Touring - Saddle Sores; Cleanliness and Other Approaches

Some people seem to get away with ignoring the cleanliness issue, and don't have problems with saddle sores. Others have experienced extremely bothersome problems with saddle sores and other saddle-related issues.

Some people seem to find it important to be diligent about cleanliness, while others are more lax about it.

One factor might be individual differences in susceptibility or resistance -- and there are probably other factors involved as well.

What are some of the other factors that contribute to saddle sores and other saddle-contact-area problems?

What are the best ways of preventing or staying free of these sorts of problems (which can be severe, and ruin an otherwise fine trip), especially while on extended tours?

I think it's important to wear clean bike shorts each new day of riding. I bring 2 bike shorts when on tour, wash and alternate. I try to get out of the saddle as much as possible as the constant friction of sitting can be irritating. If all else fails, try using one of the biking creams to help alleviate the rubbing.

On my touring bike, I've rotated between three saddles that I ride on daily with my bikes (Brooks B17, Selle San Marco Regal and Selle Italia SLR XP) I actually prefer the XP, but that's personal preference that is rarely the majority opinion.
Best of luck finding the right choice for you, it makes a world of difference to have that comfort all day long.

Keep the area CLEAN.
I add a dab of Hydrocortisone cream before applying chamois creme.

What are some of the other factors that contribute to saddle sores and other saddle-contact-area problems?

How about thousands of vibrations from the road that are transferred to you through your saddle every single hour that you ride?

I think this is the biggest factor in saddle sores. Dirty shorts might make it worse once an open sore has formed.

Recumbent bike riders, for example, do occasionally get a numb ass (recumbent butt), but rarely (never?) get saddle sores.

OTOH, if cleanliness was a major factor, wouldn't thousands of non-cyclists get saddle sores? Homeless people and populations of third world areas without adequate water supply would have the worst saddle sores....right? But they don't, AFAIK.

I've worn the same shorts for 3-4 days at a time while backpacking - I never got saddle sores. Blisters on my feet, yes.

In my experience, saddle sores start after a tiny hair gets pulled out of my ass and the follicle becomes infected by the action of pressure and sweaty shorts. I was a bit of a bum on my last tour and washed infrequently because of the lack of hot, clean water, but from now on I won't leave home without a large pack of wet wipes. Life-savers!

The best way to avoid saddle sore is ......... making sure your bicycle fits and is set up properly for you.

If your bicycle does not fit and/or is not set up properly for you, you have increased your chances of unwanted friction and therefore of saddle sores. If your saddle is too high, you'll rock from side to side. You increase the chances of achilles tendon problems, and also saddle sores where the inside of your legs attach to the torso. If your saddle is too low, you've got all sorts of extra friction going on there, and you increase the chances of knee problems.

Next, you need to make sure you have a saddle that is wide enough for you, but not too wide. Too wide, and it will be rubbing the insides of your legs all the time. Not wide enough and you'll be sitting on your soft bits rather than your sitbones. You need to be able to sit on your sitbones.

Which brings me to the next point: posture. You've got to sit on the bicycle properly in order to avoid saddle sores. I call it "perching". You don't flump into the saddle like you're a sack of potatoes, rather you perch gently on your sitbones. Divide the weight between your sitbones and your feet. Also tuck your pelvis under so that you are indeed sitting on your sitbones, and so that your soft area is slightly raised. This requires a strong core because the way to do it is to suck in your abs which helps you tuck your pelvis under. The stronger your core is, the more comfortable you will be on the bicycle.

Once you've got the bicycle set up properly, and once you're sitting on the bicycle properly, you've just removed most of the chances of developing saddle sores. But a few more tips.

--- Mid-ride, it is a good idea to pull over at a convenience store, or some other place with water, and wash your sitting region, and then pat the area dry with a paper towel. You don't need soap or anything, you just need to wash that area so that you get the salt from your sweat off. Salt is abrasive and you don't want it on your skin. If you don't have access to water, baby wipes will work as well. If the ride is long and hot, you might want to do this more than once ... it feels so good!!

