Advocacy & Safety - Your opinon on listening to music while riding.

I would like your opinion on listening to music while riding. Please base your opinion on a safety stand point. When I say listening to music I do not mean with ear buds or headphones. I am talking about external speakers. There are differant set ups available, from something like the Cycle Sound to home built units.

This is for all types of riding on roadways. Whether it is in an urban or country side setting.

What do you think, from a safety stand point? Good idea, or not? Do you think it is safer to not listen to music with external speakers, or does it make a differance? Do you think it is any differant from listening to music in a motor vehicle?

I am asking because I am considering listening to music when I ride, but want to get some opinions on it first.

Thanks.

I was thinking about this last night as I bicycled in the dark on one of the busiest streets in out city.

I know that, in fact, riding with headphones on impairs the rider's hearing and is thus not as safe as riding without them.

However, last night, I found myself turning the music up just so I could have the courage to be mixed with that traffic. Without the music, I would have been white-knuckled and couldn't have done it. Ironically, you could say that the music provided me enough ignorance of the environment to allow me to bicycle in that crazy traffic.

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg194/unregistered_coward/admiralackbar2jl1.jpg?t=1228052006

I think of it as shutting one of your senses off to the surrounding. A great comparision would be blinders that only allowed you to see forward.

I think you should avail yourself of the search tool. There's about a gazillion threads on the subject. The electrons are still drying in some of them.

Happy reading. (http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?do=process)

Not helpful to safety. I won't even play music in a car. Have heard things dangerous many times.

Auto designers are steadily increasing the number of distractions in vehicles. One of the nice things about bicycles is the lack of distraction.

I don't even ride with one of those little computers. I just pay attention.

Whether it's safe or not depends on rider skills like how good one is with their eyes, if they use a mirror and the particular riding situation like the type of road and amount of traffic.

I listen to music every ride out and anybody that attempts to tell me I'm taking a risk doesn't have a clue. I might add I don't need to hear what I can see.

I think you should avail yourself of the search tool. There's about a gazillion threads on the subject. The electrons are still drying in some of them.

Happy reading. (http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?do=process)

but it's so much fun to rehash the same old rants. ;)

It depends on the music. If I were listening to rap or hip hop, I'd actually be hoping for a crash.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=411063&highlight=ipod

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=444721&highlight=ipod

Enjoy.

-Kurt

I need to pay FULL attention while in traffic. When I listen to music, I really listen to it....I gotta choose one or the other. I mean, it's possible for me, but I can see how it can be a distraction. I believe in focusing on my rides 100% as a good way to fully enjoy them.

When I'm on some trail where there is no traffic, I like to pull out some Floyd.

Almost always listen to music or audiobooks while cycling. No impact on safety, and it makes riding much more enjoyable regardless if I'm commuting, shopping, or riding for exercise. Often chew gum and eat mints as well to further enjoy my ride. Good stuff. I recommend it.

It depends on the music. If I were listening to rap or hip hop, I'd actually be hoping for a crash.

winning post! :thumb:

I wouldn't want external speakers on my bike. I would want to go all out, including a subwoofer and custom lighting, all so I could stop and.......dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyAY4eMQCU).

I wouldn't want external speakers on my bike. I would want to go all out, including a subwoofer and custom lighting, all so I could stop and.......dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyAY4eMQCU).

:lol:

I'm not sure who has more time on their hands, those guys, or you to find that thing! Very funny.

btw, I know we all have too much time on our hands to hang around here though, right?

If you're going to use external speakers and subject everyone within earshot to listen to your music, then you should only play Wagner - with the volume turned up full blast.

I wouldn't want external speakers on my bike. I would want to go all out, including a subwoofer and custom lighting, all so I could stop and.......dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyAY4eMQCU).

lmao! Love it.

The day I can't ride with music will be the day I stop riding.

Leave the safety component out of the argument for a minute.....what about courtesy? I'm not even talking about being bothered by the external noise.....what about on a bike trail? I've come across numerous situations with people listening to music and have no clue what's behind them. Often times they are not riding (or walking, jogging, roller blading, etc.) far enough to one side to pass safely. I have a bell I usually use from a certain distance to alert and it does the trick most times. But with music playing people cannot hear it. The last time this presented itself I had to get right up behind someone and yell as loud as I could. Scared the crap out of them! What do others do in this situation?

I slow down as I approach and prepare to come to a full stop while saying "excuse me". Then they move, I say thanks, and pedal on.

Speaking just for myself, I

do not listen to music while cycling.
have not problems with cyclists who choose to wear headphones.
dislike being around those who cycle with external speakers.

