Training & Nutrition - Problems Sleeping

I wasn't sure if biking coudl possibly mess up my sleeping habits.

I'm having trouble waking up in the morning (about 6:30 am.) and feeling fresh and staying awake throughout the day. (I usually crash midway through classes at around 11:45am or so)

I bike 10 miles (a little bit more) to school and back. classes start at 8 and end at 4 I have 1-1hour break and thats from 10 30 - 1130 where at I'm not usually tired, but upon getting to the next class, I pretty much just fall dead asleep for 15-30 minutes.

I was wondering what I could do to fix this? Im sure its not biking, but just thought Id throw it out there.

Additionally I was looking into this 90- min sleep cycle thing where I would sleep for 3-4 cycles but no more then 90*4=6 hours or 90*3 = 4.5 hours and just wake up...

I know this is a biking forum but im looking for any help besides the usual go see a doctor, because I did and they wnat to prescibe me sleeping pills...any ideas?

I don't think you're cycling enough for cycling to affect your sleeping.

Yes, the 90 minute sleep cycle thing works well, but if you're constantly trying to get only 4.5 to 6 hours of sleep each night, it's just not enough. That's fine for when you're trying to finish up a big assignment or study for finals, but most people need more sleep. I can manage 6 hours a night, 5 nights a week ... but then I sleep like a log for anywhere from 9 to 12 hours on the other two nights to try to catch up.

If you've been getting 4.5 to 6 hours of sleep for a while now, that's very likely why you're nodding off in class. For the next few nights aim for 7.5 to 9 hours of sleep, and see how you feel then.

what is your diet looking like?

This may be barking up the wrong tree, but this could be classic symptoms of sleep apnea. Do you snore heavily?

^^Something to consider.

Furthermore, there is not one shred of credible research that suggests humans can adapt to even moderate sleep deprivation (<~7 hours/night weekly average).

thanks for the help guys,

as far as my diet goes Its kinda bad, in the sense that I usually go off a small breakfeast (bowl of cereal and glass of milk), generally no lunch or like a nutty bar or at most. dinner usually changes but usually consists of some amount of meat generally and if not meat then rice. In between, I drink protein shake after working out and generally one before dinner. I would eat more, but so far with this sorta diet, my weights stayed the same, so I dont want to increase eating even though I would like to :P (which is kinda weird since I usually run 3 miles everyday on top of the biking and working out 3-4 days a week)

as far as snoring, I used to snore heavily and sleep walk when I was aruond ages of 10-13 but that has long sinced passed.

however my roomates say I scream alot in my sleep.... I can't confirm or deny that though

A couple of suggestions. You don't mention an age but if your less than 60 y.o. six hours isn't enough. Check with your doctor as your symptoms can also be a sign of several medical conditions from very minor to significant. Additionally depression can cause these symptoms.

Just to clear this up, there is no set amount of sleep that every person must get. It is completely dependent on the individual as to how much is needed.

The "everyone must get eight hours" recommendation came from a single flawed study.

By all means, if you are tired, shore up your diet first, and then if that doesn't work, get an extra hour and see if that helps. But don't start thinking that if you aren't getting some arbitrary amount of sleep, you won't be healthy. Find what works for you.

I'm also a student who has trouble eating during the day ... I have 6 hours of classes straight through. So I eat a little packet of almonds or cashews in the middle of the day. I find that's better than a granola bar.

And how much sleep are you getting each night?

I try to get at least 6, usually I do. (sleep by midnight up by 6 :30) monday and wednesday nights I get a bit more sleep around 7 -8 generally (unless its towards presentation time for prelim or have a test the next day) since I don't have class till 10 30 and usually get out of the house around 9:40 or so. (although my classes start at 8, I like to give my self an hour to get there in case of a flat though it takes about 25 minutes, I don;t know if that changes anything though)

If it comes down to it, Ill take the sleeping pill subscription, but I want to exhaust my other options first. I don't know very well about diets, so I don't really know what to change in that. as far as the almonds thing goes, I usually have a packet of peanuts, but it doesnt help at all really, I don't know why.

thanks for all the help so far guys

You need to eat. And eat real food with proper nutrition. Without energy, engines won't go. Classes can be exhausting. The mind can burn a TON of energy when working hard. (Which it should be doing in class).

Figure the number of calories you are burning every day. Figure what you are consuming. Then adjust WHAT you are consuming to get everything balanced out. Since you are in school, see if there is a nutritionist on campus you can talk with. If there is a PE major offered, go over to that department and ask for help.

Sleep? Listen to your body. If you need more, get more (within reason). BTW, all through college I almost always needed a 20 min nap around lunch. WORLD of difference.

