Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Miche Pistard track vs. Cane Creek Track V vs. Custom

I'm going to apologize in advance for all these threads I've posted in advance but I would like to place my order tomorrow and I cant make up my mind on certain things like wheels and such. So here are what I am thinking are my three options:

1. Cane Creek Track V
http://www.thebikebiz.com/PhotoGallery.asp?ProductCode=TRK-WHL-CANE02

2. Miche Pistard Track
http://www.ride-this.com/index.php/miche-pistard-track-wheelset.html

3. Handbuilt wheels built by myself (and yes I've built wheels before) consisting of Miche Primato hubs, DT Swiss Revolution spokes, and Deep-Vs.

These will be going on a Surly Steamroller with a Sram Omnium Crank as for set up. What do you guys think? Ups and downs for either of the first options? Thanks, Greg

well if they're going to be used on the road and not the track, i'd go with the last option but use different hubs, i'm not a fan of the Miche hubs since they make you use their own lockring.

I run Miche hubs laced to CXP 33s & love em. I do run Phil lockrings and Phil bearings though.
My Miche bearings always had an unexplainable drag and I had to adjust them every two weeks or so.

The Cane Creek Track V looks like a really nice setup and would be interested in hearing what people have to say about them.

anybody else?

I like the cane creeks, but it is a shame that if they are going to re think the wheel and design a new type of hub that they did not do a bolt on cog.

What is everyone's obsession with bolt on cogs?



I have never had an issue w/ a cog slipping before...


If you install it properly and the hub is properly manufactured, there shouldn't be an issue

Those Cane Creek hubs do look pretty fancy and kinda cool in a weird sorta way, but they also look very untrustworthy to me, especially for riding on the street.

What is everyone's obsession with bolt on cogs?



I have never had an issue w/ a cog slipping before...


If you install it properly and the hub is properly manufactured, there shouldn't be an issue

The Track V's are a flip flop hub not bolt on

miche pistard $270+free ship

http://aebike.com/page.cfm?PageID=30&action=details&sku=WE2102

miche pistard $270+free ship

http://aebike.com/page.cfm?PageID=30&action=details&sku=WE2102

thanks but i work at a shop so I would be ordering them through a supplier

I rode the Cane Creeks for around 4 months and they are really strong wheels with the rough roads I ride on. I'm 190lbs so that speaks pretty well of how they hold up. They definitely as fast to spin up and don't feel as "heavy" as the #s say. The hubs are absolutely gorgeous though!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3466/3271986617_0b0160eb44.jpg?v=0

Funny you put this up because I have a set I'm selling (but a pending buyer said they're going to buy them). If they back out would be interested in buying them? They are the Cane Creek Track V-33 carbon wrapped clincher model. I'm selling them for much cheaper than what Bike Biz is selling the version you linked. I'm selling because I have the wheelset sitting around because I changed the wheels on my other bike which were hand built (I hate having parts sit around not being used so I'd rather have someone else use them. I'd rather use the wheels that were custom built than sell them off).

The hubs are absolutely gorgeous though!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3466/3271986617_0b0160eb44.jpg?v=0

That picture sells 'em alright. That looks sexy. I still don't think I'd trust one on the rear on the street though.

I rode the Cane Creeks for around 4 months and they are really strong wheels with the rough roads I ride on. I'm 190lbs so that speaks pretty well of how they hold up. They definitely as fast to spin up and don't feel as "heavy" as the #s say. The hubs are absolutely gorgeous though!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3466/3271986617_0b0160eb44.jpg?v=0

Funny you put this up because I have a set I'm selling (but a pending buyer said they're going to buy them). If they back out would be interested in buying them? They are the Cane Creek Track V-33 carbon wrapped clincher model. I'm selling them for much cheaper than what Bike Biz is selling the version you linked. I'm selling because I have the wheelset sitting around because I changed the wheels on my other bike which were hand built (I hate having parts sit around not being used so I'd rather have someone else use them. I'd rather use the wheels that were custom built than sell them off).

pm'd

not to de-rail, but semi on topic... has anyone tried the pistards? seems like a low cost option from a quality name, but do they hold up for street riding?

not to de-rail, but semi on topic... has anyone tried the pistards? seems like a low cost option from a quality name, but do they hold up for street riding?

