Foo - Outdoor gear markup

While at my local outfitter shop looking at sleeping bags I asked the salesman for his price list and catalog for the Western Mountaineering line of bags. When I got home I realized that he had accidentally given me a copy of the store price sheet which included not only the retail price but their wholesale prices as well. I’ll spare you the explicitives that I uttered and simply say that the percentage of markup is unbelievable! :eek: Is 55% to 75% markup the norm for outdoor gear? The markup on production bicycles is not even that high. (20% to 35%)

Now I realize there’s probably not a lot I can do about it. I’m sure with that kind of markup they can afford to loose a customer if I decide I don’t’ want to pay their price. However, I think I will go back once I’ve decided on which bag and ask them for a discount. I won't have anything to loose by asking and I certainly won't feel guilty about it.



Anybody have much luck when negotiating with outfitters and sports shops? Any suggestions?

Thanks,



Krispy

(RANT)

Yeah... pay their retail price and be thankful the store is there for you to buy from.

This unbelivable markup is what pays the mortgage on the property, and the taxes and insurance on it too. It pay the electric bill to keep the store warm and well lit so you can see the merchandise on dislpay... which it too has paid for. It pays for losses due to shrinkage (shoplifting & employee theft). It pays local, state & federal income taxes. It pays for the Social Security, Health Insurance and 401k of the employees. It pays even the inept employeee that gave you the wrong price list. Then, IF there's anything left over it gets put called "PROFIT" and taxed to death all over again.

Why do you feel that YOU are entitled to a discount at that store? You shop there regularly? OK, does your grocery give you a discount when you shop there every week? How about the gas station? I'm there 2-3 times a week spending 20 bucks a shot and they don't give me a discount.

If you want discount shop mail order. But don't complain when your local retailer goes tits up from lack of business and you can't see and fondle the merchandise... before you buy mail order.

(/RANT)

Krispy, 55- 75% is nothing... look at perscription drugs. 500%-!200% mark up at retail level now that's outrageous!!!

(RANT)

Yeah... pay their retail price and be thankful the store is there for you to buy from.

This unbelivable markup is what pays the mortgage on the property, and the taxes and insurance on it too. It pay the electric bill to keep the store warm and well lit so you can see the merchandise on dislpay... which it too has paid for. It pays for losses due to shrinkage (shoplifting & employee theft). It pays local, state & federal income taxes. It pays for the Social Security, Health Insurance and 401k of the employees. It pays even the inept employeee that gave you the wrong price list. Then, IF there's anything left over it gets put called "PROFIT" and taxed to death all over again.

Why do you feel that YOU are entitled to a discount at that store? You shop there regularly? OK, does your grocery give you a discount when you shop there every week? How about the gas station? I'm there 2-3 times a week spending 20 bucks a shot and they don't give me a discount.

If you want discount shop mail order. But don't complain when your local retailer goes tits up from lack of business and you can't see and fondle the merchandise... before you buy mail order.

(/RANT)

Krispy, 55- 75% is nothing... look at perscription drugs. 500%-!200% mark up at retail level now that's outrageous!!!

You were joking, right? :D

As a former Specialty Outdoor Retail manager, I can assure, no one in outdoor retail is getting rich. As for mark-ups, there is not the volume to pass along savings such as book sellers, grocery stores, etc. can do. It is a low volume business. Typical mark-ups are more along 50%. (if you shop for clothes anyplace other than x-mart, you pay a higher mark-up there.) There is a high cost of doing business in regards to staff education (service is typically much more than "look on aisle 3", it is more along the lines of a doctoral dissertation on the advantages of different climbng rope weaves one minute, and the chemical make-up of waterproof fabrics the next). And all the guarantees. Outdoor companies have oversold the "lifetime guarantee" as a marketing tool and now face a HIGH percentage of returns/repairs with each sale. Remember, if you want x-mart prices, you'll get x-mart service and quality.

BTW: bike sales are one dollar ahead of a loss leader for bike shops. They make money on parts and accessories (better margins and they don't need 1.5 hours to assemble a new helmet).

Support the local shops that educate, service, and lead community efforts to build trails, access, and clean-ups.

(RANT)

Yeah... pay their retail price and be thankful the store is there for you to buy from.

