Advocacy & Safety - on the shoulder or the road?

70 mph highway with a wide shoulder with a surface much like a gravel road and a rumble strip separating it from the highway. Where would you ride?

someplace else.

someplace else.

Me too. Fortunately I don't have to ride it but saw someone today. Tourists ride roads like these too. I'm guessing most people say the shoulder with some beefy tires?

What 70mph roads even allow bikes?

What 70mph roads even allow bikes?

We got em everywhere.

A rider was killed in this area a couple of years ago (or less, i'm not sure), when he and his wife were on a ride. There route took them on US Hwy 280 just north of Auburn for about 1 or 2 miles. This is a 4 lane divided highway, and the speed limit there was either 55 or 65, most people routinely do 65 or 70, or more. The driver was reaching for something that fell off the passenger seat, drifted over to the shoulder, hit and killed the husband. The wife was hurt, but I'm not sure to what extent her injuries were. They were both experienced cyclists.

Cyclists vs. auto. Cyclists always loses.

No. I don't think that would be an ideal situation. We aren't the same class of vehicle as cars -- think of motor scooters as being an equivalent. All cities and suburbs should connect up lower-speed parallel routes for every highway or arterial street.

I do my commuting on a 50 mph road with no shoulder and plenty of trucks including trucks with pup trailers. Would you guys do that?

What 70mph roads even allow bikes?
A great many. I see you're in LA, so a fairly local example is the I-5. It's legal for bicycle travel on the shoulder from the Bay Area (spec. Tracy) to a little north of the LA area (spec. Santa Clarita), a stretch of about 370 miles. While bikes are not allowed on the 5 through the LA metro area, they are again permitted from a little south of San Clemente until Oceanside. Portions of many other freeways in the western states also allow bicycle travel.

Fortunately the I-5 shoulder is well-paved so one isn't faced with the situation of the OP. It does have the hazard of a great deal of truck tire debris. As this degrades, it leaves sharp steel wires from the woven belts in the tires that can puncture bike tires (we once referred to these as 'Michelin thorns').

I do my commuting on a 50 mph road with no shoulder and plenty of trucks including trucks with pup trailers. Would you guys do that?

Everyday. I have traveled thousands of miles on roads like that- some with posted 55 MPH limits. Just ride in the left tire track. Motorists eventually figure out how to get around you. No sweat.

Everyday. I have traveled thousands of miles on roads like that- some with posted 55 MPH limits. Just ride in the left tire track. Motorists eventually figure out how to get around you. No sweat.

So what do you think of the topic?

70 mph highway with a wide shoulder with a surface much like a gravel road and a rumble strip separating it from the highway. Where would you ride?

Anyone who rides their bike on the highway(not a state highway), needs their head examined

Why not just ride down the middle of train tracks? Much more direct route that way. If a train conductor doesn't see you he should be fired anyway.

A handful of posts in and not one person has answered the question. You folks have only managed to sound outraged that someone would ride on such a road. You do realize that some people don't have a choice? I guess the folks that hang out here in A&S to care about riding that much. :rolleyes:

I also kind of assumed somebody would actually be an advocate for riding just about anywhere. What do they feed you (mod edit) in here anyway?

It seems to me that most respondents did answer your question. They just didn't do so with one of your two prescribed answers. A true advocate would also include some useful information on the topic at hand in their post, (something that you failed to do) and not resort to calling people names.

Double fail for you.

It seems to me that most respondents did answer your question.

You need to read closer. You didn't answer either. ;)

...and the ***** comment was a bit tongue in cheek to get some action on this thread. Don't be so thin skinned.

I rode roads like this all the time in Vermont...
Rt. 4 into Clarendon for instance. I rode to the
right of the strip. A few flats during mud season but
if I cared enuff, flat proof tires would have fixed that. :)

I rode roads like this all the time in Vermont...
Rt. 4 into Clarendon for instance. I rode to the
right of the strip. A few flats during mud season but
if I cared enuff, flat proof tires would have fixed that. :)

THANK YOU! Only took 17 posts! :lol:

...although prathmann did address the topic.