--- Choose good shorts. If you're going with padded cycling shorts, you don't want heaps of padding because that can cause extra friction, but you do want them to fit fairly snuggly or they will move around and cause extra friction. If it is a hot day, you might consider cotton shorts. I have a couple pair of cotton cycling shorts with very light padding which I prefer to use on hot days because they breathe more. If it is a really hot day, you might consider going with just beach shorts or something like that so that the air can flow.

--- Shave! But don't shave the morning of a long ride ... shave a few days before. So in a touring setting, you might want to shave on the Wednesday before you head out on your tour on Saturday. This will give your body a chance to heal. Shave in the shower under running water if you can, use hair conditioner as a shaving cream, and apply zinc oxide cream after if you need to. I'm not talking about shaving the legs, although you might want to do that too. I'm talking about trimming the hair in the entire sitting region down to about 1/2 inch ... and shorter or gone in some areas. You might have to experiment a bit with what works for you. But if the hair in that area is at all long, it gets caught and gets pulled and causes friction and all sorts of problems. It also helps to keep the area clean if there is minimal hair involved. If you are on a long tour, you might need to trim periodically during the tour. Try to do it when you have a day off.

--- If it is pouring rain, you might consider a dab of some sort of chamois cream. It is unnecessary in other conditions but in the rain it does help protect the skin. Think about how your skin gets when you're in the tub for a long time ... that's what you want to avoid, and creams can help with that.

--- When you finish your ride, wash yourself again. The water or baby wipe method you used during the ride will work, or if you have a shower available that would be the way to go. And if you happen to have developed a tiny bit of a rash during the day, apply a bit of zinc oxide cream. That'll clear it right up ... you'll be good to go the next day.

--- If you do happen to develop something which has the potential of becoming a saddle sore, a teensy dab of Ozonol can help nip it in the bud. I always carry Ozonol, it's also good for road rash and other minor skin irritations.

--- As for your shorts, hang them or drape them somewhere so they can air out and dry out as necessary, and they'll also be good to go the next day.



I have cycled 123,524.3 km over the past 19 years .... and I have had only one saddle sore caused by riding in the pouring rain, in loose cycling shorts with too much padding, on a gel saddle. A medley of errors I don't plan to repeat.

OTOH, if cleanliness was a major factor, wouldn't thousands of non-cyclists get saddle sores? Homeless people and populations of third world areas without adequate water supply would have the worst saddle sores....right? But they don't, AFAIK.
Unfortunately, homeless people do have a lot of dermatological issues. Apparently foot problems in particular are quite common in homeless populations. As to 3rd world communities, I'm not an expert but living in a less industrialized society does not necessarily mean they have poor hygiene. And unfortunately, if hygiene really does become a major issue, other factors are likely to do overwhelming damage, e.g. cholera outbreaks.

More to the point, homeless people aren't wearing skin-tight lycra shorts, or spending 8+ hours a day performing an activity that results, for lack of a more discrete term ;), crotch sweat.

On the susceptibility issue: A friend in college developed some kind of skin infection. His doctor told him that it was from wearing dirty pants (he wore his pants for about a week, as I recall, without washing them). I've worn pants longer than that without washing them, though -- as have other people -- without any problems at all.

Part of it is probably just resistance. Some people catch colds or flus more easily than others, and some people seem to have unusually good resistance, even in the same conditions (or same exposure). The same is probably true of various kinds of skin infections and sores.

Some people are much more susceptible to boils than others, too.

And some people sweat much more than others.

***

It's probably not a bad idea to stay clean just in case.

***

Another factor is length of sitting. Whenever there is pressure on one area, from sitting in the same position for too long, the blood supply gets restricted beyond an acceptable level -- the tissues under the pressure point or points can become starved for oxygen. When they are, they are in a somewhat weakened state, and are more prone to infections. They need fresh blood to stay in optimal health and resistance to infections.

