Road Cycling - Cycling ability of other professional athletes

A few years ago, I seem to remember an article about a study of some sort whereby professional athletes from other disciplines were challenged to "ride like Lance Armstrong" in a time trial, with the objective of finding out how long they could hold that pace. (the results were amazingly poor)

I can't find that article anymore....has anyone else seen it?

I'd be interested in reading this too. I've ridden bikes for most of my 30 years, but just recently switched to the rigorous challenge of a road bike. I don't ever expect nor plan to approach professional caliber, but I am interested, as a benchmark, to learn just how much strength, endurance, and speed is possible on a road bike. I'm happy at present to just do fairly comfortable 10 mile rides between 15-21 mph. I expect a road bike, more than any other, to be enjoyable in proportion to the rider's fitness level.

A few years ago, I seem to remember an article about a study of some sort whereby professional athletes from other disciplines were challenged to "ride like Lance Armstrong" in a time trial, with the objective of finding out how long they could hold that pace. (the results were amazingly poor)

I can't find that article anymore....has anyone else seen it?

I can't site it exactly, but it was a Sports Illustrated article - perhaps the one when he was named Athlete of the Year?? They had a MLB pitcher, some hockey player and someone else all doing the VO2 max test - LA blew them away of course.

Well, it is a ridiculous stunt. Bicycling requires a very high level of aerobic conditioning which most sports do not require. Football and baseball, for example, do not require much aerobic conditioning. Basketball requires some but not a great deal.

Even if a person has a high level of aerobic conditioning, that is not enough. I knew a guy and he had just run in the Boston Marathon which requires qualifying and is a big deal. Well, he had a bike and I suggested going for a ride. He gave me this look of obvious disdain at what he considered my terrible lack of fitness so I resented this some. Well, I was in good shape and had put in a fair number of miles that summer. I had no problem dropping him on every hill even though I outweighed him by a good 20 lbs. I had a lot more muscle in my thighs and I knew how to run a proper cadence.

So this guy was obviously in tremendous aerobic shape but he did not have the cycling specific adaptations: big quads and he did not have the skill of running a reasonably high cadence.

I would say the whole challenge is pointless. It really does not prove anything because atheletic competition is so specialized that it does not transfer from sport to sport.

Does anyone here remember a basketball player by the name of Michael Jordan? I understand that he was pretty good at basketball but he wasn't even a good minor league player in baseball. Shouldn't that tell us something?

Well, it is a ridiculous stunt. Bicycling requires a very high level of aerobic conditioning which most sports do not require. Football and baseball, for example, do not require much aerobic conditioning. Basketball requires some but not a great deal.

Even if a person has a high level of aerobic conditioning, that is not enough. I knew a guy and he had just run in the Boston Marathon which requires qualifying and is a big deal. Well, he had a bike and I suggested going for a ride. He gave me this look of obvious disdain at what he considered my terrible lack of fitness so I resented this some. Well, I was in good shape and had put in a fair number of miles that summer. I had no problem dropping him on every hill even though I outweighed him by a good 20 lbs. I had a lot more muscle in my thighs and I knew how to run a proper cadence.

So this guy was obviously in tremendous aerobic shape but he did not have the cycling specific adaptations: big quads and he did not have the skill of running a reasonably high cadence.

I would say the whole challenge is pointless. It really does not prove anything because atheletic competition is so specialized that it does not transfer from sport to sport.

Does anyone here remember a basketball player by the name of Michael Jordan? I understand that he was pretty good at basketball but he wasn't even a good minor league player in baseball. Shouldn't that tell us something?
it obviously was a stunt..but a fun one at that. i dont think anybody takes seriously the validity or (ir)relevancy of the thing. :)

but anyways, you remember a certain heisman winner named Charlie Ward or some other guys who goes by the name of Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders? :D

I personally am giving up on trying to explain to everyone the athleticism of the cyclists (In america that is.) People here are never going to get it. Yesterday on my way home I heard a commercial for the new Max Kellerman sports show and he said the he felt that Lance Armstrong and Tiger Woods combined equals one good athlete. This is the same guy who once said that all cyclists do is ride from point A to point B as fast as they can, no strategy involved, no coordination involved. Moron.