Not derailed at all I was wondering the same exact thing. The only problem is they arent machined for those that want to run a brake but who needs brakes :)

awesome wheels and crankset all around ...but on a steamroller?
v's seem most appropriate then, imo; esp. if you're gonna build em.

awesome wheels and crankset all around ...but on a steamroller?
v's seem most appropriate then, imo; esp. if you're gonna build em.

well im still deciding between a steamroller and the gt gutterball. does anyone have experience with them and ridden them and even better have pics of them on their bike? thanks, greg

greg- I don't have experience w/ the gutterball but I'm just going to throw this out there---that bike is LAME. I'm sure lots of people will get onto me for not explaining myself and giving good reasoning, whatever, I just don't like it. I think it is a half-ass attempt by GT to recapture an old frame design in time to sell to fixie crazed cyclists. Nothing about it seems cool to me. Just get the steamroller. SR is a great bike by a cool company that I would rather support than GT.

No obsesssion with bolt on cogs, but if you are going to put that much effort into rethinking and redesigning the hub, you might as well go with the better system for cog attachment.

This is a sweet looking steamroller with your cranks;)
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u218/corythegreat_2007/surly-1.jpg

greg- I don't have experience w/ the gutterball but I'm just going to throw this out there---that bike is LAME. I'm sure lots of people will get onto me for not explaining myself and giving good reasoning, whatever, I just don't like it. I think it is a half-ass attempt by GT to recapture an old frame design in time to sell to fixie crazed cyclists. Nothing about it seems cool to me. Just get the steamroller. SR is a great bike by a cool company that I would rather support than GT.

Damn you bikeforums.net haha. I think I'm set on something and then I get a comment like this and I start rethinking everything haha. Now I'm kinda leaning towards the SR. WTF haha

And has anybody actually ridden the Pistards?

don't listen to people like atx who tell you what to not do and can't back it up. I'm not educated much on either frame, and I know the SR is a great bike but I've always loved the gtb and would go with the gtb.

The cane creeks my fav option you posted. But you should really build your own wheels, but forget the veeps and do some open pro CD, ceramic, or some cxp 33

don't listen to people like atx who tell you what to not do and can't back it up. I'm not educated much on either frame, and I know the SR is a great bike but I've always loved the gtb and would go with the gtb.

The cane creeks my fav option you posted. But you should really build your own wheels, but forget the veeps and do some open pro CD, ceramic, or some cxp 33

open pros are fine rims, but overrated. kinlins are the new top dog.

don't listen to people like atx who tell you what to not do and can't back it up. I'm not educated much on either frame, and I know the SR is a great bike but I've always loved the gtb and would go with the gtb.

The cane creeks my fav option you posted. But you should really build your own wheels, but forget the veeps and do some open pro CD, ceramic, or some cxp 33

Thanks dude, here's my build I'm looking at right now:

Frame: GT Gutterball
Front wheel: Forte Titan road wheel (for now)
Rear wheel: Miche Pistard (or Miche hubs laced to something else maybe)
Crank: Sram Omnium
Headset: Crank Bros Cobalt
Stem: Deda Zero
Bars: ITM Visia Strada
Seatpost: FSA SL-K Carbon
Seat: WTB Silverado (stock)
Tires: Continental Ultra Gatorskins
Chain: Miche Track

I'm pretty pumped on it. Ordering everything thursday

don't listen to people like atx who tell you what to not do and can't back it up. I'm not educated much on either frame, and I know the SR is a great bike but I've always loved the gtb and would go with the gtb.

The cane creeks my fav option you posted. But you should really build your own wheels, but forget the veeps and do some open pro CD, ceramic, or some cxp 33

be clear though, the GTB is NOT the same as the Gutterball. Look at pictures of the 2 side by side. The Gutterball has rear brake braze-ons, a top tube that slants towards the seat tube instead of the head tube, slacker head tube angle. I'm don't even think the Gutterball is aluminum. These are not the same bikes.

be clear though, the GTB is NOT the same as the Gutterball. Look at pictures of the 2 side by side. The Gutterball has rear brake braze-ons, a top tube that slants towards the seat tube instead of the head tube, slacker head tube angle. I'm don't even think the Gutterball is aluminum. These are not the same bikes.

yes they are aluminum

The Gutterball is aluminum, but it also has glasses, acne, and braces while the Steamroller is QB of the football team.

The Gutterball is aluminum, but it also has glasses, acne, and braces while the Steamroller is QB of the football team.

Yeah but the Steamroller is uglier and heavier with slacker geometry and with a carbon seatpost wont have any smoother of a ride. Yes I will give it the durability and versatility tho. I'm not hating on Surly I think they are a sick company but for what I want it doesnt quite fit what I'm looking for. Plus with the 2 builds I was going between the GT comes out $105 cheaper. Heres it broken down:

Surly:
Frame: Steamroller
Front Wheel: White MSW Deep-V laced to Surly hub w/ DT Swiss Revo
Rear Wheel: White NMSW Deep-V, Surly hub, DT Swiss Revo
Crank: Sram Omnium
Stem: Thompson
Bars: Nitto Noodle
Seatpost: FSA SL-K
Seat: Brooks B17
Tires: Continental Gatorskins
Cog: Surly
Chain: Miche track
Grand total: $863

The GT build is on the 1st page and with the stock wheels, crank, stem/handlebars, seat post sold (which I only counted as $150 though I bet I can get more for them) the total cost is $754. so $109 difference and I get an aluminum, more track geometry, a bunch lighter bike for cheaper. Does this not make sense am I missing something?

