Road Cycling - Advices needed on choosing beween tire and tubulars

Hi,

I ride around 5000 km/year both commuting and sportive rides.
I finished building my new bike 4 month ago (12 speed campy/cinelly on a benotto frame)
I choose tubular rims (mavic GP 4 32 on the front and Campy Record Strada on the rear).
For the tubular tires I decide not to break the bank with vittoria competition rally 21x28''.
My problem is that I had 2 flats in the last two month. Last year I have done all the year on the same roads with only 1 flat with vittoria (burino pro or somthing like that) 20mm tires on mavic MA40.
Here is the questions

1. Are all tubulars as delicates as vittoria competition rally 21x28'' ?
2. Can I expect from a tubular to be as resistant to puncture than
my olds vittoria (burino pro or somthing like that)? If yes at which price?
3. Are tubulars an option for average road cyclist or are they reseved to
very high level competition?

Please let me know your experience on that I do not know what to do... buying good tubulars
or come back to the tube and tire solution.

Ho yes, I switch to tubular because it makes at the same cost lighter wheels and are
reputed smoother to ride.

Thanks in advance.

Tubulars are mostly reserved for racing use. They are indeed lighter and are reputed to have a smoother ride, but they are finicky to mount and repair.

On a commuter bike it only makes sense to use a clincher tire and tube. If you flat, you can make the repair yourself at roadside. If weight is that great a concern for you, use a kevlar beaded tire.

Agreed. I raced on sew-ups but trained on clinchers. Sew ups are in my opinion just too much of a pain of the ass to repair, too expensive to replace on a regular basis, and a pain in the ass to glue and mount.

This has nothing to do with tyres. But, I just couldn't help commenting that it's great to see there's at least one other cyclist with a Benotto frame. I restored my 1988 (originally 12 speed) and put it back on the road a little over a year ago. It's now pretty much a Dura Ace 18 speed. New paint, graphics, BB, brakes, shifters, seat, seat post, cables, cassette, crankset. Between my two road bikes, it is clearly the more pleasing to look at and it is just as pleasant to ride as my 10 year newer one. If you get a chance send me i pic in private email or post so we can all take a look.

I've had pretty good luck with Continental Sprinters. They're pricey, but if you're flattening other brands on a regular basis, the price may add up to about the same.

Hi,

I ride around 5000 km/year both commuting and sportive rides.
I finished building my new bike 4 month ago (12 speed campy/cinelly on a benotto frame)
I choose tubular rims (mavic GP 4 32 on the front and Campy Record Strada on the rear).
For the tubular tires I decide not to break the bank with vittoria competition rally 21x28''.
My problem is that I had 2 flats in the last two month. Last year I have done all the year on the same roads with only 1 flat with vittoria (burino pro or somthing like that) 20mm tires on mavic MA40.
Here is the questions

1. Are all tubulars as delicates as vittoria competition rally 21x28'' ?
2. Can I expect from a tubular to be as resistant to puncture than
my olds vittoria (burino pro or somthing like that)? If yes at which price?
3. Are tubulars an option for average road cyclist or are they reseved to
very high level competition?

Please let me know your experience on that I do not know what to do... buying good tubulars
or come back to the tube and tire solution.

Ho yes, I switch to tubular because it makes at the same cost lighter wheels and are
reputed smoother to ride.

Thanks in advance.

its nuovo pros tires. here is site that sells victoria rally tires at a great price
http://www.labicicletta.com/edatcat/us/tlsstore.cgi?user_action=list&category=Tubular%20Tires :)
I too ride tubulars all the time. I like the handling of tubulars and I often ride on technical decents...I have noticed the difference when I'm not riding tubulars. :) The rally is not an especially puncture resistant tire, but it's cheap. I carry them as spares and use them for commuting. More expensive tires like the vittoria cx and continental competition are very durable. Tubular tires are very puncture resistant when new, but once the rubber gets worn...watch out.

Thanks for your advices,

Yes, I understand that clincher tires is the reasonable way. I'm not racing but I love riding and try to have the maximum pleasure with my bike, it is the reason why I decide to build tubular wheel rather than clincher. So the question is perhaps

1- Does a tubular (a good one) have more flat than a clincher ?

If I put saying $120 in 2 tubular and I get one or two flat a year, like with the clincher I had, I will do it.


To Don Cook : Happy to know another benotto owner. I bough the frame on eBay
last autaumn, and rebuild all the bike. The frame was made in Italy 56st cc 56tt cc
with an hearth under the BB shell it was originally 120mm spacing (now 126). The decalcs say BENOTTO with the world champion ribbon (green yello black red blue) I had no chance to clearly identify it. I will take picks and send them to you.