The annoying thing is that most sports analysts give more credence to Golf than Cycling as athletic. You know, a couple of weeks ago I was playing Golf and my partner hit a hole in one. Up to that point he had only parred one hole. Total accident. I guarantee you that I cannot accidentally set the fastest time up the Alpe d'huez.

Sorry for ranting.

downhill skier herman maier rode the prologue of the 2003 tour de france and posted a respectable amateur time. considering that downhill skiing is not an aerobic sport and that maier has come back from some very serious injuries, i'd say that was quite a phenomenal ride...

I periodically ride with several professional race drivers, and they bike for conditioning. While I no longer race, when I did I was CATII, but ride 40-50 miles a day now between 20 and 23mph, so I am in reasonable shape.
These drivers are in great condition. But I have read where all they do is sit on their rear ends and do what all of us do every day...drive a car.
ANY sport can be ridiculed....but the writers, at least the ones I know, would know the LEAST about conditioning. I pay little attention to the Jim Rome wannabees...BTW, Jim is a cycling and a Lance fan.
I bet a guy who said that a bike was a toy that if he rode with me he could not stay with me for five miles...
he lasted three...because I was nice..

yeah, but car racing? have you ever heard of an injury report on sportscenter for a driver? uhm, jeff gordon has tendonitis in the big toe of his gas pedal foot and is listed as day-to-day..... c'mon. these guys go out for a sit. not a ride.

how about giving these other athletes a few months to ride before the challenge. hockey translates very well to cycling....

They've put heart rate monitors on drivers and found that they maintain a very high heart rate for the entire duration of the race.

I personally am giving up on trying to explain to everyone the athleticism of the cyclists (In america that is.) People here are never going to get it. Yesterday on my way home I heard a commercial for the new Max Kellerman sports show and he said the he felt that Lance Armstrong and Tiger Woods combined equals one good athlete. This is the same guy who once said that all cyclists do is ride from point A to point B as fast as they can, no strategy involved, no coordination involved. Moron.

The annoying thing is that most sports analysts give more credence to Golf than Cycling as athletic. You know, a couple of weeks ago I was playing Golf and my partner hit a hole in one. Up to that point he had only parred one hole. Total accident. I guarantee you that I cannot accidentally set the fastest time up the Alpe d'huez.

Sorry for ranting.

I once heard an interesting definition of what is and what is not a sport. The person suggested that if you can perform very well at a very high level, yet be out of shape, it's not a sport.

There's plenty of big, fat, and rich pro golfers.

They've put heart rate monitors on drivers and found that they maintain a very high heart rate for the entire duration of the race.

I'm not sure it's the same physiological process. For instance, I don't think their respiration is at the rate
of Lance doing a prologue, even if the heart rates were similar.

I'm not sure it's the same physiological process. For instance, I don't think their respiration is at the rate
of Lance doing a prologue, even if the heart rates were similar.

You're probably right. Still, it takes a certain level of conditioning to keep your heart rate at an elevated level.

I bet a guy (not a cyclist) who said that a bike was a toy that if he rode with me he could not stay with me for five miles...he lasted three...because I was nice..

I once bet a guy, who thought he was pretty fit, that if he rode his fastest time around the local 360m velodrome (flying lap), I could maintain his one lap speed continuosly for at least 20 laps (rah, rah, ain't i a great jerkoff).

He chickened out.

We had a company party where we rode in souped up go carts around a course with tight turns(they would do fifty 55 MPH). I remember being very sore the next day and discovered a lot of new muscles I never knew I had. Your body uses muscles to stabilize in the turns when you are going fast and turning. I was surprised how much work it was to drive those things. I can only imagine what a car doing 100 + must do to you in a tight turn. It is probably more of a anaerobic workout though as opposed to aerobic.

I once heard an interesting definition of what is and what is not a sport. The person suggested that if you can perform very well at a very high level, yet be out of shape, it's not a sport.

