"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - I raced. We all got screwed.

Ride Sally Ride crit.

Early crash left one rider with hamburger on his face. I'm surfing the front with 17 laps to go, when the lap counter suddenly reads "1" and the bell goes off. Refs say "LAST LAP".

I keep at the front and sprint for a 4th place finish. w00t.

As I'm loading my bike, teammates yell at me "HEY MAN, the 4's are lining up!"

wtf?

Chief ref (who I think is a forum member) says that when the ambulance was called, he heard "7 to go" over the radio and not "17 to go" which is why they decided to end the race.

We're restarting with 10 to go. I have no matches left.

Pack finish.

I was in the cat 5 race and there was a monster crash that happened directly behind me, one guy broke his wrist and another went off in a stretcher.

yeah I heard there was a pretty bad one in the 8:45am 5 race.

In two races, people crashed on the straight section following turn 1. How anyone crashes on a straightaway is beyond me.

In two races, people crashed on the straight section following turn 1. How anyone crashes on a straightaway is beyond me.

Overlapped wheels touching? Mechanical problems?

That happened here in April in a masters race. They said last lap but it was really 3 to go. They lined most everyone back up for 3 more laps. So I guess who ever won was screwed. A pretty major race to with big prize money.

This is the second time this season that the local refs have messed up a race finish due to inaccurate lap count.

At a crit back in April, the refs rang the bell but didn't flip the lap counter until half the field was through.

So the first half thought it was a prime. The second half thought it was the bell lap.

Confusion ensued.

just file it under "that's racin'".

yeah I heard there was a pretty bad one in the 8:45am 5 race.

In two races, people crashed on the straight section following turn 1. How anyone crashes on a straightaway is beyond me.

Good question. Way back when, I was in a 5 man break in a road race with a few miles to go. I was at the back when guy #3 crashed and took us down ..... geesh. I think he touched wheels while looking down at his water bottle.

Here's my take of the Cat 4 events, mixing fact with opinion:

About 2 laps in the pace is slow so I set myself up at the front. Perfect. I look at Martin (Bike Rack) and him and I jump in a break together. As I'm in a break, and a kid (literally 13 year old) got taken out in the peloton. Someone ran him over and gashed his head open with their chainring.

The race SOMEHOW continues even though they'd called an ambulance and EMTs are blocking the right two lanes after the turn, in everyone's line after bombing that fast turn. In my opinion when the ambulance was called, this should have been neutralized. We now have to turn from 4 lanes to basically 1.5 lanes and they're blocking the outside line out of the turn. They're protecting the kid by aiming the other 89 guys right at him. Dumb.

About 5 laps later, I'm back in the pack and an idiot next to me gives a guy who was going backwards a shove forward so he wouldn't hit his wheel. Luckily it didn't affect me but the idiot swerved back and left, and 2 or 3 guys crash from that mayhem. Now we have a crash between turn 1 and 2 and still the kid with a gashed head immediately after turn 2.

The race continues, although the guys in the recent crash get out of the way quickly. After a lap or two, we pass the start/finish and they announce, with 17 laps to go, that we have ONE lap to go in the RACE.

I bolt up the outside, finding one of my teammate's wheel with half a lap left, somehow. Having gassed myself to get up to the front in 1/2 lap, he lead me out to perfection before the final turn but in the wind I got passed by 5 guys (one was bdcheung). I'm 6th, my boy Dan takes 7th behind me.

After this, about ten minutes pass and they clear the course. People are taking team pics and getting undressed, kissing their children thankful to be alive and they call the Cat 4s back to the line to re-start the race. They're calling the last sprint a "prime." WHAT THE (expletive)?!?!?!

We are now going to race 10 laps for the finish. Somehow, the 17 laps we just raced - and they did say "one to go" for the race, not prime - are now going to count as nothing compared to these 10 laps they're adding on.

Horsesh*t. I was covering a break for those first 4 of ten, then re-found my positioning with 1-2 to go. In the last corner, and idiot from BBC (black/pink kit?) takes a turn wide and nearly puts me into the curb, with another teammate on my wheel. I pedaled across the line softly, pissed off at the entire situation. I finished 25th because I wasn't going to add to the mayhem of f*cktards sprinting for umpteenth place.

