Advocacy & Safety - First Cycle Track in PDX Dedicated Monday

http://bikeportland.org/2009/08/28/new-cycletrack-on-sw-broadway-set-to-open-monday/
http://bikeportland.org/2009/08/31/first-look-at-portlands-inaugural-cycle-track/
http://bikeportland.org/2009/09/01/city-reacts-to-portlands-new-cycle-track/

Personally, I don't think it's either that necessary or that safe, but what do I know?

:)

+1...
While I definitely appreciate what they're trying to do, I think there are gonna be a LOT of problems w/ it.

Most of the people I've seen using the bike part of this thing have been cars (both parked and driving). But last time I went by there, it hadn't officially opened or whatever so we'll see. I think once people start parking on the outside, other people will 'get it'.

That being said, I think a lot of people won't 'get it', at least not at first. I think this is gonna lead to all kinds of problems. Angry riders 'cause there's a car where the bikes are supposed to go, angry driver 'cause bike people are yelling at him or he's getting a ticket/towed/whatever, angry cops 'cause they have to deal with confused riders and drivers...etc.

Those, I think, will both get better over time but it also turns Broadway from a 3 lane road to 2 lane road. From what I can tell, Broadway needs one less lane like it needs a hole in the head (does Broadway have a head? Does that analogy/metaphor still make since if Broadway doesn't have a head?). I know this is a bike website but still... angry drivers are s**ty drivers and if you think they're pissed about spending 30 more seconds in traffic, wait 'til they find out it's 'because of stupid bikes'.

But... I'm kind of a cynical pessimist when it comes to this kind of thing. Hopefully it works out great and people (myself included) figure it out quickly.

I say give them a chance.

Some guy's got a youtube video of these in NYC, they're just another place to jaywalk. PDX, you're gonna hate 'em, esp when the cops make you use 'em.

Some guy's got a youtube video of these in NYC, they're just another place to jaywalk. PDX, you're gonna hate 'em, esp when the cops make you use 'em.

There is no requirement to use them. The literature describing the cycle tracks makes that clear up front.

There is no requirement to use them. The literature describing the cycle tracks makes that clear up front.

once they become 'official', ORS 814.420, the mandatory bike lane and sidepath law, will apply. At least one commenter on Bike Portland already has had a cop tell him he was supposed to be in the cycle track when he was riding in the main traffic lane - to avoid a parked car in the cycle track.

:eek:

once they become 'official', ORS 814.420, the mandatory bike lane and sidepath law, will apply. At least one commenter on Bike Portland already has had a cop tell him he was supposed to be in the cycle track when he was riding in the main traffic lane - to avoid a parked car in the cycle track.

:eek:

did the cop ticket the car?

did the cop ticket the car?

nope, just drove right by

...At least one commenter on Bike Portland already has had a cop tell him he was supposed to be in the cycle track when he was riding in the main traffic lane - to avoid a parked car in the cycle track....
enjoy your separate but equal facilities

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2628/3912223571_27a3c456f0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2571/3912223637_dc40baa8fc.jpg

Motorists fill cycle track with parked cars (http://vancelongwell.blogspot.com/2009/09/this-just-in-sw-broadway-cycle-track.html)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2628/3912223571_27a3c456f0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2571/3912223637_dc40baa8fc.jpg

Motorists fill cycle track with parked cars (http://vancelongwell.blogspot.com/2009/09/this-just-in-sw-broadway-cycle-track.html)

OK that really sucks. Are police ticketing the wrongfully parked cars? If there is no enforcement then the idea is totally useless.

OK that really sucks. Are police ticketing the wrongfully parked cars? If there is no enforcement then the idea is totally useless.

PPB are more likely to ticket cyclists for riding outside the cycle track than to ticket illegally parked motorists in the cycle track.

PPB are more likely to ticket cyclists for riding outside the cycle track than to ticket illegally parked motorists in the cycle track.

How can you ride in it with cars parked there?

Oh and perhaps the best "revenge" is that those cars parked in there really have no way out. :innocent:

I certainly would be temped to call some parking enforcement division or whatever to ticket and tow them... is there not some "no parking" mandate associated with these cycle tracks?

How can you ride in it with cars parked there?

Oh and perhaps the best "revenge" is that those cars parked in there really have no way out. :innocent:

I certainly would be temped to call some parking enforcement division or whatever to ticket and tow them... is there not some "no parking" mandate associated with these cycle tracks?

It seems like it'd be hard to tow them w/ all the other cars there. Although, I'm frequently amazed at how surgical some tow truck drivers can be.

