"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - to buy or not to buy? carbon wheels

looking to upgrade from my 1800+gr easton vistas. i have a good deal on a set of used a/c carbon 38's. 1134gr. they have tufo tires on them. the only other thing i would hold out for is a set of 404's. i am not very big and was wondering if the 404's would be to much to handle if it was a heavy cross wind? any input is valued if you have any experience.

Soul 4.0s. Not carbon, not expensive, not terribly heavy.

looking to upgrade from my 1800+gr easton vistas. i have a good deal on a set of used a/c carbon 38's. 1134gr. they have tufo tires on them. the only other thing i would hold out for is a set of 404's. i am not very big and was wondering if the 404's would be to much to handle if it was a heavy cross wind? any input is valued if you have any experience.

If these will be your everyday wheels, I would recommend against it...but it's up to you. Some people claim to race, train and ride their carbon fiber wheels with no issues, but one guy on a team I raced for cracked his in two races.

I second the Soul 4.0's.

My soul 4.0s got scratched today in the pickup bed of the truck I was hitching a ride in to the race. It's not structural but it might have been with the carbon wheels if it had gone through the clearcoat.

How much did you pay for your Souls? I'm thinking of getting a set for my Giant.

Does BF have a group buy for 'em?

How much are the A/C's?

I got my Souls for ~ $420, shipped.

For how many times I see wheel threads and how many times it ends up with people saying SOUL S4.0s....we should really have a group buy. I would buy a pair then :P

they're already dirt cheap.

What is cheaper than dirt then?

sponsorship?

So who is going to write the letter to SOUL for BF to be sponsored by them?

Enjoy that...

I've got a pair of Ritchey wheels (they use Zipp 404 rims) and they aren't all too bad in a heavy cross wind, I weigh 140lbs. On the really windy days I'll be hesitant about riding them, but I usually do anyways.

Sadly, I'm probably going to sell them to get money to buy a mnt bike.

They're fine in crosswinds, I weight 145 pounds and the only time I have trouble is when gusts get about 25mph, but even then, deep wheels are not bad in the wind.

Seems like a group buy would be good if it could wack some of the $65 shipping off.

The AC's are rebranded Zipp rims. I blew apart two AC tubulars on one pothole. Many others have done the same. They are comparatively fragile.

With that, 38's will be quite managable in crosswinds for most riders.

How much are the A/C's?


$650 canadian dollars but i need to put a shimano freehub on them.. also they would only be my race wheels.

Would SOUL S4.0s be okay for fat people like me? I weigh 190ish and feel like they will just fold under me.

If you train on the tall wheels, you'll be able to ride them in relatively windy conditions. I rode TriSpokes (now HED3s) in steady 50 mph winds, 80 mph gusts, at about 150 lbs (Hurricane George, FL). Granted, I was riding with only two other people, both friends. In more real-world situations, I've regularly raced TriSpokes, 404s, and DV46s in sustained 20-30 mph winds with gusts up to 40-50 mph in tight crits.

The only time I have difficulty with taller rims (over 30 mm) is in unpredictable gusty conditions, like when big trucks pass really close on a descent while I'm going, say, 40-45 mph. Or strong wind around a big building where you get a funnel effect and insanely gusty winds even in relatively quiet conditions.

Re: Weight: Usually higher weight riders (which I consider myself to be) have two concerns with wheels - durability and stiffness.

I rode the same (i.e. literally the same pair) wheels when I was well into the 190s in weight, perhaps 8 years later. I also rode Spinergys (Rev-X), I think the first gen Eurus. Riding technique is most important - proper technique will save wheels from impact damage while incorrect technique will trash even strong ones. At 130 lbs I could flatspot a wheel if I hit something wrong, but I could also bunnyhop something correctly and not trash a wheel when I was 60+ lbs heavier. In fact, I bought the TriSpokes from a Junior that flatspotted/dented the aluminum rim when he hit a pothole at high speed. For more extreme examples, think of the Trials riders who jump from 5 or 10 feet up - with incorrect technique their wheels would fold too, but they have that stuff down. A Cannondale engineer (now with Spec) used to jump road bikes off a stone wall at the Cdale headquarters. Again, proper technique let him do such stuff.

Flex-wise the lighter wheels will be a bit more flexible, but I don't think that makes a huge difference in the scheme of things. The TriSpokes, for example, aren't that stiff, but that didn't deter me from using them in crits and such.

cdr

^

last nights race had 70kph winds.

because there was also rain forecast, i opted to put my ksyrium on front, instead of my token.

it was a good call - got slapped by a gust out of nowhere, which created a brief, but dodgy moment.

I would probably go for 50mm or more, then just use them in milder conditions, using your vistas for very windy races if you can't learn how to handle the deeper rim by then.

The AC rear hub is light and cheap. It has a reputation for fragility which is largely due to a bad batch of innards from a supplier 3-4 years ago. AC handled it pretty well.

The problem I have with the hub is the narrow flange width. AC does it so that the spoke tension is less unequal, but it makes for a very flexy wheel. I'm all of 143 lbs and when I stand, I can bounce the rear rim off the brake blocks at will (on 32 spoke AC350s). Whether that's a problem for you depends on your riding and pedalling style.

Soul 4.0s. Not carbon, not expensive, not terribly heavy.

The S 3.0 SLs appear to be the new sweet deal to me. Not quite as aero, no, but still pretty aero, 1450g (according to the web site) and cheaper than the 4.0s.

Eh, sure. 30mm to 41mm is a significant difference though. The weight isn't really an issue.

Eh, sure. 30mm to 41mm is a significant difference though. The weight isn't really an issue.

230 grams is a fairly large difference, being close to a pound. And I might as well face the fact that I only get top 5s when my races finish uphill. Keep in mind that I'm thinking about those wheels as an only wheelset; if I were in the position of getting a second set of wheels for racing, I would get something like Reynolds Assaults or DV46Cs, depending upon how much money I had available. If I already have (say) a 30mm wheelset for racing and training and only have $500 to spend, I might as well save my money for all the good that extra 11mm will do me.

230 grams is a fairly large difference, being close to one half a pound. .
fixed

looking to upgrade from my 1800+gr easton vistas. i have a good deal on a set of used a/c carbon 38's. 1134gr. they have tufo tires on them. the only other thing i would hold out for is a set of 404's. i am not very big and was wondering if the 404's would be to much to handle if it was a heavy cross wind? any input is valued if you have any experience.

This evaluation might be worth consulting since it includes the 404s and your vistas: http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-15087917.html

The 'Sonic Super 50' wheels in that article are the 50mm Gigantex taiwanese-made rims that are used by blackwell research, token, edge, planet x, etc. Less than a watt difference between those and the 404's and less than half the price too.

fixed

:o I swear, I'm usually better at the conversions. Still significant, I say!

:o I swear, I'm usually better at the conversions. Still significant, I say!

To that, I raise you a 'meh'...

Significant on the scale, but not really anywhere else...