There's plenty of big, fat, and rich pro golfers.
That rules out the mental capacities needed for sport. There is plenty of fat fishermen too but if I went out fishing with one of them I would probably catch nothing and they would have dinner. Why? Because they understand the habitats and nuances of the fish they are trying to catch. Golf is a very mental sport but sure it doesn’t require some of the physical feats that a hockey player needs. So if you cannot play golf then you are mentally out of shape.

yeah, but car racing? have you ever heard of an injury report on sportscenter for a driver? uhm, jeff gordon has tendonitis in the big toe of his gas pedal foot and is listed as day-to-day..... c'mon. these guys go out for a sit. not a ride.


have you ever seen an overweight nascar or f1 or cart driver? have you taken a tight turn at 100mph in a hot car in a full body suit for 3 hours straight? do you realizes the G-forces that these drivers are subject to during a race? c'mon now

have you ever seen an overweight nascar or f1 or cart driver? have you taken a tight turn at 100mph in a hot car in a full body suit for 3 hours straight? do you realizes the G-forces that these drivers are subject to during a race? c'mon now
F1 and CART exerts a lot more on a driver than ovaling in nascar, you can't even begin to compare the cars. That said, F1 and cart drivers at least look more fit than their nascar counterparts, which aren't too chubby to begin with. A lot of race car drivers lift weights and work out a lot to condition themselves to the rigors of hauling a car that puts out 1hp/2lbs that can pull of stunts at 4+ g's while sticking to the ground.

i always find it amusing when someone gets together some rugby players [or similar] to see if they can do ballet. [as they sometimes do]

it's hilarious.

ballet dancers are hardcore.

fssb
sparky
eo: the buzzcocks - ever fallen in love?

Even if a person has a high level of aerobic conditioning, that is not enough. I knew a guy and he had just run in the Boston Marathon which requires qualifying and is a big deal. Well, he had a bike and I suggested going for a ride. He gave me this look of obvious disdain at what he considered my terrible lack of fitness so I resented this some. Well, I was in good shape and had put in a fair number of miles that summer. I had no problem dropping him on every hill even though I outweighed him by a good 20 lbs. I had a lot more muscle in my thighs and I knew how to run a proper cadence.

So this guy was obviously in tremendous aerobic shape but he did not have the cycling specific adaptations: big quads and he did not have the skill of running a reasonably high cadence.


Why? Because they understand the habitats and nuances of the fish they are trying to catch.
Perhaps your friend just didn't understand how to 'ride the bike.' I have a feeling he was probably trying to push the big gear and burned out his legs with brute force pushing himself. If he had made the right gear choices and been spinning in the 90 - 115 RPM range, as I'm willing to bet you were, I would suggest the results may have been different.

This was not so much a fitness contest as a test of cycling knowledge. Had the two of you ridden a flat ride (which requires much less technical expertise than climbing) I doubt you would see a difference. Like Bill Dance or Roland Martin, you understood the nuances. He didn't. Don't pat yourself on the back too hard.

I think if you took a cyclist and a distance swimmer on singlespeed bikes and have them race a course, I think the only noticable difference you would see would be that the cyclist would probably be able to maintain a higher cadence without spinning out.

eo: the buzzcocks - ever fallen in love?
but why can't i touch it?

yeah, but car racing? have you ever heard of an injury report on sportscenter for a driver? uhm, jeff gordon has tendonitis in the big toe of his gas pedal foot and is listed as day-to-day..... c'mon. these guys go out for a sit. not a ride.


But they sit in 140+ temperatures, pulling 4 - 5gs, with the car on the very edge of spinning out every single turn. Some of these guys can lose 9 lbs in a single race.

The last time I checked, Lance's bike had a saddle on it.

You can't say a guy is not an athelete because he is not going aerobic. So, a power lifter is not an athelete? They are all atheletes, they are just very specialized. I don't think Lance would hold up very well to a big hit from an NFL tackle.