If you didn't race you missed nothing. I'm sorry for the WWVC guys because it's a great event, but as soon as the ambulance was called and the course was blocked, refs should have neutralized it (think Tyson's, we took a neutral lap, then restarted).

On a personal level, I'm mad because now my top ten finish from the first part of the race is worth nothing. Holy hell this was a dumb race because of bad decisions. I understand there was a miscommunication because the ref heard 7 laps to go instead of 17 laps, so he called the race, but that was too late to make things safer anyways (in fact creating more chaos on that first final lap). And what the hell was the point of the last 10 laps? To let us "race more?" Bull.

I talked to the ref (was that fatguyracer? If so, fatguy, I'm the NCVC guy that talked to you after the race). In hindsight, I should have actually protested so my top ten counted for something. I'm really sorry for guys like bdcheung that should have been in the money on the first race, then get screwed in the second race. WTF. They counted the first race for BAR points, but nobody cares about BAR points anyways.

If you have to call an ambulance and you know it's going to get on the course, neutralize the darn race immediately. I hope that kid's ok...

both my bad crashes have been in straight sections. very frustrating

Wow. Sorry guys. That effing blows and I understand your frustrations, but hey, at least you guys all walked away from the race with all your skin still attached. Any word on the kid?

I did do the 35+ 4/5 race earlier in the day, and there was big wreck there too - it seemed like 10 guys went down. But it doesn't seem like a big deal compared what you guys are saying about the 5 and 4 crashes. I'm really glad I sat out of the 4 race now...

For a simple, wide course, there sure were a lot of riders going down today. This is making me want to take up something safer like free diving.

RudeSiggy pretty much hit the nail on the head.

I held my position well in the W4 race, and I had a good sprint for once (except for my rear wheel jumping 3 times). I passed a ton of people and wound up 4th. I would've been 3rd, but I decided not to risk killing the junior swerving in front of me near the line--I was trying to avoid shooting by in the gutter. I yelled at her, but she was suffering too badly to notice or do much about it, so I looked around at the field and backed off. Her dad talked to me after the race, and he admitted that that's where the kid tends to be pretty dangerous. Uh, yeah, work on that.

Then I tooled around on the W&OD some more until the men's 4 race. What a sh**show.

just file it under "that's racin'".

...twice.

I held my position well in the W4 race, and I had a good sprint for once (except for my rear wheel jumping 3 times). I passed a ton of people and wound up 4th. I would've been 3rd, but I decided not to risk killing the junior swerving in front of me near the line--I was trying to avoid shooting by in the gutter. I yelled at her, but she was suffering too badly to notice or do much about it, so I looked around at the field and backed off. Her dad talked to me after the race, and he admitted that that's where the kid tends to be pretty dangerous. Uh, yeah, work on that.

Then I tooled around on the W&OD some more until the men's 4 race. What a sh**show.

There needs to be something done about juniors who can't hang racing with the big folks. I've been in races with kids who couldn't be much more than 10, and they were incredibly dangerous. Weaving all over the place, way off the pace, etc.

If they're fast enough and can handle their bikes, fine. But I think the officials take pity on them and leave them in races that they really have no place in. In a crit they should be pulled when they're lapped, they're dangerous when you're closing on them at 10 mph speed differential and they're weaving. In a road race it usually takes care of itself.

You gotta keep those races stretched out. It won't eliminate crashes, but it sure helps. If it bunches up, someone from your team needs to head to the front and get things going (either off the front or on it). EDR did this for us last week, and enabled a safe sprint for everyone, just by dragging the field around at 28mph for a lap.

You gotta keep those races stretched out. It won't eliminate crashes, but it sure helps. If it bunches up, someone from your team needs to head to the front and get things going (either off the front or on it). EDR did this for us last week, and enabled a safe sprint for everyone, just by dragging the field around at 28mph for a lap.