Thanks to all.

ok, so why is it that no one makes a tubular wider then 22mm? it seems to me that a tubular with a nice, thick 28mm cross section would be like butta' to ride on, and with that reduced rolling resistance that they are supposed to have,they would still roll fast in the bigger size.

If I put saying $120 in 2 tubular and I get one or two flat a year, like with the clincher I had, I will do it.
Thanks to all.

You can fix a clincher flat though for $5. Not so with a tubular. You either buy a new one or you learn to sew. Even then it's not a guaranteed fix.

Hi Laggard,

I fixed my 2 flats on my tubulars for $5 patchs+thread+cement, but it's sure that it is not as easy as with clincher... you have to book all an evening to do the job..... Although note that with my glincher wheels it was really a mess to mount or remove the tire from the rim. I just want to know if I am supposed to have more flats with good tubular than with good glinchers or if it should be equivalent.

Regards,

Philippe.

You can fix a clincher flat though for $5. Not so with a tubular. You either buy a new one or you learn to sew. Even then it's not a guaranteed fix.

Well, that is if you throw away the tube. If you take the tube home and patch it, a flat costs you about $0.50.

ok, so why is it that no one makes a tubular wider then 22mm?

That was my argument when the bike shop guy told me to stop
using 20mm Conti GPs at 150psi, and use 23mm Michelins pumped
up to 110psi. I said: "then why are all the best tubular road tires 21 or 22mm,
and go up to 170+ psi?" (jeez, I'm even quoting myself) And what about
time-trial tires? 19mm, or so?

What bugs me about 23mm tires is the low pressures. My fat hack ass
pushes my rims to the road if I use less than 120psi.

ok, so why is it that no one makes a tubular wider then 22mm? it seems to me that a tubular with a nice, thick 28mm cross section would be like butta' to ride on, and with that reduced rolling resistance that they are supposed to have,they would still roll fast in the bigger size.
Tufo tubulars have a variety of sizes. They do Cross tires.
And some wide tires. The elite road is a 23mm tire. The diamond pro is 28mm tire.
They also now have a line of Tubular MTB tires.
Clement Paris Roubaix is a 24mm tire.
Marty

Well, that is if you throw away the tube. If you take the tube home and patch it, a flat costs you about $0.50.

Tufo has a sealant that really works well...it even works (although not as well) with non Tufo tires. ;) tirealert.com can fix tubulars with a new tube for 16 bucks each for two or more tires. :p

Tufo tubulars have a variety of sizes. They do Cross tires.
And some wide tires. The elite road is a 23mm tire. The diamond pro is 28mm tire.
They also now have a line of Tubular MTB tires.
Clement Paris Roubaix is a 24mm tire.
Marty

yea, but that 28mm is a knobby. I was talking about a bigassed tubular slick. can you imagine how smooooth that would be?

I just have to comment that what is good for racing is not usually what is good for the road. That goes for bikes and cars.

I keep it short. I train on tubulars and race on them too. Different wheels. Why? I can build a much lighter wheelset (sub 1500g) a bit over $500. I train on lighter wheelset because it helps me to race like I train and train like I race. I want to climb faster with greater leg speed work. I train on a set of Chris King hubs with Mavic Reflex rims. Second, just my experience, good quality light clincher tires do not wear well. For puncture issue, I use Tufo tire with Tufo sealant. I haven't had a flat yet. Sometimes I carry a spare tubular tire. Tubular tires do give you a more "comfortable" ride.

A couple of things I've noticed, that when it comes to "performance" tires (not just race tires, but good performing tires) the amount of flats on tubulars is less than on clinchers. I say "performance" tires as one can go out and buy a big heavy duty clincher that will resist punctures (but is boring to ride on), where that option doesn't exist in the tubular world.

For repair concerns, learn to fix sew-ups, the cost then becomes much less of an issue. It's not all that difficult once you get the hang of it, a little tedious at first though. Or if the cost is just a minor concern somebody had posted a link to company that specializes in fixing sew-ups, I believe the cost was around $10-15 for each tire plus the shipping both ways. The other thing you can do is find a couple of the hard core racers around your area and ask them if they'll "buy" your flat sew-ups from you (as they'll fix them and then ride them) to help offset the cost of buying new tires.

Andrew

Here's a couple of web sites that answer your questions:

http://www.yarchive.net/bike/tubulars.html
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tires.html

And by the way, I used tubulars for about 15 years, I now have been using clinchers for the past 15 years. And guess what? I'll never go back to tubulars again! And yes I did fix my own tubulars...oh yippee!