This is the explanation dermatologists and other doctors give for the formation of skin ulcers (bedsores) in people who are unable to move, and keep pressure on certain areas -- they often get skin ulcers as a result of the restricted blood supply. The tissues are deprived of fresh blood and oxygen for too long.

Standing occasionally and relieving the pressure (and refreshing the blood supply) could be helpful at times.

I have resorted to a long series of rituals and superstitions before every ride...haha not quite there yet. Someone on this board mentioned getting up off the seat once in awhile, "stand up and pedal", get the weight off your seat. I think that's a great idea which I now practice regularly. When I start to feel some heat or minor irritation, I stand up and pedal for awhile. I've also resorted to a brooks B-17, wet wipes, a dab of neosporin anti bacterial cream in the morning before a ride and in the evening after showering or washing, also clean white loose fitting underwear combined with plain cotton outer shorts. I ditched all the padded biking shorts with the exception of a pair of very thin padded underwear. Somehow for some reason this is working for me.

The best way to avoid saddle sore is ......... making sure your bicycle fits and is set up properly for you.

.

I'm not saying this isn't important but realize that even many professional cyclists end up fighting saddle sores and of course their bike fit is right on.

I tried gel-padded biking shorts with a gel saddle cover, and found that it made for saddle comfort, especially when riding all day long, day after day. It isn't the only solution, but it is one way to go. I spoke with someone else who used this approach (although he used a gel saddle, rather than a gel saddle cover), and even though he was riding 200+ miles on some days, he said it solved his seat-area problems.

***

Brooks saddles seem to chafe less. The leather is slippery enough not to grab and chafe over time, as some of the other materials seem to do. Seams can also cause problems, whether on the saddle or in the clothing.

Once the skin is chafed and broken, things can start getting very very uncomfortable, so I try to avoid this.

If anyone out there has found other approaches that minimize chafing or skin irritation, please feel free to post the ideas.

I tried gel-padded biking shorts with a gel saddle cover, and found that it made for saddle comfort, especially when riding all day long, day after day. It isn't the only solution, but it is one way to go. I spoke with someone else who used this approach (although he used a gel saddle, rather than a gel saddle cover), and even though he was riding 200+ miles on some days, he said it solved his seat-area problems.


I think most cyclists agree that gel is NOT the way to go. Not a bad idea for a beginner who doesn't ride much, but not a good idea for someone who wants to ride lots day after day. Go ask about gel in the Road forum or Long Distance forum and see what the opinions are.

Here's one thread as an example:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=538143
I would not recommend bringing gel shorts on a tour for the reasons mentioned in that thread.

When you sink down into something like gel, you put more pressure and friction on your skin. Ideally you want to perch on your sitbones on your saddle with only minimal contact between your soft areas and the saddle.

------------------------------
Now, another point that Rowan reminded me of last night is that gradually building up to riding lots helps. We both have developed callouses at the end of a season of Randonneuring, as do many other long distance cyclists. If you ride lots, you toughen up the whole sitting area too. Yet another reason to be in shape before a tour!!

I think most cyclists agree that gel is NOT the way to go. Not a bad idea for a beginner who doesn't ride much, but not a good idea for someone who wants to ride lots day after day. Go ask about gel in the Road forum or Long Distance forum and see what the opinions are.

Here's one thread as an example:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=538143
I would not recommend bringing gel shorts on a tour for the reasons mentioned in that thread.

When you sink down into something like gel, you put more pressure and friction on your skin. Ideally you want to perch on your sitbones on your saddle with only minimal contact between your soft areas and the saddle.

Not always true at all. There are saddle designs that take the pressure off. Gel Shorts vary in design as well; and some very experienced cyclists who ride a lot more than those expressing these other opinions favor some of the gel designs. They are a viable way to go if done properly.

Not always true at all. There are saddle designs that take the pressure off. Gel Shorts vary in design as well; and some very experienced cyclists who ride a lot more than those expressing these other opinions favor some of the gel designs. They are a viable way to go if done properly.


