no $50 tires for Ferrari, or Corvette for that matter.

Technically you could mount the latest $100-for-a-set-of-four from Discount Tire on your Ferrari or Corvette. Size selection might be a problem given your rims but hey... you could swap out the rims for cheap steel ones too and still come out ahead pricewise. What, you say that the performance will suffer? Well duh!

Please help me find companies making a 240% return on their investment as I have a few dollars set aside and I'd love to invest in an opportunity like that.
If you are unwilling to compare apples to apples what is the point in this debate?
If you are riding any bike over $1000 the equivalent motor vehicle would be $50,000+. There are no $50 tires for Ferrari, or Corvette for that matter.
The profitability of companies such as Nike..In many instances, this is not much of an exagerration.
The auto related companies I know that closed down in Michigan that went to Mexico had an annual profit margin of like 6%. No longer good enough. CEO pay packages don't come out of nowhere..They come out of the pockets of cheap/cheap labor.

Mostly, Nike sells sneakers. Mostly, everybody buys sneakers. Doens't work very well as an example for the cycling industry. Next, Mexico is losing it's "cheap/cheap" jobs to China. It's begun moving up the 'food chain' because it has to. Next, while there are a few large bike companies, cycling isn't a mass market/mall kind of thing. Most if us need service, and the market is diverse enough to support hundreds of manufacturers. You can't say that about sneakers. The closest thing to Nike nobody has even mentioned in this thread; and it's pretty obvious.

I always equate this to the cost of an item.
How long does it take to build / produce the item.
how much money did they spend in R&D
And lastly, how much money does the tire company have to keep in reserve because some moron is going to ride their bike too fast into a corner, loose it, slide into oncoming traffic and then their lawyer sues the contractor who built the road, the oncoming driver and Conti because they didnt send somone around to instruct you, the consumer, on how to corner on their tires. :D

A car might have 80+ in^2 on the ground while your bike only has about 0.7 in^2.
A 3000 lb car would exert 37.5 psi on the tires. A 150 lb bike+rider would exert FIVE times that on the tires.

I have a pair of specialized hemispheres on my commuter bike that cost $60. Given the fact that over 1000 miles in city traffic so far over glass, nails, wood splinters, and the 50+ pieces of glass shards I've dug out of the tears in the main threading plus the occasional ride over piles of broken glass by the road at near 30mph without one single flat so far has lead me to believe that a $20 pair of tires wouldn't last me a month.

Suppose you bought a BMW M3, removed the speed limiter and you're blasting down the road. Where would the fun be if your tires blew at 180mph because they weren't Y-rated?
$50000 sedan with $1000 (2nd most expensive Michelins from tirerack.com) in tires = 2% of the price of the car.

Now suppose you bought a Specialized E5 and you're blasting through a winding road in excess of 50-60 with heavy braking. What would be the price you pay if your tires gave away around a corner?
$3500 bike with $60 (2nd most expensive road/race tires from Specialized) in tires = 1.7% of the price of the bike.

Compare the cost of overhead in making an engineered racing tire for a bike for $60/pair and the cost of making a pair of sneakers at $60/pair and things make a lot more sense. Especially since the materials used to make a pair of $60 Nike's aren't all that much different from the materials used to manufacture this $5 Big Mac I'm eating.

Especially since the materials used to make a pair of $60 Nike's aren't all that much different from the materials used to manufacture this $5 Big Mac I'm eating.

Interesting... I would have thought that the materials used to make a pair of $60 Nikes would be more in common with those of a $1.50 PowerBar. :D

Interesting... I would have thought that the materials used to make a pair of $60 Nikes would be more in common with those of a $1.50 PowerBar. :D

I swear those Clif bars ARE old ground up Nike's.
You ever watched that episode of the simpsons when homer's eating the apple sauce bar?
"Homer, our bars are nothing more than apple cores and old chinese newspapers!"
*Homer, looking at the bar* "Hey Duong Chao Ping died..."

Compared to the price of bike tires, if any of you ever bought a designer handbag for your spouse, now THAT's extortion.