+1

I learned that in an early season crit this year. Sometimes it pays to string things out, even if you have to burn a couple matches to do it.

Dunno, WR, this race was pretty strung out during both of the first 2 crashes. I am becoming truly amazed by some of the things people can do to cause crashes when it seems almost impossible to do so. I was the rider on Siggy's wheel when the guy cut across his wheel in the last turn and almost took both of us out. I don't even know where he came from, we were so far on the outside of everyone else on the exit of that turn, and not more than 10 riders form the front.

I am really just getting the impression that people don't know WTF they are doing and don't care.

And I agree about the juniors, although in today's case I don't think the junior who got the crap end of that crash caused it.

You gotta keep those races stretched out. It won't eliminate crashes, but it sure helps. If it bunches up, someone from your team needs to head to the front and get things going (either off the front or on it). EDR did this for us last week, and enabled a safe sprint for everyone, just by dragging the field around at 28mph for a lap.

this. I did the cat 3 and 35+, both had about 28 mph avg. speed and never felt a bit of danger in either one. I watched the M4 and M4/5 35+, both were bunched up every time the race came through the S/F area (that I observed). this makes it dangerous on non-technical fast courses as folks get on the rivet but can still hang on and unskilled racers who often are otb are still there making a mess of things.

tough day for the officials, no camera for the M3 race, which ended in a bunch kick, and the M4 mess. oh well, at the end of the day, it's just a bike race.

bd and siggy - take the lemons and make lemonade, you now both know that you can finish well in a race, even though this one didnt count. now go and do it again, lots of opportunities over the next 1.5 months. :)

I've always known I can finish well in a race... when half the field doesn't think the race is finished!

I've always known I can finish well in a race... when half the field doesn't think the race is finished!

;)

Sorry about the situation...a little strange too!

I was working turn 3 in both of those races - actually perdy much all day except for when I was racing. The first one (8:45am race?) was on the straight. That was a cluster in many ways - right up to the rescue captain turning around his car ON THE COURSE and going the wrong way INTO the race traffic. Scared the bizness right out of me - but he was strung pretty tight when I tried to sum up the current situation for him when he got on the scene. I appreciate their help, but dude... it's a broken wrist and a broken finger, hardly the worst case scenario of cycling accidents.

The crash in the 4 race happened because (I think) the kid (who actually does pretty well in the 4's usually) got over ambitious on the turn 2 and put himself in the curb before getting run over. I'm definitely in the "feel bad" category for the 4's on this one. Hell, we had a guy off the front when they told us "we're calling this the bell lap" and he sat up thinking it was a prime. In any case, I agree that (regardless of lap count) - neutralizing and restarting with the existing break would have been more sensible, but that's not based on my knowledge of the rules. That was a tough call all around - and I'm sure there will be a ton of Monday morning quarterbacking on it.

As for race reports - the cat 3 race was reasonably smooth. It was consistently fast. My legs had been dead all week so I planned to work for a teammate. We never matched up toward the end and the plan just fell apart. No crashes, but there were some close calls out of that fast turn two near the gutter. Camera malfunctioned, they worked results from the riders.

1-2-3 race - fast from start to finish. There was a break up the road for a while, but it got sucked back in with like 20-25 to go (of 48 laps). Nothing else got away, and DC velo pretty much controlled the field the rest of the race. I hadn't planned on doing the 1/2/3 so I just used it as an exercise in pack movement at very high speed. The 1/2/3 race averaged just shy of 29 mph for the 1 hr 3 min of racing. The pack was a constant reshuffling and holding good position seemed to be getting everyone.

DC Velo finished it off by running an 8 man leadout for Ken Young through 3 to go to the end.

Thanks all for coming out and racing - even with the technical difficulties. It's definitely a fun course to race, and making left turns felt like being back in Japan!

Edited: one crash in the 1/2/3 - one of my teammates went down in turn 2 when his back wheel locked - bad hub or something. He was only about halfway through the turn and the back wheel just stopped spinning and the sound of brand new Derosa sliding across pavement was the inevitable next step. He came away with a good welt and some road rash, but all in all - not a really big deal.

