Cyclocross - Ritchey cranks bb question

Hi all...I recently picked up a set of Ritchey crank arms (double) without a bb and am trying to determine which bb is required. The arms are splined and I have been told by one source that they take an Isis bb and another says Shimano Octolink (longer splined version I'd guess). I will be using these on a Kelly Knobby X frameset.
Thanks.

A picture sure would help. I have seen only one non-shimano octalink so my very uninformed thought is Isis.

Edit: If it's the one below it uses a Shimano octalink (Ultegra or D/A). That's a new one on me.

http://www.excelsports.com/image200/Ritchey%20Crankset%20Compact%20WCS.jpg

Thanks, I will get a pic up soon although the crankset is quite similar to the one you posted but all black....actually they look just like these except they have the 'TR' shield type logo as part of the forging:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2263/2542651896_079e1dc3de.jpg?v=0

The Ritchey cranks definitely take Octalink (V1) bottom brackets, not ISIS. They're getting tougher to find, but not impossible. I've picked up a couple on eBay, and there's still several on-line stores that carry 'em.

Edit: The polished version above is the WCS compact model; the all-black one on the previous post looks more like the Pro Cross V with the 130bcd bolt pattern.

cambria has octalinks on sale

Thanks all. I see Bikeman carries them as well.

Not sure of the appropriate width though...

Thanks all. I see Bikeman carries them as well.

Not sure of the appropriate width though...

doubles are ~110mm and the triples are 118.5

Thanks all. I see Bikeman carries them as well.



Bikeman has lots of the V2 (mtb crank) Octalink BBs, but they won't work (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octalink#Octalink) with your Ritchey crank. The only 68x109mm axle V1 model they list that is the Dura-Ace model. Cambria has a 105 model in a 68x109mm axle

Thanks for the help all.

I was wondering about spindle length as the Kelly frames were designed to use a mtn triple and mine has 135 rear spacing (have some ultegra wheels I'll use with some washers for spacers).

I see Bikeman has this V1 105 68x109.5 bb listed...will this not work?

http://www.bikeman.com/CR4800.html

is your bb shell 68 or 73mm?

It's a 68 mm shell.

I just put a ritchey compact on an old frame. Turns out that I *HAD* to use a 118mm bb for the cranks to fit properly.

I have the Ritchey Pro cranks in 110 (compact) bcd. I've used them for cross, they're fairly light, and I like the octalink BBs, and they're a good crank at a great price.

But sell them off while they're still new and get something else for your Kelly.

The first and biggest problem has been identified above- Your frame requires a longer BB spindle, I don't know exactly how long it needs to be but I was considering a Kelly and shyed off the purchase when I learned about the BB/chainline issues that people were asking about on several forums. I think most solutions involved a triple or MTB BB. The Ritchey cranks require a V1 model Octalink, these only come in double, roadbike sized spindle lengths, you'll be very challenged to find an Octalink V1 any longer than Shimano's standard road double 109mm spindle. Not to say that it's impossible, but good luck- Longer Octalinks spindles are found in the V2 model for MTB and triples, but you cannot use a V2 with those pro/wcs (double) Ritchey cranks- the V2 splined end is longer than a V1 and pressing the Ritcheys onto a V2 will end in tears and a ruined crank- you wouldn't be the first to discover this. Another small problem is that the Ritchey cranks use the crank arm as one of the five spider attachments. Most aftermarket chainrings are set up for cranks that use 5 distinct spider arms, so the pin that prevents the chain from accidently jamming between the crank arm and the large ring is in the wrong place. Not really a big deal, but I've never found aftermarket rings from Ritchey and the aftermarket/replacement rings commonly found (eg FSA) don't have the pin in the right place for Ritchey style cranks.