This unbelivable markup is what pays the mortgage on the property, and the taxes and insurance on it too. It pay the electric bill to keep the store warm and well lit so you can see the merchandise on dislpay... which it too has paid for. It pays for losses due to shrinkage (shoplifting & employee theft). It pays local, state & federal income taxes. It pays for the Social Security, Health Insurance and 401k of the employees. It pays even the inept employeee that gave you the wrong price list. Then, IF there's anything left over it gets put called "PROFIT" and taxed to death all over again.

Why do you feel that YOU are entitled to a discount at that store? You shop there regularly? OK, does your grocery give you a discount when you shop there every week? How about the gas station? I'm there 2-3 times a week spending 20 bucks a shot and they don't give me a discount.

If you want discount shop mail order. But don't complain when your local retailer goes tits up from lack of business and you can't see and fondle the merchandise... before you buy mail order.

(/RANT)

Krispy, 55- 75% is nothing... look at perscription drugs. 500%-!200% mark up at retail level now that's outrageous!!!
Oh yeah. I like this one. :D

I used to do pricing for a manufacturer. Granted, it was not outdoor stuff, but standard practice was a 250% markup over cost of materials. Bottom line is that you're not the only one with bills to pay.

Perhaps your list is from the manufacture and lists the wholesale price and MSRP as a selling point to retail stores. It would be reasonable to assume you would not have to pay full mark-up.

There is a high cost of doing business in regards to staff education (service is typically much more than "look on aisle 3", it is more along the lines of a doctoral dissertation on the advantages of different climbng rope weaves one minute, and the chemical make-up of waterproof fabrics the next).
This would be a good argument except in this case the guy apparently was either not trained or not trained properly because he was guessing at a lot of his answerers. I don't think he was a new employee because he knew right where everything was and made reference to some older model products that they no longer had. That's why I asked for the catalog so I could read up on the products myself.


Support the local shops that educate, service, and lead community efforts to build trails, access, and clean-ups. Good point also except that in all the years this store has been here I've never seen or heard of them participating in any of the above efforts. This would be a good reason for me to drive a little further to do business with the outfitter who has.

It's the same old argument that goes on on this forum about supporting the LBS. There is an LBS in my town that I've bought two bikes from. I negotiated a 30% discount on the first and a 35% on the second and from 15% to 20% off all other merchandise that I got with the bikes. On top of that I got exceptional service after the sale. Their mechanics always do good work, are happy to answer my questions, and always go out of their way to help me. On the other hand after listening to another LBS rant and rave about the evils of asking for a discount and how that I should be loyal and his shop would give better service etc. etc. etc. I bought a Litespeed from him at full price. Long story short his after the sale service has been the worse I have ever had. He refused to do warranty work that Litespeed insisted must be done on a defective headset and I was forced to take my business elsewhere.

The successful LBS above has been in business for a long time because they made their customers feel good about the deal by giving a discount when asked and delivered good customer service after the sale without preaching to everyone that their customers should be loyal and thankful for their existance like Stacy mentioned in the previous post. The second has been in business for only about 5 and filed for chapter 13 bankruptcy shortly after selling me my Litespeed for full price. Go figure!

You were joking, right? :D


(SARCHASM)
Yes Krispy... I was just joking. What part did you find particularly amusing? :rolleyes:
(/SARCHASAM)

What kind of business do you run that you feel 55 - 75% mark-up is unreasonable? Even my ghanga man makes 100% on an ounce of smoke... he's the one with the risk, he should make the profit. It's called... and repeat after me... CAPITIALISM!!! The concept of free enterprize... what seperates us from Comunists

(SARCHASM)
Yes Krispy... I was just joking. What part did you find particularly amusing? :rolleyes:
(/SARCHASAM)

The part where you said I should be thankful for them. I thought I was about to hear another sermon on pledging my blind elegance and loyalty to a business just because their address is in my city.


What kind of business do you run that you feel 55 - 75% mark-up is unreasonable? Even my ghanga man makes 100% on an ounce of smoke... he's the one with the risk, he should make the profit. It's called... and repeat after me... CAPITIALISM!!! The concept of free enterprize... what seperates us from Comunists
Did I every say or imply that they couldn't or shouldn't be in business? I also didn't say "unreasonable" I said unbelievable. The concept of free Enterprise and Capitalism also give me the right to say "Hey I think I can get or find a better deal. It's my money after all!"

So are you saying I'm a communist because I would like a discount? Dude you might want to cut back on the ghanga! :D

Mark-ups are hard to understand. They have to cover the cost of the item of course, but also the building, saleries of the sales,cleaning, and whoever else forces and still make a little profit. If it's a quality store with knowledgable folks working there support it. If you can't find a place that seems worth it shop on line. It's your $$ to vote with. I like doing business with private small companies if I can seems better than Xmart even if it costs a little more.