I consider wearing headphones something of a safety compromise, but it's also true that any speed beyond about six miles-per-hour also would qualify in most settings.

I wouldn't want external speakers on my bike. I would want to go all out, including a subwoofer and custom lighting, all so I could stop and.......dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yyAY4eMQCU).

I can dance almost as well as those guys...but only if I have been drinking. :o


As to the OP, I occasionally see the odd cyclist or two with external speakers. While they may be safer than earbuds, they are quite irritating, and tend to produce the same effect as earbuds when I try to pass them.

I liken them to those folks who blast music in their cars with all their windows turned down, attempting to put their music into all the other cars on the road, because their music is better than anyone else's. I understand that this is not your intention, but that is how it comes off.

Like earbuds, it is your call as to whether you do the external speaker thing or not. I would recommend against it. But I would just keep in mind that you will have to be extra-vigilant when listening.

(At least you are concerned about it - the people I see every day walking/jogging/cycling listening to music couldn't seem to care less about the safety or courtesy for themselves or others, judging by their behavior.)

Rock On!

Without music and at cruising speeds, all I hear is wind. I've tried it both ways and I prefer the sound of my music to the rush of wind and those stupid ricer mufflers.

I should explain that I use 3 mirrors, as I ride a recumbent. a handle bar mirror on each side and a helmet mirror. I typically ride solo, this is what I usually prefer, thoug sometimes i partake in a club ride. I have a set up right now that I could easily use on my bike. It is an MP3 player connected to a pair of external "desk top" speakers with their own power supply, 4 AA batteries, operated by a power switch and volume control. I have never used it on the bike. I think I will when I start riding next year, just to see how I like it.

I feel the speakers would be dangerous, as a lot of people would try to smash them, or throw rocks at you for playing them. The punks in the little cars with the big speakers are bad enough. If you can't live without what you call music, get the ear buds and spare the rest of us.

I feel the speakers would be dangerous, as a lot of people would try to smash them, or throw rocks at you for playing them. The punks in the little cars with the big speakers are bad enough. If you can't live without what you call music, get the ear buds and spare the rest of us.

The speakers I use would not be able to be seen by anyone, unless they really looked close. I use a day bag that fits over the seat frame, it has a mesh pocket on each side the speakers fit just perfectly into. They are not that easy to see unless you really look for them. I already tested this out since we have been discussing this. I put the MP3 player in the bag and the speakers in the pockets, put the bag on the seat frame and sat on the bike. I am easily able to reach back and hit the power switch and even adjust the volume if I need to. Of course I have yet to try this while riding, so far I have only tested this in a controlled environment, inside my house with the bike in a trainer frame I use as a work stand when I have to do maintenance on the bike.

Folks listening to music don't notice me as easily. Pretty clear what's happening.

So unless those who indicate "no problem" above are constantly checking their mirrors and can see in them really well, then their safety is compromised.

This is when I'm cycling and approaching. I suspect I'm not as visible or as loud as a car. I have to call out twice more often when approaching someone with ear things in.

Running an additional risk is OK. Denying that there's an additional risk is OK, too. Trying to convince others isn't.

Thought experiment: Full hearing, no wind noise, obviously the best for hearing things happening. No hearing at all is the opposite. In a cycling context, the safest is to hear, the least safe to have no hearing. Anything that slides one towards being less able to hear environmental noises hurts safety. The amount it hurts safety remains in question and is likely quite individual. Different people hear differently, use their hearing differently, and have different physical limitations on hearing.

My hearing isn't that great. My listening is very very good. I would on musical instruments and distinguish very fine gradations of sound and peel out very faint signals all the time. I can hear things around me when I'm cycling quite well, but I have to work at it. Add a little noise, I probably can't hear anything well. I can really tell this in my car - I go a little blind when a radio is on.

frequently checking their mirrors and can see in them really well



That's a no brainer wouldn't you say?

Isn't that what you are always supposed to do when sharing the road no matter what you are driving? 360 degree awareness all the time? That's what I strive for even when in an auto.

If you have to listen while riding, open-design headphones are a good way to go. They're a lot easier to deal with than amplified speakers, but let a lot of sound in... Grado (gradolabs.com) makes some really nice ones. Sennheiser's PX100 or some related version is also an open-design one. They're often referred to as poor man's speakers since they allow your music to blend in with environmental noise.

personally, i DON'T use hearing devices that alter awareness while v-bicycling.
there truly is a time to listen to devo, bach, coltraine, etc, and place.
not while riding!

