Southern California - Water Availability on Azusa Canyon/39?

I'm going to be heading up Highway 39 on Friday, having lunch with a motorcycling buddy at Newcombs Ranch, and returning to Pasadena on Highway 2. I have done this route a few times but always the other direction. I'm concerned about water availability once I start up Azusa Canyon. Is there anywhere along the route to refill water? Push comes to shove I know there is a little spring about half way up near a cabin.

The spring is good water. Never tested the creek though, and if there is any snow in drifts, I wouldn't hesitate to use it, provided it isn't yellow. You might also check the Coldbrook campground which is on Coldbrook Creek above the bridge, as most of the Nat'l Forest Campgrounds have water accumulated in water tanks from snow runoff and rain. Once at AC, there is water at the Buckhorn Flats Campground, but the road into the campground is marginal. Going in from the east, which is the campground exit road, is easier than from the entrance, which is further west on AC. Of course, once you're there, it isn't that much further over Cloudburst and down to Newcomb's.

Contrary to some reports, none of the creeks in that area appear to be fed by Crystal Lake on topographic maps, however, there are numerous cabin sites around the Falling Springs area, which is the main creek that passes through the boulders where the road curves back into a shallow revine, that could possibly contribute to contamination of creek water.

Have a good trip.

I'm not sure if it's the campground he's talking about, but I stopped at the last campground I saw before Crystal Lake (WAY below the lake), and the water spigots were dry. There is no water at the Crystal Lake site - I've searched pretty extensively.

There is a water spigot on 39 just past east fork at the OHV area ranger station. (where they pay). Some lady there advised against drinking it once, but if you're thinking about drinking creek water, you should be fine.

Someone with knowledge of the water options up there, and who has some photoshop skills, it would be nice to see a map of exactly where those water options are. You're hereby commissioned to produce such a map and make it available here.

Perhaps one is already available? Linky?

Long ago I learned to only drink water from streams away from roads, and only if it's way upstream and were its moving also.
It's better not to drink water were people may have been in it or worse.... take your own water would be the best option.
But if you must make sure you know what your doing, and were its been.

Someone with knowledge of the water options up there, and who has some photoshop skills, it would be nice to see a map of exactly where those water options are. You're hereby commissioned to produce such a map and make it available here.

Perhaps one is already available? Linky?

Have you seen the "SoCal water stop thread" on TFTSNBN?

Have you seen the "SoCal water stop thread" on TFTSNBN?

I've seen that. Many in the Santa Monicas I know about, but there are references to places elsewhere that I don't. Especially in the San Gabriels. Following my own advice, I'm going to create and post a graphic of places in the Santa Monicas I know about.

p.s. I don't know what TFTSNBN means.

There are no water faucets on 39 once you start the climb, the spring coming form the rocks up higher is the only water until you get to Buckhorn Campground and at that point you might as well keep going to Newcomb Ranch.
I'm not sure it is passable yet, it was blocked by snow a couple weeks back, (39, that is.)

I've seen that. Many in the Santa Monicas I know about, but there are references to places elsewhere that I don't. Especially in the San Gabriels. Following my own advice, I'm going to create and post a graphic of places in the Santa Monicas I know about.

p.s. I don't know what TFTSNBN means.

A vague reference to "The love that shall not be named". See, then you're supposed to know to substitute "The forum" for "The love". It should all make sense now. :twitchy:

Or, I could have just said, "this place" (http://www.socalbikeforums.com/index.php).


Trust me, I'm not quitting my day job anytime soon. ;)

the 39 is definitely passable from the crystal lake turnoff all the way to dawson saddle. still plenty of snow but the roads are all clear 'cept for a few sections littered with rocks. but yes, no water available once you start the climb from west fork so bring more than you think you need, esp now that its getting warmer.

Thanks for all the advice. I will bring my little water purification solution and plan to get water at the spring.

