Classic & Vintage - Another Unknown????

I posted this a while ago (don't remember where) but never really got to work on it since I've been busy with other projects. I finally got a Victory RD to replace the cheap one it has now. :rolleyes: I thought since I was going to try to get a matching RD for the Crankset I might as well find out what it is. So what is guys? I hate not knowing what it is :notamused:. It rides beautifully and it fits like a glove.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3170/2866363626_b4c9276b95_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3094/2865563763_420cc8f138.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3079/2865557725_571febe020.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3125/2866379724_843c416506.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3163/2865546895_8c441c5c5b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/3062555080_8aece9efcd.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3138/3062556938_0c3116e988.jpg

You can ship that "cheap one" that was on it along with the Rossin... :p

-Kurt

You can ship that "cheap one" that was on it along with the Rossin... :p

-Kurt
NO buddy. That RD is going on the Rauler. It's getting a special touch to it; Drillium.;) SOOOOOOOOOO what's up with my Aleyska?? ;)

Drillum, eh? Get a gander of the RD second on the left here:

http://www.jaysmarine.com/CampyDerailer_Display1.jpg

Does it make me officially evil?

The Alyeska is scheduled to get packed December 2nd - the day after University finals...

-Kurt

geez, a lighted showcase, Kurt?

Yep, used to be for 1:18 scale automobiles. Serves the components even better then the cars now, though I miss the days when that top shelf was nothing but Campag derailers from one end to the other. Now only the Zeus 2000 and a graphite-finish '88 Victory RD (from Gilberto, incidentally), sit there amongst other Campag parts. Looked far better when it was solely an RD lineup.

-Kurt

bikes are better for you than scale models (I used to sniff testors regularly, myself).

bikes are better for you than scale models (I used to sniff testors regularly, myself).

Forget it - I'm back into the model railroading scene again. Scratchbuilding, no less. Devcon's Plastic Welder makes Testors enamel paints pale in comparison.

-Kurt

Remember when Testors glue smelled pleasantly of citrus? That was a bad marketing decision...

Don't remind me of the blue-tubed "non-toxic" tubes. Still have half a dozen of them, and I found that their best use was in the capacity of melting plastic far more then intended, while simultaneously failing to bond the two surfaces to satisfaction.

-Kurt

Was the citrus stuff in blue tubes? I was in second grade at the time so I don't really recall. However, I do remember a P-51 model being melted away by my inept glue-handling hands.

Both tubes smelled, but the blue non-toxic stuff particularly stunk of oranges, while the orange tube smelled more of typical glue contents/solvents/etc.

Melted P-51? Citrus? Scale napalm.

-Kurt

I guess a melted f4 phantom would have been more apropos.

geez, a lighted showcase, Kurt?


Geesh
+1

. Nice kurt, love the drillium RD. who took the drill to it ?
:)
T

... and gr23932's bike still remains a mystery. Time to put the glue, models, and plastics away boys!

Nice kurt, love the drillium RD. who took the drill to it ?

Search me - I found it at the LBS like that. It isn't even a first-gen SR - it is a second-gen with a NR plate installed on it, and an NR pulley cage. I've since changed the pulley cage to a proper second-gen SR piece.

-Kurt

as far as the *bike* goes: it could be any of a dozen makes: what about the BB threading (Ital?) and the steerer tube (rifled)?

my gut says that it is italian. there is a small sticker back by the rear derailleur and one below the shifters on the downtube. What are these?

oh, and whatever it is, it is probably a good one. Number tabs don't tell you anything much about a junior's bike, but this is pretty clearly an adult frame, and is more than likely built out of good stuff.

I'd betcha it is a repaint (also a very good one), based on the generic stickers.

Serial number or stampings on the BB?

Lugs and fork crown look very similar to Raleigh Professional, but the rear brake bridge cooks that thought. That brake bridge is the key to IDing the frame IMO.

afraid the brake bridge is not anything distinctive: it's a standard Italian item used on many makes. Without something stamped, pierced or pantographed there's not much to go on, here.

afraid the brake bridge is not anything distinctive: it's a standard Italian item used on many makes. Without something stamped, pierced or pantographed there's not much to go on, here.

That bridge and lug combination is telling though. We can eliminate Cinelli, Colnago, Pogliaghi, and a few other Italian makes because none of them use that style of windowing. In fact, the only bicycle I found with those lugs on it is the Raleigh Professional/Team Professional - but the brake bridge is wrong for those.

Sorry for the lag, just got back from Germany. The Bb threading is British. There is no serial number on the BB nor any markings. I haven't removed the fork yet but I will tomorrow. The brake bridge looks a lot like the one on my Guerciotties, but it's no Guerciotti. All the decals are Campagnolo. I guess the previous owner wanted to make sure everyone knew what his bike had. He tried convincing me it was a Colnago but that was an easy NO. It was repainted by his kid's 14 year old friend as a practice test run before painting his caferacer. The kid really did a good job. There are varies paintchips on it now from being leaned on walls and such. I'll report back tomorrow once I remove the Fork.

Based on info so far I'd guess it's Belgian or possibly Dutch.

Painted by a 14 year-old? Send that kid around here to earn some pocket money!!! Plenty of work for him in my shed if that's what a damaged practice paint job looks like!

I suppose HE doesn't remember what it looked like before repaint?