I always laugh at those 'cyclists aren't really athletes' idiots. Especially when I see that golfer, Daly, with his fat stomach, smoking a cigarette.Let's see him get up Mont Ventoux! However, golf is like cycling in the sense that it looks easier than it is. So people say, 'oh yeah, anyone can ride a bike'. So then I should be able to get up mt ventoux! But I wouldn't assume I could just get out on a golf course and hit a ball like Tiger woods or even that fat slob daly! I'd probably hurt myself! I know it looks easier than it is.

BUt cycling is no doubt more demanding than most of our popular sports. No time out, no half time, no dancing girls, no sitting in the dugout or on the bench, you can't just stop and take a break except maybe a few seconds to relieve yourself, unless you're badly injured you have to keep going for six hours, you have to eat while riding, and they almost never call it on account of bad weather! Yeah, I'm sure I could do that no problem!

F1 and CART exerts a lot more on a driver than ovaling in nascar, you can't even begin to compare the cars. That said, F1 and cart drivers at least look more fit than their nascar counterparts, which aren't too chubby to begin with. A lot of race car drivers lift weights and work out a lot to condition themselves to the rigors of hauling a car that puts out 1hp/2lbs that can pull of stunts at 4+ g's while sticking to the ground.
oh, you mean ovals like sonoma, watkins glens, and infineon? :rolleyes:
id like to see you endure 100*+ in a suit for 3 hours

Somehow the general separation between sports and games has been lost.

Games= Baseball, football, hockey, chess, badminton, tennis, golf, etc....

Sports = Running track and feild, cycling, jumping, powerlifting, swimming, triathalons, etc....

It really does not prove anything because atheletic competition is so specialized that it does not transfer from sport to sport.

Then again, I know plenty of "naturally athletic" people for whom switching between sports comes naturally. A friend of mine, in particular, spent a short time playing pro baseball. Well, when it came to playing B-Ball with the guys, I heard he was amazing at that sport. Golf - same thing. Racquetball, same. Some people have whatever it is (motor skills, the right array of neurons, whatever) that make them naturally athletic.

But then again, like you say, my impression is cycling is more a function of cardiovascular conditioning, muscular fitness, and the right body type. Cycling may be enhanced by coordination and athleticism, but I suspect less than in other sports.

Cycling and distance running are the two sports that I hear the most people rag on as "not being sports" and "not requiring skill." There is huge skill, strategy, athleticism, etc. Take an average nay-sayer and try to get 'em to ride a century or run a sub-17:00 5k as they stand and they'll likely wind up unconscious or crying foul. Screw the morons...we know what's up.

Perhaps your friend just didn't understand how to 'ride the bike.' I have a feeling he was probably trying to push the big gear and burned out his legs with brute force pushing himself. If he had made the right gear choices and been spinning in the 90 - 115 RPM range, as I'm willing to bet you were, I would suggest the results may have been different.

This was not so much a fitness contest as a test of cycling knowledge. Had the two of you ridden a flat ride (which requires much less technical expertise than climbing) I doubt you would see a difference.

I think if you took a cyclist and a distance swimmer on singlespeed bikes and have them race a course, I think the only noticable difference you would see would be that the cyclist would probably be able to maintain a higher cadence without spinning out.

I'm sorry, Superachievo, but I consider these statements to be outrageous! It seems as though you've generalized from your own experiences (unwise) probably because you either have little cycling experience/fitness/strength, are a super-freak athlete, or know some super-freak athletes. Sports such cycling, skating, rowing and cross-country skiing require a combination of strength, power, and long, continuous concentric contractions that running does not. Running is dominated by much shorter, concentric and eccentric contractions, with very little strength requirements.

To suggest that someone who has developed their fitness from running or swimming could match the speed of a condtioned cyclist in a bike race, just so long as they were briefly informed about cadence and technique, is ludicrous! :eek:

One example of different strength requirements (not the best, I admit) would be to compare the physiques of ice-skaters and runners. Even those that compete in events that take the same amount of time will look very different.