If your roomates were serious about the screaming - you could be having night terrors or other problems that are keeping you from getting a "restful" sleep. Might be worth a trip to the doctor. If all they want to do is give you sleeping pills, find another doctor.

if you have trouble falling asleep at night count your breaths: in (one), out (two), in (one), out (two), etc.. don't try to quiet the thoughts you are having just keep counting. soon you will be waking up. this is a natural way to allow your brain to turn itself off and for the sleep cycle to begin. with a little practice you fall asleep within minutes and not during class the next day.IMO 6-61/2 hours of sleep is not enough for a young man/woman. Sleep docs will also tell you to have a routine, e.g. time when you go to bed, avoiding caffeine and alcohol for 3-4 hours before bedtime, etc. they call this good "sleep hygiene".

you may also want to consider having a sleep study done. I was diagnosed with sleep apnea about a year ago at 27 yrs. old. I was slightly overweight, but the doctors says that weight isn't always a factor(more about anatomy). I was experiencing the same symtoms you are as well as a wife complaining of loud snoring and gasping for breath in my sleep. If you can't get a roomate to listen for snoring etc. try setting up a recording device so you can listen to yourself. If you here yourself stop snoring/breathing for more than about 10 seconds and then gasp for air you should look into a sleep specialist.

u need to visit a sleep lab

srsly

in the meantime set up a web cam and let us laff at you sleeping

two things helped me quite a bit:

1. learning to relax through breathing.
2. sleep CD

you may also want to consider having a sleep study done. I was diagnosed with sleep apnea about a year ago at 27 yrs. old. I was slightly overweight, but the doctors says that weight isn't always a factor(more about anatomy). I was experiencing the same symtoms you are as well as a wife complaining of loud snoring and gasping for breath in my sleep. If you can't get a roomate to listen for snoring etc. try setting up a recording device so you can listen to yourself. If you here yourself stop snoring/breathing for more than about 10 seconds and then gasp for air you should look into a sleep specialist.

Yeah, you should do this. I'm a different person after being diagnosed.

Yeah, you should do this. I'm a different person after being diagnosed.

hey Ka_Jun & md250r: I don't sleep well, too. I'm just curious, what kind of treatment would a sleep therapist suggest? I'm curious to know if the therapy is chemical, dietary, psychological...a combination? did insurance pay for it?

Im also curious as to the answer of slim's question. I just got back from college and am on winter break, and the last couple of days I completely knocked out at night and woke up early so Im not sure whats up, but I am still going to go see one of the doctors over here [was seeing the college doctor before] and try to get a sleep lab thing going.

In terms of my roommates makin it up, I don't think they are, because twice towards the end of the semester I was half asleep and noticed myself get up off of bed (using my two arms just to prop up my upper body I think) and started yelling about some crazy crud. I know I wasn't dreaming because I woke shortly after because my roommate was askin if I was ok.

I think I will get a diagnosis done. Thanks again, but also just like slim asked what do they do/prescribe, and its a one overnight sort of thing I am guessing?

Oh and Id do the webcam thing but no webcam; I really don't care if people laugh at me :P should see me on the trails with my disc brakes squealing like an animal or something.

For my situation my tonsils are large enough that it causes a blockage in my airway after I fall asleep and the muscles in my throat relax. The doctor perscribed a CPAP machine that forces air into your throat via a mask (try googling Sleep apnea treatments). These machines are cumbersome and difficult to get used to, but are 100% effective in treating these conditions if used properly. Other options were surgical, but they have a sketchy success rate and the possibilty of complications. I have tried the machine unsucessfully and tried exercising and losing weight to help. So far I have lost about 40lbs and I feel much better rested in the mornings. Of course you have to have a sleep study done in order to find out if and what condition you may have. Insurance did pay for the sleep study minus the normal co-pay and also paid for the cpap machine. Please do some research. There is a forum called apneasupport.org that has multitudes of info about all sorts of sleep disorders and treatments. There are also a lot of friendly people on there that share thier stories of how they suffered and overcame their conditions. I kind of owe this condition to leading me here, as when I decided to start getting healthier I broke out the bike and started pedaling. I can't stress enough to go to a doctor and gt checked out, it can mean the difference between a great, fullfilling life and a dismal existence in which all you want to do is withdraw and sleep.

..... generally no lunch or like a nutty bar or at most.

I think I figured out why you're falling a sleep right after lunch. I bet, if you eat a decent lunch, then you'll be better off at mid day.

I personally think you ride enough to affect your quality of sleep, but there are other factors besides exercise that go into that. When I started eating really healthy and running/biking I slept like a baby. I can absolutely tell a difference in my sleeping habits when I don't do something I'm used to.

