Training & Nutrition - I hate my trainer

I'm finding it very hard to ride my trainer. I can be in the lowest of gears working a moderate cadence and my heart rate seems to be to high. So I tried lessening the tension on the rear wheel and this only creates "slippages" of sorts when I spin at a higher cadence and intensity. My trainer is a two years old Cyclops bought from REI. Should I buy a new trainer, HTFU and ride this one, by some rollers, or start running in the park? Thanks for the help guys.

Your HR "seems" to be high. What does your HRM tell you?


Personally, I can't get my HR anywhere near high on a trainer, spinning bike, or stat bike ... even when I ride as hard as I can. But put me on a very small hill outside, and my HR is way up there.

Yeah, trainers suck.

It has been raining torentially here with temps right above freezing so I have been doing some HR based workouts on the trainer like 2x20's.

Its a motivation issue though. I hate being on the trainer so Ill try to ride up to my zone with percieved exertion and then look down at the low HR number and be like are you kidding me?


Just stick with it man and HTFU.

I suggest planning on using the first 20 min to ease into it physically+mentally and to make any adjustments on the resistance 1/4 turn at a time.

Yes you don't want to loosen off the wheel too much but there should be some sort of resistance setting on the unit. I have a basic CycleOps unit which has 3 resistance settings. I usually use the middle setting.

Anthony

If you don't already have one, get an industrial grade fan.

It's about 35F, the front door is open, and 4 windows. That helps.

You can try watching movies and shows while you spin. But you'll want
something like Spinervals as well.

You get used to it, sort of. I bought a used Concept 2 rower, and alternate.
That helps too.

Thanks for the advice. I think I'll just bust out some quick Spinervals and get them over with. And Machka, my HR on rolling hills with moderate effort is about 180. My HR on the stupid trainer in the lower gears and light resistance is about 170. It just sucks because I got my dad into cycling and he rides his trainer for about 90 minutes everday. Old man is showing me up :)

I much prefer group spin classes at the local gym. The down-side is that they only last an hour at most gyms (they do 2-hour ones at my gym 3 days per week, but that is kind of rare from what I've seen). Spin classes are pure interval workouts, so you won't get a lot of your core training in if you only do that. I mix in cross training for the rest of my cardio. I can't stand trainers either. They are like self-inflicted torture devices.

try rollers

Try an Tacx imagic or Fortius, you can compete against other riders. You can ride virtual or Real life terrains.

What trainer should a beginner buy?
Oh

Weird - I've got the highly regarded Cycleops fluid trainer (recent model), and I'm finding that on the maximum gear setting, there's not enough resistance to do decent standing position climbs. Definitely enough resistance for hard spinning at high cadence, but not as good for low-cadence grinds.

What trainer should a beginner buy?
Oh

Depends more on the budget. I have a Kurt Kinetic. Nice, but $$.

Here's a good basic one.
http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=6000123&subcategory=60001087&brand=&sku=18824&storetype=&estoreid=&pagename=Shop%20by%20Subcat%3A%20Trainers%20and%20Rollers

Go to the Spinervals website and check the videos out. You can look for a better price, but they have a few like Aero Base Builder 5 that take the best couple hours from a bunch of earlier hour long dvds. More bang for the buck, as it were.

http://www.spinervals.com/products/item26.cfm

You, too, can hate Coach Troy.

Weird - I've got the highly regarded Cycleops fluid trainer (recent model), and I'm finding that on the maximum gear setting, there's not enough resistance to do decent standing position climbs. Definitely enough resistance for hard spinning at high cadence, but not as good for low-cadence grinds.

interesting because I just bought a Fluid2 and find the resistance quite high, or at least much higher than my Cyclops magnetic. Are you sure the resistance unit is properly fitted to your tire? (sorry if this is redundant but if you have the clamp the unit should just touch the tire before you fold the clamp down. If you have the knob, once it touches the tire turn it 2.5 times more.