Joe

The part where you said I should be thankful for them. I thought I was about to hear another sermon on pledging my blind elegance and loyalty to a business just because their address is in my city.
No, No, & No... Ok, so you thought I was going to say something that I didn't. That set the tone for your comprehension of what I did. Please, read what I wrote and not assume the non-existent hyperbole you've place between the lines. My intention was that you should be thankful that they are there for you to choose as an option for your shopping dollar.



Did I every say or imply that they couldn't or shouldn't be in business? I also didn't say "unreasonable" I said unbelievable.
Unreasonalbe - Unbelievable... what's the difference? You're picking nits. You can do better than that.



The concept of free Enterprise and Capitalism also give me the right to say "Hey I think I can get or find a better deal. It's my money after all!"
Yes, you're right it is your money spend it as you will, where you will. It's yours to squeeze the last iota of value out of it and subsequently the last bit of profit out of the retailer. Have fun. but don't b!tch.



So are you saying I'm a communist because I would like a discount?
I didn't say you were a communist, though it's readly apparent that you believe you are somebody special, gods gift to the retalier, that you are too good to pay retail... NOT! You are a leach. A parasite on the margins of the enterprise machine.

I've heard this little saying once: "We love to see all our customers. Some when they come, some when they go". I feel you'd fit into the latter.



Dude you might want to cut back on the ghanga!
PLUEEZE!! You don't want us to bring up that chronic ************ habit now do you. :D

Buy your own business then you will find out why and how mark ups work, until then shop where you find the best deal. I bet you will find that most stores are competitive.

I worked in a local hardware store when I was in high school. Everything was pretty much marked up 100% (double the store's cost) for all the reasons Stacey said. :)

Mark-ups are hard to understand. They have to cover the cost of the item of course, but also the building, saleries of the sales,cleaning, and whoever else forces and still make a little profit. If it's a quality store with knowledgable folks working there support it. If you can't find a place that seems worth it shop on line.

I too like doing business with local stores as much as I can especially when they have quality people, quality service, and a quality product. 95% of all my bike related purchases have been with an LBS. As I've learned the hard way some are better than others but most will GLADLY give you some sort of price break when you ask. Now you and I both know that if they couldn't afford it they wouldn't give it.




It's your $$ to vote with.

You are exactly right! Nearly everything in life is negotiable in some way or form but it all comes down to this; If you don't ask you don't get. Unless what you are purchasing is an urgent or an emergency situation the buyer is the one who is in the position of power. If you don't like the price you can try to negotiate. If the store does not negotiate the customer can walk away and buy somewhere else.

A few years ago I was buying a used Mercedes Benz. The salesman and I were haggling back and forth about the asking price vs. the NADA value. When we reached a point that the salesman would go no further I put my papers down and calmly said "You know Joe we can talk all day long about value and NADA but when it is all said and done were talking about a Mercedes. It's a car that I WANT but don't really NEED. Now here's what I feel is a fair price and a price that I'm willing to give right now. Would you ask your manager if he'll accept it? Otherwise I'll be on my way." A few minutes later I was writing out a check and he handed me the keys.

When I bought my Volvo the very snooty salesman and sales manager assured me that there would be no haggling because their customers always paid what was on the sticker. It was a "NO Haggle Dealership" Well guess what! I haggled anyway and when it was all said and done I paid a lot less than their asking price!!!

Now the average American consumer thinks it's OK to haggle over the price of a car but when you mention a discount at the local bike or camping store they cringe and get on a soap box and start talking about how rude that is and how it's just not done! Bull!!! If you don't ask you don't get!!! Gosh they were even saying the same thing on Dateline 2020 about a month ago. They were in a mall and the news guy was shopping and got a discount at nearly every store they shopped at simply by asking.

Did you all accept your boss's first offer of salery when they offered you the job? If not why not? If you don't ask you don't get! Did you pay the asking price for the house you own or did you make a counter offer? What about the appliances in your house? Your carpet? Your furnature? I negotiated and got a better deal on all that and all of those companies are still in business. If they couldn't afford to give a discount they wouldn't have done it. Plain and simple! The buyer is in the position of power. If you dont' like the price, the service, the product go buy it somewhere else. Afterall it's the American way! Really, about the worse thing that can happen is that they will say NO. But you will never know if you don't ask!

