Utility Cycling - A trailer/mod for my courier business

Hi guys. I've been reading everything I can find in this section, and looking at all the pictures of trailers and bike mods - plus on many other websites. So I have lots of ideas, but I wanted some opinions about my own situation. I am a bicycle courier, working independantly in my city. Mine is the only bike courier company in the area. I currently just have my Dawes Galaxy and paniers, but I wanted to be able to offer transport of larger consignments.

Many bike courier companies that can do that have purpose-built freight bikes, for example www.outspokendelivery.co.uk and www.yjdelivery.co.uk. I can not afford anything like that, so it's out of the question.
This company, http://www.thebikesthebusiness.co.uk/courier.html, appears to use trailers, an xtracycle-type setup and purpose-built freight bikes (click through to the other pages for pics).

I am not living at "home" right now and so don't have my full tool + junk resources. I do, however, have a spare mountain bike, two other spare 26" wheels (with very chunky tyres), quite a bit of wood from shelves and other things, and some interesting metal frames. Those are the makings of a trailer, I reckon, and so I want to have a go at building one. The wheels are very large for a trailer, I realise, so I might keep an eye out for some smaller ones.

I will post some plans and photos when I get something worked out, but for now I wanted to look at it from the perspective of me as a bicycle courier. What do you think to using a trailer? Would something like an extracycle be better perhaps?
My city has some awful traffic on roads I can't easily avoid, and so I want a very narrow trailer (about handle-bar width. I think I'd rather make a trailer than cut up the mountain bike, because my Galaxy doesn't have very low gears, whereas the mountain bike does. As such, I could roadify the mountain bike a bit, and use that as my trailer-puller, and keep the Dawes for jobs when the trailer is not required.

I'm not sure what, if anything, I just asked - but feel free to give your opinions at this stage. I will try to get some photos of the material I have available, and you can say what you see.

Thanks a lot

--Joe

Check out the trailer sticky......at the top of this forum

maybe something like the bob yak trailer would be a design idea http://www.ababyoutlets.com/images/bob_yak.jpg

I am thinking a longtail bike is easyer to ride in such conditions. A trailer is of course possible, but much more difficult to goin and out of traffic, and must be heavyer. If you use the 26" tyres for a trailer try to make it so that the load is carryed lower than the axels of the trailer wheels.

im with badmother, a longtail sounds like the perfect solution to me. If you dont have the funds for one there are some homebrew setups on here that look somewhat promising.

Hmm. I suppose I could try to get a third bike, or a frame at least, and then cut the back end off and put that on the mountain bike I mentioned? Just to check, by "longtail" you mean like an Xtracycle, yea?

The only trouble is that it's more technically complex, it seems, especially with getting the derailleur "relay" set up right? Also, from the pictures I've seen, extended bikes don't really offer a huge amount of extra space - it's basically just like having two panier racks or something.

I drew up some plans for a trailer based on parts of a shelf that I have. The pictures are very large so when you open them, make sure they aren't reduced to fit on the screen:

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/5456/27588157kf9.th.jpg (http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/5456/27588157kf9.jpg)
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9881/77408654vn0.th.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9881/77408654vn0.jpg)

That's the basic idea, though it doesn't show extra braces and fixings and all that.

Hmm. I suppose I could try to get a third bike, or a frame at least, and then cut the back end off and put that on the mountain bike I mentioned? Just to check, by "longtail" you mean like an Xtracycle, yea?

The only trouble is that it's more technically complex, it seems, especially with getting the derailleur "relay" set up right? Also, from the pictures I've seen, extended bikes don't really offer a huge amount of extra space - it's basically just like having two panier racks or something.


By longtail I mean Etracycle or similar homebuilt, Big dummy..

I do not agree on that you just have one extra rack. You also have the platform (wideloaders) and whatewer setup you decide on. 1+1 (racks in ths case) is`nt always 2, sometimes it is more.

one big bag with a platform under is much more space than two normal panniers on each side.

I`we seen pictures of somebody putting one big long narrow plasticcontainer on each side (something like the rubbermaid) and put one full size dog in each of them, riding to the park like that.

Take some time and look at pix of real Xtra`s and how peopel use them.

For a homemade one try to find a rear triangle from a cheap "full suspension MTB". They`we got a strong rear triangle that is easy to remove. If it has a steel flatbar also you can use that from the front top of the triangle to behind the BB on the bike (or up to the seatstay/ seattube area like on the BIG Dummy).

Problem is not gearing but chainline, to make sure the chain is not rubbing where the bike and the rear triangle is joined together.

From just a fast look at it your trailer is looking good. I know you said you might get smaller wheels. The box you show on it now is so big you are going to need this size.