I was up there about a month ago and had a heck of a time getting past all the snow. I had to cross several stretches of snow littered with rocks in my biking shoes. The last one had be walking with a steep snow bank on one side and a large cliff on the other with about a 2 foot path to walk on. Then there was the ~5 snow wall I had to descend. After I got past the snow everything was good. This all could have been avoided if I had saved some legs but I didn't have enough in the tank to return to Pasadena via the 2. I figure if I made it through back then it should be much easier now. I just wonder if the partially decomposed deer carcass will still be there. :)

I have been drinking from the spring that is on a switchback at about the 4000ft mark for a while now with no adverse effects. Be sure to drink from the first one you come to not the one closer to the cabin. It's always cold and some of the best tasting water you can find.I would never drink from any of the streams though. There are plenty of animals up there that use the streams to drink and as a toilet.

OK; here is a topo of hwy 39 with the prominant locations identified from East Fork to Islip Saddle, which is the junction with Hwy 2, and west to Cloudburst Summit.

It occurs to me from some of the other posts, that water supplies in the Nat'l Forest Campgrounds are probably still turned off to prevent lines from freezing with over night temps still dropping down to the freezing level. Newcomb's Ranch turns their outside water fountain, at the corner of the porch, off during winter months also.

http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w177/imspec/cycling/Hwy39toAC.jpg

. . . .I would never drink from any of the streams though. There are plenty of animals up there that use the streams to drink and as a toilet. I doubt that wildlife use the streams as a toilet intentionally Bob. Where do you think all that water in the San Gabriel Reservoir comes from, if not the streams that constitute the water shed above it, that provides water supply for the San Gabriel Valley?? No doubt it's been treated and filtered before distribution, but that is where your water comes from all the same my friend. :D

Nice JustMe! As a professional cartographer I applaud your mapping efforts. :thumb:

I would add there is water in the Chilao campground. When riding up ACH from the 210 use the first entrance to Chilao (the entrance near the CHP yard). Take the first left into the campground. The water is just past the trailhead to the Silver Moccasin Trail. We use this water source when mountain biking in the area.

OK; here is a topo of hwy 39 with the prominant locations identified from East Fork to Islip Saddle, which is the junction with Hwy 2, and west to Cloudburst Summit.

It occurs to me from some of the other posts, that water supplies in the Nat'l Forest Campgrounds are probably still turned off to prevent lines from freezing with over night temps still dropping down to the freezing level. Newcomb's Ranch turns their outside water fountain, at the corner of the porch, off during winter months also.

h ttp://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w177/imspec/cycling/Hwy39toAC.jpg

Nice graphic Justme. Thanks. Perhaps you or someone might know the answer to this question. If you go to Google maps and search for Azusa, CA as a starting point, you can view route 39 and 2 areas in great detail using street map, satellite, and terrain. Using terrain and zooming in, the map shows all sorts of names for locations such as La Cienega Spring, White Fur Spring, Windy Spring, Courtleyou Spring, Cedar Snow Spring, Rattlesnake Spring, Reed Spring, Buckhorn Spring... Are all those in fact water springs? Perhaps for those at the higher elevations only after a good rainy season, or for a time after snowmelt season. From what I can tell from the map, the name of the spring on 39 at the 4000 mark is called La Cienega Spring.

From my experience with water springs here in CA and back in OH/PA where I grew up, many have their own water source independent of seasonal precipitation and flow year round. They're no doubt fed by the rainfall and snow melts, but their main source obviously stays full enough year round to keep the spring running. Where I live in Topanga around 1100 feet in elevation there's a spring that runs year round a few hundred feet from my home. Years ago someone built up a concrete catch basin over top of it to collect the water for their water needs via piping and gravity. My survivalist neighbor has considered the same but using a pump to draw the water up to his home. It flows the same amount of water regardless of how much rain we get in the winter.

There's a spring in the Santa Monica mountains along Stunt Road in Calabasas that runs year round. I've filled my water bottles from it. Perhaps some of those springs along the 39 and 2 also run year round.

A vague reference to "The love that shall not be named". See, then you're supposed to know to substitute "The forum" for "The love". It should all make sense now. :twitchy:

Or, I could have just said, "this place" (http://www.socalbikeforums.com/index.php).