People get on their soap boxes about being loyal to your local business. That's fine if they are worthy of your loyalty. But what about your loyalty to your family and to yourself? If the average person was more frugle with their money they would have more to spend on their children, their spouse, their pets, and their own expenses.

I probably misworded my origional post. It should have been something like "Is this the normal markup on camping gear? Are there any angles out of the ordinary that one would use to negotiate on price?"

Oh, BTW. When I bought my tent from the competitor of the above mentioned outfitter store they wouldn't move on the price but they did give me a gift certificate for 25$ off my next purchase. I think I'll buy my sleeping bag from them. If you don't ask you don't get!

I do like it when they do get on thier soapbox to shop local for me that would be REI, Eddie Bower, and Starbucks not to mention Microsoft.

If you don't ask you don't get!


Funny, my LBS has a sign, in prose, behind the cash register. Explaining why he'd appreciate it if you don't ask for a discount. Some of the reasons I cited are on that sign. I've been patronizing this store for 4 years now and not once have I asked him for a discount. What's even more funny, is that somewhere around my third visit I noticed a drastic reduction in the bottom line of my invoices. Currently I'm at somewhere around cost plus 10%... never once have I even hinted around at getting 'Special Pricing". No, I'm not buying a $4000 bike every year, but rather just tires, tubes, cables and the like... not even a helmet or a computer, no stationary trainer or carrier rack. Just nickle dime stuff and the guy treats me like a queen. Must be something in my personality, eh? :)

I get a 10% discount at most LBS' because I'm a member of the local bicycle advocacy org. The discounts easily pay for my annual membership in the organization.

You are a leach. A parasite on the margins of the enterprise machine.




PLUEEZE!! You don't want us to bring up that chronic ************ habit now do you. :D

Stacey,

You and I may disagree but I've not resorted to calling you names. I think you can show more maturity than that.

Perhaps your list is from the manufacture and lists the wholesale price and MSRP as a selling point to retail stores. It would be reasonable to assume you would not have to pay full mark-up.

That's a very good point.

Thanks!

Buy your own business then you will find out why and how mark ups work, until then shop where you find the best deal. I bet you will find that most stores are competitive.

Actually I did own my own business years ago. I was successful at it and when I closed shop to pursue other interests my books were showing a profit. When asked I always gave discounts. More often than not people do ask for discounts. I never dropped my price below what I could afford to do do business at but dropped it enough that the customer and I were both happy.

I do like it when they do get on thier soapbox to shop local for me that would be REI, Eddie Bower, and Starbucks not to mention Microsoft.

:lol: Wow! You have the best of both!

Krispy-"I negotiated a 30% discount on the first and a 35% on the second and from 15% to 20% off all..."

I can't call Bull$hit on this, because I was not there, But(Having been in the biz for ten years) I find it hard to believe a LBS selling bikes for 30% off could remain in business. I can only see it happening if the bike was very old stock or WAY over priced. Example: Bike cost = $1000, typical markup of 40% = $1400, discount 30% = $980. Hmmm, that does not look like a good way to do business.




Krispy-"Now the average American consumer thinks it's OK to haggle over the price of a car but when you mention a discount at the local bike or camping store they cringe..."

Bike shops also do not recieve sale incentives from the manufacturer as is practised in the Auto industry. We also do not get the opportunity to make money off of interest on payments.

Krispy-"A few years ago I was buying a used Mercedes Benz. The salesman and I were haggling back and forth about the asking price vs. the NADA value. When we reached a point that the salesman would go no further I put my papers down and calmly said "You know Joe we can talk all day long about value and NADA but when it is all said and done were talking about a Mercedes. It's a car that I WANT but don't really NEED. Now here's what I feel is a fair price and a price that I'm willing to give right now. Would you ask your manager if he'll accept it? Otherwise I'll be on my way." A few minutes later I was writing out a check and he handed me the keys.

When I bought my Volvo the very snooty salesman and sales manager assured me that there would be no haggling because their customers always paid what was on the sticker. It was a "NO Haggle Dealership" Well guess what! I haggled anyway and when it was all said and done I paid a lot less than their asking price!!!"

Anyone that talks about buying a Mercedes and a Volvo but complains about the price of camping equipment should perhaps rethink his spending habits.
Brings to mind the customer that drove up in a new Porsche 911 and then *****ed about the price of a pump, that price $30

Alright ladies and gentlemen, let's keep the childish name calling out of this, shall we?

