"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Under-rated pro riders.

Eddy Merckx once said in reference to Belgian pro Ludo Peeters that some riders get talked about often but don't produce many results, while others take big wins but are never hyped. Peeters was definitely in the latter category.

Ninjaman suggested three time world TT champ Mick Rogers as a present day example of a rider who quietly does the business without any major hype.

Anyone have any other candidates, past or present?

I'd nominate as a past example Eric Van Lanker - winner of Liege-Bastonge-Liege, Amstel Gold, Wincanton Classic, GP Americas in Montreal and a Giro stage as a rider who got the big wins without any hype.

Current examples might be Phillip Gilbert or Davide Rebellin. Plenty of big wins but little hype compared to the Cunegos and Boonens.

Current examples might be Phillip Gilbert or Davide Rebellin. Plenty of big wins but little hype compared to the Cunegos and Boonens.

Rebellin, while he has plenty of big results, will always be known as a bridesmaid. He's been fantastic (2004), and he's always a threat, but I don't think of him as a guy on the top step. His podium appearances are staggering, but when I think of him, I think "Oh, he's the dude who got 2nd/3rd at _______ _______ (insert hilly classic) this year.

And really, Phillipe Gilbert is still a young pup. He's only 26, and while he doesn't quite have the palmares of Boonen at that age, he's doing very well for himself. Provided the right course and the right form, I think we'll see him in rainbow stripes someday.

I would have said Gilbert.

Ballan

Chavanel

Chavanel

Would you have said that at this time last year?

But seriously, I was also thinking Rebellin; he certainly does have plenty of non-win podiums, but saying he's the bridesmaid is like saying the same thing about Erik Zabel, proud owner of 7 Green jerseys in the Tour.

Anybody else feel like Daniele Bennati is vastly underappreciated? He's clearly one of the top 5 sprinters in the world, but isn't given even the limelight of half the mediocre talents out there. Lampre didn't even bother to stop him from leaving, opting for Danilo Napolitano instead!

Would you have said that at this time last year?

But seriously, I was also thinking Rebellin; he certainly does have plenty of non-win podiums, but saying he's the bridesmaid is like saying the same thing about Erik Zabel, proud owner of 7 Green jerseys in the Tour.

Anybody else feel like Daniele Bennati is vastly underappreciated? He's clearly one of the top 5 sprinters in the world, but isn't given even the limelight of half the mediocre talents out there. Lampre didn't even bother to stop him from leaving, opting for Danilo Napolitano instead!

You are a bloody genius ninjaman! I agree with all that.:D

Expanding on Chavanel, he was the great white hype until last year. Rumour had it he was on some ridiculously huge salary and getting no results. In 2008 he finally got off his arse and rode to his potential, which was good to see, but if anything he was overhyped, not underappreciated.

Ballan


Interesting choice. He probably was under-appreciated compared to some of his overhyped compatriots until he won his rainbow jersey last year. His wins at Flanders and Hamburg were impressive, as was his worlds win. Good to see him getting kudos now.

Freire. Never favored to win, but gets it done...

Chris Horner is someone that doesn't get enough hype, probably because of his age and that he got started in Euro pro cycling much later than all. His results have steadily improved since he arrived in Europe. He got 15th in the Tour helping Cadel so he's one of the best in the world. The problem is that he's making his career of a great domestique in the shadow of other stars. I just realized this but his results were better when he was riding for himself (Saunier Duval-stage win & 5th overall Tour Suisse, all day break to near stage win in the Tour) (Webcor-9th at worlds, good fall classics) compared to the 15th place and stage win in romandie. I guess that's a given that you'll have less results when riding for other bigger names. Whatever, my point is Chris Horner is a great rider but you'll only see it when he's got the freedom.

i think the reason is pretty obvious why gilbert doesn't get the mega hype - he's a walllonian, who until this year raced for a french team, in the era of boonen.

on top of that, i doubt you'll see many posters of him in teenage girls bedrooms.

