Long Distance Competition/Ultracycling, Randonneuring and Endurance Cycling - The mental differnece?

Through the years, 59 of them, I have ridden a bike some, but never very serious. About 2 1/2 years ago I started riding much more serious. Actually I rode 5800 miles in 2008. This included six century events and many 100K rides. This May I would like to ride my first 200K. That ride includes two very difficult climbs, anther almost that difficult, and lots of rolling hills.

So what's my question? After each of the 100 mile events I have been completely exhausted. My time in the centuries has been between 5 hours 45 minutes, my fastest, to 7 hours. With the major climbs and another 30 miles thrown into the mix I know there must be a different mental approach to the 200K rides, and longer, than the centuries I have ridden. What is the diffenece in mental attitude from an event of 100 miles and the "long distance" rides the cyclist chronicle on this forum?

You need to eat more durning your 100 mile rides.

What is the diffenece in mental attitude from an event of 100 miles and the "long distance" rides the cyclist chronicle on this forum? Perhaps a better way of phrasing your question would be:


How do you handle the "mental component"
of a ride when you are attempting an event that is harder
than anything you've accomplished before?

My own tactic is to avoid thinking about the enormity of the task at hand. I never think about how long, how difficult, or how painful a ride "might become" just for the sake of worry. I always focus my "mental" view on the immediate conditions I'm experiencing, and what is needed to reach a "meaningful" fraction of the overall event.

Keeping my focus on incremental goals, such as an "hour by hour" inventory of my performance, or split times for 25-mile segments, or making a certain town or fuel stop at a certain time are all ways of occupying the "mental needs" of a ride.

Marathon runners seldom think about an entire race, even while they are racing. They focus on their pace -mile by mile. And only think about the entire distance as a means of maintaining their goal focus.

Hope you get your 200k. Good luck.

Keeping my focus on incremental goals, such as an "hour by hour" inventory of my performance, or split times for 25-mile segments, or making a certain town or fuel stop at a certain time are all ways of occupying the "mental needs" of a ride.

This is an excellent approach, and what helped me out going from 200k up to 200 miles. I don't look at the overall distance, I just break it down into chunks of "the next 25 miles" or if it's a really tough segment "the next 10 miles". It's much easier for me to tell myself "only 10 more miles 'til these hills are done" or "20 more miles to the next stop" than to look at the cue sheet and see that there's still 70 miles left to go.

Heck, on my commute home I have a 2.25 mile long hill and sometimes I'm hauling 30 or more pounds of groceries. I break that one down into micro-goals: OK, just around the next corner. Not so bad... Now I just need to make this steep section. Not so bad...

After each of the 100 mile events I have been completely exhausted. My time in the centuries has been between 5 hours 45 minutes, my fastest, to 7 hours.

With these kinds of times on a 100 mile ride, you should have no problem riding a 200km. If it is an official brevet, you have 13.5 hours to complete.

What is your goal? If you feel compelled to push the pace you might well finish similarly exhausted. If you pace yourself -- knowing your limits and pacing are the key to long distance riding -- you should be able to ride a 200k comfortably.

Agree with Rando. It's just pacing. You can attempt to exhaust yourself just as thoroughly on a 100k, 200k, 300k, 400k, etc. You just pace it so you last longer. The simplest way to do this is to put an upper limit on your HR right from the start. Period. No HR over that. Adjust that limit to the length of ride by experimentation. There are other systems, but that's the simplest and most foolproof.

So you could try using the climbing HR you could achieve at the end of a hard 100k as your HR limit for 200k. For every ride over 200k, use the ending HR at the previous distance as the starting HR for the longer distance. At least that's something to start with.

Oh, sorry. You asked about mental attitude. For me it's just the idea that yes, I can ride in pain for a very long time. A very, very long time. No permanent damage. So it's just a matter of regulating the intensity of that pain so I reach the finish still pedaling and not walking. Like LA, some of us do it for the pain. You just thought you were exhausted. Heh. There's a reason it's called The Dark Side.

For me it's just the idea that yes, I can ride in pain for a very long time. A very, very long time. No permanent damage. So it's just a matter of regulating the intensity of that pain so I reach the finish still pedaling and not walking. Like LA, some of us do it for the pain. You just thought you were exhausted. Heh. There's a reason it's called The Dark Side.