I can't call Bull$hit on this, because I was not there, But(Having been in the biz for ten years) I find it hard to believe a LBS selling bikes for 30% off could remain in business. I can only see it happening if the bike was very old stock or WAY over priced. Example: Bike cost = $1000, typical markup of 40% = $1400, discount 30% = $980. Hmmm, that does not look like a good way to do business.


They don't sell EVERY bike at that percentage of discount. You'd be suprised at the number of folks who will walk in and pay full sticker even though the name of the shop even implies that they wheel and deal! However they are willing to haggle. All you have to do is ask. They have even showed me their cost on a few items and we came to a mutual agreement on a fair price. All of my friends have bought bikes from him and none of them paid retail. The percentage they are willing to discount varies according to circumstances. The bike I bought that they discounted by $1000.00 was almost a year old. Of course they don't often discount one by that much straight out of the box. However, a friend of mine did buy one straight out of the box at a decent discount because the dealer didn't want him to buy from someone else.

The owner owns the building and only has three employees. The store is always so jam packed with bikes there is hardly room for more than a hand full of customers at a time in the store. Yet as I’ve gone in there month after month to buy stuff the inventory is constantly turning over. Beyond knowing that he has a lower than average overhead for our town and that he sells a much higher volume than his competitors I’m not sure what other way he is able to beat his competition. The fact remains that he is though.



Anyone that talks about buying a Mercedes and a Volvo but complains about the price of camping equipment should perhaps rethink his spending habits.


Now why do you say that? Would it have made a difference to you if I had said Ford or Chevy? Are you implying that because I have owned a Mercedes and now own a Volvo (2 actually, my wife owns one also) that I should just lay down and passively accept any price that's thrown at me?

Maybe the reason I can buy a Volvo and buy 5 bicycles from the LBSs in my area and buy thousands of dollars worth of bike gear (again all from LBSs) is because I've tried to make wise business and spending decisions? I'm by all means not rich. I have friends who make a lot more money than I do that drive beaters for cars and can't pay their bills.

Neither the Mercedes nor the Volvos were brand new and I know I paid less than some friends of mine who bought top of the line brand new Dodges and Fords. The primary reason for the Volvos is safety. The added benefits have been that our insurance has been lower (the safety factor again) than our friends’ with the shiny new fully loaded domestic cars. They have been more reliable than previous cars I’ve owned. As a consequence I’ve actually had a lower cost of ownership than other vehicles I’ve owned. Now what is it about that you think I should reconsider?

I’ll admit the Mercedes wasn’t as good decision as I had originally hoped. I didn’t do my research very well before I bought it. After I saw what the cost of upkeep was going to be it made more sense to get rid of it.

My point in mentioning the type of vehicles was not to flaunt what I own but to illustrate that even the snooty car dealers who advertise “No Haggle” prices will still haggle. I didn’t realize it would be taken so badly by some.

It's funny that none of the LBS in my area have ever complained about taking my money and none of them have ever said they thought I should pay more because of what I drive. Nearly all of them give me (and others) some sort of discount. I even occasionally do some business with the one LBS in town that doesn't give people discounts. Like I said before 95% of my bike related purchases were done with a local shop and NOT online.

This week I made my first significant online bike related purchase when I ordered a set of panniers from Arkel. None of the local dealers really wanted to contact them about carrying their products because there isn't much market for bike touring equipment in this town. I can understand their point of view and I at least gave them the chance first before I bought online.

Gosh, it could be the other way around I could be spending 95% of my money online and only 5% local. There are even a few newer LBS in my town that will acknowledge to their customers that the items can be bought online for cheaper and will offer to match those prices to keep their business. Some of the older shops are calling them traitors but the fact is the newer shops are gaining business because of their honesty and willingness to be more flexible on price. Of course I guess some here might consider their business practices blasphemy. ;)

Actually, my point was more along the lines of "People that buy high end cars ***** about the cost of the more mundane purchases. As in the example of the Porsche owner. I have worked as a mechanic for various retailers (Trucking, heavy equipment, power equipment, bikes, for twenty years) and it has been my experience that those that buy highend stuff other people can see(Like cars and homes), tend to be pretty parsimonious elsewhere. If I repaired and had to deliver a riding mower and this mower was a ragged out poorly cared for Murray, I could be reasonably certain that the home I derlivered it to would be five or six times the cost of mine. Not all the time but often enough for it to be a safe assumption. The shop I work for has four windows facing the parking lot, so I see a lot of the customers drive up, and I know what they drive. And the folks with the 60K cars tend to be the one that cry about price. Personally I don't give a damn what you or anyone else owns or lives in or does with their money. Your money is yours to do with what you want, but the money we loose on dealing is mine and my employers. I am far more likely to give the kid working at the grocery store and going to college a deal than the guy that just hauled a huffy out of the back of his G-wagon.