Ooh that's a scary one. I would avoid it like the plague, but if I had to ride it, I would probably ride on the shoulder. Only because at 70mph, people are too likely to get into a "highway hypnosis" mode and not see you until it is too late. In this case, I believe that the chances of getting hit would go down if you ride on the shoulder. In (almost) every other case, I would ride in the middle of the lane (or right tire track, depending on the idiot level of the day).

I guess a good mountain bike could handle the gravel road, but having to ride through that for a few miles can wear you down. Walking might be a better option if it's a reasonable distance. I wouldn't ride on the highway under any circumstances. There are just too many incompetent drivers on the road.

Now we're getting somewhere. Keep it coming. What if your only other choice was not to ride at all? Would you really give up cycling? I couldn't.

One thing I can add is that there is not a tremendous amount of traffic on these highways. Rush hour could be a little dicey. Otherwise, traffic would be fairly easy to monitor.

The problem with the shoulder of course is that many people won't bother changing lane position as they pass you which gives you no indication whether they see you or not.

Let me ask our gentleman from Vermont. Do you try to monitor traffic with a mirror or do you just ride along with fate in your hands? Do people generally change lane position for you when you are on the shoulder? Shouldn't a person feel safer with a rumble strip there too?

This is easy; take the lane. It's what you do when you don't feel safe, right?

This is easy; take the lane. It's what you do when you don't feel safe, right?

It's what I do in my situation. Not so sure on this one.

Let me ask our gentleman from Vermont. Do you try to monitor traffic with a mirror or do you just ride along with fate in your hands? Do people generally change lane position for you when you are on the shoulder? Shouldn't a person feel safer with a rumble strip there too?


I NEED a mirror. Here in Fl Im sure its saved me more than once. In Vt,
I didnt like the rumble strip as a cyclist, especially when riding a fixie, but I
suppose it did help keep the riff raff on 'their' side. Even in bicycle friendly
Vermont I would not be so stupid as to try to take a lane on Rt. 4. I was on
that road at 5:30 in the morning which is totally dark. A car/truck going 65 or
so is sort of outdriving its headlites relative to seeing a guy on bike, on a
highway, riding in dead winter, snow all around. In any state Ive commuted
in, people changing lanes are a micro minority. In PA and VT, they give you
a little room, in FL, you cant change lanes because the traffic is too dense.
I can assure you, if someone needs to hit a cyclist to avoid hitting an SUV to
their left, they will . Actually slowing usually doesnt enter the thought process.
I expect someone from California to tell me Im wrong, though. :)

Taking the lane is bike speak for becoming a hood ornament, or even worse, becoming a human speed bump.

Taking the lane is bike speak for becoming a hood ornament, or even worse, becoming a human speed bump.

I don't feel invincible for sure but I feel competent enough to notice when I am not being given the lane. Do you?

I don't feel invincible for sure but I feel competent enough to notice when I am not being given the lane. Do you?

Well, that's the thing about riding alongside motor vehicles. Physically we're no match for these beasts. We're at their mercy. I don't know what's going through a driver's head at any given moment and I'm not willing to risk my life on guessing what their intentions are. Drivers do a lot of inexplicable stuff all the time, and at high speeds that could only lead to disaster.

I expect someone from California to tell me I'm wrong, though. :)

Your wrong!

That would be "you're" wrong, California.:)

Considering that the only information we were originally given is "70 mph road and wide gravel shoulder", I can't give an answer. It would depend on a lot of things besides just the speed limit of the road. Not until post #21 were we told there is "not a tremendous amount of traffic".

How many lanes, what are the weather conditions, and how rough is the gravel shoulder, are only a few of the questions I would have off the top of my head. Also, I don't think one has to choose either "road or shoulder". I would probably use both as conditions warranted.

What 70mph roads even allow bikes?
I5 on the way to San Diego.

So if traffic is light, you're taking the lane, checking traffic with your mirror, and if somebody doesn't switch lanes far enough behind you to convince you he sees you, you go to the shoulder?