Thanks for the reply. The drawing isn't really to scale or anything - but yea I could make a reasonably big box out of it. if I made a longtail I'd need to get a new roadbike as well, as the body, because I don't want to dismantle my Dawes, or I'd have no bike left for non-work use. I will think about where I might find abandoned bikes.

It seems to me that you get into a whole set of compromises here. If you build a trailer that can haul "anything", then it's heavy and wide, which makes it awkward to carry small stuff.

I'm currently building a camping trailer which promises to be much narrower. The catch is, it's fairly useless as a general-purpose trailer. But this is where I'm at, so far. The tubs are "Action Packers" made by Rubbermaid, the 8 gallon size, available here in the US. I already had one and just bought the other. I haven't gotten to a hitch yet.
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z172/stephenhazelton/MiscBikePhotos/Trailer1.jpg
http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z172/stephenhazelton/MiscBikePhotos/Trailer2.jpg
My first observation is that a sturdy trailer made out of wood, bicycle wheels, etc., is going to be Heavy. Ideally, hunt you up some aluminum rims, and use front hubs on both wheels (I used steel wheels off an old kid's bike, and one has the coaster brake still on it.)

Here in the US, industrial cargo tricycles are available new for $800-$1500 or so. But what I find is that used ones have very little demand and can go for as low as $100. I don't know if anything like that would ever show up where you're at, but keep your eyes open on the used market, on Craigslist or whatever. Similarly, good cargo trailers are expensive, but these kid-trailers sometimes show up pretty cheap, used.

What size of things are you planning to carry? Unless you have a lot of different trailers available, you will need to have some limitations. An Xtracycle like setup sounds just right for your expansion plans. Right now you are only carrying small items and the Xtra will allow a lot larger, heavier items. If it turns out your customers have even larger needs, you can add a trailer behind the Xtra equipped bike. I carry construction equipment on my Xtra, so I am sure it would be a great next step. A Bob trailer wouldn't be as good in traffic and it doesn't really carry strange shapes as well as the Xtra (I also have a couple of Bob trailers). I only use the bob for camping or groceries. When my loads are really big, the 8 foot long Bikes At Work trailer is used. Really big, I have to break down and use my small pickup and trailer.

Thanks guys. StephenH - that looks pretty nice. Post some pics of it in action when it's all done, and let us know how it works out.


What size of things are you planning to carry? Unless you have a lot of different trailers available, you will need to have some limitations. An Xtracycle like setup sounds just right for your expansion plans. Right now you are only carrying small items and the Xtra will allow a lot larger, heavier items. If it turns out your customers have even larger needs, you can add a trailer behind the Xtra equipped bike. I carry construction equipment on my Xtra, so I am sure it would be a great next step. A Bob trailer wouldn't be as good in traffic and it doesn't really carry strange shapes as well as the Xtra (I also have a couple of Bob trailers). I only use the bob for camping or groceries. When my loads are really big, the 8 foot long Bikes At Work trailer is used. Really big, I have to break down and use my small pickup and trailer.
I don't know really what I'd carry on it, but I was going to base the dimensions around those of the A4 paper size, since many archive boxes and things like that are of that size. I don't really know what I'd be asked to carry, if anything, until I can offer it. The courier companies with cargo bikes say they transport all kinds of things, absolutely anything you could think of really. I think that if you have the ability to carry something, someone might ask you to do so.

I'll head towards a longtail idea then, and leave the trailer alone for a while.

--Joe

It looks like you consider bicycle couriering something different than we do here in North America. Here they pretty much limit what they carry to what will fit in a courier bag. The idea being that they can move through heavy traffic quicker than say a cab, lock the bike up and run into the building, maybe to the tenth floor, and deliver it. The riders are insane, time is money, the quicker they are the more deliveries they can make.

We would most likely call that a delivery service, and I do not see where a cargo bike or trailer would be economically viable unless you worked in an area where folks would be willing to pay extra for what they see as evironmental reasons. However, from the links you included, it does seem to work where you are.

If you go to the Xtracycle site, you can see if anyone in your area is willing to let you try one out. There are lots of them on the West Coast of the U.S. but it thins out across the world.

It looks like you consider bicycle couriering something different than we do here in North America. Here they pretty much limit what they carry to what will fit in a courier bag. The idea being that they can move through heavy traffic quicker than say a cab, lock the bike up and run into the building, maybe to the tenth floor, and deliver it. The riders are insane, time is money, the quicker they are the more deliveries they can make.

We would most likely call that a delivery service, and I do not see where a cargo bike or trailer would be economically viable unless you worked in an area where folks would be willing to pay extra for what they see as evironmental reasons. However, from the links you included, it does seem to work where you are.

Yea, there's kind of two different sides to it. Most bike couriers in London are of the first kind you mentioned, on their track bikes with a messenger bag and jeans over lycra. However, outside of London larger loads seem to be popular.
I don't think customers would be paying more - it's only £3 or £4 usually for even a large delivery, and it would cost a lot more than that in a van.