Alright ladies and gentlemen, let's keep the childish name calling out of this, shall we?

Oh, come on now, whos tattling??

Actually, my point was more along the lines of "People that buy high end cars ***** about the cost of the more mundane purchases. As in the example of the Porsche owner. I have worked as a mechanic for various retailers (Trucking, heavy equipment, power equipment, bikes, for twenty years) and it has been my experience that those that buy highend stuff other people can see(Like cars and homes), tend to be pretty parsimonious elsewhere. If I repaired and had to deliver a riding mower and this mower was a ragged out poorly cared for Murray, I could be reasonably certain that the home I derlivered it to would be five or six times the cost of mine. Not all the time but often enough for it to be a safe assumption. The shop I work for has four windows facing the parking lot, so I see a lot of the customers drive up, and I know what they drive. And the folks with the 60K cars tend to be the one that cry about price. Personally I don't give a damn what you or anyone else owns or lives in or does with their money. Your money is yours to do with what you want, but the money we loose on dealing is mine and my employers. I am far more likely to give the kid working at the grocery store and going to college a deal than the guy that just hauled a huffy out of the back of his G-wagon.

I appreciate the clarification. I agree with your being more willing to give the college kid a deal than the other customer. Who wouldn't be? I can also see how that based on your previous experience you might think that I was just like your Porsche owner customer and cuss at you over the price of a pump.

Not that I really need to justify myself to you but for whatever it's worth I have never treated anybody in an LBS (or camping store for that matter) unprofessionally. I might not agree with the price and depending on how badly I want it I might buy it anyway or I may choose to buy it from your competitor. However, I won’t cuss at you or try to belittle you over it.

Your perception of customers who ask for a discount and/ or drive high end vehicles is based on your experiences over the years. Who can dispute that? My perception of LBS (and other businesses for that matter) concerning discounts is based on my own experiences as well. For some reason it has been my experience that the businesses who are flexible on price have somehow also given me the best after the sale service. The businesses who have become offended at my asking for a discount turned out to give the worse service after the sale even after I paid full price. I can’t explain and can only theorize why that is but the fact remains that this has been my experience.

Is one of us right and the other wrong? I don’t think so. We are both right based on our own experiences.

So here we are a retailer and a consumer. You are in business to make a profit. It’s my prerogative to pay less when I can. If you give a discount it lowers your profit. If I pay full price I have less money to spend on other things, some of which might also be in your store. This isn’t a battle. It’s not who’s right and who’s wrong. It’s a simple business transaction. If I ask politely if you can be a little flexible on the price of a pump that I feel is priced a little higher than the competition or if I ask you if you give a bike club discount it’s not meant to be an insult against you. Now it’s entirely up to you if you choose to feel insulted or offended by my asking but I'm still going to ask. :D


Oh, and BTW, I don’t own a ragged out Murry. My mower is a Snapper. I bought it used 12 years ago (at a good price) and have taken good care of it. It is still running strong. :D

Markups are so common- I don't often bargain for the discount, since I know that it's the profit margin I'm fighting against, and I probably wouldn't get much anyway... :D Better to wait for stuff to go on sale and get it then.

I just watched a news report last night. Crude oil for gas is like at 66 cents a gallon, and the markup for gas is incredible... how is it that the gas stations are charging $2.09 a gallon for regular gas? If there's any complaining about getting ripped off, it's at the pumps. Now, I don't drive, so it's not as important to me, although I know I'm affected indirectly because I'm sure delivery folks pass that extra costs onto stores, then the stores pass it to me.

Markup happens every day for everything- we need to be aware of this before getting upset about it.

Koffee

I guess the retailers never ask for a discount from thier supplier. :rolleyes:

What gets me about this thread is your post complains about the high mark up (55% to 75%) well in th eretail world thats a low mark up as many people here who have expreriance pont out. I have never been able to talk anyone down in price when dealing with stores that you mention, it just doesn't happen (except with demo models, closeouts etc.) I personally think the Rev has probably hit the nail on the head with this one. People who constantly come into retail stores and try to talk the price down will have unrealistic expectations and are generally viewed as a royal pain in the a$$.