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0bsh6Y150eba6/610x.jpg

gerald ciolek

i think the reason is pretty obvious why gilbert doesn't get the mega hype - he's a walllonian, who until this year raced for a french team, in the era of boonen.

on top of that, i doubt you'll see many posters of him in teenage girls bedrooms.

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0bsh6Y150eba6/610x.jpg

Hmmm. He does have a bit of a pineapple head on him.

Chris Horner is someone that doesn't get enough hype, probably because of his age and that he got started in Euro pro cycling much later than all. His results have steadily improved since he arrived in Europe. He got 15th in the Tour helping Cadel so he's one of the best in the world. The problem is that he's making his career of a great domestique in the shadow of other stars. I just realized this but his results were better when he was riding for himself (Saunier Duval-stage win & 5th overall Tour Suisse, all day break to near stage win in the Tour) (Webcor-9th at worlds, good fall classics) compared to the 15th place and stage win in romandie. I guess that's a given that you'll have less results when riding for other bigger names. Whatever, my point is Chris Horner is a great rider but you'll only see it when he's got the freedom.

FWIW, he went over in 1996 or thereabouts and rode with FDJ. Didn't have much in the way of results in his first Euro stint, and went home to race domestically. But yes, second time around he has done well and doesn't get the column inches some of his less well performed countrymen seem to get.

Hmmm. He does have a bit of a pineapple head on him.

poor kid must have looked like this as teenager.

http://www.nerve.com/CS/blogs/screengrab/2008/05/23-End/CrazyLove.jpg (http://www.nerve.com/CS/blogs/screengrab/archive/2008/05/30/forgotten-films-quot-love-is-a-dog-from-hell-quot-1987.aspx)

Lookalikes?


Manuel Noriega
http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0bsh6Y150eba6/610x.jpg

Phillip Gilbert
http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/ap/ny11601241248.widec.jpg

ouch.

Would you have said that at this time last year?

But seriously, I was also thinking Rebellin; he certainly does have plenty of non-win podiums, but saying he's the bridesmaid is like saying the same thing about Erik Zabel, proud owner of 7 Green jerseys in the Tour.

Anybody else feel like Daniele Bennati is vastly underappreciated? He's clearly one of the top 5 sprinters in the world, but isn't given even the limelight of half the mediocre talents out there. Lampre didn't even bother to stop him from leaving, opting for Danilo Napolitano instead!

I was thinking this myself.

Johann Van Summeran - I dont think anyone has spent more time on the front of a peloton since 2003, although in the service of others.

Definitely agree with the previous mentions of Bennati, Rebellin, and Oscar Friere, big wins for each.

Stuart O'grady also comes to mind, he's accomplished lots as a sprinter in the GTs, as a one-day racer, and on the track, but always seems to be overshadowed by the larger than life figures of mcewen, cancellara, and boonen.

Popovych...he has been a lieutenant for some of the best riders, tirelessly, and never gets great hype his way. I'm pretty sure he spent the entire ToC at the front riding tempo, every time the versus coverage showed the front of the peloton he was in the first three wheels. I still don't understand why he doesn't take a run at a GC title or some of the smaller stage races, maybe the pay is better as a lieutenant?

Bennati is a primadonna, he came to the Commerce Bank Phila race this year and did about 20 miles before packing it in. There was so much hype about him coming to the race because it suited him well after coming from the Giro, so I was let down.

Matti Breschel and Jason McCartney are two riders that come to mind, as well as Grim Kim Kirchen

i think the reason is pretty obvious why gilbert doesn't get the mega hype - he's a walllonian, who until this year raced for a french team, in the era of boonen.

on top of that, i doubt you'll see many posters of him in teenage girls bedrooms.



or teenage girls in his bedroom.:innocent:

or teenage girls in his bedroom.:innocent:

seeing as he's a wallonian, he probably has a few tweens in the basement.

Stijn Devolder. His tour attempt didn't go well last year but he was a solo maniac at Flanders last year.

