Utility Cycling - Smorris' Xtracycle blog, build, and questions

Hi gang!

I've only posted in this forum a couple of times. Since I found BikeForums, I've mostly hung out in the 50+, C&V, and my regional forums. I had a couple of posts here about a good candidate for a donor for an Xtracycle, and a thread about whether anyone has gone the Xtracycle route and not liked it. (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=578651)

Well, Sunday (8/30) I bought a used mountain bike from craigslist, and later that evening ordered the Xtracycle kit. The above linked thread meandered from my original question to more build oriented questions and discussion, so I thought I'd start a better named one for anyone who wanted to follow along, and as a place for me to ask questions as I go.


The Bike:

I bought a used KHS True Temper steel mountain bike. Best I can narrow it down, it is a 1997 KHS Summit X, based on BikePedia. There are several differences, but nothing else that I've found comes close. I posted a query for ID in BikeForums' and MTBR's forums, but never was sure. I'm going to write KHS and see if they can figure it out. It isn;t really important, but I'm anal about details, so I'd like to know. Here's a link (http://smorris.smugmug.com/The-Garage/Leaning-Against-the-Wall/1997-KHS-Summit-X/9462226_wXNXZ) to my smugmug gallery for the bike as I bought it.

http://smorris.smugmug.com/photos/634829836_ykJfp-XL.jpg

What I do know:

KHS Summit 17" frame
True Temper AVR ChroMoly double butted tube set with "DeltaLinear Downtube"
Rock Shock Indy C suspension fork
Dia-Compe VersaControl 737 V-brakes
Dia-Compe 7EXA PowerControl brake levers
DiaTech headset
Un-marked stem (with DiaTech plug), handlebars, seatpost and seatpost clamp.
"Brooks" Taiwanese padded saddle
Shimano STX-rc rear derailleur
Shimano "A" front derailleur
Sachs twist shifters
STX-rc 8 rear hub
Un-marked front hub
SR Powerflo Front PF-F crankset
Alex AL-MP 19 rims with Panaracer Duster II R 26X2.10 tires
Un-marked pedals

So that kinda matches up with the BikePedia listing (http://www.bikepedia.com/QuickBike/BikeSpecs.aspx?Year=1997&Brand=KHS&Model=Summit+X&Type=bike) for the Summit-X. If anyone knows about KHS bikes, please look through these and confirm my guess or suggest something different?

This bike looks practically brand new, with the mold marks still on the tire lugs and barely any markings on the rim sidewalls. The guy said all he did with it was use it for riding around his neighborhood with the kids.


Pieces Parts:

On Sunday evening, I ordered the Xtracycle FreeRadical, Longtail Kit, Footsies, and Magic Carpet from Bike Trailer Shop. (http://www.biketrailershop.com/catalog/355-xtracycle-kit-wsetup-options-p-134.html) According to the tracking number, it won't be here until Tuesday due to a busy spurt at BTS. While I'm glad business is picking up for retailers, I'm a little disappointed not to get it before the long holiday weekend.

As noted in the other thread linked above, I've had an ongoing email discussion as to whether the Surly 1X1 rigid fork (http://www.surlybikes.com/forks/1x1_pop.html) would be the correct size to swap in in place of my Rock Shox Indy C. Today we determined that it is almost the perfect size, only 1mm off on rake, and 7mm off on axle-to-crown measurement with the fork compressed about half of its 2" stroke. That's less than 1/3 degree change in effective head tube angle. Soon after finalizing that, a new for got added to my birthday list for the kids to give me in a couple of weeks. :D

Based on discussions here and in the Flickr Xtracycle group, I ordered a pair of Schwalbe Big Apple tires in 50-559 (26X2.0) from Wallingford Bicycle Parts. (http://www.wallbike.com) They should be here Friday. I'm already having second thoughts as to whether I should have ordered the 60-559 (26X2.35) size. Thoughts?

During an experiment swapping handlebars on my Bridgestone RB-T (see link in my sig) I ended up with a left over set of Nitto Albatross bars. I may give those a try on my Xtracycle. If I do, I'll change from the twist grip shifter to a set of cork grips and a trigger shifter. I've never had a mountain bike before, and don't really know too much about the different shifters. On the bikes I've tried, I like the push one lever/pull another better than the indexed thumb shifter or two triggers that you push both. From what I've read, 8-speed shifters are not that easy to come by any more. The LBS has a Shimano Alivio SL-M410, but the review are not that stellar on them, with many reports of breakage. Anyone have a better, medium cost suggestion?

That's about where I am today. I'm getting a couple of water bottle cages, I'll get some cam straps, bungies, etc to hold things on. I'm contemplating getting a better headset when I replace the fork. This one just has a collar clamp, and no good way to move spacers top to bottom to adjust the handlebar height.

Thanks for following along. This post sorta got long, but brings anyone following along up to date. Feel free to comment as this thread continues, and if anyone has answers or suggestions on the questions above, I'd appreciate the input. There will be photos and more comments or questions added as I go along.