I'm finding it very hard to ride my trainer. I can be in the lowest of gears working a moderate cadence and my heart rate seems to be to high. So I tried lessening the tension on the rear wheel and this only creates "slippages" of sorts when I spin at a higher cadence and intensity. My trainer is a two years old Cyclops bought from REI. Should I buy a new trainer, HTFU and ride this one, by some rollers, or start running in the park? Thanks for the help guys.

How is the PE on your legs? I assume you have the quick release clamp? I just posted int the racing forum about my own frustrations and was told that I may need to release some tire pressure and adjust my gear combos as there is NO correlation between gear choice on the trainer and outdoors. So instead focus only PE/Power/HR.

this LINK (http://www.bikeforums.net/showpost.php?p=3355022&postcount=10)was passed along to help put things in perspective.

1. Buy some spinervals DVDs

2. Rip the audio tracks (make MP3s out of them)

3. Put on your headphones and HTFU.

Oh and buy one of these too:

http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=149740

I don't hate on anybody late.
Thanks again.
Oh

For all you CycleOps Fluid 2 owners, can you increase the resistance enough to do anaerobic 20-30sec standing sprints on it? I can't on mine at the lower cadence (60ish rpm standing) - not enough resistance, even with the locking handle down to the point that it's indenting the tire. It's plenty strong for seated high-cadence sprints (max gearing, 90+rpm) , but seems to not be enough for the standing position for me.

I got the CycleOps Fluid 2, after returning the Blackburn, for me it gives good resistance and can get the HR up to at least feel I had a good workout.

For those who want a super hard trainer, buy the Blackburn (I think it is like 300 dollars), it is suppose to have three ball bearings that can be adjusted to different intensities. The one I bought seem to be on hard level all the time, very inconsistent on resistance levels, one moment hard, in the next second super hard. I returned it to PerformanceBike and took a CycleOps, now I am happy with mine. At the time I used to live in Sonoma where I have done many good hills, Ink Grade, Marshall, Coleman Valley, and at least the Cops was enough for me for those rainy cold days when the vein is itching for some workout.

It's about 35F, the front door is open, and 4 windows. That helps.

You can try watching movies and shows while you spin. But you'll want
something like Spinervals as well.

You get used to it, sort of. I bought a used Concept 2 rower, and alternate.
That helps too.

+1.

Although make sure you watch some videos/read the web about correct rowing technique, can lead to frustration at the start. A very good whole body workout. Although new rowers (don't get those magnetic plastic thingos, only Concept 2's) arn't cheap, just a heads up.

For all you CycleOps Fluid 2 owners, can you increase the resistance enough to do anaerobic 20-30sec standing sprints on it? I can't on mine at the lower cadence (60ish rpm standing) - not enough resistance, even with the locking handle down to the point that it's indenting the tire. It's plenty strong for seated high-cadence sprints (max gearing, 90+rpm) , but seems to not be enough for the standing position for me.

The shortest intervals I have been able to do without getting tire slippage is around 30 seconds or so. Anything shorter than that and the acceleration is too much - I can feel the tire slipping on the drum. I can't imagine trying to do standing 20 second sprints.

To the OP, its possible you have a unit with unusually high resistance. I recently had to get a replacement resistance unit from Saris, and the power curve is dramatically higher than the original unit. Just a rough estimate is that 16mph on the new unit is the same power as about 21mph was on the old unit. I would not have believed 2 units of the same design could have been so different. Assuming they use the same impeller design and the fluid is the same viscosity, there should be very little power difference between 2 units with today's manufacturing tolerances. It may loosen up a little as the seals wear in, but it will never match the power curve of the original unit. So perhaps Saris has made some recent changes and you have a newer unit.

Question for the group. I'm about to take the plunge and buy a trainer (probably Kurt Kinetic road machine) and have read several posts in the past saying that trainers create some serious wear and tear on tires. Is this problem overrated, or does it make sense to get a spare, relatively cheap back wheel to use just for training indoors? Thanks in advance.

Everyone seems to say that, but it has not been my experience. I think that to the extent some people have had seemingly quicker tire wear it may be due to two things - clamping the tire too tightly, and the tendency to use the trainer for interval workouts. I think for most people a much higher percentage of the time on a trainer is typically spent doing intervals as compared to riding on the road - so the average power transfer is usually higher on the trainer.