I feel as though I couldnt go wrong with either build and they both would be super sick but why not spend less money?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_4i4dKm39nK4/SRaLXYHr0aI/AAAAAAAADWA/xLl9pHuB7m8/s400/DIFFRENT+STROKES.jpg

Yeah but the Steamroller is uglier and heavier with slacker geometry and with a carbon seatpost wont have any smoother of a ride. Yes I will give it the durability and versatility tho. I'm not hating on Surly I think they are a sick company but for what I want it doesnt quite fit what I'm looking for. Plus with the 2 builds I was going between the GT comes out $105 cheaper. Heres it broken down:

Surly:
Frame: Steamroller
Front Wheel: White MSW Deep-V laced to Surly hub w/ DT Swiss Revo
Rear Wheel: White NMSW Deep-V, Surly hub, DT Swiss Revo
Crank: Sram Omnium
Stem: Thompson
Bars: Nitto Noodle
Seatpost: FSA SL-K
Seat: Brooks B17
Tires: Continental Gatorskins
Cog: Surly
Chain: Miche track
Grand total: $863

The GT build is on the 1st page and with the stock wheels, crank, stem/handlebars, seat post sold (which I only counted as $150 though I bet I can get more for them) the total cost is $754. so $109 difference and I get an aluminum, more track geometry, a bunch lighter bike for cheaper. Does this not make sense am I missing something?

I'm just messing around. I have a couple minor problems w/ the gutterball but i think in reality it is probably a great bike and better for your purposes. You seem to know what you're doing, so go with your intuition.

I'm just messing around. I have a couple minor problems w/ the gutterball but i think in reality it is probably a great bike and better for your purposes. You seem to know what you're doing, so go with your intuition.

haha nah its totally cool dude I was just seeing if there was something I was missing. honestly, if I could get the steamroller in any other color besides maroon (which is all qbp has) it would definitely be a much harder decision than the hard decision right now because in my mind both frames are going to do what I want perfectly well so saying both frames are equal in the respect they are going to be what I want in different ways then personally i like the looks and the lightness of the gutterball so that's ultimately whats guiding me. sorry if this didnt quite make sense im pretty tired and yeah i've put a lot of thought into these builds but if you've got any recommendations in part changes you see then just let me know. you've definitely made me think about this a lot more and thats a good thing so i dont make a wrong decision and regret it. thanks, greg

be clear though, the GTB is NOT the same as the Gutterball. Look at pictures of the 2 side by side. The Gutterball has rear brake braze-ons, a top tube that slants towards the seat tube instead of the head tube, slacker head tube angle. I'm don't even think the Gutterball is aluminum. These are not the same bikes.

I never even hinted at saying they are the same. I said I was not educated on either, and simply stated I liked the gtb so I am assuming I'd like the gutterball too.

And a road wheel up front? Why not just get a matching pistard wheels set?

I never even hinted at saying they are the same. I said I was not educated on either, and simply stated I liked the gtb so I am assuming I'd like the gutterball too.

And a road wheel up front? Why not just get a matching pistard wheels set?

Because they are basically free and super light like 750 grams or something. Well that's not super light but about 200 grams lighter than the Pistard front or a similar custom built wheel. I'm probably just going to ride that for the summer and then build up a burlier wheel before I leave to go out to college. I live in upstate NY so theft isnt an issue like at all so I'm not worried about the quick release in that respect. Plus if you look at reviews they are bombproof low spoke count wheels so I don't really think I can go wrong

I ride the CC Volos, similar to the Track Vs except the front is radial laced. Primarily meant as a track setup but I have beat on them in the streets and they're stiff, smooth, light as hell, spin up easy and climbs well. It went out of true ever so slightly but trues right up and holds up well considering the lighter and weaker shallow "aero" rim. The straight pull spokes are definitely an improvement over the traditional style.

I also have a 36h Formula laced to a Mavic OP on my beater that I've put ~1000 hard miles on and the wobble it got was the same as the Volos, 1mm side to side at the most.

Comparing that to a 24/28h, it's pretty pretty impressive but performs much better.

I also know someone who had the Pistard wheelset and he didn't think it was anything special. I don't personally have any experience with these but they're just Miche Primato hubs laced to a deep aero rim w/ bladed spokes. I don't see any advantages of that wheelset over the Track-V (strength, lighter rotational weight, stiffer) and a custom build (solid, bombproof and customizable).