Rebellin is the ****in MAN. Classics and week long SR's, he's a threat. Silver at the olympics. A straight up G.

Rebellin is the ****in MAN. Classics and week long SR's, he's a threat. Silver at the olympics. A straight up G.

true, but his racing style can be lumped into the zoetemelk/evans/leipheimer category.

not exactly fun to watch.

true, but his racing style can be lumped into the zoetemelk/evans/leipheimer category.

not exactly fun to watch.

^^Maybe, but if you were to pick the current racers with the best tactical sense, who understand exactly what to do and exactly when to do it, Rebellin would be at the top. (don't worry Lance-lovers, he would be up there too.). While Rebellin is unquestionably in fantastic shape and trains as hard as anyone, but the real reason he's still one of the most dangerous riders in the peloton is his racing brain.

^^Maybe, but if you were to pick the current racers with the best tactical sense, who understand exactly what to do and exactly when to do it, Rebellin would be at the top. (don't worry Lance-lovers, he would be up there too.). While Rebellin is unquestionably in fantastic shape and trains as hard as anyone, but the real reason he's still one of the most dangerous riders in the peloton is his racing brain.

the same can be said about horner, sastre, erik dekker (when he was still racing) and a slew of other wily vets.

Roman Kreuziger?

Vladimir Karpets?

Luis Leon Sanchez?

Matti Breschel?

seeing as he's a wallonian, he probably has a few tweens in the basement.


That is just plain evil botto. Has Belgium actually gotten over all that yet?

Roman Kreuziger?

Vladimir Karpets?

Luis Leon Sanchez?

Matti Breschel?

Sanchez I'd tend to agree. Karpets keeps failing when it counts. The other two are still young.

Chris Horner is someone that doesn't get enough hype, probably because of his age and that he got started in Euro pro cycling much later than all. His results have steadily improved since he arrived in Europe. He got 15th in the Tour helping Cadel so he's one of the best in the world. The problem is that he's making his career of a great domestique in the shadow of other stars. I just realized this but his results were better when he was riding for himself (Saunier Duval-stage win & 5th overall Tour Suisse, all day break to near stage win in the Tour) (Webcor-9th at worlds, good fall classics) compared to the 15th place and stage win in romandie. I guess that's a given that you'll have less results when riding for other bigger names. Whatever, my point is Chris Horner is a great rider but you'll only see it when he's got the freedom.

horner rode with Française des Jeux in his mid-20s (97-99).

ed rader

I'll say everyone, except Lance and Levi during February.

That is just plain evil botto. Has Belgium actually gotten over all that yet?

isn't it? :D

Eddy Merckx once said in reference to Belgian pro Ludo Peeters that some riders get talked about often but don't produce many results, while others take big wins but are never hyped. Peeters was definitely in the latter category.

Ninjaman suggested three time world TT champ Mick Rogers as a present day example of a rider who quietly does the business without any major hype.

Anyone have any other candidates, past or present?

I'd nominate as a past example Eric Van Lanker - winner of Liege-Bastonge-Liege, Amstel Gold, Wincanton Classic, GP Americas in Montreal and a Giro stage as a rider who got the big wins without any hype.

Current examples might be Phillip Gilbert or Davide Rebellin. Plenty of big wins but little hype compared to the Cunegos and Boonens.


i see guys like rodgers and menchov as under-performers :eek:.

ed rader

Sanchez I'd tend to agree. Karpets keeps failing when it counts. The other two are still young.

+1, but Breschel and Kreuziger will certainly give us a lot to look at in the next few years. Karpets hasn't seemed to capitalize on opportunities when they've been there in a race, perhaps if he were ever able to ride for himself? I will always remember Sanchez's incredible descent on the last stage of last year's Paris-Nice, I was checking that they didn't have the wrong Sanchez onscreen. Classic! I keep forgetting he's only 24. Maybe we should start another sister thread about who we expect huge things from in the next 5 years?

i see guys like rodgers and menchov as under-performers :eek:.

ed rader

Menchov has won the Vuelta, so I'd probably disagree on the old evil looking diesel powered ex-KGB siberian salt camp inmate looking Russkie.