I sometimes do a 70 mph 4-lane with a 12 foot wide shoulder strip, with 4 foot wide rumble strip, the 8 foot-wide chip seal right of this is smooth enough, and I stay close to the outer edge. I think if a lot of people rode it, statistics might catch up to somebody some day, but those of us relatively few riders who use it haven't had any problems, except for wheat harvesting season when 20-foot wide combines sometimes use the highway to move between fields, which is not unsafe, but a little challenging.

On I-5 south of San Clemente, did they close the old bike route through Camp Pendleton to Oceanside? I don't remember I-5 being open in the early 90s, although maybe it was, but I mis-assumed you couldn't ride on any freeway,

So if traffic is light, you're taking the lane, checking traffic with your mirror, and if somebody doesn't switch lanes far enough behind you to convince you he sees you, you go to the shoulder?


Not necessarily. Your answer is on the shoulder. Thanks for the response.

If the road "limit" is 70 then figure some people travel 5-10mph+ over that. If the road is a 55 and people travel at 70 then those roads are set up differently. Ride a far on the shoulder. On a 70mph most people are not expecting bike traffic.

On I-5 south of San Clemente, did they close the old bike route through Camp Pendleton to Oceanside? I don't remember I-5 being open in the early 90s, although maybe it was, but I mis-assumed you couldn't ride on any freeway,
Never rode it in the '90s, but in the late '70s the route through Camp Pendleton and the I-5 shoulder were both available options for cyclists. AFAIK, this remained the case until the Pendleton route was closed for a while after 9/11 for security reasons leaving I-5 as the only choice. I believe both routes are again available.

First I would move myself on the line and see what motorists would do?
Then I would move on the right tire track and see what they do?
I would use hand signals indicating move over.
Finally I would be looking at a map to get me outta here.

Of course you have all the safety gear right?

Taking the lane is bike speak for becoming a hood ornament, or even worse, becoming a human speed bump.

I definitely disagree.

Yesterday, I had to leave the house at 6am to make it to a 10am club. I never made it because, halfway there, I got a flat tire n' tube. I was honked at, by a driver in an SUV. I wouldn't give him the lane because, there was a clear passing lane for him to take. I am not breaking the law by being on the road and, I will not surrender to idiot drivers.

70 mph highway with a wide shoulder with a surface much like a gravel road and a rumble strip separating it from the highway. Where would you ride?

I ride on the highways around where I live. I guess you could say I'm one of those people that doesn't have a choice. When you need to go somewhere and the highway's the only route, you gotta take the highway.

No, I don't take the lane when the traffic is going 60+ mph. There are roads that I ride on sometimes that are a lot like what you describe. When you say the shoulder surface is "much like a gravel road" does that mean it is gravel, or that it's paved but has pebbly debris and junk on it? In those cases, I ride on the shoulders. Especially if it's just a two-way two lane highway. If the shoulder has too much crap in it, or sharp debris that could puncture my tire, or nonexistant, I ride on the white outside line, or just inside the white line.

70 mph highway with a wide shoulder with a surface much like a gravel road and a rumble strip separating it from the highway. Where would you ride?

Certainly not on the highway. Where I do ride, I 'take the lane'.

I suspect you'd get a different perspective if asking this over in the Commuting or Touring forums. I try to use lesser traveled routes and slower roads, but having to travel some distance with fast traffic won't keep me off my bike.

I used to ride almost daily on a 70 mph speed limit road. I would ride in the lane near the exit ramps, because a lot of the traffic was going down those ramps. Also, you had to take the lane for the bridges, no shoulder. Traffic was somewhat sparse. Never had any close calls except for one(?) right hook at an exit. If there was a lot of traffic I would cross the exit ramps at 90 degree angles where they actually split from the interstate and yield to any exiting traffic. This was in a canyon in Utah, so there was a descent with a reasonable slope. I would generally take the lane when I was at speed. A cyclist at 40-50 is not hard to deal with, I would rather not force motorists traveling at 75 to overtake me when I was going 15-25. Going up the canyon, I was on the shoulder. I rode to the left of the rumble strips because to the right was a gravel/thorn jungle.