If I were you, i would of course keep up the biking...maybe go harder some days, not necessarily longer distances but just spring and pump hard. Make sure you're out of breath, basically. Also, eat well.

I wasn't sure if biking coudl possibly mess up my sleeping habits.

I'm having trouble waking up in the morning (about 6:30 am.) and feeling fresh and staying awake throughout the day. (I usually crash midway through classes at around 11:45am or so)

I bike 10 miles (a little bit more) to school and back. classes start at 8 and end at 4 I have 1-1hour break and thats from 10 30 - 1130 where at I'm not usually tired, but upon getting to the next class, I pretty much just fall dead asleep for 15-30 minutes.

I was wondering what I could do to fix this? Im sure its not biking, but just thought Id throw it out there.

Additionally I was looking into this 90- min sleep cycle thing where I would sleep for 3-4 cycles but no more then 90*4=6 hours or 90*3 = 4.5 hours and just wake up...

I know this is a biking forum but im looking for any help besides the usual go see a doctor, because I did and they wnat to prescibe me sleeping pills...any ideas?

When it comes to sleep, there are a lot of factors that need to be considered. How much do you sleep? What's your diet like? How hard are you going in those 10 miles? What are you doing in your classes? Do you like them? Are you stressed?

I think that the biggest factor in tackling sleeping issues is getting the right amount of sleep as consistently as possible. With school and/or work, this can be tough. Eight hours is recommended, but you may need more or less to feel "fresh." Oversleeping can cause grogginess (or at least with me and several others that I know, it does), so try to avoid that.

An old psychologist that I visited recommended looking into creating a "sleeping routine" to help depress stress levels, which can really affect how restful your sleep is. Seeking better ways to make your sleep "restful" can really impact how well you sleep and may even decrease the number of hours needed. Sometimes, I feel totally fresh after five hours of good, quality sleep, but feel completely drained after seven or eight hours. Lots of things can affect that; what I did the night before, the weather, how I'm feeling, etc.

Do you snore? If you snore pretty heavily, that might indicate that you have a breathing issue while sleeping. Talking to your doctor about that can help.

Another thing to consider is diet. Eating a lot of carbohydrates in one sitting (especally simple) can make you feel very lethargic afterwards. Caffeiene can also act as a depressant at large quantities. There are people around here that can help improve diet specific to fixing sleep, though I've found that having a balanced diet usually takes care of that feeling.

If you're really serious about looking into it, try finding a sleep center nearby you. From what I've heard, they make you sleep at one of their centers, and they fully analyze your sleeping patterns and give you feedback when you wake up. I'm considering trying it, though my sleeping issues are not as severe as they were before.

Good luck!

I try to get at least 6, usually I do. (sleep by midnight up by 6 :30) monday and wednesday nights I get a bit more sleep around 7 -8 generally (unless its towards presentation time for prelim or have a test the next day) since I don't have class till 10 30 and usually get out of the house around 9:40 or so. (although my classes start at 8, I like to give my self an hour to get there in case of a flat though it takes about 25 minutes, I don;t know if that changes anything though)

If it comes down to it, Ill take the sleeping pill subscription, but I want to exhaust my other options first. I don't know very well about diets, so I don't really know what to change in that. as far as the almonds thing goes, I usually have a packet of peanuts, but it doesnt help at all really, I don't know why.

thanks for all the help so far guys

BTW, do you eat breakfast? Breakfast is super important, since it provides many of the nutrients needed to get a good jumpstart on your day, as well as control hunger and cravings. It also helps from conking out in the afternoon, though balanced diets all throughout are the best solution.

Personally, I think that sleeping pills are a last-resort solution, since they can mess with other things and produce not-so-desirable side effects. Plus, I think that a good portion of people that take them are really running away from the real problems causing sleep issues.

Good luck!

More sleep, better diet. I had essentially the same problem and that solved it.

Regarding the snoring issue I too am "blesssed" with this habit. (family tradition)

At some point I decided that since I didn't want to have the "missus" move to another bed, ;) I better do something. I tried the homeopathic "snore stop" or whatever it was called from Walmart. It worked but only as long as I took it.

Then at some point I did an experiment where I laid down and relaxed my mouth as if I were asleep and breathed till I got the "music thing happnin":lol:
Then I moved my head back and at some point the breathing got easier. So then I moved my head back as far as comfortable and arranged the pillow to hold it there. Voila, no more snore. I felt much better in the AM.

Then I stopped eating before bed. That made a huge difference. I didn't wake up with "jungle mouth" and felt much better. Some say that eating protein (other than milk) close to bedtime causes nightmares.

Good sleep and balanced diet can get you over your problem and along with this you should also try and get some time for workout like cardio 3-4 times a week.
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