Rogers I can see where you are coming from, but he has had major injuries and illness the last 1-2 years.

Menchov has won the Vuelta

twice

Underrated pro's? Aren't they called Domestiques? I think some of the hard men of cycling like Ekimov and Andre Tchmil should get more attention if for anything racing there bikes for 25 years.

Janez Brajkovic
Geert Steegmans

Julian Dean

Linus Gerdemann. He won a stage and wore the yellow jersey in the 2007 TdF. You might remember that he missed most of last season, after he crashed in the stage 5 TT of Tirreno-Adriatico (still finishing 8th on his spare bike). After he returned he won three races straight away, including the Deutschland Tour. I think he is the most talented of the present riders, but gets much less attention than most.

I think some of the hard men of cycling like Ekimov and Andre Tchmil should get more attention if for anything racing there bikes for 25 years.


They got paid.

I think guys like Horner are not necessarily underrated. I think he and others were overrated and never got rid of that label. If you think of Horner as a domestique, good for 2 climbs in a 5 climb stage, then he meets expectations. If you expect him to be pulling on the 5th climb of the stage, well, he doesn't do that too much. I think he's strong, but he doesn't have the magical touch to be more than a really good domestique.

I think you have to do the Vaughters thing. He and Guimard seem to be able to find guys with talent. Guimard, okay, his track record is pretty spectacular (Van Impe, Hinault, Fignon, Lemond), but Vaughters is very interesting. He's the one that got Vande Velde to almost podium in the Tour. Who heard of Cozza before his day long break at MSR last year? He's had a few duds too, but those duds were guys that I thought were good too (notably Danielson). I figure Vaughters must have a lot of underrated pros on that team (and a few that are really good).

I think Dominique Rollins will be a huge hit in the future. His old team (that missed ToCA one year, and that was the last year the team existed) thought he was a star of the future. His stage win the following year was incredible. I think in a couple years we'll be reading a lot about him. He seems like the Cancellara type, fast, powerful, tough. I see him doing well in the spring classics for sure.

Having said all that, I have to say that no matter what I say about Horner, he is freakin fast. He blew by me and a friend on the road one day. Horner was chatting to a BMC rider, and they were hauling. I ramped it up to about 25-28 mph to see if that would do the trick but that was about their speed, going up a short climb, into a stiff cross headwind. And he was chatting away, gesturing, and not showing any effort.

cdr

Flecha

Janez Brajkovic
Geert Steegmans

I don't think Steegmans is really all that underrated. He's been getting a fair share of press since 2007/early 2008, and he has a reputation as a very strong Classics rider and fast sprinter. You don't win stages two years running in the tour by being mediocre. But he also has a well-deserved reputation of being unable to deliver the results that he is capable of when under pressure. I think the biggest difference between him and Tom Boonen is psychology, not talent. I hope that he'll continue to bloom, as it were, over the next couple years. He's a very good rider. If by underrated you mean that people don't realize just how strong he is, I'll give you that, but if by underrated you mean that he delivers results without much hype, I'd disagree. He's gotten great results, but he's physically capable of more.

Wasn't Steegmans more lauded than Boonen when they were competing against each other as juniors? If Brajkovic can stop celebrating 2nd place finishes, he might be a good leader for a team without 5 Grand Tour leaders already.

Wasn't Steegmans more lauded than Boonen when they were competing against each other as juniors?

I've heard this, too.

Wasn't Steegmans more lauded than Boonen when they were competing against each other as juniors? If Brajkovic can stop celebrating 2nd place finishes, he might be a good leader for a team without 5 Grand Tour leaders already.

No, he was more successful.

Wasn't Steegmans more lauded than Boonen when they were competing against each other as juniors?

Nobody was more lauded as a child than Boonen.
Well, maybe Lebron James.

Nobody was more lauded as a child than Boonen.
Well, maybe Lebron James.
And you're not even from Cleveland....