Trust me, I'm not quitting my day job anytime soon. ;)

Yes, it all makes sense... except for why that forum was started to begin with. I was never in on that loop or decision making process. I'm sure there were sound reasons.:rolleyes:

Nice JustMe! As a professional cartographer I applaud your mapping efforts. :thumb: . . . .
Thanks MTB; I appreciate the accolade, but as a professional cartographer I'm sure you know the hard part here is all courtesy of USGS and Nat'l Geographic. The few notations added are just to try and help orient others to some landmarks.


. . . . Are all those in fact water springs? Perhaps for those at the higher elevations only after a good rainy season, or for a time after snowmelt season. From what I can tell from the map, the name of the spring on 39 at the 4000 mark is called La Cienega Spring.
. . . .

My experience is that identification of geographic locations generally bear some relationship to surrounding features or local legend. Sometime those features are more or less permenant, sometimes seasonal, sometimes strictly mythical. Is there anywhere in the southwest that doesn't have a "Rattlesnake" something or other?? The spring Bob referred to, that is labeled as "Potable spring water" on the map, does seem to provide year round flow, as does the adjacent Coldbrook Creek, located at around the 4200 ft. level. There are, however, many springs which are only seasonal in nature that may be identified by maps, but only present in spring time. Maybe that's how the season got its name.:D

Yes, it all makes sense... except for why that forum was started to begin with. I was never in on that loop or decision making process. I'm sure there were sound reasons.:rolleyes:

I officially take back my rolling eyes. I was told via PM why "it" was created.

All,

I had a GREAT day out there today. Temps in the morning were nice and cool. I got started about 8:15 in Pasadena. I took California, to Huntington, to Foothill, to the SGRT, to Highway 39. There was minimal road traffic at that time which was nice. I refilled one bottle at the closed OHV pay booth. Taste wasn't great but also worked just fine. The road was close a bit lower that I've seen it in the past.

The lone remaining cabin owner by the spring around the 4,000 foot level was just arriving home as I rolled up. I took the opportunity to stop and talk to her about the water. The owner of a store at Crystal Lake was there helping her with things around the cabin. They both told me there a lot of animals in the area and to use caution. I had 1.5 bottles at that point so I decided to fore go getting water. I had my Klear Water (http://www.klearwater.com/) purification drops just in case though.

They mentioned the plan is to open the road to Crystal Lake in the fall. The guy who owns the store up there mentioned he will be opening a restaurant type place up there tool. This could be a really nice addition to the area. Nice place for a breakfast in the mountains.

Caltrans was driving down at one point and must have been clearing the road becuase the road was totally clear all the way to Highway 2. Neary a rock larger than a marble or snow drift.

Temps really started to cool off on the descent. I put on my wind vest at Newcombs and then arm warmers at Clear Creek. I was really glad I had the arm warmers for the last descent because it was cold.

I brought my camera but it got all fogged up and I didn't take a single photo all day, sorry.

Total Distance: 89.38 miles
Total Ascent: 8,874 feet (Average of Garmin Training Center, Motion Based, ad Geoladders)
Average Speed: 13.1
Total Ride Time: 8:36
Total Moving Time: 6:24
Max Speed: 44.8

MTB, do you ride up there alone often? Did you meet your friend at Newcomb's?
Great ride, I've only done it the other way.

Actually every time I've done this ride it's been alone. I've done it clockwise twice and counter clockwise one. I like counter clockwise best so far. I think because the climb is so peaceful with the road closed. That and getting all the big climbing done before Newcombs is nice. The other way the climb past Newcombs to Cloudburst Summit is SO painful after you stop for lunch.

Yes I did meet my friend. We said we would meet somewhere between 12:30 and 1:00. I ended up getting there at 1:15; 5 hours to the minute from the time I left Pasadena. We I scheduled things I thought no way will it take me the full 5 hours. I can do a flat century in 6, surely I can do 55 miles in under 5. Big difference between doing 20 MPH on the flats and 6 MPH on 9% grade for 15-20 miles.