Even my ghanga man makes 100% on an ounce of smoke... he's the one with the risk, he should make the profit. It's called... and repeat after me... CAPITIALISM!!! The concept of free enterprize... what seperates us from Comunists

sounds like you've been doing a little TOO much business with him......

viewed as a royal pain in the a$$.

Have you been talking to my wife??? :roflmao:

Markups are so common- I don't often bargain for the discount, since I know that it's the profit margin I'm fighting against, and I probably wouldn't get much anyway... :D Better to wait for stuff to go on sale and get it then.

I just watched a news report last night. Crude oil for gas is like at 66 cents a gallon, and the markup for gas is incredible... how is it that the gas stations are charging $2.09 a gallon for regular gas? If there's any complaining about getting ripped off, it's at the pumps. Now, I don't drive, so it's not as important to me, although I know I'm affected indirectly because I'm sure delivery folks pass that extra costs onto stores, then the stores pass it to me.

Markup happens every day for everything- we need to be aware of this before getting upset about it.

Koffee

Koffee,

You know, yours is a much more reasonable response to my origional question. I'm a lot more inclined to see your point of view since you didn't call me names or try to discredit my previous buying experiences or type cast me because of the type of car I drive.

Thanks! :)

Markups are so common- I don't often bargain for the discount, since I know that it's the profit margin I'm fighting against, and I probably wouldn't get much anyway... :D Better to wait for stuff to go on sale and get it then.

I just watched a news report last night. Crude oil for gas is like at 66 cents a gallon, and the markup for gas is incredible... how is it that the gas stations are charging $2.09 a gallon for regular gas? If there's any complaining about getting ripped off, it's at the pumps. Now, I don't drive, so it's not as important to me, although I know I'm affected indirectly because I'm sure delivery folks pass that extra costs onto stores, then the stores pass it to me.

Markup happens every day for everything- we need to be aware of this before getting upset about it.

Koffee

Crude oil has to be refined so the markup is not 2.09 - .66 and then there is road tax on it. We'll never figure out that markup with no more information than that. Sorry Koff

Joe

I am not offended at a request for a reasonable discount, and if it is a reasonable amount I may even give it. Mostly I handle repair so that is where I give my deals. My regular customers get special consideration. It it is mostly not a discount, but priority service. Getting bumped to the front is better than a discount, when you break a spoke on friday afternoon. I also have a pretty high repeat business, with a large group of repair regulars. Our shops have been rated best in the Triangle nine of the last ten years, got beat out by Bikes USA (A heavy discounter) one year but they went belly up about ten months later.

Crude oil has to be refined so the markup is not 2.09 - .66 and then there is road tax on it. We'll never figure out that markup with no more information than that. Sorry Koff

Joe


I feel ya. They broke down how much it cost for refining oil, plus road tax, city tax, state tax, etc. Even then, it all came out to $1.57, and if gas is now over $2 a gallon, what the heck is going on?

I follow the markets too- the price of a barrel of oil was at $38 a barrel, but yesterday, it dropped to $32 a barrel. Despite that, some gas stations still jumped their prices up 6- 12 cents yesterday. :-/

Koffee

I am not offended at a request for a reasonable discount, and if it is a reasonable amount I may even give it. Mostly I handle repair so that is where I give my deals. My regular customers get special consideration. It it is mostly not a discount, but priority service. Getting bumped to the front is better than a discount, when you break a spoke on friday afternoon. I also have a pretty high repeat business, with a large group of repair regulars. Our shops have been rated best in the Triangle nine of the last ten years, got beat out by Bikes USA (A heavy discounter) one year but they went belly up about ten months later.


Now that sounds fair to me. You are willing to consider a reasonable offer or you are willing to give priority service which I agree is sometimes more valuable. You didn't get offended and I most likely would buy the pump from you. You are happy with the deal or you wouldn't have otherwise accepted it and I'm happy and will probably give you more business down the road.

The next time I come to your store I will already know your preferred policy is to give better value in service and that is what I would expect. The topic of discounts would not come back up unless some item was outrageously marked.

All but one of the shops in my town offer discounts on bike gear to customers if they are a member of a bike club. One gives 15% and the others give 10%. However they don't have a big neon sign in the front that says that. You have to ask but you usually only have to let them know once on your initial visit. After that they usually remember that you are a club member and automatically give the discount. But again the key is that initially you have to ask.