It's better than nothing. Look at the great bike lane created in between the two sets of parked cars ;)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2628/3912223571_27a3c456f0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2571/3912223637_dc40baa8fc.jpg

Motorists fill cycle track with parked cars (http://vancelongwell.blogspot.com/2009/09/this-just-in-sw-broadway-cycle-track.html)

Okay, who are the "double parkers?" The people parking in the correct parking spaces, or the moron's parking in the cycle track?

How can you ride in it with cars parked there?

Oh and perhaps the best "revenge" is that those cars parked in there really have no way out. :innocent:

I certainly would be temped to call some parking enforcement division or whatever to ticket and tow them... is there not some "no parking" mandate associated with these cycle tracks?

Is there a time limit on the legitimate spaces? If not I'd call a bunch of friends when the cycle track is full of illegally parked cars and have them all park in the legal spots all day long. Just to see how the owners of the illegally parked cars like being blocked in. About the only illegally parked cars that stand any chance of getting out would be the first and last ones at the intersections.

It's better than nothing. Look at the great bike lane created in between the two sets of parked cars ;)

LOL Right... double door zone bike lane. :eek:

It seems like it'd be hard to tow them w/ all the other cars there. Although, I'm frequently amazed at how surgical some tow truck drivers can be.

Well really all they have to do is start at one end of the street and then methodically work their way to the other end. After all they can only pick up one car at a time anyway.

Can someone explain this?
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2618/3875708378_441740bce7_m.jpg

Can someone explain this?



it's a bike box to get cyclists out in front of traffic at a light. If you are going to segregate cyclists into bike lanes, they are essential

it's a bike box to get cyclists out in front of traffic at a light. If you are going to segregate cyclists into bike lanes, they are essential

But it is marked with a left turn arrow, on first glance it looks like it is designed to kill cyclists making left turns instead of having them make left turns from the left most lane - maybe I am mistaken but it looks like traffic can flow to the left of this arrow - or probably more likely it is OK to just turn left there as the cyclist is protected? - I'd have to try it to find out I guess. I just don't get how is it even possible to merge left for a turn while following the strongly marked guidance?

It's not a 'turn lane' per say. It looks like they removed the last parking space, and provided a space for a cyclist to wait until they can make the left turn without blocking other cyclists in the travel lane. One of the difficulties with this bike lane seems to be that parked cars separate bikes from cars, so you can't merge over to the left ahead of the intersection. I guess here, you just have to wait and do the merge and turn all at once.

Can someone explain this?

That right there is innovation. Just ask Bek.

But it is marked with a left turn arrow, on first glance it looks like it is designed to kill cyclists making left turns instead of having them make left turns from the left most lane - maybe I am mistaken but it looks like traffic can flow to the left of this arrow - or probably more likely it is OK to just turn left there as the cyclist is protected? - I'd have to try it to find out I guess. I just don't get how is it even possible to merge left for a turn while following the strongly marked guidance?

Yeah you'd think it would be more like the image below...

It's not a 'turn lane' per say. It looks like they removed the last parking space, and provided a space for a cyclist to wait until they can make the left turn without blocking other cyclists in the travel lane. One of the difficulties with this bike lane seems to be that parked cars separate bikes from cars, so you can't merge over to the left ahead of the intersection. I guess here, you just have to wait and do the merge and turn all at once.

Are you sure the cyclist needs to wait? The box is green and there is no yield or stop that I can see - left turns don't' require one to stop for traffic in the same direction. Maybe there is a stop sign for the thru drivers? Although this would create again an issue if some motorists didn't stop, just like the right hook issue. I'd like someone who has seen it to better explain.

They have "bike boxes" in Portland. The intent is for you to filter to the front and get in front of right turning traffic. The bike box is the big green box. Since they force you to ride in bike lanes in Portland, they also need to facilitate left turns. I don't know how that works if you come upon a light when it's green (I assume the idea is the cyclist takes the lane), but when the light is red, you filter to the front and take your left turn. It's not an unreasonable compromise. They adopted bike boxes when a cyclist was killed in a right hook accident.

Can someone explain this?
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2618/3875708378_441740bce7_m.jpg

It's a bike box designed to make a 'Copenhagen left turn' from. If you want to go left, instead of merging left to make your turn, you enter the box and wait for the green light on the cross street.

^^thank you

Well really all they have to do is start at one end of the street and then methodically work their way to the other end. After all they can only pick up one car at a time anyway.