The Cat 5 men crash was a pretty big one and there were a couple guys that ate it pretty hard (hope they are ok). I was about 5 riders back from the front when I heard what sounded like a tire exploding, then just sounds of brakes and frames scrapping the ground. Next lap we come around and see the wrecks and it was definitely not pretty, one guy was just sitting on the ground looking dazed. After the race was over I was talking with my friend who was there being a rep for Blue Comp. cycles, and noticed the firetruck and then 2 guys sitting on the massage tabels getting looked at.

From what I heard happened, on the 2nd turn about mid way threw the feild, a group of riders took the turn wide. They decided then to dart across everyone to get back in the line, cause up front we started to move to the left. Someone got clipped and then everything just unfolded.

Definitely were a couple other close moments that I heard about, but up front things were fairly smooth for us. Ended up getting 11th which was not great but all things considered good (last 3 days off rehabbing stringed calf)

Crits suck. They're too dangerous. Y'all are mostly amateurs and with real jobs or families or school as primary duties. No need for such risks. Why on earth we here in the USA do so much crit racing and so little road racing is beyond me. Ya'll gots big cahones, that's all I know. Real men with lots of courage.

There are plenty of crashes in road races too. It's not the course, its just racing. A bunch of strong, aggressive guys trying to win a race. Sometimes it results in crashes.

Our most dangerous race around here (in my opinion, of course) is actually on the Portland International Raceway circuit. Wide open, car race (read: gentle) corners, glassy smooth pavement, 2 mile circuit... you wouldn't think that it'd be dangerous at all. But the open course promotes risk taking, and there have been some pretty horrific crashes out there.

That's just weird. Around here they say point blank that the lap cards don't really mean crap. When you hear the bell that's your last lap no matter how long you have been racing or what the counter says. They always use a different bell for primes so there is usually no mistaking it.

....that and I can't recall us ever restarting a race.

Up here they would have called it done. Hell the next race would have been a few laps in already.

There needs to be something done about juniors who can't hang racing with the big folks. I've been in races with kids who couldn't be much more than 10, and they were incredibly dangerous. Weaving all over the place, way off the pace, etc.

If they're fast enough and can handle their bikes, fine. But I think the officials take pity on them and leave them in races that they really have no place in. In a crit they should be pulled when they're lapped, they're dangerous when you're closing on them at 10 mph speed differential and they're weaving. In a road race it usually takes care of itself.

She could hang. There was no reason to pull her. She got third, and wouldn't have been worse than 4th if I passed her. I'm not even sure I would have gotten all the way in front of her by the line, but I was thought about that video of the Tradezone crash and was too timid to pull alongside her after I saw her swerve badly twice as I gained on her. It was just that when she was red-lining it in the last 50 meters or so that she totally fell apart. On course with a larger field or fewer than 4 lanes to work with, it could've been really bad.

You gotta keep those races stretched out. It won't eliminate crashes, but it sure helps...

I can confidently say I did my job there! Of the 14 one kilometer laps we did (including both starts), I spent at least half of that at the front pulling/chasing a break, or in a breakaway myself.

Actually, the most dangerous part of the race is when they spontaneously announced "1 to go" and everyone swarmed like madmen (myself included). I don't know how there weren't any incidents on that first last lap, because it was a 6-person wide gaggle at 30+ mph and everyone had been caught off guard (no real lead-outs).

That's why I'm mad. The refs made things more dangerous.

that's why we do all our crits here in so cal on time instead of laps, because we KNOW our officials can't count, you guys have to figure it out the hard way...

One time I was watching the p/1/2 field come in and there was a lead group of like 15 guys. No big deal right? It was a successful break. About 3 minutes later everyone else rolled in and the were saying they were about to catch the break and the lead police officer took a wrong turn, lead them off course for several minutes before figuring it out.

Sh1t happens. Sucks but what can you do.


Crits suck. They're too dangerous. Y'all are mostly amateurs and with real jobs or families or school as primary duties. No need for such risks. Why on earth we here in the USA do so much crit racing and so little road racing is beyond me. Ya'll gots big cahones, that's all I know. Real men with lots of courage.