Steve

I would look for a set of older Shimano XT M740 shifters if you want just shifters. There are several more options if you want to run integrated shifter/brake levers. You can find them on ebay occasionally and sometimes on clearance on different web sites.

Thanks, I'll kep an eye out for them. The current brake levers seem fine. I figure I'd have more adjustability options with separate components.

Anyone have an opinion on the tires? 2.0 vs 2.35 Big Apples?

Thanks,
Steve

Anyone have an opinion on the tires? 2.0 vs 2.35 Big Apples?

Steve

For sure 2.0 is plenty, unless you are going to load it with horses and cows. I use 622.47 on my Dogbike2.

Hi gang,

Thanks for the replies. Sorry I hadn't got back to this thread earlier, but had company for the weekend. Now everyone is gone, the daughter is back at school and wife back at work. I took an extra vacation day to finally relax. Plus, the Xtracycle kit is on a FedEx truck, and according to the tracking info, out for delivery. :)

Since my last post, I've torn down the mountain bike, scrubbed, polished and cleaned everything, lubed it all up nicely and put it back together. I installed the Big Apple tires, and they sure make for a better road ride. I tried them on the pseudo-trail through a new housing development where the road will be at some time, and htey still work fine there, too. So I think these will work out fine.

I took off that fake "Brooks" gel/nylon saddle and put my old Selle San Marco Regal on for now. I may end up with Brooks B-67 depending on where the handlebars end up.

I swapped the Nitto Albatross bars for the flat mountain bike bar. The rear shifter and brake fit OK, but the front cables were too short. That's OK for now. I'll use the longer rear cable and housings when I put on the new ones from the Xtracycle kit. I think the Albatross will work out OK, although I might end up with a shorter, higher stem.

Although I really like the bar end shifters on my RB-T, I decided to get a set of integrated brake/shifters along with cork grips for this bike. There's not much out there for 8 speed shifters. Instead of converting to 9 or hacking together mixed used parts from eBay, I ordered the cheap Shimano ST-EF50 Altus brake/shifter set. If that doesn't work OK, then I'll try something else.

So, I think I'll go take a last ride around town on the bike in this current configuration, and then start taking parts back off in anticipation of Santa; err, I mean the FedEx guy stopping by with presents.

Steve

Well, I never even made it for a ride, although it started raining a bit after my previous post. FedEx guy arrived and I've unpacked stuff. I'll grab lunch and start in.

Packing was a little disappointing. The box is in OK shape, but stuff inside wasn't isolated very well. The two uprights (H bars?) must have rubbed against each other or something sharp, because the silver annodizing/brushed surface is scraped up along the outer edges under the rear reflectors. Not enough to send back, but it looks crappy. The Magic Carpet foam must have been stuffed up against something sharp, as it is all compressed and really lumpy. Hopefully it will return to its original shape.

I'm surprised the dropouts were not protected better instead of just against the bottom of the box. I don't think they are bent. The just look like when they were welded they cupped a bit and are not flat parallel surfaces for the axle nuts and Q/Rs to clamp against. The derailleur hanger doesn't look bent, just not aligned very well, further out at the back than the front. Both dropouts and hanger look sorta like this / \ (greatly exaggerated) looking at the frame from the bottom. I guess I was expecting more.

We'll see how it all goes together.
Steve

W00t! More parts arrived! :) Here's what I've got so for.

KHS Summit X donor bike
Xtracycle Free Radical Kit
Xtracycle Freeloader Kit
Xtracycle Footsies
Xtracycle Magic Carpet
2 stainless water bottle cages
2 Schwalbe Big Apple 26X2.0 tires
Selle San Marco Regal perforated leather saddle
Nitto Albatross handlebars
Shimano ST-EF50 Altus brake/shifter set
Dimension Cork grips
Rubbermaid Slim-line 12 can cooler
Yakima fork mount for towing
Cannondale wedge seat bag


Arriving Tuesday is a set of Planet Bike Hardcore ATB fenders.

Possible future additions:
Surly 1X1 fork
New headset with spacers
Lighting

I'll be putting on the shifters/brakes tomorrow and finishing up adjusting everything. Oh, and I put the two mountain bike bar end extensions on one side of the freeloader to act as a sort of mini-Wideloader. I just pivot them behind the bag when not in use. Haven't tried them with anything loaded yet.

Finished! Well, at least for now.

My first ride on the Xtracycle (just finished putting it together this afternoon), and my first load. I sure got a lot of looks from people in passing cars! I took my daughter's bike to meet the bus after a cross country meet. Then she rode the bike home with me. The boys thought the "surfboard" was cool. 12 year old daughter soaked in the attention.

http://smorris.smugmug.com/photos/647258366_HufR2-XL-2.jpg


As I pulled out of the driveway and started down the road, I was greeted with a fair bit of fork shimmy. It was worse when I pedaled than when I was coasting, and it went away as I got some speed. Probably some of it was the fork compressing, but I'm not so sure I'll be towing the bike too much. This was just two miles. It is a bear to back up! With just me with no load coming home, it was much more stable. Not sure if it is no-hands stable, though. I think a rigid fork is in order. I told the kids about it for my birthday, but I also ordered a Magic Carpet and Footsies that seemed to have disappeared after I opened the Xtracycle kit. Maybe I'll get to unwrap them again on Friday! :) So I also told my brothers about the fork.