I was in a bike club meeting where a LBS owner gave a presentation and at the end naturally put in a plug for his shop and also mentioned the club discount. A fairly new member got a little upset because he had just bought a bunch of gear and paid full price. He didn't know to ask and he missed out. Live and learn.

Maybe LBS in other towns are not this way but that's the way they are in my town.

So you can see if I were new to your town and didn't know you and came into your store why I might initially ask you for a discount. The same holds true for my original question about the store that sells the sleeping bags. I have never done business with them. I didn't know what to expect in pricing and because I was thinking in terms of how much markup I'm familiar with concerning bikes my initial reaction was that of shock when I saw their markup. That's why I asked my question about if this was a normal markup for that type of product. It's why I also asked if others had any experience with discounts in that field.

Yesterday I learned from a friend that he gets 20% off everything in the store that sells the sleeping bags because he is a Boy Scout leader. He also said that any member or parent of a member of the Boy Scouts gets the same discount. So to answer my own initial question; Yes discounts are possible at that store.

Being a bike club member is a good way to get a discount, but you do need to ask. You gotta ask me anyway, I am lucky if I can remember things like getting back and forth to the house, tying shoes and such. We give 10% for bike clubs and If you join the Raleigh All-Stars (our team) for $65, you get a team jesey and you get a 20% discount(There are some exceptions to that) You also get fees back if you win races.

Being a bike club member is a good way to get a discount, but you do need to ask. You gotta ask me anyway, <snip>

Was this not what I was saying earlier in several of my previous posts? “If you don’t ask you don’t get” :D



We give 10% for bike clubs and If you join the Raleigh All-Stars (our team) for $65, you get a team jesey and you get a 20% discount(There are some exceptions to that) You also get fees back if you win races.

Excellent! No wonder your store got a best rating. You offer top quality service with a generous discount to boot! If I lived in your town I would want to do business with you. :D :D :D


So let’s say I walk into your store to buy that bicycle pump and I politely say “Hello Rev. Chuck I need a new pump. I was told that you offer a 10% discount for folks who are members of a cycling club and 20% if they join your team. Now I’m fat and slow so you probably don’t want me on your team but I’m a member of XYZ Bicycle club and I’d be happy to do business with you at your 10% club discount price”

You might say something like; “Yes, we do offer a 10% discount to club members just remind me when I ring up your ticket.” I’d be happy, you’d be happy. Life is good. :D

So now let’s say I walk into the local outfitter shop that sells the sleeping bags and say something like; “Hello Ms. (insert manager’s name) I’d like to buy a sleeping bag. I understand you give a 20% discount to the Boy Scouts. Now I’m not a member of the Boy Scouts but I am a member of XYZ bicycle club and last year we added X additional miles of new trails to 3 of the state parks and we devoted X amount of additional hours of time to trail maintenance in those parks. On one of our projects we allowed the boys from Boy Scout troop XYZ to assist us in building some of our bridges. We were appreciative of the additional help and it also allowed them to earn their merit badges. Does this qualify me and our club for any of your store discounts?”

Now she might say “No. Sorry we only give discounts to the Scouts” or she might say “Yes we give discounts to clubs who do community projects” or “we give discounts to AAA members” She also might say something like “No but if you wait until next week we will be having a sale” I seriously doubt she’s going to say “get the **** out of my store you Volvo driving leach!” :lol: but seriously my point is that unless I ask I may be missing discounts that are available.

If she offers a club discount then great! I can tell my friends in the club and they can benefit also, if she doesn’t offer one then it’s no big deal and there was no harm done by asking. If a discount is not available I can decide if I want to do business with them or if I want to drive to the other side of town to do business with their competitor that gave me the $25.00 gift card (the same thing as a discount) when I bought my tent.


So why is it that some folks agree it’s OK for me to walk into Rev. Chuck’s store and ask for my club discount but it’s not OK for me to try to find out about what discounts are available at the store that sells the sleeping bags?

When you compare the 20% discount the outfitter store is giving the Boy Scouts to the 20% discount Rev. Chuck is giving to his team members would you all not agree that Rev. Chuck is actually giving a larger discount because his markup is much much lower than the outfitter whose markup is 75%? Look at my original post. My astonishment was based on the comparison between outfitters and bike shops. After all I was posting this question to a bike related forum wasn’t I? :)