I have always felt that there are different skills for different sport.. There are finesse, power and Hand/eye sports.. Some athletic endeavors combine many of these facets.. Yes very few athletes have the pure aerobic ability of a Lance Armstrong.. But put a golf club in Lance's hands and he could barely break a hundred.. I have been fortunate to play many sports at a high level..

I can honestly say that bike racing was the most taxing physically and mentally than anything I had ever done before.. But it was a completely different skill set than baseball or soccer which I also played in college..

I remember Lance when he was a junior triathlete and was kicking everyones butt.. Fortunately the National Cycling team saw his potential and worked with him so that he is the great cyclist that he is today... If that had not been done, he most likely would of been a world class triathlete.. It is just unfair to compare athletes of different disciplines..

I'm sorry, Superachievo, but I consider these statements to be outrageous! It seems as though you've generalized from your own experiences (unwise) probably because you either have little cycling experience/fitness/strength, are a super-freak athlete, or know some super-freak athletes.


I'll give you a guilty as charged - almost. By way of disclosure, I went from running 70 - 80 miles a week and being a 31-minute 10K runner to road cycling a few years ago. It took me a while to learn to climb well (technique), but I was always able to hang solidly with the Bs and attack on the 27-mile Tuesday nighters and was able to do 50K timetrials at about 25mph. I will agree this isn't the most usual of experiences, but I’ve known lots of fast runners who have been able to make the transition to cycling with relative ease. I will by way of full disclosure say that after about 40 to 50 miles of hard riding I did have some serious quad issues until I built more muscle mass.

Now, let's revisit the scenario. Cyclist goes for ride with Friend who qualified for Boston. It's obvious this runner trains a lot and has pretty good speed (qualifying for Boston is no joke). So, we can assume he probably has good leg strength, well above average cardio fitness and lactic acid tolerance. He also knows how to hurt for long periods of time. IMHO, being able to hurt is the most important factor in any endurance sport.

Unless Dude is trying to smoke his buddy at some crazy speed or riding on crazy long hills - there is no reason besides lack of technique that his Bro should not have been able to ride with him.

As for the swimmer thing, I'll admit it is out there - especially because the mechanics are different. I do think it would be interesting to take a good high school or college swimmer (large leg muscle mass, high cardio fitness, mind-numbing lactic tolerance) and match them up against a reasonably good cyclist on a course designed to minimize the impact of cycling's 'skill' areas like climbing.

Superachievo - I like it. Everyone else calls me a slacker.

I forgot to pop one of these on my post.... :D

Now, let's revisit the scenario. Cyclist goes for ride with Friend who qualified for Boston. It's obvious this runner trains a lot and has pretty good speed (qualifying for Boston is no joke). So, we can assume he probably has good leg strength, well above average cardio fitness and lactic acid tolerance. He also knows how to hurt for long periods of time. IMHO, being able to hurt is the most important factor in any endurance sport.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but strength in one discipline doesn't always transfer into strength in another discipline. Runners develop different muscles and in a different way than cyclists do. I never knew that runners needed really strong muscles. Rather they need muscles capable of carrying them for long periods of time.

I may be wrong.

If leg strength were all that was needed to be a strong cyclists, then once could become a great rider simply by pumping iron.

Speed skating is the one discipline that transfers well to cycling. Lots of skaters cross train by cycling. Eric Heiden was a strong cyclists (U.S. pro championship winner, TDF rider) after he hung up the skates.

again, are we talking about taking a pro athlete from one sport and putting him on a bike with no prep (a few months of training at least?) or are they just provided a bike to ride when they get to this test.
yes, there are natural athletes that will excel at any endevour.