I like the lever shifter/brakes a *lot* better than the twist shift! And the Albatross bar works out great on here. Better than on the RB-T that I bought them for, actually. I think the longer stem gets them far enough away from me that they are more comfortable.

We stopped at one of my daughter's friends house on the way home. Her dad came out and asked if my wife had kicked me out of the house, 'cause I looked like one of those homeless men...

More photos at the link in my sig. I'll add to it tomorrow and take some of just the completed bike.

I'd get a Pletscher double leg kickstand or if you can afford it, a Rolling Jackass centerstand. You want stability when dealing with heavy loads when parked.

I'd get a Pletscher double leg kickstand or if you can afford it, a Rolling Jackass centerstand. You want stability when dealing with heavy loads when parked.

I've never seen a Pletscher work with an Xtra/BD because the kickstand mount is off to the left.....have you installed one on your rig?

As I pulled out of the driveway and started down the road, I was greeted with a fair bit of fork shimmy. It was worse when I pedaled than when I was coasting, and it went away as I got some speed. Probably some of it was the fork compressing, but I'm not so sure I'll be towing the bike too much. This was just two miles. It is a bear to back up! With just me with no load coming home, it was much more stable. Not sure if it is no-hands stable, though. I think a rigid fork is in order. I told the kids about it for my birthday, but I also ordered a Magic Carpet and Footsies that seemed to have disappeared after I opened the Xtracycle kit. Maybe I'll get to unwrap them again on Friday! :) So I also told my brothers about the fork.

I'd just skip her bike and give her a ride home on the back....if she wants to look cool she can surf the rear deck while you pedal!

That suspension fork is not very laterally rigid and will cause you issues with heavy and/or long loads. A rigid fork will definitely help. You'll also find the stock rear MTB wheel is not up to heavy loads and will cause some handling issues. If you can find something from a DH MTB that would be a better fit.

Enjoy your new ride....:thumb:

Enjoy the new bike.

Not on my BD. I've the Xtracycle BD centerstand.

I was going to just give her a ride on the back, but I wanted to try this out.

As of now, I don't foresee really heavy loads. I've had about 120 pounds on the Burley trailer, so I can still rely on that behind the RB-T. I'll keep a heavy duty wheel in mind, though. Ya never know what may pop up on craigslist.

I'm definitely enjoying the ride! :D

(And I forgot, I'm not done yet. Fenders are due to arrive Tuesday.)




I'd just skip her bike and give her a ride home on the back.


That suspension fork is not very laterally rigid and will cause you issues with heavy and/or long loads. A rigid fork will definitely help. You'll also find the stock rear MTB wheel is not up to heavy loads and will cause some handling issues. If you can find something from a DH MTB that would be a better fit.

Enjoy your new ride....:thumb:

Enjoy the new bike.

Glamour Photos!

Click here to go to the gallery of 22 photos (http://smorris.smugmug.com/Leaning-Against-the-Wall/Xtracycle/9623204_97EF8)

http://smorris.smugmug.com/photos/648521917_KgXyV-XL-1.jpg

Finished! Well, at least for now.


Well, that didn't take long. Today I got the Footsies and Magic Carpet from my daughter and a Surly 1X1 fork from my brother for my birthday. I don't know what the other brother is getting, but Wideloaders were on the birthday/Christmas list.

So of course I had to get goodies to go along with it. I ordered a Ritchey Scuzzy Logic headset and a Reynolds spacer kit. Plus I got a couple spare tubes for the Xtracycle and my RB-T, since I didn't have any. While I was at it, I ordered a custom 13-32 cassette with gear ratio increments more to my liking.

Oh, and I bought a set of Planet Bike fenders earlier this week.

Now I should be done for a while... :)

I'm impatient, and couldn't wait until my friend returns. I temporarily put the
new fork on today using the old bearings and cups, and a second stem to take up
space on the long steerer tube. (The KHS has the Diatech style headset that has
a conical pinch bolt that clamps up against the bottom of the stem or spacers
instead of an Aheadset style clamp.) Wow, does that make a difference! Much more
nimble and lighter feeling steering. It feels like a completely different bike.
At fist I was disappointed with the Xtracycle, because it made a fun mountain
bike feel heavy and sluggish. That's all gone now. What a drastic improvement!

I've put three work in progress photos at the end of the "Xtracycle Build"
gallery (http://smorris.smugmug.com/Leaning-Against-the-Wall/Xtracycle-Build/9568253_heqy\ V#P-2-28) to show what it looks like now.

xtracycle + suspension fork = :(