All right ... name the cyclists who ride more than 10,000 km a year who use gel ... and name the brands. Show me the articles to back up your claim.



I used a gel saddle cover when I first started Randonneuring, and even did both the RM1200 and PBP with a gel saddle cover, but when I switched to my Brooks life was so much happier. I had my one and only saddle sore with gel and I was getting rashes quite frequently. Not only that, but I started developing nerve issues. Gel doesn't breathe and causes extra pressure.

Soap and water.
And like most dudes, I don't shave down there as mentioned above!
I've never had a saddle sore.

Some information from well-known long distance cyclists:

http://www.ultracycling.com/equipment/points_of_contact.html
http://www.ultracycling.com/equipment/shorts.html

I used a gel saddle cover when I first started Randonneuring, and even did both the RM1200 and PBP with a gel saddle cover, but when I switched to my Brooks life was so much happier. I had my one and only saddle sore with gel and I was getting rashes quite frequently. Not only that, but I started developing nerve issues. Gel doesn't breathe and causes extra pressure.

I would have to respectfully disagree with much of this.

First, gel designs can breathe if designed properly.

I've used them, though I had to (or at least preferred to) alter the shorts I had, and they worked fine for all-day riding for weeks at a time. The gels worked well with a WTB saddle that had a cutout design. Never had any problems with rashes or anything like rashes.

Although somewhat similar, long-distance randonneurs (like you) have different ride schedules and requirements from long-distance touring cyclists, and rarely ride every day for weeks or months or in some cases years on end. The situations are different. Although there is some overlap, it is a different sport, as is road cycling. I see no reason whatsoever to listen to roadies over longterm touring cyclists.

And no, I don't always catalogue the names of the cyclists I meet while on tour, and some of them do find gel to be an excellent solution.

Isolating the pressure to small points is certainly not the only way to go.

Pilots use something like gels; they distribute the pressure rather than isolating it. When the pressure is distributed it is less intense, not more so.

Brooks saddles don't work for everyone either. Different people find different solutions. Gels have worked very well for some touring cyclists I have met, and they have worked for me -- and although they are not the only solution, they are among the solutions that people have found, among others. Individuals are different, and one or more different solutions can work for a given person and situation.

Some information from well-known long distance cyclists:

http://www.ultracycling.com/equipment/points_of_contact.html
http://www.ultracycling.com/equipment/shorts.html
Points of Contact

"What works for one person may not work for another, as physiognomy and riding styles differ so widely."

edited by John Hughes

Although somewhat similar, long-distance randonneurs (like you) have different ride schedules and requirements from long-distance touring cyclists, and rarely ride every day for weeks or months or in some cases years on end. The situations are different. Although there is some overlap, it is a different sport, as is road cycling. I see no reason whatsoever to listen to roadies over longterm touring cyclists.



Well, as a matter of fact, most randonneurs do ride every day for weeks or months or years on end. That's how we train for our events.


I agree that everyone is different, and that different solutions work for different people, and if gel works for you that's great ... it seemed to work for me for a little while too, but now I wouldn't recommend it, and I know a lot of randonneurs (who cycle every day, etc.) who would also not recommend it. Go ahead and ask in the Long Distance forum.

Well, as a matter of fact, most randonneurs do ride every day for weeks or months or years on end. That's how we train for our events.


I agree that everyone is different, and that different solutions work for different people, and if gel works for you that's great ... it seemed to work for me for a little while too, but now I wouldn't recommend it, and I know a lot of randonneurs (who cycle every day, etc.) who would also not recommend it. Go ahead and ask in the Long Distance forum.
A lot of roadies cycle every day, but for a relatively short time -- not the same as touring cyclists who spend many more hours in the saddle.

They often ride before or after work or school (like you), or on weekends. Not the same as extended touring.

Touring interests me much more than randonneuring or its forums.

A lot of roadies cycle every day, but for a relatively short time -- not the same as touring cyclists who spend many more hours in the saddle.

They often ride before or after work or school (like you), or on weekends. Not the same as extended touring.

