Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - wheel question

I've searched for the last hour and haven't been able to find what I'm looking for.

I'm looking for a wheel set that is bombproof, mostly because i'm over 210 lbs. and will do all sorts of riding, from commuting, ie potholes and such, to some trail riding. I don't want to have to worry about getting them trued every other week.

As some of you know, I recently bought a redline conquest pro...rear spacing is 135mm...it's also got disc brakes.

Any suggestions?

1. extremely durable
2. disc brakes
3. 135 mm
4. 700c

Thanks!

Tyler

Try Universal cycles.

You could get a hand built set of XT disc hub/ Mavic 317 rim / 36 spoke wheels for around $200

I am sure others will have higher end recommendations. The wheel builder at Universal cycles allows you to try out different options to see how price is effected and adjust to your needs.

Congrats on the new bike.

thanks. unfortunately, after doing some more research, it seems that i have the '06 model, which has 130 mm rear spacing. ugh. i'll figure something out :-)

Those mavic rims are nice, but you can get use an Ultegra hub with them and hand built.

Check out Ebay item #120336289046. $199 free shipping. XT hubs, Dt Swiss spokes and Mavic 319 rims. I got the same set from another Ebay seller, and they have been trouble free.

The biggest, most important thing is to have the wheel actually be properly tensioned and stress-relieved. Even a wheel with high-end parts will go out of true quickly if it hasn't been tensioned and stres-relieved.

1. extremely durable
2. disc brakes
3. 135 mm
4. 700c


I'll agree with Wirehead: how the wheel is built is more important than what parts it's built with. A good wheelbuilder can make a bombproof wheel out of average components. A bad wheelbuilder can take very nice components and turn out crap.

FWIW: I'm 6-foot-4 and 220 pounds when I shed my winter insulation. I've built my own wheels for 27 years. Since I found how to properly tension and stress-relieve wheels I haven't broken a single undamaged spoke (broke a couple after putting the chain into the wheel). I'm not gentle on wheels, either- since I ride recumbents, I can't "unweight" the wheel on rough stuff.

My latest wheel has 36 double-butted spokes and a Velocity "Aero" rim. It's holding up fine. If you want bombproof, a 36-spoke wheel on a Mavic A719 (http://www.mavic.com/road/products/a-719.324119.2.aspx) will be more than adequate.

Check out Ebay item #120336289046. $199 free shipping. XT hubs, Dt Swiss spokes and Mavic 319 rims. I got the same set from another Ebay seller, and they have been trouble free.

XT hubs are 135mm, OP needs 130mm. So than means road based hubs.

XT hubs are 135mm, OP needs 130mm. So than means road based hubs.

Waitaminute- they built a cross frame with 130mm OLD and disc brakes? What were they thinking?

In any case, respacing hubs is no big deal. I have a 130mm OLD Deore XT hub on one bike right now (non-disc, though) and I've made 135mm OLD Ultegra hubs. Any competent bike mechanic can do this.

I run a Mavic A719 40 spoke with a Phil Woods hub. It is a tough wheel.

...rear spacing is 135mm...it's also got disc brakes.


XT hubs are 135mm, OP needs 130mm. So than means road based hubs.

????????????

I think he wanted 135. Anyway, I went through a similar search, and 700c with disc is somewhat rare. I ended up finding options on Ebay.

thanks. unfortunately, after doing some more research, it seems that i have the '06 model, which has 130 mm rear spacing. ugh. i'll figure something out :-)

I think you are reading something wrong. w00die's link shows that the hubs are 135mm XT. Shimano hasn't made a 130mm XT hub since the late 90's.

Here's another wheelset from Cambria (http://www.cambriabike.com/shopexd.asp?id=83081&page=SHIMANO%20XT%20M756%20MAVIC%20A317%20700C%20DISC%20WHEELSET). You also want to look for 29er wheels. Those are just 700C in disguise.

Do mountain bike rear hubs normally have 36 spokes? For heavy riders, I would recommend a minimum of 36 spokes. There's no question that more spokes make a wheel stronger, all other things being equal. And the weight cost is minimal. In fact, I'm dismayed that there is such a trend for reducing the number of spokes on road bikes. There isn't much good reason to do this.

If you want me to build you a wheel, I can do that for you, and I'll guarantee the results. I don't do this for a living, but I used to. If you like your hub, we can put a new rim on it. I once built a wheel for a tandem rider. He said he destroyed his rear wheel on every trip. He and his wife took a trip on the wheel I built for him, and not only was it not destroyed, he said it was still as straight as an arrow.

OP-

FSA RD-460 wheels? if so, they are 24 hole.

Phil Wood,Velocity,Joytech and a couple others make 130mm disc hubs.

http://www.velocityusa.com/downloads/hubs/Road%20Hubs/road-disc-rear-shim-500.jpg

I think you are reading something wrong. w00die's link shows that the hubs are 135mm XT. Shimano hasn't made a 130mm XT hub since the late 90's.

Here's another wheelset from Cambria (http://www.cambriabike.com/shopexd.asp?id=83081&page=SHIMANO%20XT%20M756%20MAVIC%20A317%20700C%20DISC%20WHEELSET). You also want to look for 29er wheels. Those are just 700C in disguise.