I don't know the stats but it seems from my experience that there are just as many crashes in road races as in crits and the ones in the road races tend to be worse. And crashes seem to happen more on straight roads too. Everyone is at least focused on corners but on the straights people tend to drift off.

I don't know the stats but it seems from my experience that there are just as many crashes in road races as in crits and the ones in the road races tend to be worse. And crashes seem to happen more on straight roads too. Everyone is at least focused on corners but on the straights people tend to drift off.

Yeah, I'd say there are an equal number of crashes. I would guess that most of them don't happen in a particular sort of road, but just when there's the most movement within the pack (guys swarming around other guys, etc.). Lots of the crashes I've seen in corners are just one guys overcooking things and taking himself out.

Sh1t happens. Sucks but what can you do.



I don't know the stats but it seems from my experience that there are just as many crashes in road races as in crits and the ones in the road races tend to be worse. And crashes seem to happen more on straight roads too. Everyone is at least focused on corners but on the straights people tend to drift off.

Whatever the case, when it comes to racing I think I'll stick to snapping photos :eek:

They rang the bell to indicate one lap to go. You raced your bike accordingly, and the race ended, albeit mistakenly, very early. However, it DID end.

That result should stand, and whatever they decide to do after that should be considered another race entirely.

>>I raced. We all got screwed.<<

How does that differ from any other bicycle race?

Crits suck. They're too dangerous. Y'all are mostly amateurs and with real jobs or families or school as primary duties. No need for such risks. Why on earth we here in the USA do so much crit racing and so little road racing is beyond me. Ya'll gots big cahones, that's all I know. Real men with lots of courage.

the benefits outweigh the cost. crit racing is insanely fun when done right and the chances of incident rely upon the people riding.

. Why on earth we here in the USA do so much crit racing and so little road racing is beyond me.
Because
a) it's easier to close the streets for a crit and
b) Americans lack the attention span to wait more than 2 minutes for riders to whizz by again.

I am really just getting the impression that people don't know WTF they are doing and don't care.

Hence the reason my days of racing in MABRA are over for the foreseeable future.

Whatever, it's going on my race resume as a 4th place finish. If the upgrade rep wants to argue, I'll argue.

Posted in response to RudeSiggy's blog:



Gus Grissom, President of WWVC here. I'm genuinely sorry you thought this race was (in your words) a "sh*tstorm."

Because we had so many Cat 4's screaming, hollering, and protesting that they might not get their upgrade points (and possible invitations to ProTour teams!), the officials went back and reviewed everything from the race. In the end, the decision was made to give BAR and Upgrade Points to "both" Cat 4 races that were held. So, you will get your upgrade points for your efforts in race 1 (stopped with 17 to go) and race 2 (the 10-lap "prime" race).

In hindsight, I wish we had not held that second "race" of 10-laps. Once the decision to stop the race was made we should have stuck to it. But, you would not believe how many Cat 4 racers were standing around the officials tent screaming, whining, and generally making asses of themselves because "their race" had been shortened just so "some kid could get hauled away in an ambulance" (and yes, those are the exact terms I heard from some racers!).

We tried (in vain!) to make everyone happy by using the "leftover" time in the schedule to give the Cat 4's one more chance to get it out of their system for the weekend. Turns out it really is impossible to make everyone happy! Lesson learned.

Anyways, rest assured you will get your upgrade points and all of this will be announced on the D20 listserve once all results are made official. I hope your next race goes more smoothly than this one and suggest you try working at a race all day sometime just to see exactly how hard the officials work and how much they genuinely care about each and every racer in this district. You may think they acted foolishly this weekend, but they did what they did out of a genuine concern to give every racer every bit of the racing experience a $20 entry fee can provide. Seriously, the MABRA officials really do give a crap about you, your Cat 4 upgrade points, and the racing scene overall.

See you next year?

