Road Cycling - Looking for Female Advice

Hi! I'm a young engineer, that can finally purchase a road bike. I road my step mothers all through High School (it was ancient and ill fitted for me) but i loved it. My parents made me stop riding in college. They refused to let me take my bikes to school, and i couldn't aford my own. So i have been out of the circle for a while.

I'm petite 5'0". Currently have a specialized WSD Mtn Bike, am thrilled with the bike but miss the speed and distance i can do on a road bike. I want to start pursueing centuries, and other long distance rides.

Can any one offer advice? I am so confused as to steel or aluminum. 650 vs 700 wheels. Getting a women's specific design or just adapting a mens bike. I just want an entry level bike that will get me through a couple years, before i upgrade. Any help would be much appreciated.

Clueless, KL in Little Rhody

Specialized Dolce Comp...will fit and will do you well for 1,000s of miles. Forget all the other...it HAS to fit you at your size and stature. This is one sweet ride.

How much are you looking to spend?

For your size, 700c wheels are too big. There may be frames which take them, but the geometry will be bodged. Get 650c.
Fuji make an excellent value 650c bike, The Finest Women's.
In addition to 650c, it has short cranks and narrow bars, for about $600.

http://www.fujibikes.com/road/bike.asp?category_short_name=road&myArray=87,88,89,90,91,92,93,102,94,95,96,103,97,104,106,99,98,100,105,101,107,108,109,112,110,111,1 13,114&myArrayID=22&yr=2004#

There are two great bikes on www.bikesdirect.com that are WSD. One is the Motobecane Gigi (aluminum) and the other is the Mercier Elle (steel). Both are under $900. Great bikes, great components, great deals.

I ride a Terry Symmetry and love it. Their website has a 2001 Symmetry on sale for $675. http://www.terrybicycles.com/Bikes/salebikes.lasso
They also have a section of people selling their bikes also http://www.terrybicycles.com/Trade/trade.lasso

The smaller Raleigh Capris have 650 wheels. It's a women's-specific design. The frame sizes start at 42cm. 105-ish componentry, about $1000 (I just scored a "new" '03 model for $800). The WSD question is mostly one of body proportion. Yeah, there are other nuances, but for the most part, WSD frames are shorter in the top-tube relative to the seat-tube, because women generally have shorter torsos and longer legs relative to overall height than comparably-sized men. (Okay, "men generally have shorter legs and longer torsos....")

I'm at a loss to reply to your parents' bicycling prohibition during college. Discouraging young people to ride is, IMHO, one reason why we drive too much in this country. Our public school district has a policy, currently being challenged, that prohibits kids under 10 from bicycling to school, even with adults. They cite safety as a reason, oblivious to the fact that the major safety risk is the preponderance of parents driving their kids to school in cars. Oops, tangent-check. Well, the bright side is, you're enthusiastic about riding now.

Specialized Dolce Comp...will fit and will do you well for 1,000s of miles. Forget all the other...it HAS to fit you at your size and stature. This is one sweet ride.

This is one of the makes i have been looking into. I currently have a Specialized StumpJumper WSD and it fits great. What experience do you have with this bike?

For your size, 700c wheels are too big. There may be frames which take them, but the geometry will be bodged. Get 650c.
Fuji make an excellent value 650c bike, The Finest Women's.
In addition to 650c, it has short cranks and narrow bars, for about $600.

http://www.fujibikes.com/road/bike.asp?category_short_name=road&myArray=87,88,89,90,91,92,93,102,94,95,96,103,97,104,106,99,98,100,105,101,107,108,109,112,110,111,1 13,114&myArrayID=22&yr=2004#

My boyfriend who has been drilling me to get a fugi, and he is curious why you prefer the 650 wheels on someon my size? Any particular reason? We have been arguing about this because I previously road a bike with 700cc tires that was much to large for me but loved it.. and i have felt like i was going to fall off every 650cc tired bike i have been on to test ride.