Touring interests me much more than randonneuring or its forums.

You're mixing up the "roadies" and the "long distance" crowd in your information there. You don't log 10,000 km a year, or 16,000 km a year, or 20,000 km a year, or more, like long distance cyclists do, doing little after work/school rides and a bit of a ride on the weekends.

You're mixing up the "roadies" and the "long distance" crowd in your information there. You don't log 10,000 km a year, or 16,000 km a year, or 20,000 km a year, or more, like long distance cyclists do, doing little after work/school rides and a bit of a ride on the weekends.

Not mixing them up at all. And most of the randonneurs are not in the saddle for nearly as many hours each day as those who are on extended tours. They are safe and comfy at home, with all the amenities, between work or school, and between their local rides and their occasional events.

Not mixing them up at all. And most of the randonneurs are not in the saddle for nearly as many hours each day as those who are on extended tours. They are safe and comfy at home, with all the amenities, between work or school, and between their local rides and their occasional events.

OK, you can believe what you want to believe. :rolleyes:

My number one thing I always do is sleep in the buff. More air flow during the night refreshes everything for the next day.

OK....
Would rather look at the facts, like the fact that fulltime, all-day, extended touring involves many more hours in the saddle. Most randonneuring is not the same at all, and most randonneurs are working or going to school and doing their local rides from home, with occasional events (like you) -- and breaks between events (often long breaks) -- and the experiences and conditions are not the same. :rolleyes:

Most of them are simply not on the road fulltime for extended periods -- weeks and months, day after day.

My number one thing I always do is sleep in the buff. More air flow during the night refreshes everything for the next day.
This sounds like a good approach. Some of these different approaches can probably be combined and add or work together.

Would rather look at the facts, like the fact that fulltime, all-day, extended touring involves many more hours in the saddle. Most randonneuring is not the same at all, and most randonneurs are working or going to school and doing their local rides from home, with occasional events (like you) -- and breaks between events (often long breaks) -- and the experiences and conditions are not the same. :rolleyes:

Most of them are simply not on the road fulltime for extended periods -- weeks and months, day after day.

It's OK. You don't know what you're talking about and the more you say, the more clear that becomes.

Let's just throw out an example:

Cycletourist - rides 50 miles a day, 5 days a week = 250 miles a week.
Randonneur - rides back-to-back centuries on the weekend, a 40 mile ride on a Wednesday, and a couple 25 mile rides = 290 miles a week ... plus work, school, etc.

Cycletourist - does that 50 miles a day, 5 days a week for approx. 2-5 weeks a year
Randonneur - does that 290+ miles a week all summer long from April to August.

Cycletourist - does his/her 250 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions.
Randonneur - does his/her 290 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions.

Where a cycletourist can hop on and do a tour with minimal training, a randonneur needs to train for the events in order to keep the speed up for the distances we ride. There may be breaks between our events, but that doesn't mean we stop riding! And not only that, but many randonneurs incorporate touring with our events. When I went to Australia in 2004 to do the Great Southern Randonnee (1200K), I also toured for 3 months.

I happen to enjoy both types of cycling very much, and think both types of cyclists put in a lot of cycling (especially if the cycletourists are on extended tours or actually train for their tours), but to say that a Randonneur doesn't ride as much as a cycletourist is just uninformed nonsense.

My number one thing I always do is sleep in the buff. More air flow during the night refreshes everything for the next day.

Niles and Machka, you can both now quit bickering as we have a winner. Thanks for playing. :)

It's OK. You don't know what you're talking about and the more you say, the more clear that becomes.

Let's just throw out an example:

Cycletourist - rides 50 miles a day, 5 days a week = 250 miles a week.
Randonneur - rides back-to-back centuries on the weekend, a 40 mile ride on a Wednesday, and a couple 25 mile rides = 290 miles a week ... plus work, school, etc.

Cycletourist - does that 50 miles a day, 5 days a week for approx. 2-5 weeks a year
Randonneur - does that 290+ miles a week all summer long from April to August.