**as for the race car driver, it is his engine and other technologies that produces the fast speeds. its not like a driver can overcome the top drivers with more work on his forearms. He relies SOLEY on technology to squeeze out more speed. yes, lance benefits from technology, but he doesn't rely soley on technology >> without training he is nowhere close to the others. yes, a driver needs to overcome the fear factor, and there is a certain something that you need to drive fast.....but as a test

*****i hooked up a HRM to my son while he played playstation2 and his HR went from a resting 76 to a range of 92 to 108 with a high of 114**** (this is for the post that states that a race car driver's HR elevates to high levels, thus defining their athleticism)

i hooked up a HRM to my son while he played playstation2 and his HR went from a resting 76 to a range of 92 to 108 with a high of 114**** (this is for the post that states that a race car driver's HR elevates to high levels, thus defining their athleticism)

I always assumed that the race car driver's elevated HR was mostly due to excitement/adrenalin, but now I'm thinking that they must become very accustomed to the situation. For instance, is their HR still high when they're 2 miles in front of the 2nd place guy, and there's only a few laps to go, but they're still driving at the same speed?

I dunno nothin'

**as for the race car driver, it is his engine and other technologies that produces the fast speeds. its not like a driver can overcome the top drivers with more work on his forearms. He relies SOLEY on technology to squeeze out more speed.

I disagree. There is quite a bit of skill needed too. You have to know where, when and how to take the turns. You have to know proper throttle management. It's true that athletically speaking the body isn't used to get those speeds... it's used to survive the trip. However, saying that winning a car race is the result of pure technology is glossing over a lot of other factours... some subtle and some not.

Now this is what I call thread drift!

**as for the race car driver, it is his engine and other technologies that produces the fast speeds. its not like a driver can overcome the top drivers with more work on his forearms. He relies SOLEY on technology to squeeze out more speed.
jesus christ..talk about your gross hyperboles

I'm a decent cyclist, but I'm a terrible runner. Having to carry my own body weight is hard. However, I'm an excellent paddler and solid rock climber, with little practice or training. Go figure.

Well, sports are strange. I was terrible at sports in high school. But then I got involved in cycling and my natural power and endurance were assets that never came into play in any known high school sport. I have a terrible sprint, if I have a quick twitch muscle fiber, I haven't found it and nearly all high school events are quick twitch events.

I have ridden with people from various backgrounds. I have ridden with people who were nationally ranked body builders. They were in superb shape. Shoot body builders are generally in decent aerobic shape unlike many foot ball players. But the body builders I knew were easily dropped because they had not learned how to run a cadence high enough to go faster then say 24 mph.

And there was the time I was riding with a couple of fit ladies and this guy who obviously worked out on weights a fair bit joined us. He obviously wanted to dump the ladies and go faster and kept hinting at me to do so. But I waited and it was very satisfying to see the ladies drop his over developed posterior on the series of hills we hit. Upper body mass just does not help hill climbing much.

I rode with an ex pro hockey player once. He said that hockey really was not an endurance sport. I also rode awhile with an ex pro tennis player and again tennis is not really that much of an endurance sport.

And some sports are really deceptive. Many shot putters are incredibly good sprinters. You would never think that someone THAT BIG could run THAT FAST! The reason for this is that both sprinting and shot put are quick twitch muscle events. Of course the size of the shot putter puts him at a competitive disadvantage in the sprint (running event) and the sprinter's lack of size puts him at a disadvantage in the shot put.

Also many people pointed out that there are sports which require quite a bit of coordination like diving or skill like golf and so on.

Of course, I think the people who disparage cycling forget about the Tour de France. You have to perform every day for 21 days against world class competition. If you mess up once, you are basically out of contention. That takes quite a bit of skill, consistency and knowledge. I think this is why people who win the tour are usually pretty experienced. A young rider with great physical abilities is probably going to make a mistake sooner or later and that is the end of the matter. Of course, you get too old and you lose just a bit of the physical side of it. It makes things pretty tough.