The smaller Raleigh Capris have 650 wheels. It's a women's-specific design. The frame sizes start at 42cm. 105-ish componentry, about $1000 (I just scored a "new" '03 model for $800). The WSD question is mostly one of body proportion. Yeah, there are other nuances, but for the most part, WSD frames are shorter in the top-tube relative to the seat-tube, because women generally have shorter torsos and longer legs relative to overall height than comparably-sized men. (Okay, "men generally have shorter legs and longer torsos....")

I'm at a loss to reply to your parents' bicycling prohibition during college. Discouraging young people to ride is, IMHO, one reason why we drive too much in this country. Our public school district has a policy, currently being challenged, that prohibits kids under 10 from bicycling to school, even with adults. They cite safety as a reason, oblivious to the fact that the major safety risk is the preponderance of parents driving their kids to school in cars. Oops, tangent-check. Well, the bright side is, you're enthusiastic about riding now.

One last reply. I have a hard time dealing with anyone that discourages any sort of physical activity. And we wonder why there is such a problem with weight in the US. I'm saddened that children are not able to bike to school with there parents in your town. I love biking to school as a kid.

To answer some other questions i dont want to spend much more than 1200 on a bike. If i find something that works for less i will be thrilled, and plan to upgrade in 2-3 years.

> 5'0"

Do you have short legs, short torso, or are just shorter (i.e.,
do you fit a men's frame but are just proportionally smaller)?

Have you tried a Compact frame?

> the 650 wheels

I'd stay clear of these unless you have no other choice.
Less choices (compared to the plethora of 700c wheels out there).
Harder to find sales on consumables (tubes/tires).

> spend < 1200
> plan to upgrade in 2-3 years.

Do you mean replace the whole thing in 2-3 years or upgrade
some parts?

My recommendations:

http://www.giant-bicycle.com/us/030.000.000/030.000.006.asp?dealerid=&dealercountry=&lYear=2004&bikesection=8834&range=149&model=10808
http://www.giant-bicycle.com/us/030.000.000/030.000.006.asp?dealerid=&dealercountry=&lYear=2004&bikesection=8834&range=143&model=10769

The first is the Giant OCR Elite.
Currently, just outside your price range.
The second is the OCR 1, within your price range.

Best prices I found for the 2004 models:

http://kozy.com/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=3300&Catalog=1&sort=Price
$1400

http://kozy.com/site/itemdetails.cfm?ID=3302&Catalog=1&sort=Price
$950

This store is in Chicago I believe.
Performance also carries the Giant line.
You could try this:

http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=7705

a 10% off coupon code.
Performance price matches. So you could try print out the ad from
Kozy. If Performance will price match and honor the coupon code,
then the

OCR Elite is $1260 (still high)
OCR 1 is $855

And no ... I don't ride a Giant.

But I do ride a Compact.
Stand over height is wonderful.
Compact frame is lightning quick.

Both of those (as usual) don't include pedals.
And don't forget the HELMET.

Best.

Why 650c.
If you were to scale up a small womens 700c bike to large man, imagine how big the wheels would be. Then ask your BF if he would be happy riding 40" wheels.
It is traditional to fit the largest wheel which will fit inside a frame. For a small man (5'4") that is roughly a 700c. For anyone shorter, the 700c will not fit into a well proportioned frame.
Take a look at the frame geometry charts, and compare the largest and smallest with a med (54cm) size. Med size are generally well designed. Look closely at the height/length ratio: small bikes are longer, large bikes are shorter. Looks odd to me. (also, compare the hight of the bike off the grouns, ie bottom bracket height)
There are lots of reasons for using proportional components on a small bike. You get a lighter bike, the rear traingle is shorter, there is no need for toe-clip overlap or slack steering angles (which move the front wheel further forward). The bike is more agile and manouvreable, easier to carry... (enough already)
Have a look at the excellent readings from:
http://www.myra-simon.com/bike/tips.html

ps
If you want a more common wheel size, try 26" MTB, there are plenty of 1" road tyres for this size. There are a few small road/touring bikes which take MTB wheels, but its mainly a British thing.

ps
If you want a more common wheel size, try 26" MTB, there are plenty of 1" road tyres for this size. There are a few small road/touring bikes which take MTB wheels, but its mainly a British thing. That's actually how my front tire is labelled. The front wheel is a 650, but the tire is an IRC, marked "26x1". So I'm not so sure about the above comment wrt. sales on tubes/tires. Certainly not tubes; every time one of the big LBS's here has a "super sale" or "mega sale" or what-not, they price their tubes at, like $2/each or 2 for $5, and for any size.