Cycletourist - does his/her 250 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions.
Randonneur - does his/her 290 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions.

Where a cycletourist can hop on and do a tour with minimal training, a randonneur needs to train for the events in order to keep the speed up for the distances we ride. There may be breaks between our events, but that doesn't mean we stop riding! And not only that, but many randonneurs incorporate touring with our events. When I went to Australia in 2004 to do the Great Southern Randonnee (1200K), I also toured for 3 months.

I happen to enjoy both types of cycling very much, and think both types of cyclists put in a lot of cycling (especially if the cycletourists are on extended tours or actually train for their tours), but to say that a Randonneur doesn't ride as much as a cycletourist is just uninformed nonsense.
Nonsense, Machka.

There are multiple errors and falsehoods in your post and in your thinking, with all due respect.

First, there is the fallacy of thinking in terms of miles rather than hours (among other factors).

Then,

"Cycletourist - rides 50 miles a day, 5 days a week = 250 miles a week."

This may be your touring schedule, but it is not shared by all.

And,

"Randonneur - rides back-to-back centuries on the weekend, a 40 mile ride on a Wednesday, and a couple 25 mile rides = 290 miles a week ... plus work, school, etc."

When was the last time you did this, Machka??

Do all randonneuring cyclistas keep up this schedule??

Week after week and month after month??

And how long does it take to do forty miles on an unloaded bike?

Wednesdays??

"25-mile rides"??

"Work, school, etc." -- with *that* one would have to agree, for it is a fact for most randonneuring cyclistsas.

"Cycletourist - does his/her 250 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions.
Randonneur - does his/her 290 miles a week on highways in the country in all sorts of conditions."

Or the cyclotourist does more, for many more hours, and the randonneur does less and for many fewer hours. There are all kinds of variations. Extended fulltime touring is different from part-time randonneuring/working/going to classes/"etc."

Randonneurs are not on fulltime extended tours. If they are, then they are touring. Please don't conflate the two.

There are some other mistakes and misunderstandings as well, which I may address later. Please try to make more accurate and better points, Machka. I don't have time to address so many inaccuracies and miscontructions.

My number one thing I always do is sleep in the buff. More air flow during the night refreshes everything for the next day.

Yes, and I find that wearing loose boxers does the same sort of thing. :) And if I happen to need to use a bit of zinc oxide, it doesn't get everywhere, the boxers keep it contained.

I usually try to change out of my cycling attire shortly after arriving at my destination, and into loose baggy clothes so that the whole airflow thing has a chance to work.

"Cycletourist - does that 50 miles a day, 5 days a week for approx. 2-5 weeks a year
Randonneur - does that 290+ miles a week all summer long from April to August."

These are supposed to be accurate or widely applicable numbers somehow?

"Where a cycletourist can hop on and do a tour with minimal training, a randonneur needs to train for the events in order to keep the speed up for the distances we ride. There may be breaks between our events...."

This depends on the individual -- sometimes the training is more rigorous on the other side; and it is time in the saddle that is the more significant issue, not training.


"...but to say that a Randonneur doesn't ride as much as a cycletourist is just uninformed nonsense."

(1) It's only nonsense if you misread or misconstrue it -- which you continue to do.

(2) It is not even the meaning of what I said.

(3) Fulltime extended tours typically involve more time in the saddle over longer periods of time, with fewer and shorter breaks; and they also take place away from home and its amenities -- also for extended periods of time. Simple facts.

I ride a couple of hundred miles a week training for triathlon. Teach spin classes all winter on bikes with seats that are not that great. . I have never personally used a gel seat/cover or gel shorts. The gel covers that are at the gym seem to last about a month maybe before they are destroyed, so not too sure how they would hold up on a tour. Touring/ riding I find the best thing are good quality bike shorts, keeping the area clean and dry, and never wearing my shorts more then one day without washing them. The only time I get saddle sores are early in the spring when riding in wet weather or if I up my milage significantly early in the season. I find that treating it early with an antibiotic cream seems to clear them up overnight enough to not cause problems the next day
ymmv
Cheers

I average 340 miles a week.
Keep it clean.