Kurt, do I understand correctly, that it's possible to fit a Nuovo Record sideplate to a Super Record rear derailleur? I've got a good spare SR with a scratched up sideplate and am currently looking for a NR in good condition/cheap price for a build. I'm pretty sure one of my friends may still have a broken NR with clean sideplate I could swap a pair of bars for, so if this can be done, problem solved! If it can be done, is it difficult and what's needed? New pivot pins, etc? Would appreciate any advice.

Stuart

Sideplate...do you mean the parallelogram plate, or the pulley cage?

If the pulley cage:

The NR cage plates (and for that matter, Rally), though different in geometry from second-gen SR, are interchangeable. Nothing except the cage plates need to be replaced - the threaded stud on the derailer that they fit on is identical throughout, and the spring location is the same as well.

One thing - your SR's parallelogram will swing farther forward then an NR if it is a second-gen. Unless it is a first-gen SR, in which case, the cages will be of identical geometry.

If the outer (or inner) parallelogram plate:

I know that they are replaceable, but I have never done so myself. I believe the SR-style expandable pins can be re-used, but the NR squash-fit are a different story. I don't know any more then this, sorry.

-Kurt

Sideplate...do you mean the parallelogram plate, or the pulley cage?

If the pulley cage:

The NR cage plates (and for that matter, Rally), though different in geometry from second-gen SR, are interchangeable. Nothing except the cage plates need to be replaced - the threaded stud on the derailer that they fit on is identical throughout, and the spring location is the same as well.

One thing - your SR's parallelogram will swing farther forward then an NR if it is a second-gen. Unless it is a first-gen SR, in which case, the cages will be of identical geometry.

If the outer (or inner) parallelogram plate:

I know that they are replaceable, but I have never done so myself. I believe the SR-style expandable pins can be re-used, but the NR squash-fit are a different story. I don't know any more then this, sorry.

-Kurt

Thanks for the instant reply Kurt! Sorry, I should habe been clear - just woken up the day after Night shift! I was talking about the parallelogram plate, didn't think about the swing, so that's helpful. I'll see if I can collect the bits and line them up by eye. Great collection of derailleurs by the way!

Stuart

The saddle and groupset are all very similar to what is on my friend's old CIOCC,

which he leaves outside, unlocked, to rust.

Could it be an incognito CIOCC?

I really like the seatpost, btw. What make/model is it?

Could it be an incognito CIOCC?

I really like the seatpost, btw. What make/model is it?

I was thinking along the same lines...
Here in my garage i have a frame that is amazingly similar to yours.
It's a Concorde Astore which i bought here in belgium.
It's been stripped from part for repainting and i seem to have misplaced the pictures.
What i do have are some pictures from the seller of the bike.
The lugs and braze-ons are very similar to yours, including the internal cable routing and number hanger.
Does yours have campy dropouts?
If you want i can take some pictures of my frame and take some tube-measurements.

I think some of the old concordes where in fact built by Ciöcc and brought to The Benelux, painted and sold here as Concorde.

Sorry for my english, it's not my native language.

Now for some old pics: (if they are too big just let me know)

http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/DSC01125.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/DSC01126.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/DSC01124.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/DSC01123.jpg

The seatpost looks Campagnolo Chorus from 1990's?

Those windows in the lugs are almost heart shaped, but alas, no.

I was thinking along the same lines...
Here in my garage i have a frame that is amazingly similar to yours.
It's a Concorde Astore which i bought here in belgium.
It's been stripped from part for repainting and i seem to have misplaced the pictures.
What i do have are some pictures from the seller of the bike.
The lugs and braze-ons are very similar to yours, including the internal cable routing and number hanger.
Does yours have campy dropouts?
If you want i can take some pictures of my frame and take some tube-measurements.

I think some of the old concordes where in fact built by Ciöcc and brought to The Benelux, painted and sold here as Concorde.

Sorry for my english, it's not my native language.

Now for some old pics: (if they are too big just let me know)


If you could please post some pics of the lugs, seatcluster, BB that would be great. Does your bike have Italian or British threaded BB? I didn't have time to take the fork out today to check the steerer for any stampings but tomorrow for sure I will. This bike does have campy dropouts. I too have a Concorde but it has different lug cut outs and brake bridge. Where is Belgium are you at?

the Concorde looks pretty close, but it seems to my eye that the OP's bike has "peaks" in the center of the front head lugs (both top &bottom) and the seat stay caps are different (without seeing your Concorde's I just know what they should look like and OPs look more "Benelux" to me) plus the Concorde almost definitely would have Italian BB threading.

I'll try and take some pictures of the lugs and the rest of the bike.
I seem to have misplaced the ones i had taken already a few months ago.
The frame looks very much the same but with some differences.
Like the seatstay caps and the fact that concordes have italian BB Threading.
But it's the closest thing i can think of right now.

I'll upload the pictures tomorrow.
And to answer your question i live in Belgium near Leuven.

I Finally got round to taking some pictures of my similar looking frame.
Here they come:

I think the bike is a mid' 1980's Concorde Astore.

http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde8.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde7.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde6.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde5.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde3.jpg
http://users.telenet.be/decharel/Bikes/Concorde/Concorde2.jpg

I Finally got round to taking some pictures of my similar looking frame.
Here they come:

I think the bike is a mid' 1980's Concorde Astore.

[
Thanks for posting those pics. Though they do look similar, the cut outs on your bike are more heart-like than mine which are more or less triangle shaped. Hopefully I'll find out some say though I plan on keeping it since it fits me very well and I like the way it rides.