There was mention in one of the last issues of American Randonneur about pedalling through the pain, and "if you think it will heal in 10 days or less, keep riding."

Back in 05 I completed 23 centuries. Plenty of flat and some good climbs. I don't see much difference between a flat 100 and a double metric with rolling hills and a couple of big climbs like CoolBreeze. A few riders described the big Casitas Pass climb. Once I was over it, I was still loooking for a big climb!:eek:

Nothing different IMO between the two! If you want a mental difference, do a ride like this one, "Ride Around the Bear". This changes one's mindset a bit. :D

I did it 3 years in a row and plan 05,04, and 03. This year I plan to do it again in June with RonSmithJr!:D

ANd like yuo, my typing was much bettre before I started riding centrees!:p



http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l267/gulpxtreme/albumnumbertwo/Bear.jpg

for me, the trick is the break up the big rides (400k+) into segments. when you roll out on mile zero, don't start thinking, "372 to go.." you should think "40 miles to the next checkpoint"

then when you get there, it's another 40-60 mile stretch to the next destination.

i've also experimented with not using a cyclocomputer on the longer rides - i like to call it a "torture device" for the long ones.

for me, the trick is the break up the big rides (400k+) into segments. when you roll out on mile zero, don't start thinking, "372 to go.." you should think "40 miles to the next checkpoint"

then when you get there, it's another 40-60 mile stretch to the next destination.

This is my approach as well. Another way to think about it is to remind yourself to "keep focused on the task at hand." If that task seems daunting, then re-define the task to something that seems manageable. Riding to the next conrtol works well on the short brevets; on a 1200K, it becomes riding to the top of the next hill. Ok, made it. Now let me just ride to the top of the next one.


i've also experimented with not using a cyclocomputer on the longer rides - i like to call it a "torture device" for the long ones.

I did a 200K earlier this month with no computer and no cue sheet. I knew the route (and the area) by heart. It was a really fun way to ride a bike. Just like being a kid again. :D

It appears the best way to increase the total mileage for a ride is to break the ride into segments and only concentrate on each segment.

That approach does sound reasonable. I have been thinking of how totally exhausted I have been at the end of each century and that I could not have gone another mile.

I have worked hard to hydrate correctly and eat correctly on the centuries and have been surprised at how exhausted I have been. That exhaustion in spite of my work on my hydration and food intake is the reason I decided to ask about the mental difference because I felt I had prepared very well for the centuries.

The 200K I want to attempt is an official brevet. I knew the time allowed was over 12 hours, but I could not remember the exact time. I have not stayed on a bike for more than 7 hours, so that will be a new experience and that brings up another question, if I may. I have two bikes, a road bike that I have ridden on my centuries and a newly acquired Surly LHT. Which bike should I use for the 200K?

It appears the best way to increase the total mileage for a ride is to break the ride into segments and only concentrate on each segment.

That approach does sound reasonable. I have been thinking of how totally exhausted I have been at the end of each century and that I could not have gone another mile.

I have worked hard to hydrate correctly and eat correctly on the centuries and have been surprised at how exhausted I have been. That exhaustion in spite of my work on my hydration and food intake is the reason I decided to ask about the mental difference because I felt I had prepared very well for the centuries.

The 200K I want to attempt is an official brevet. I knew the time allowed was over 12 hours, but I could not remember the exact time. I have not stayed on a bike for more than 7 hours, so that will be a new experience

You've done your centuries between 5.75 and 7 hours, which is great ... but maybe try doing your next century at a more relaxed pace. Slow it down just a bit, have a look at the scenery, take a break now and then ... and see how you feel at the end of a century like that.

...I have been thinking of how totally exhausted I have been at the end of each century and that I could not have gone another mile.

I have worked hard to hydrate correctly and eat correctly on the centuries and have been surprised at how exhausted I have been. That exhaustion in spite of my work on my hydration and food intake is the reason I decided to ask about the mental difference because I felt I had prepared very well for the centuries.

The 200K I want to attempt is an official brevet. I knew the time allowed was over 12 hours, but I could not remember the exact time. I have not stayed on a bike for more than 7 hours, so that will be a new experience and that brings up another question, if I may. I have two bikes, a road bike that I have ridden on my centuries and a newly acquired Surly LHT. Which bike should I use for the 200K?