If you are going to use external speakers, might as well use the best ....

I'm not certain if the OP is serious in this query or just baiting us for the pleasure of watching the debate. If you want to listen to music while riding, go right ahead. There is no law preventing you from same. I am annoyed by radios in parks whether carried by pedestrians or sitting as a table accessory to a pleasant picnic at the park . . . but, I defend the right of those listeners to pursue their own brand of pleasure. The effects of the audio assault towards me is always temporary. I would view (rather listen) to your music in the same vein.

As for safety, that which may distract one person's attention keeps another person alert. It's a personal thing. Do what works for you.

I doubt we'll find much data on how 'drunk' a person becomes from listening to music has he/she rides, and, if such data existed, I know it could never be balanced by counterpoint showing the number of non-listening fatalities that occurred absent other variables.

One of the newest 'stories du jour' is how someone's research shows that talking on a cell phone while driving is as bad or worse than driving with a BAC in excess of .20. It's ever so much dribble, IMO.

The best info you'll get on this topic is the practical knowledge you'll derive by trying your speakers on your own bike.

We'll look forward to your posts describing your experiences in detail.

Caruso

I would like your opinion on listening to music while riding. Please base your opinion on a safety stand point. When I say listening to music I do not mean with ear buds or headphones. I am talking about external speakers. There are differant set ups available, from something like the Cycle Sound to home built units.

This is for all types of riding on roadways. Whether it is in an urban or country side setting.

What do you think, from a safety stand point? Good idea, or not? Do you think it is safer to not listen to music with external speakers, or does it make a differance? Do you think it is any differant from listening to music in a motor vehicle?

I am asking because I am considering listening to music when I ride, but want to get some opinions on it first.

Thanks.

It is illegal, stupid, and dangerous!!!

It is illegal, stupid, and dangerous!!!

I'd like to know where it is illegal at. In my state, county and city it is not illegal, that I have already checked on. As far as dangerous, where is your proof? Show me statistics of this, please. Is there anything that shows accidents reulting in injuries and fatalities because a cyclist was listening to music on external speakers? Heck show me stats. on cyclists who use head phones, ear buds, etc.

Before you make a comment like this please cite something to back it up. Otherwise your statements will be called into question and you may very well be thought a fool.

External speakers? sure... as long as you could hear what's going on around you... the main difference between riding w/music and driving w/music is that on a car you have this thingies called rearview mirrors that let you know whats going on. They come for bikes too, I know, but...

Anyway, as long as you don't over do it...

http://thegoat.backcountry.com/blog/files/2007/11/bike-radio.jpg

I'd like to know where it is illegal at. In my state, county and city it is not illegal, that I have already checked on. As far as dangerous, where is your proof? Show me statistics of this, please. Is there anything that shows accidents reulting in injuries and fatalities because a cyclist was listening to music on external speakers? Heck show me stats. on cyclists who use head phones, ear buds, etc.

Before you make a comment like this please cite something to back it up. Otherwise your statements will be called into question and you may very well be thought a fool.

afaik here in Florida it is... *googles a little bit* here you go:

Florida Statute 316.304 states "A cyclist may not wear a headset, headphone or listening device, other than a hearing aid, while riding."

It is ...dangerous!!!Quoting from The Effects of In-Vehicle Music on General Driving Performance (http://www.chs.usyd.edu.au/conf04/submit/minipost/ew-leung.pdf)

...the presence of music did not detrimentally affect general driving.Note that driving and riding can both be defined as the direct operation of a road vehicle.

I know that, in fact, riding with headphones on impairs the rider's hearing and is thus not as safe as riding without them.

A few problems with this statement...

Hearing is almost useless for telling where cars are unless you're out in the country and there's only one car at a time... I'm in the city... there are cars everywhere and you really can't tell much by the noise.

And earbuds are just as likely to HELP my hearing as hurt it... they block some of the wind noise that would drown everything else out, anyway.

I find it rather amusing that it's against the law to ride a bicycle with headphones... but a deaf person is allowed to ride...

afaik here in Florida it is... *googles a little bit* here you go:

Florida Statute 316.304 states "A cyclist may not wear a headset, headphone or listening device, other than a hearing aid, while riding."

Quite amusing that they're REQUIRING car drivers to use a headset with cellphones in many areas, while the same thing on a bike is against the law, huh?

Whatever happened to having all the "rights, duties, and responsibilities of an operator of a motor vehicle"?