I'm sure that most tow companies have more then one truck. And yes, I know what you mean, but if they had to tow just one at a time that's giving the next in line the chance to "escape."

it's a bike box to get cyclists out in front of traffic at a light. If you are going to segregate cyclists into bike lanes, they are essential

Does that mean that cyclists are suppose to make left hand turns from the right side of the road? Isn't that dangerous?

Does that mean that cyclists are suppose to make left hand turns from the right side of the road? Isn't that dangerous?

see post #28

It's a bike box designed to make a 'Copenhagen left turn' from. If you want to go left, instead of merging left to make your turn, you enter the box and wait for the green light on the cross street.

Thanks, that clears things up. There was actually a thread or more on here recently discussing people making left turns like that at an intersection without the box.

We'll see how well these cycle tracks work out. They look to be OK, as long as there aren't intersections that they traverse where cars headed parallel to them get a chance to turn right on red (if such intersections exist then there will be a cyclist-specific traffic light, and right-on red for the cars prohibited.)

On a side note, the 3 ft buffer on the right side of the cars can serve as a good model for properly dealing with parallel parking and bike lanes (which would be to the LEFT of parked cars). Doorings should be extremely rare with the setup.

see post #28

Still seems dangerous.

Still seems dangerous.

keep in mind that the left turn box is protected by the row of parked cars, and there are no right turns permitted anywhere along the length of the cycle track - it is continuously bordered on the right by a college campus.

keep in mind that the left turn box is protected by the row of parked cars, and there are no right turns permitted anywhere along the length of the cycle track - it is continuously bordered on the right by a college campus.

I tried to do a Google/YouTube search but couldn't come up with any footage of it. Which side of the road does one end up on after making their left turn? Does cross traffic automatically allow a cyclist to turn left?

Which side of the road does one end up on after making their left turn? Does cross traffic automatically allow a cyclist to turn left?

1. the right side

2 I don't understand the question

I am curious to see how these play out. I will have to check them out next time I am in that part of town.

1. the right side

2 I don't understand the question

You or someone said that the person in the green box waiting to make a left turn does so when the cross street light turns green. So does that traffic automatically stop and wait for the cyclist or what?

there are no cyclist specific signals included in this design yet. If you are waiting in the green left turn box when the cross street light turns green, any traffic facing you that wants to turn left across your path is supposed to yield/wait for you to proceed straight through the intersection first, as is normal in all traffic situations.

there are no cyclist specific signals included in this design yet. If you are waiting in the green left turn box when the cross street light turns green, any traffic facing you that wants to turn left across your path is supposed to yield/wait for you to proceed straight through the intersection first, as is normal in all traffic situations.

Okay, that sounds reasonable, and I presume that there have PSA's aired and billboards, and whatnot to alert drivers about how they are suppose to react when they see a cyclist in the green boxes? What about the out of town/state driver who doesn't have the green boxes where they're from?

Okay, that sounds reasonable, and I presume that there have PSA's aired and billboards, and whatnot to alert drivers about how they are suppose to react when they see a cyclist in the green boxes? What about the out of town/state driver who doesn't have the green boxes where they're from?

there is a trifold handout, I'll see if I can find a copy on the web.

PDOT Cycle Track Brochure (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=50257&a=261581)

PDOT Cycle Track Page (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=50257)

PDOT Bike Box Page (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=46717&)

PDOT Cycle Track Brochure (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=50257&a=261581)

PDOT Cycle Track Page (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=50257)

PDOT Bike Box Page (http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=46717&)

Do cyclists have the option not to use the cycle track?

How many cities are talking/thinking about installing them?

Do cyclists have the option not to use the cycle track?

How many cities are talking/thinking about installing them?

1. as they are currently considered 'experimental' the city has stated that cyclists are not required to use them. However, Oregon has a state mandatory bike lane and side path statute (ORS 814.420 (http://landru.leg.state.or.us/ors/814.html)) which suggests that use could be considered mandatory.

2. none beyond Portland AFAIK

1. as they are currently considered 'experimental' the city has stated that cyclists are not required to use them. However, Oregon has a state mandatory bike lane and side path statute (ORS 814.420 (http://landru.leg.state.or.us/ors/814.html)) which suggests that use could be considered mandatory.

2. none beyond Portland AFAIK

Similar designs are all over Barcelona.

Similar designs are all over Barcelona.

1. Barcelona is not in the US

2. the Ramblas in Barcelona is not the same. unless they've built it in the past 5 years, I didn't see anything equivalent when I was there