Other than those 2 things, I don't know what else would cause higher tire wear. The drum is polished steel, so there should much less tire wear due to abrasion compared to a typical asphalt or concrete road surface. And the tire is in the airflow of the cooling fan, so tread temps are probably lower than on the road. I guess one exception is if you are trying to do sprints and creating a lot of slippage - that would burn off tread quickly.

Also, to the extent that tire wear is occuring on the trainer, it is confined to the center of the tread, so it gives the illusion of wearing down faster due to the squaring off. Typically a round profile comes back after a couple hundred miles on the road as the edges of that flat section are run off.

Thanks JayhawKen. Appreciate the feedback. I'll just give it a go before spending the dough for a spare rear wheel.

Originally Posted by AGAROSE2000
"Weird - I've got the highly regarded Cycleops fluid trainer (recent model), and I'm finding that on the maximum gear setting, there's not enough resistance to do decent standing position climbs. Definitely enough resistance for hard spinning at high cadence, but not as good for low-cadence grinds."

Cyclops "re-tuned" their newer model fluid trainer for a more road like feel according to their tech guys. My girlfriend has one of the newer ones(1 year old) and I have an older one (4 years old). On the newer one I can ride the 53x13 or 14 and spin along pretty easily. If I crank it hard in teh 12 tooth and a high cadence I can finally get in some ho wattage work. On my older trainer almost all my workouts are in the small chainring unless I am doing some low cadence work. But to turn the 53x12, 13, 14 even 15 tooth is a huge difference compared to the newer style.

Took the plunge and got a trainer (Kurt Kinetic Road Machine); nice machine. So I hop on the thing, start the computor, and start peddling like mad, when I notice that the clock is ticking but nothing else is registering -- when of course it occurs to me that the computor is triggered by the front wheel -- place dunce cap here. :) In any case, I went on line and searched for computors for trainers and several people were down on the one promoted by the Kurt Kinetic folks, but some of the reviews were from more than a year ago (they say it's pretty flimsy and poorly made for the price, about $50). Anyone have any leads on a decent comptor for the trainer to measure speed, cadence, and perhaps watts?

I use a Powertap wheel. Of course they are expensive, but you get watts, heart rate, speed and all the regular features of a computer.

I'm surprised anyone would say KK is cheaply built. Too many hours on mine now and zero problems of any sort.

I wear heart rate monitor only but still get a great work out. Looking forward to spring thaw though so can get back outside!

have any leads on a decent comptor for the trainer to measure speed, cadence, and perhaps watts?

I have to say that I have used the Tacx iMagic for a few years and it's a great trainer coupled with the software (Fortius software is pretty buggy though). Old school now, but the imagic and imagic software is pretty faultless compared with the Fortius. I think Fortius has maybe gone a bit too clever to soon.

Anyway, I digress slightly. The iMagic is good but apart from a generally higher reading for wattage than a Powertap (as an example) it lacks features. For example, it won't give you your average or max output whilst riding and you can only check once you finish a course. Depending on what you want to do in your rides it is a good idea to use a Powertap wheel and computer as well (or just on its own with a turbo - the Tacx Swing is a good solid trainer). The powertap is a great training tool and has many features but is expensive. Do what I did, scan ebay for a while and pick up one for cheaper. It's a risk admittedly so look out for newer models. As a guide, I'd say the iMagic wattage readings are 10-30watts higher than that of the powertap but both tools give consistent readings (which is the important factor) so as long as you aren't really that fussed about what your ACTUAL output is, both are sufficient.

As for hating the trainer (as in the original post) get an iMagic, it's good for anything up to an hour in my opinion and hard to get bored, especially if you have iTunes running blasting out a bit of Metallica. Many will tell you to avoid the Fortius and to a degree they have a point but run on a new PC, dedicated to the fortius software (again expensive I know), you should have no problems. Some (possibly most) people have Fortius problems on older PC's packed to the rafters with software, buggy Microsoft updates and spyware, playing havoc with the software and drivers.