I disagree. There is quite a bit of skill needed too. You have to know where, when and how to take the turns. You have to know proper throttle management. It's true that athletically speaking the body isn't used to get those speeds... it's used to survive the trip. However, saying that winning a car race is the result of pure technology is glossing over a lot of other factours... some subtle and some not.

yes, there is skill. but is it a sport? it is a team endeavor however. the pit crews, the mechanics, the equipment... i'm not an expert, but there are people who hate the concept of using limiters (is that the right lingo?) so every car driver is riding the same machine (or similar machines like road racers are benefiting from equal technologies) and then that drivers skills and decision making is taking him to the checkered flag. remember when greg lemond won that time trial using his new aero helmet and freaked everyone out with his 'advanced technology?'

again, i am taking the slant of race car driving as a sport, not as a test of will and desire. does a car driver go either aerobic or anaerobic? yes, it does require strength.

just answer me this: does the increased speeds in car racing over the last 30 years come from technology or the superior athletisicm of the drivers? is jeff gordon a better driver than richard petty was in his prime? runners go faster today due to training, not high tech shoes. cyclists are better today. what % would you say is due to improved training techniques vs. technology. today, most every SPORT i can think of has had subtle to rapid improvements in performance due to improved training techniques and the seriousness of sport today.

have you ever seen an overweight nascar ...driver?

Exhibit A:

Jimmy Spencer...

I once heard an interesting definition of what is and what is not a sport. The person suggested that if you can perform very well at a very high level, yet be out of shape, it's not a sport.


Baseball...not a sport.

Exhibit B:

David Wells

Baseball...not a sport.

:roflmao:


This is obviously an argument/discussion that has no end. Our local sport radio station has been going on about this, on and off, for ten years.

The European talk-back callers sure get catty if anyone suggests that Formula 1 is not a sport.

As far as sport-specific training goes, you can't get much more specialized than technical climbers. Fred Nicole, a world class climber, is able to crank a one arm, one pinky pullup. Chris Sharma trains via one arm, one finger pullups in loops of .5 inch webbing. Their finger strength is INSANE.

I wonder how LA would do as a center for the Rams? Turning the double play for the Dodgers? Stopping 40 shots on goal for the kings? Getting the ball to shag? Most likly as well as those teams players riding in the TDF.

Getting the ball to shag?

Well, this seems fitting for Lance.


....I know, you meant Shaq, but who can pass up a good double entendre?

just answer me this: does the increased speeds in car racing over the last 30 years come from technology or the superior athletisicm of the drivers?

I did not argue those points nor will I do so. That was not the point I responded to. You claimed that the increased speeds were due all to technology. I claimed it was not. I never claimed the increased speeds were due in most part to athleticism nor have I said that car racing was considered an athletic event. If one were to think that auto racing was purely a technological competition then all one has to do is look at electric slot-cars. Given two slot-cars on the same track with the same power source (there is usually only one), then the final outcome should always be the same... a tie. But that isn't so. The reason is that they are seperately controlled. If you run them flat out all the time in all the curves, you will also have the same outcome... a crash. This is just one aspect of racing... throttle management. There are many others. Auto-racing is more a sport of skill than an athletic sport and I have said so in the previous post. The amount of athleticism required is used solely to endure the punishment of the event... not really to exert any amount of direct energy into moving the vehicle. This is along the same lines of why astronauts and pilots need to be physically fit.

Auto-racing is more a sport of skill than an athletic sport and I have said so in the previous post. The amount of athleticism required is used solely to endure the punishment of the event... not really to exert any amount of direct energy into moving the vehicle. This is along the same lines of why astronauts and pilots need to be physically fit.

This is the correct answer. I went to school with a guy who did Formula 3 for a while. Took me out to the race-track. After experiencing what these guys have to endure in one of those things for hours - constantly fighting negative forces, mental alertness, stamina (yes stamina - fatigue plays a HUGE role in car racing) - I'd say that unless you are fit or a total freak, top-flite motor racing isn't for you.

This is the correct answer. I went to school with a guy who did Formula 3 for a while. Took me out to the race-track. After experiencing what these guys have to endure in one of those things for hours - constantly fighting negative forces, mental alertness, stamina (yes stamina - fatigue plays a HUGE role in car racing) - I'd say that unless you are fit or a total freak, top-flite motor racing isn't for you.

I heard danny sullivan say he had to have different size dress shirts for the season because his neck size would change almost 2 inches from g forces.

I seem to remember in the book The World According to Garp that Garp thought the only true sport was collegiant style wrestling since it was just you against your opponent with no ball, stick or other devise to get in the way.