# Training & Nutrition - Surprised w/Heart rate during a sprint compared to a buddy who is 50lbs heavier

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FreddyBoy
02-09-09, 09:11 PM
Background:
After any gym workout I've been incorporating a simple run on a treadmill.
I do 8-10 1min sprints with a 1min cool down in between.

Got a buddy who easily weighs 60lbs more than me that also did the treadmill.
My heart beat was 165 right after the sprint portion. He was sprinting substantially slower but his HBeat was 185,
I was more "spent" than he was after each sprint. (not quite to gasping but fatigued though I quickly recovered)

I cannot imagine being able to last @185beats/min for a full minute and am perplexed that he was able to do so.
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UPDATE: Just checked my max HBeat during a lifting workout. Somewhere during the workout I reached 195 and I wasn't even pushing all that hard for the most part.
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Anyway how this is all cycling related, is that I was trying to add a little something to a "gym" workout that incorporated a sort of interval. Help me with my sprinting on the bike.

Is this a lactate threshold issue?
Should I be trying to raise my heart beat/exertion during those intervals?

Hmm. Just doing some mental calculations:
A 200yd sprint
@30mph takes 13.63 seconds (recalculated to get the tenths correct)
@35mph = 11.68seconds (couldn't do that second one in my head :-)
Thinking maybe I should double up on the the running sprint intervals to 30 seconds and only allow a 30 second cool down.

supcom
02-09-09, 10:09 PM
You can't compare your heart rate with someone else's. Your buddy likely has a significantly higher maximum heart rate than you.

FreddyBoy
02-09-09, 10:15 PM
I was 220 Max HB back in college (long time ago and certainly exerting more effort - rowing compared to this treadmill sprint)
I will have to get around to testing for my Max HB.

Anyway still amazed that this guy (big dude with 50lbs to lose) was able to maintain that kind of heart beat.

agarose2000
02-09-09, 10:25 PM
Part of it is conditioning, and part of it is genetics.

Oddly, the better conditioned you get, the lower you tend to "top out" at. Untrained folks regularly go 200+ on sprints, whereas conditioned athletes, or even the same folks on a serious exercise program may find it extremely hard to go over 200.

Genetics and weight also play a factor. More weight = more muscle = move blood to move = increased cardiac output = higher HR.

165 does seem a tad low though, although some folks do in fact top out low.

silver bullet
02-10-09, 12:55 AM
....but more importantly, your buddy has a higher max HR - and that has no relevance to fitness level or weight. It just is what it is.

edbikebabe
02-10-09, 08:53 AM
I can routinely hold high heart rates while running, without being super out of breath or fatigued. If I ran at the "recommended" HR, I'd be going sooo slow. However, my recovery is fairly fast. I've learned to just go with it & work with my body. I'm hoping as I get in better shape I start seeing my speed increase for the same HR.

FreddyBoy
02-10-09, 10:02 AM
I'm hoping as I get in better shape I start seeing my speed increase for the same HR.
I keep thinking I "AM" in good shape, only to be schooled every weekend during a a group ride :-)
Anyway interesting that running pushes you nearer your upper end and you can "hold" it.

When I rowed, I recall pushing to near collapse when we got measured for max HR. Only time I ever came close to that exertion level recently was my gym's "boot camp" - very similar to those P90X style workouts.

Oh to change the topic a little...
when I ride, even when climbing an 18% grade over 0.7miles, I get tired and sluggish but NOT exhausted to the level I feel (small white dots, light-headedness) during that bootcamp. (I might be unconsciously saving some gas on the climbs because there is another hour of riding)

gregf83
02-10-09, 11:08 AM
Anyway how this is all cycling related, is that I was trying to add a little something to a "gym" workout that incorporated a sort of interval. Help me with my sprinting on the bike.
I've never heard that running is an effective way to train for sprinting as the muscles used are not the same. Why not just wait until you can ride outside and train on the bike. Sprinting performance can be relatively quickly trained provided you have a decent base to build on.

Pat
02-10-09, 11:43 AM
Maximum heart rate varies quite a bit from individual to individual and it does not have anything to do with how well conditioned one is.

As for the comment by Freddy Boy on "help me with my sprinting on the bike". Well, Freddy, you messed up and chose the wrong parents. Sprinting is related to the proportion of your muscle fibers that are "quick twitch" and that is genetic. One can not train to become a great sprinter. Sprinters are born. Sure great sprinters have to train but they can not train to be great. You either have a great sprint or you don't.

agarose2000
02-10-09, 06:53 PM
I sort of disagree with the fact that you can't develop your sprinting. It's true that to become a GREAT (world-class) sprinter, or even a state champion, you will rely heavily on genetics. But still, you can become a dang good sprinter with even the wrong genetics by training your rear end off correctly. For sure, world champions don't just show up with "no training" - sprinters in all disciplines, from running to cycling to skiing often train for 4-6 hours per day on various drills, weights, and sprints to optimize their potential.

FreddyBoy
02-10-09, 08:05 PM
I've never heard that running is an effective way to train for sprinting as the muscles used are not the same.

Just realized that. I am sort of new to the "re-introduction" of running. I was thinking it would get me winded and increase my cardio. But after tonight's lifting workout I noticed my HBeat maxed at 195 and it wasn't even all that strenous a lifting session.

I sort of disagree with the fact that you can't develop your sprinting. It's true that to become a GREAT (world-class) sprinter, or even a state champion, you will rely heavily on genetics. But still, you can become a dang good sprinter with even the wrong genetics by training your rear end off correctly. For sure, world champions don't just show up with "no training" - sprinters in all disciplines, from running to cycling to skiing often train for 4-6 hours per day on various drills, weights, and sprints to optimize their potential.

I agree 100%.
Pat is probably right that I might not have the "ideal" genetic make-up of a sprinter (actually I think I do but don't hate me for my conceit :-)

Pat
02-11-09, 08:03 AM
I sort of disagree with the fact that you can't develop your sprinting. It's true that to become a GREAT (world-class) sprinter, or even a state champion, you will rely heavily on genetics. But still, you can become a dang good sprinter with even the wrong genetics by training your rear end off correctly. For sure, world champions don't just show up with "no training" - sprinters in all disciplines, from running to cycling to skiing often train for 4-6 hours per day on various drills, weights, and sprints to optimize their potential.

The thing is that training really increases one's performance in aerobic performance. A person can go from getting winded walking from the couch to the fridge to reeling off reasonably fast centuries routinely with just training. Most people with just average abilities can train to an impressive level of performance in aerobic events. However, it does not matter how much you train, if you are slow in the 100 yard dash, you are not going to run a 10 sec hundred yard dash ever no matter how much you train. It used to be said that milers are made not born and sprinters are born not trained.