Talk about some stupid laws. ;)

Quoting from The Effects of In-Vehicle Music on General Driving Performance (http://www.chs.usyd.edu.au/conf04/submit/minipost/ew-leung.pdf)
Note that driving and riding can both be defined as the direct operation of a road vehicle.

I took a look at that study and I call bullshlt! :)

Driving closer to the center line because of music? Seriously? Beginners tend to drive closer to the center line just because they are beginners, sheesh!

It is illegal, stupid, and dangerous!!!

People who make judgements about others while being clueless of the particular situation are stupid and dangerous. ;)

and once again I want to repeat, a person does not need to hear what they can see, right?

Note that driving and riding can both be defined as the direct operation of a road vehicle.

Note that a dreamy ideologue can define/re-define anything, any which way he likes, to fit his agenda/dogma/beliefs.

afaik here in Florida it is... *googles a little bit* here you go:

Florida Statute 316.304 states "A cyclist may not wear a headset, headphone or listening device, other than a hearing aid, while riding."

The key word here is wear. I am not going to wear the MP3 player or the speakers in any way shape or form. It will be in my seat frame bag with the speakers in the side pockets. Did you miss the fact that I said I will be using EXTERNAL speakers? NOT head phones, ear buds, etc. In fact here are the speakers I will be using: http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-SONY-SRS-A27-DESKTOP-IPOD-ZUNE-MP3-WALKMAN-SPEAKERS_W0QQitemZ170284827059QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item170284827059&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

I don't know about you but I can not figure out a way to wear these speakers to where they cover my ears. Even in Florida these would not be illegal nor would it be illegal to listen to music in Florida with these speakers. Heck they don't even violate the noise ordinance, even if they are cranked up all the way.

Not wanting to use head phones or ear buds has nothing to do with not being able to hear while riding. That is not the safety factor I am most concerned with. My biggest problem is with head phones while riding a bike messes up my balance and equillibrium for some reason. This is regardless of volume or type of music playing. I tried a long time ago and have always had a problem with it. The last thing I want to do is lose my balance and fall while riding because I am listening to music through head phones.

Funny how a request for opinions becomes name calling.

It's a simple thing to figure out - the amount of attention any entity has is limited. The more things that interfere with attention to safety and navigation factors, the less effective the attention to those factors is. Whether that's negligible interfere or not is another matter. But that there's competition for brain cells isn't.

Individual factors weigh in. I suspect the biggest individual factors is listening. Listening is a learned skill. Many people don't listen very well, although they'll deny that. Everyone thinks they can listen. Most people think most storebought speakers are OK, too. They're wrong. Speaker testing really shows this. It's a rare person who right away can sit in front of real speakers (Linkwitz Orions, for example) and point to where each track was placed right away. Takes training and practice.

I listen to instruments all day. I watch players come in and try to distinguish them. Even most musicians can't listen very well! So it's no wonder that many cyclists discount the amount of information available through listening. Certainly I see a good number of cyclists and motorists not using listening and seeing and feeling very effectively.

People keep saying that they listen to music to drown out the wind noise, but I really find it to be the other way around. Typically when I listen to music on my earbuds I keep the music around 5 or so in volume on my Zune beacuase A) I still want to hear some cars and B) I've gone to enough loud concerts I don't need to wreck my hearing from headphones too. What I find is that having those little bits of plastic in my ears actually intensifies how much wind I hear and gets drowned out by the wind and cars anyway.

Generally if I'm just riding short trips around the city or something I'll wear them, but for my 10 mile commute I prefer to hear cars coming up from behind me. Listening to fast music gets me so pumped to ride though - Daft Punk and Venetian Snares help me destroy any hill that gets in my way, though I'm usually pretty destroyed myself by the time I get off my bike...

it depends on the music. If i were listening to rap or hip hop, i'd actually be hoping for a crash.

yessss

I wouldn't do it; I like hearing what's around me while riding.

Riding with and without music I find no difference in if I can hear a car/truck/tractor trailer or not. Most of them are either too quiet for me to hear till they are upon me or so loud I can hear them no matter what. It might be different if I was wearing noise insulating in ear speakers or over the hear headphones that an audiophile uses or played the music so loud it vibrated my brain. When I wear those even with no music on the only thing I can hear is my own heartbeat and really really loud noises even then I don't think it would matter. When I drive the car with the windows closed and no music on I can hear far less then on a bike with music.

Regardless of if I ride with music or not I can't ride on my recumbent without mirror(s) as it cuts off too much area behind me. There is really nothing to hear or see on my commute except buildings, freight transfer stations and poor roads.