Niles, settle down ...



I've asked you this before and have got no response so I'll ask again. Do you have a website, or blog, or log on crazyguy, or any actual personal tour reports? Do you have photos of you posing by your bicycle while overlooking some scenic vista you've seen on tour? Anything to show us about your tours or rides you've done?

I think Rondo is pretty similar to long distance touring. Similar enough to be of interest on something like this. You can find people out there touring the world on a penny farthing, and doubtless many on gel, If you see my wife out there she is the one on a 35 dollar bike from Goodwill. I just find gel terribly uncomfortable.

I think one thing that could be a risk factor for saddle sores would be tropical conditions. Anyone experience that? I have been so stuck in the north I don't have that as a worry, purely a curiousity.

Randonneur/tourer/commuter/roadie: I gotta think most of us wear all of these hats(helmets) at one time or another. I've do all 4 every year. Training is the same...I get on a bike as often as possible and ride for as long as possible and sometimes I even try to ride fast as possible:)

Someone said bike set-up and that includes saddle height. I know that. For sure. Once you get sores—surgical scrub soap. Everyday. Cleanliness is next to the saddle. Gel in the shorts isn't a great idea, neither are thick gel saddles. Your sit bones force gel out of their way and it packs itself into other places—not a good thing.

To each their own. Just my two cents. Machka's first post on the topic was pretty right on, I thought.

Think you two could get a room, or just get back to the topic at hand?

Think you two could get a room, or just get back to the topic at hand?

They seem to be done, no need to worry.

To All,

Here is one of the best things I have found so far, written by an MD (Mayo Clinic):

http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cache:HPPDVakL88kJ:www.liquicell.com/assets/pdf/Saddle%2520Sores%2520(P.%2520Kortebein).pdf (http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cache:HPPDVakL88kJ:www.liquicell.com/assets/pdf/Saddle%2520Sores%2520%28P.%2520Kortebein%29.pdf)

On page seven he discusses tests showing beneficial results with gel- and liquid-filled saddle surfaces, and explains why they might be beneficial.

He explains the importance of cleanliness. And he also goes into the variety of factors that can contribute to saddle sores. He seems to take an approach that includes a good understanding of the causes and progression of tissue damage, and the understanding that this can be helpful or beneficial in dealing with these issues.

Niles and Machka, you can both now quit bickering as we have a winner. Thanks for playing. :)


Agreed. Thank you robow.

Okay I've been beckoned onto this thread to clean it up a tad. You all know that I don't come on here too often because I try to leave everyone alone and when bickering comes to a head I figure it would burn itself out.

Please keep in mind that due to everyone's individual experiences - touring, randonneuring, road cycling - different things work for different people. If someone is saying what is best for them, there is no need to ask for proof or try to call someone out. What works for someone may not work for another. Different body types, saddles, sweat issues, and time in the saddle all contribute to the problem.

Let's come together and give each other tips on how to alleviate it.

I've cleaned this thread up and I really don't want to be asked to come do it again so if we can please cooperate with each other that would be appreciated.

Thank you

Siu Blue Wind
Forum Admin.

Thank you.

***

Dr. Patrick Kortebein's article is fascinating. It is the best thing I've seen on this topic. Since finding it yesterday, and re-reading it, I've come to appreciate it even more.

What he says about shear and adventitious bursae is much more insightful than anything else I've seen on those topics (which are usually completely ignored). I'd like to learn more about these issues.

Here is part of what he says,

It is also conceivable that the ischial bursae may
become more like adventitious bursae; by accumulating more synovial fluid over
time, they may be better able to accommodate the extra pressure and shear forces
associated with cycling. Professional cyclists have been noted to develop fluid-
filled cysts of their perineum that may be a similar adaptation.

Fascinating stuff.

There may be more around somewhere, maybe in medical journals.