I hope that helps you a bit on picking wheelsets, I had a similar debate over the Pistards, Ellipses, and Volos back then.

Also, I don't know if you have a strict budget but I heard the Miche chains are really loud and generally of poor quality. I personally would get a Wipperman track chain with an EAI cog if I had a choice.

I ride the CC Volos, similar to the Track Vs except the front is radial laced. Primarily meant as a track setup but I have beat on them in the streets and they're stiff, smooth, light as hell, spin up easy and climbs well. It went out of true ever so slightly but trues right up and holds up well considering the lighter and weaker shallow "aero" rim. The straight pull spokes are definitely an improvement over the traditional style.

I also have a 36h Formula laced to a Mavic OP on my beater that I've put ~1000 hard miles on and the wobble it got was the same as the Volos, 1mm side to side at the most.

Comparing that to a 24/28h, it's pretty pretty impressive but performs much better.

I also know someone who had the Pistard wheelset and he didn't think it was anything special. I don't personally have any experience with these but they're just Miche Primato hubs laced to a deep aero rim w/ bladed spokes. I don't see any advantages of that wheelset over the Track-V (strength, lighter rotational weight, stiffer) and a custom build (solid, bombproof and customizable).

I hope that helps you a bit on picking wheelsets, I had a similar debate over the Pistards, Ellipses, and Volos back then.

Also, I don't know if you have a strict budget but I heard the Miche chains are really loud and generally of poor quality. I personally would get a Wipperman track chain with an EAI cog if I had a choice.

Thanks I'll definitely look into this or other chains but as for the wheelset I'm still not quite sure on what I'm doing. I threw that out there as it would be cheap and pretty sick just to run for the summer probably and then build a new wheelset after but really thinking about it I dont know what rims or hubs I want to run so this would also kind of just make me not have to decide that haha.

Just for reference, I've heard people compare the Miche bearing quality to be similar if only slightly better than Formulas. The CC bearings are far smoother, more so than the loose ball Suzue Promax I had but the smoothest by far are these Mavic 501 hubs I have.

Mind you this was just from spinning in my hand but I did feel a difference between them all riding. You probably don't want loose ball for daily street use plus you can just get quality bearings for your Miche or Formula hubs if you don't want to spend.

Ok yeah so I totally rethought my wheelset and I am going with Velocity Deep-Vs laced to Phil Woods with Wheelsmith butted spokes.

Ok yeah so I totally rethought my wheelset and I am going with Velocity Deep-Vs laced to Phil Woods with Wheelsmith butted spokes.

that will be nice. Maybe a little heavy, but durable as hell and good looking, too. what color veeps?

that will be nice. Maybe a little heavy, but durable as hell and good looking, too. what color veeps?

Ok I def. lied there the color veeps I was going for was sold out (celeste) and now I realized I have more money than I thought so it's between the Cane Creek Volos and the Track V's. I feel as those the Track V's will be a little more durable with the deeper rims even tho ive heard the volos are pretty bomber themselves

i have a friend who rides the volos pretty hard with no complaints, i've actually been looking for just a rear for awhile based off the good things people have been saying about them.

i can say from experience that if you arn't planning on doing tricks or skip stopping the rear wheel too much when it comes to street riding, you won't need the deep v for the strength, it's probably overkill. Having ditched my front deep v for over a year now i feel they're good for a bombproof rear you can do anything to, but i'd definitely opt for a lighter front from the start if i did it again.

I don't think they make the Volos anymore so that may help you decide. I personally like a radial laced front and the smaller hub.

I don't think they make the Volos anymore so that may help you decide. I personally like a radial laced front and the smaller hub.

QBP still has them to order so I dont know if its NOS or what. But as for 2 posts up I weigh like 200 pounds so the extra bulk on the rims might help a little bit haha

I don't think they make the Volos anymore so that may help you decide. I personally like a radial laced front and the smaller hub.

i prefer low over high flange, but i dislike radial lacing.

I was on the fence about it before but having a 24 spoke radial laced wheel it looks quite alright. Definitely not a fan of those 36h wirewheel radials.
Plus it seems to function perfectly fine that way as a front. I wouldn't take radial on the rear unless it was engineered though.

But having those high flange CC hubs up front just looks weird to me, the Volos balance nicely.

Thank you everybody that put input into this thread I ordered a pair of CC Track Vs since the extra deepness of the rims will be stronger under my fat ***** haha

Thank you everybody that put input into this thread I ordered a pair of CC Track Vs since the extra deepness of the rims will be stronger under my fat ***** haha