The reason I now think an xtracycle solution would be right is because, unloaded, it wouldn't really be any slower or more awkward than my normal bike (or so the adverts would have you believe). As such, if I end up mostly just carrying small parcels and mail, it won't really matter. But if I need to carry something big, I could.

Go on roc_ten splash out and get one of these :D

http://www.cyclesmaximus.com/cargotrike.htm

Xmas is just around the corner, plenty of prezzies to deliver? ooops sorry that jobs already taken :D

Tom

Go on roc_ten splash out and get one of these :D

http://www.cyclesmaximus.com/cargotrike.htm

Xmas is just around the corner, plenty of prezzies to deliver? ooops sorry that jobs already taken :D

Tom

heh, those pics on the front page are from a company where I used to live, in york: http://www.green-link.co.uk/

they have an operation in Luton as well, hence that name on the trike in the right-hand pic on your link.

At the time, I didn't know they were a courier/delivery company, but I used to see them riding around sometimes.

----------------

Yesterday I was kindly given two bike frames. The first is an anonymous road-bike frame, of unknown dimensions but a crude comparison tells me it's pretty much the same size as my Dawes, which would be fine.
It has no useful wheels on it, and the bottom-bracked is rusted solid. The handlebars have been cut off half way along, strangely, giving little bull horns. The frame and forks seem sound, though, and so if I can get it cleaned up I will strip the paint off, spray it my company's colour, and use that as the body of the bike.

The second one I got seems to have been attacked by the same person who modified the handlebars on the other bike. Here, the whole seat tube has been removed, just the seat tube. As such, I unfortunately can't use that frame as the back-end of the xtracycle. I did get the brakes off it, though, and they're in pretty good condition and spring nicely, so that's good.

I decided also that I could manage just fine with a single cog at the back, i.e. no rear derailleur and no long cables, and then 3 chainrings at the front. My Dawes has 5 and 2 = 10 speeds, and the two chainrings are both quite large, there's no "small" one like on any mountain bike. So by my testing, I reckon that I could do with what is a "medium" gear at the back, and three chainrings, two of which could be the sizes I have now, plus one smaller one. At first I'd put a 5- or 6-speed block on the back, and manually move the chain around sometimes to test different gears, and then later I could get a single-speed freewheel when I settle on a size.

I'll use this thread for updates on what happens

--Joe

You will need a derailer or a chain tensioner to take up the slack in the chain when you move it to different gears. I would just put on a regular system on it for utility work. Is there some reason you want to have a single speed? It can't be weight savings. Go with the normal setup and then decide on which gear works for that bike, then change it to a single speed. You will know what gearing works.

You will need a derailer or a chain tensioner to take up the slack in the chain when you move it to different gears. I would just put on a regular system on it for utility work. Is there some reason you want to have a single speed? It can't be weight savings. Go with the normal setup and then decide on which gear works for that bike, then change it to a single speed. You will know what gearing works.

I wanted single speed (at the back) because it would avoid having to get a working derailleur set up, which would mean longer cables, new lengths of cable housing, and another thing to go wrong or at least need adjustments.
I hadn't thought about chain tension, so I suppose I'll have to have a derailleur on it after all (rather than find a chain tensioner). It can just be an inactive one, though, stuck in one position but just keeping the chain tension right and allowing changing on the chainrings.

Is this set up ever used? One sprocket at the back and multiple at the front?

Gosh, I posted a "wanted" ad on my local freecycle group, asking for junk bike parts or sightings of them, and I've had about 10 replies, people telling me where they've seen bikes abandoned. Tomorrow I'll go round and collect them I suppose!

Here's a bike I got today. The wheel is damaged and can't be used. The forks and chainstays are bent but not buckled or anything. The rear derailleur is twisted, the bottom bracket seems alright (but it's of a type I'm not familiar with, actually), and the brakes are ok. the best bit is the handlebars, actually.
I don't know what size it is but the main three tubes each measured about an inch less than on my Dawes (the back wheel of which is in the shot)

http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/7863/dscf4927ts7.jpg

In addition, I found what I really needed - a frame of a dual-suspension mountain bike. So now I have that useful rear triangle to use for the back of the xtracycle. In addition I have the frame pictured above, a mongoose mountain bike, and a large empty road bike frame. I will have to think about which would be best for the body of the bike. I'll post pics of them all tomorrow if I can.
The mongoose is in good condition generally, except that all three chain rings are severely damaged, and the sprockets at the back don't look very sharp, either. The wheels are ok but look and feel very cheap and weak. It's a much smaller frame than the road bikes, though, and so perhaps would be better suited for pulling stuff?