I thought I had the '07 model, but it's def an '06 which has 130mm rear spacing.

i guess it would help if i actually posted the picture...lol

I thought I had the '07 model, but it's def an '06 which has 130mm rear spacing.

I thought you were talking about the wheels...not the bike:o However, you what to take the wheel you currently have out and physically measure the dropout. If the bike was set up for discs, as it appears to be, I'd suspect that the true dropout width is 132.5. There aren't many 130mm discs hubs available. Using the 132.5mm dropout width, Redline could make the bike for both the rim brake market and the disc brake market.

It looks like the rear wheel has 24 spokes. Not enough, in my estimation, so you need a new hub and a new rim.

If you can't find a ready-made wheel with the components you want, have the parts sent to me, and I'll build the wheel for a very reasonable fee.

If you can't find a 135mm hub, we can probably change the axle and add spacers to make it wide enough. It's an aluminum frame, right? If it's steel, you can use a narrower hub without worry.

Yea, it's aluminum. And I'm thinking I'm going to need an altogether new wheelset. Apparently there are a few companies out there that make a 130mm disc compatible hub, velocity, chris king, etc. Right now, I don't think I have the money for what it's going to cost, but I do want to get some ideas in my head...

OP-

FSA RD-460 wheels? if so, they are 24 hole.

Phil Wood,Velocity,Joytech and a couple others make 130mm disc hubs.

http://www.velocityusa.com/downloads/hubs/Road%20Hubs/road-disc-rear-shim-500.jpg

thanks!

Do mountain bike rear hubs normally have 36 spokes? For heavy riders, I would recommend a minimum of 36 spokes. There's no question that more spokes make a wheel stronger, all other things being equal. And the weight cost is minimal. In fact, I'm dismayed that there is such a trend for reducing the number of spokes on road bikes. There isn't much good reason to do this.

If you want me to build you a wheel, I can do that for you, and I'll guarantee the results. I don't do this for a living, but I used to. If you like your hub, we can put a new rim on it. I once built a wheel for a tandem rider. He said he destroyed his rear wheel on every trip. He and his wife took a trip on the wheel I built for him, and not only was it not destroyed, he said it was still as straight as an arrow.

Most MTB's are built with 36 spoke wheels, even higher end ones, although I see a few now with less. On trails, even small riders need tough wheels.

Right, but I thought that tydaddy has a mountain bike, but he doesn't. I guess his bike would be called a cyclocross bike. 24 spokes? That's just crazy. What are these people thinking?

tydaddy, in the meantime, you can help your wheels by overinflating your tires. I've heard that the tire makers test their tires at twice the rating, so if your tires are rated at 100 psi, 140 psi or so will help with your size, and the risk of a blowout isn't bad.

since you dont have the money to replace them any way why dont you give them a chance and see how they do. it might be a good idea to run it by your lbs and have the spokes retensioned. my sequoia has 28 rear and 24 front spokes and i have not been easy on them. some of the bridges on the mup are tough and im 335 lbs last weigh in. i do run 130-140 psi in the tires and have only been riding this bike since last fall so time will tell.

Most MTB's are built with 36 spoke wheels, even higher end ones, although I see a few now with less. On trails, even small riders need tough wheels.

Most of them are 32...not 36. Even cheap mountain bikes usually use 32 spokes.

Most of them are 32...not 36. Even cheap mountain bikes usually use 32 spokes.

This trend of fewer spokes really dismays me. In the 60's, rear wheels had 40 spokes and fronts had 36. In the 70's and 80's, both wheels had 36 spokes.

The market is selling us stuff that needs more frequent repair. Worse, a wheel with a broken spoke is harder to ride than before, because each spoke plays a bigger role in keeping the wheel straight. People who ride for sport don't care as much as those who ride for utility, but I think everyone should care.

If you can afford it, consider an Aerospoke (www.aerospoke.com (http://www.aerospoke.com)). I did, and I don't regret it one bit. Absolutely bomb-proof, no spokes to worry about, and you can get it any way you want it (size, width, with/without disc brake, etc.). Rides nice and looks cool, all for the price of a hand-built 36- or 40-spoke high quality wheel. I should mention, you probably only need one for the rear. A good 36-spoke wheel with a Dyad rim for the front can probably be had for about $150.

This trend of fewer spokes really dismays me. In the 60's, rear wheels had 40 spokes and fronts had 36. In the 70's and 80's, both wheels had 36 spokes.

The market is selling us stuff that needs more frequent repair. Worse, a wheel with a broken spoke is harder to ride than before, because each spoke plays a bigger role in keeping the wheel straight. People who ride for sport don't care as much as those who ride for utility, but I think everyone should care.

Spoke counts have gone back up with the prevalence of disc brakes in mountain bikes. While there are some low spoke count disc wheels out there, many of them are going from the 12 -18 boutique wheels of 1998-2002 to 32 again.