Soap and water.
And like most dudes, I don't shave down there as mentioned above!
I've never had a saddle sore.

After soap and water I further clean with 91% isopropyl alcohol as a disinfectant (70% isopropyl is used to cleanse the skin prior to a blood draw). I haven't had a saddle sore in years since doing this.

BTW, I also use the alcohol as a deodorant. Dries quickly with no residual scent, and is somewhat refreshing due to the cooling by evaporation. I haven't heard of any complaints. :innocent:

There once was a TV commercial for a deodorant with a person on camera stating that "I don't use *** deodorant and I have a perfect home life," to which an off-camera voice asked, "You live alone, don't you?." :rolleyes:

All of this cleanliness thing is a cultural thing and not a necessity to avoid problems IMO. I like to get a shower when I can and it is nice to put on clean shorts, but going 5 or more days without isn't a problem.

As someone already said airing out the area is important. Getting into loose clothing after the ride helps immensely as does sleeping either in the buff or in something loose enough to allow good airflow. If any little heat rash, chafing, or other sore spots do crop up some zinc oxide based diaper cream worn overnight nips the problem in the bud.

At least that is what has worked for me.

All of this cleanliness thing is a cultural thing and not a necessity to avoid problems IMO. I like to get a shower when I can and it is nice to put on clean shorts, but going 5 or more days without isn't a problem.

As someone already said airing out the area is important. Getting into loose clothing after the ride helps immensely as does sleeping either in the buff or in something loose enough to allow good airflow. If any little heat rash, chafing, or other sore spots do crop up some zinc oxide based diaper cream worn overnight nips the problem in the bud.

At least that is what has worked for me.


+1

Especially that bit about it being a cultural thing. Even as short a time period ago as the 1970s having baths once or twice a week was considered normal ... the Saturday night bath so you were nice and fresh for Sunday and the start of the week! The whole business of showering everyday is a very recent thing.

All right ... name the cyclists who ride more than 10,000 km a year who use gel ... and name the brands. Show me the articles to back up your claim.



I used a gel saddle for years and really liked it. I started our last trip with it and rode about 5 or 6 thousand miles with it until the nose broke off and I had to replace it. I got a Terry saddle to replace it with and HATED it!! Now I got a Brooks for this trip and, while I like the Brooks just fine, I really do wish I had my get saddle back!

I used a gel saddle for years and really liked it. I started our last trip with it and rode about 5 or 6 thousand miles with it until the nose broke off and I had to replace it. I got a Terry saddle to replace it with and HATED it!! Now I got a Brooks for this trip and, while I like the Brooks just fine, I really do wish I had my get saddle back!

You can get gel covers. During my first few months with the Brooks, I carried a gel cover with me on long rides, just in case I might need it.

If you do go that route you will have to adjust your saddle height a bit.

I'm used tothe Brooks now and wouldn't bother with a gel cover - but I have to say that old gel saddle I had was way m ore comfortable than this Brooks will ever be!

I'm used tothe Brooks now and wouldn't bother with a gel cover - but I have to say that old gel saddle I had was way m ore comfortable than this Brooks will ever be!

Mine gel saddle was good for about 2 years, and I wondered why people would ever want to go with a Brooks ... then all of a sudden I started developing wicked sciatic pain when I rode. I could barely ride any distance at all and my back and leg would be in agony. I got the Brooks because I figured it couldn't make the situation any worse. It was great, and I haven't had a trace of sciatic pain in the 5 years I've been riding the Brooks.

The gel was cushy, and there have been moments when I've wanted a bit of cushiness, but for some reason the gel also put too much pressure on the wrong places.

+1

Especially that bit about it being a cultural thing. Even as short a time period ago as the 1970s having baths once or twice a week was considered normal ... the Saturday night bath so you were nice and fresh for Sunday and the start of the week! The whole business of showering everyday is a very recent thing.

No, I remember the 70s and we bathed every day back then too.
Daily bathing became popular with the advent of interior plumbing and hot water heaters.