Hmm.. I 'm gonna try and get to a few of the bike shops this weekend and see what feels good. The ones i've opted to try. Fuji women's finest. Specialized Dolce.. Bianchi eros donna.. and Giant ORC. Fugi seems to be the only one with the 650cc wheels. So i have to be sure to look at toe over lap and stuff.

Any thoughts on ability to keep up with a bunch of guys on 700cc wheels. Will I be over exerting myself?

-KL

I love the argument against 650c wheels. Don't let the big guys who don't understand the size issues talk you out of 650's. My wheels of choice for the last 9 years are 650s and I don't plan to go back to 700's. The wheels accelerate faster, triathletes love them for that reason, I don't seem to work as hard pedaling. I'm not sure how easy it would be to pedal with 165 crankarms and 700c wheels.

Yes, at first I thought I was going over the handlebars but after years of riding bikes that were too big my first small bike seemed like a toy anyway.

I live in Cincinnati and in 9 years have not had a problem getting tires or tubes. Granted mail order catalogs don't seem to stock them but I usually have the shop install my tires anyway.

I would not mix wheel sizes, my friend has a Jamis that has a 700c tire in the back and a 650c in the front. For some reason she didn't want 650's but now she has to carry 2 tubes with her.

My avs is around 15mph but on flats with no wind I can get up to 19-20 mph. My limitations in keeping up are due to my short legs and age rather than my wheels.
BTW, I'm 5'2 am superlight weight, ride a 44cm frame and am 56 years old.

The other thing you should consider when you buy your bike is the size of the chain rings in the front. I recommend a compact chainring. I ride a double and I switched my big ring (51) to a 46. I love it and and I'm now using my all the cogs on my cassette. Plus climbing grades with more power and flats a lot faster. I even seem to have more power in the wind.

Compact frames often have tt's that are too long for small riders. Also, be sure the frame geometry is appropriate for your size. Check out the article on women's fit on the Titus website http://www.titusti.com/womenfit.html

Because of your size you are going to have fitting issues that the average riders do not have. Getting a professional bike fit is well worth the money to avoid buying a bike that does not fit. It will also help you decide on size if a bike has to be ordered without you being able to test ride it in your size.

Good luck,
Kathi

Hmm.. I 'm gonna try and get to a few of the bike shops this weekend and see what feels good. The ones i've opted to try. Fuji women's finest. Specialized Dolce.. Bianchi eros donna.. and Giant ORC. Fugi seems to be the only one with the 650cc wheels. So i have to be sure to look at toe over lap and stuff. The Raleigh Capris of 42 and 45cm have 650c's. In '03, the 48, 51 and 54cm had 700/650; in '04, the 48 and 51 (54 is discontinued) have 700 front and rear.



Any thoughts on ability to keep up with a bunch of guys on 700cc wheels. Will I be over exerting myself? The Capri I just got is an '03 54cm (700/650). Gives me the drive gearing of a 700, with the toe clearance of a 650. Turns out to be a FAST bike. Right now I'm only carrying a 700 tube. The LBS guy said that, just to get it home, I could put the 700 tube in the front if I absolutely had to. 'Course, the seat bag I'm using on it right now has room for two tubes, so one day I might do that. Thing is, at your size, I doubt you'll find (or would want) a 700/650 bike. Look, don't worry about keeping up with other riders of either sex; if you can't keep up with a group you've found, and they aren't willing to adjust to keep the group together (which is fine, I suppose), find a group you can keep up with. Roading is about pushing your own abilities, and about being with people of similar strength so you stay together. You just gotta find your element (like everyone, I guess...).