That said, a 32 spoke 26" mountain bike wheel is a very strong unit. I'd put it on a par with a 40 spoke 700C wheel. Materials are also better now then in the 80s and further back. Spokes, hubs and rims are all stronger now than they were back then. Most rims were single wall construction, not the box construction we have now. Most spokes were galvanized mild steel and the aluminum for hubs (if the hubs were aluminum:rolleyes:) was of a pretty poor grade. Things have changed a lot in the last 25 years.

I used DT spokes in the early 80's. I can scarcely see how there are better spokes, but I'm all ears. But your assertion that a 32 spoke 26" wheel is equivalent to a larger wheel with more spokes. I suspect that larger diameter wheels need more spokes and the contrapositive should be true, too. Double wall rims are not new. Maybe they went out of style and came back when I wasn't looking. I had some in the late 70's, and they performed very well, and they were not heavier than rims today. I think Super Champion (later called Wolber) might be gone, but darn, they were good. Mavic was the best, and it seems they are still well regarded. Interesting that the Italians made the best of just about everything but the French made the best rims. I suppose nationality counts for less these days, though.

Yes, hubs have improved in design and construction. I was leaving the business just when freehubs (cassette hubs) were coming in. They were truly an improvement.

Still, the industry moves at a dinosaur's pace, compared with that of electronics. Most of the claims of innovations are mere marketing glitz. Also, the industry attracts garage inventors who think they have a new idea where it's often an old discarded idea, discarded for good reason. I was at a bike show many years ago, and a Japanese company was showing off it's pedal lever bicycle. The idea is to use the part of the pedal stroke that has the most power and discard the rest. I stood on the bike and pedaled hard, and the whole thing exploded under me, and I fell. The reps were extremely apologetic, but I didn't mind; I wasn't hurt. I pointed out that it was an old idea, and the acceleration and deceleration of the legs is more costly than the wasted part of a round pedal stroke.

I used DT spokes in the early 80's. I can scarcely see how there are better spokes, but I'm all ears. But your assertion that a 32 spoke 26" wheel is equivalent to a larger wheel with more spokes. I suspect that larger diameter wheels need more spokes and the contrapositive should be true, too. Double wall rims are not new. Maybe they went out of style and came back when I wasn't looking. I had some in the late 70's, and they performed very well, and they were not heavier than rims today. I think Super Champion (later called Wolber) might be gone, but darn, they were good. Mavic was the best, and it seems they are still well regarded. Interesting that the Italians made the best of just about everything but the French made the best rims. I suppose nationality counts for less these days, though.

DT spokes weren't the 'norm' in the early 80s...especially on production bikes. Most bikes then were built with mild steel zinc coated spokes that popped like corn in a microwave:rolleyes: Same with double walled rims. I build many mountain bike rims with single walls that were just awful wheels...not nearly as strong nor as light as the rims out there today.

The metallurgy for the bikes and wheels are better today also. Purity of the constituent metals and quality control have improved even DT spokes over the ones 30 years ago. Not to mention that the overall price (adjusted for inflation) is better;) And, for us especially, DT's Alpine spokes are heaven sent. They stand up to the loads we subject them to much better than any other spoke I've ever tired.

The main reason you can get away with few spokes on a 26" wheel than on a 700C is that the spoke is around an 1" shorter. That translates into a lot of strength over a longer spoke. I have 2 tandems...on a 700 C and one a 26" wheel. The 700C has 48 spoke wheels front and rear and needs them. The 26" wheel tandem has 32 spoke wheels and I've never felt it needed more. The 32 spoke wheels on my mountain bikes have held up to a lot more abuse than the 36 spoke 700C on my touring bike with a whole lot less trouble. Sometimes I wish I had a set of 40 or 48 on the touring bike...or 26" wheels.


Yes, hubs have improved in design and construction. I was leaving the business just when freehubs (cassette hubs) were coming in. They were truly an improvement.

Although the freehubs are a great improvement, the metallurgy in the hubs is what I was talking about. The forging and alloys used now are much better than 30 years ago. Again, improvements in quality control.


Still, the industry moves at a dinosaur's pace, compared with that of electronics. Most of the claims of innovations are mere marketing glitz. Also, the industry attracts garage inventors who think they have a new idea where it's often an old discarded idea, discarded for good reason. I was at a bike show many years ago, and a Japanese company was showing off it's pedal lever bicycle. The idea is to use the part of the pedal stroke that has the most power and discard the rest. I stood on the bike and pedaled hard, and the whole thing exploded under me, and I fell. The reps were extremely apologetic, but I didn't mind; I wasn't hurt. I pointed out that it was an old idea, and the acceleration and deceleration of the legs is more costly than the wasted part of a round pedal stroke.

Mountain biking is what has really pushed bicycling in the last 25+ years. The demands of the sport...stronger, lighter frames, stronger components, suspension, etc...have really pushed down into other aspects of cycling. Without mountain biking, I don't think that road bikes would be doing the things they are doing now with new materials and frame designs. Left to the UCI, bicycles would still be 2 speeds with flipflop hubs:rolleyes:

Wow, thanks for bringing me up to date so succinctly. And your last sentence is funny, of course.

I oughta pick your brain about tandems one of these days. I don't own one but I'm dying to get my wife to try one. She's kinda lukewarm on the idea.