Posted in response to RudeSiggy's blog:

Nomad, I hate to make you play messenger but in lieu of having Gus's email address, can you pass my response on to him:

Dear Gus,

Thank you for taking the time to listen to the many criticisms that have been flung at you and the officials. It is more attention than many of us deserve. I fully understand the process and rationale behind the decision to have a "second" Cat4 race. I also understand the rigors of working all day at a race and hoping everyone leaves satisfied - we had a similar officiating incident at our Syn-Fit Criterium this past April.

Ultimately I think our two clubs have learned, albeit the hard way, that it is truly impossible to make everyone happy. In my humble/honest opinion, decisions made by the officials - no matter how they are judged in hindsight - should be final. If, after all has settled, any decisions made by officials are deemed inaccurate, incorrect or mishandled, then appropriate measures should be taken to ensure the same mistake is not made in the future; however, the decision made is binding and its results should stand.

I appreciate your efforts in putting on this race. Whole Wheel Velo Club hosted an amazing event that will surely become a MABRA classic. Thank you for your efforts, and see you next year!

Warm regards,
* *
Evolution Cycling Club

Nomad, I hate to make you play messenger but in lieu of having Gus's email address, can you pass my response on to him:



cheung, post it on my blog... http://sigberto.blogspot.com. even chuck hutch left us some words of wisdom, haha!

FWIW, Tyson's (one of our team's 4 races) had a darn identical situation in the Cat 4 when a guy's head hit the curb on the second lap. They neutralized the race the next lap then re-started (after the ambulance came) with only 8 to go. It sucked for the other racers, but worked out just fine and as far as i know nobody complained.

yeah I heard there was a pretty bad one in the 8:45am 5 race.

In two races, people crashed on the straight section following turn 1. How anyone crashes on a straightaway is beyond me.


I saw a very near wipe out on a straight (after a climb and our turn 1) in a crit today. The guy was drinking with no hand on the brakes and nearly rear-end the riders in front of him and then goes all weavy while he is on top of them. I don't know how he pulled it out, I'm just happy he did because I was 2 riders back. He then dropped his bottle which got bounced around when we passed for the next two laps.

I don't know how he pulled it out, I'm just happy he did because I was 2 riders back.

Yeah... I was right behind my friend cheung yesterday when he executed the best fishtailing recovery I'd ever seen at 25+ miles per hour. Scared me and a teammate sh*tless. Good handling on his part!

Yeah... I was right behind my friend cheung yesterday when he executed the best fishtailing recovery I'd ever seen at 25+ miles per hour. Scared me and a teammate sh*tless. Good handling on his part!

I shouldn't have overlapped wheels, though. Definitely my fault. I think I lost a few years of my life when I fishtailed, unclipped a foot, and somehow managed to not go down.

Did I mention a black cat crossed my path on the trail while I was commuting home on Friday? No joke.

I attribute my bike handling skills to the many miles of commuting I did throughout the winter in rain, snow and ice.

I shouldn't have overlapped wheels, though. Definitely my fault. I think I lost a few years of my life when I fishtailed, unclipped a foot, and somehow managed to not go down.

It reminded me of the quote from the Tour when Armstrong "nearly lost his manhood."

It reminded me of the quote from the Tour when Armstrong "nearly lost his manhood."

yes, 2003. Luz Ardiden, after the first fall when his bars were snagged by a fan with a musette bag. he was hammering and pulled out of his pedal.

mine wasn't that dramatic though, i don't think... then again it all happened so fast for me.

mine wasn't that dramatic though, i don't think... then again it all happened so fast for me.

Imagine what Iban Mayo was thinking. Yep, that was me.

on the upgrade points stuff: way too much whining going on.

cat 3 race too. some route 1 velo guy who I dont know was whining up a storm because he didnt get "placed", even though he was no where near the money ... acting like a fool saying he wasted his whole day because he didnt get his placing.

gee whiz guys, act like adults. it's not like there arent a hundred races everyone can do for precious upgrade points. if you actually deserve them, they'll come. plus if you're a cat 4, you dont even need them, just upgrade when you feel like it from experience.

whole wheel - fun event on a fun course for an industrial park crit. I hope everyone who was involved in a crash is OK.