That Fuji seems like a good deal. IIRC, it's about $600, which I guess is good for any 8-spd Sora-equipped bike. Check out the radial-spoked front wheel! My Raleigh is 9-spd 105 and comparable, and cost about what any 105-ish bike would cost.

Lots of taller women like to give the speech about how unneccessary WSD is, their men's frame fits them just fine. DO NOT BE BULLIED. I am a tad under 5 feet, with a peasant, chunky build (127 lbs). It is hard to find bikes that have standover of less than 700mm, regardless of wheelsize. Do not worry about small wheels and speed. My hybrid has two 24" wheels and I have the same average speed on my commute with it as I do with my touring Terry with a 24" front and 700c rear. It is only when I'm cruising on the flat that there is a difference in speed, 18-19 mph on touring bike, 16-17mph on hybrid. Tires are a problem only if you aren't close to a good bike shop. As pointed out earlier, Terry's website has sale prices on NOS bikes, putting the Symmetry in a sub $700 range. I test rode a Fuji with 650 wheels and enjoyed it a lot, but ultimately decided that given my milage I wanted higher level components than Sora. Surly makes some small frames that with 26" wheels would serve you well. If it is in your price range, Waterford makes their smaller frame road and touring bikes with 26" wheels also. Face it, you are a lot smaller than most bikes are designed for (at the time I was looking last year, Giant still said that their compact frames would fit riders over 5'2") and you need to try a lot more bikes to find the one that calls your name. If the Fuji Finest feels good to you, consider upgrading a step for better components. Good luck and happy shopping!

Regarding speed and efficiency:
If you fix all the other factors, large wheels have lower rolling resistance. This resistance is constant at all speeds, so is most important at lower speeds.
Small wheels have lower air resistance. This factor increases with velocity2, so the faster you go, the more significant it becomes.
Small wheels are lighter, so they accelerate and brake faster, and climb better.
It is swings and rounderbouts, so ignore efficiency and concentrate on fit.
Triatheles who choose 650c will use larger chainrings to compensate for the smaller wheels. They pedal at the same cadence and go as fast as their 700c collegues. I'm not saying that you should use extra-large rings.
You should be using small cranks (160-165mm). This also affects the choice of cog ratios. No-one can say in advance what set of ratios you will need, and you can always change the rings or rear cogs to suit your own strength and pedalling cadence. Just check that the bike has short cranks and use the std gearing.

Thanks for everyone's advice. Everything has been very helpful. I have learned of some bike companies i hadn't heard of. I unfortunately didnt get a chance to get out and test ride at all this weekend. All of the local bike shops i have called don't have any bikes near my size.

It would be wonderful to go to a store and just try them all on like a shoe store. Its an entire day event to visit all the shops that c arry the differnt lines, and then to be dissappointed they dont have anything to try.

This is a frustrating ordeal. I am loosing the better part of the summer. Or tiring myself out doing distances not meant for a MTN bike.

Thanks for everyone's help.

-KL

Thanks for everyone's advice. Everything has been very helpful. I have learned of some bike companies i hadn't heard of. I unfortunately didnt get a chance to get out and test ride at all this weekend. All of the local bike shops i have called don't have any bikes near my size.

It would be wonderful to go to a store and just try them all on like a shoe store. Its an entire day event to visit all the shops that c arry the differnt lines, and then to be dissappointed they dont have anything to try.

This is a frustrating ordeal. I am loosing the better part of the summer. Or tiring myself out doing distances not meant for a MTN bike.

Thanks for everyone's help.

-KL

Oh one more thing the Fuji I am looking at is the Finest Lady. It goes up a component level.. for not a whole lot more.

Specialized Dolce Comp...will fit and will do you well for 1,000s of miles. Forget all the other...it HAS to fit you at your size and stature. This is one sweet ride.


What are your thoughts on the Dolce Elite? (the comp is allittle more than i wanted to spend)

How about comparing it with the Fuji Finest with 650cc wheels. I have yet to ride the Fuji.

kl