Do you want to qualify, or set a record? If you just want to finish, slowing down a little would help a lot. I think in terms of effective mph, adjusted for wind, elevation, road surface, etc. Based on limited experience, training, centuries, and brevets, here is my unscientific impression of how fast I could go for how long:

MPH----22---20---18---16---15---14---13---12---11---10
HOURS-1/2---1-----3----5----7----18---21---24---27---until I fall asleep...

Note the huge jump around 14+1/2. You can find your magic number by riding training loops near home, say 10 miles out and back. Try it at 17, 16, 15, 14...until you get a number you can ride for 100 miles or more without bonking. For me, on my current brevet bike, it's 14 and change. If I try to go 16 all day, I'm fried about 80 miles out. If I stay in the 14's, or under, I can ride all day.

You should get 13:30 to finish, which means you could go 10 mph and still make it. So, say 13 is your number. Unless you face a brutal headwind both ways, you can make it easily.

Finally, the easiest question: you should ride the brevet on the bike you already know, unless you have time for adequate training on the LHT. If your bike fit is not just right, it will really add up over 200k.

You started this as a mental attitude issue; I'm not sure it isn't a pace issue. For a good riding attitude, I'd say gain confidence through experience, on training rides. Pace yourself carefully. Be aware of changes in conditions that require a response: temperature, wind, etc. If you've done these things, then relax and have fun.

p.s.-edit: I took for granted that you worked out all the eating and hydration issues, because you said you did. But you did not spell out what you are doing. That was/is the hardest part for me, so maybe you could make more gains there(?).

This May I would like to ride my first 200K. That ride includes two very difficult climbs, anther almost that difficult, and lots of rolling hills.


Mt. Magazine 200k? I'm thinking about making that my first brevet also. Best of luck on your ride. Maybe I'll see you there.

Here's my bullet-proof tip for solving mental attitude and pace issues on your first brevet. Find some real battle-scarred rando folks at the ride start and ride with them for the day. Introduce yourself, tell 'em your new, and ask if they wouldn't mind your joining them for a few miles. Here it's an easy task, since our RBA rides with the riders. Other clues for finding the "right folks" are anyone wearing a PBP or other 1200K jersey (the older, the better), or anyone who generally strikes you as prepared and confident. Stay away from the racer crowd; you're looking for people to go take a nice easy ride with and whose brains you can pick for all kinds of randonneuring wisdom and war stories. Good luck!

Nothing different IMO between the two! If you want a mental difference, do a ride like this one, "Ride Around the Bear". This changes one's mindset a bit. :D

I did it 3 years in a row and plan 05,04, and 03. This year I plan to do it again in June with RonSmithJr!:D


Huh? What? Trying to slip something by me? :twitchy: This is a good ride. I'd do it again if not for that altitude problem I have. When doing it in 2005 I found out for the first time that I am crap above 6000 feet. Sucks. Of course by the time I got back to the finish I was fine.

Mentally speaking, I am burned out on rides longer than 100 miles. Just don't want to do them right now. That will change. Memories fade.

The big mental challenge came for PBP in 2007. At the start line, 9:00 pm on the Monday evening, I thought about how I had to do 7.5 centuries (ok, 7.7) without the clock stopping, and that I'd be on the move (or sleeping or eating) until Friday afternoon. Couldn't wrap my brain around it, which is probably a good thing.

On my first double, the 2003 L.A. Wheelmen Grand Tour, as the dawn was breaking a guy I was riding with (we were all double century newbies) suggested that we turn our lights off right away to save battery power for the evening. That was when it dawned on, ok came crashing down on me, that we were still going to be out riding when the sun went down. At the end of the double I said the same thing as when I finished my first century: "Wow, I'll never do that again." What a dumb thing to say.

At the 2005 Fall Death Valley Double (I said it was a dumb thing to say) I was talking to a newbie the evening before the ride. I mentioned how I was going to carry my lights instead of using a drop bag. His response? "We need lights?" Why yes, unless you are going to finish in 11 hours, beating everybody else (11 was the course record for the northern route, and is when dusk hits). It just didn't occur to him that he'd be out riding when the sun went down. Never saw him again.