A better option, for a similar price is a 110 bcd Sugino XD crank. I have a couple of those- similar weight to Ritchey (and Ultegras of a few years ago), very nicely polished silver. These use a square taper BB, easily found in many lengths at several price points. Nothing wrong with square taper, Octalink is a slightly lighter design than square taper, but not by much. Sugino chain rings are excellent quality are easily found relatively cheap (eg check Harris cycle for an online source), Sugino rings are usually without pins and ramps but you don't really need ramped chainrings for the relatively close 10 tooth jumps (eg 36-46t) found on cross rigs. It's really only the large ring that's ramped anyway, and if you really want that you can find FSA aftermarket rings. I think the Sugino XD models are perfect for cyclocross, especially at the pricepoint you're looking at. Several models of FSA cranks (eg Gossamer) can also be found at 110 bcd and are not too expensive, but I've seen and heard of too many problems with their proprietary "mega-exo" bottom brackets with the external bearings from team mates and various forums. FSA wouldn't be my first choice because I think the FSA external bearing model BB's are junk, at least the cheaper ones are (my opinion- YMMV). Here's a random link to the Sugino- look around on the web, or your LBS can order them for you.
http://www.velo-orange.com/suxddocr48.html

Thanks for the great info. I paid $20.00 for them and they are set up with a Salsa Crossing Guard in place of the big ring and a nearly new Origin 8 38 tooth ring both of which are worth more than the purchase price so I may scavenge them for use on another crank. I'm guessing these are the same bcd as the Sugino mentioned?

I do see v1 XTR 952 bb's available which are quite a bit wider but the price is about $85.00 so I'm more inclined to save the crank for another project where I'll be able to use the cheaper 105 bb.

I am doing this project a little on the cheap initially, probably in the $1000-$1200 max range. The XD cranks look good and I've run the ss versions. I see there is also a mtn triple version although I see no reason why I cannot use the road/cross version with a 113 or 118 mm bb.

the xtr is for 68/73 bb shells(must use spacers on 68mm)
come in 113 and 116mm

Thanks for the great info. I paid $20.00 for them and they are set up with a Salsa Crossing Guard in place of the big ring and a nearly new Origin 8 38 tooth ring both of which are worth more than the purchase price so I may scavenge them for use on another crank. I'm guessing these are the same bcd as the Sugino mentioned?

I do see v1 XTR 952 bb's available which are quite a bit wider but the price is about $85.00 so I'm more inclined to save the crank for another project where I'll be able to use the cheaper 105 bb.

I am doing this project a little on the cheap initially, probably in the $1000-$1200 max range. The XD cranks look good and I've run the ss versions. I see there is also a mtn triple version although I see no reason why I cannot use the road/cross version with a 113 or 118 mm bb.

Square taper is square taper, unless it's Campagnolo, then it's a slightly smaller hole/spindle. You want a JIS standard square taper BB spindle, I think there have been discussions posted here and roadbikereview and other forums as to the BB spindle length you need for your Kelly- you don't want it wider than necessary or your chainline suffers- ideally your chainline will be close to parallel when the chain is in the middle of the cassette in the rear and the small chainring position (for a double). If you're wanting a single ring set up then there's no advantage in a compact 110bcd crank, you could easily find an older square taper road crank and just use the 39 or 42 tooth ring that came with the crank and be done with it. Your 38t Origin8 ring could be either 110bcd or 130bcd, because 38t is the smallest ring that can fit on a 130bcd road crank. You can measure between the centers of two bolt holes to tell which you have: 110bcd are about 65mm and 130bcd are about 76mm spacing between adjacent holes. The reason 110bcd are popular for cyclocross is because you can mount a ring as small as 33t (though I've never seen smaller than 34t anywhere). For a single ring setup, you could also consider an older MTB crank without ramped chainrings, just use the middle position with either the middle or large chainring, although 44t as a single is too big a gear for most cross mortals, most prefer 42t or smaller. With a single ring setup, it's probably better to avoid modern ramped chainrings as you don't want it to "shift". You may be able to find the a triple version of the Sugino without having to buy any new rings- like a 26-36-46, just remove the granny and once it's mounted you'd have to look hard for the extra holes to see that it's not the double model, if vanity comes to visit during your decision.

the xtr is for 68/73 bb shells(must use spacers on 68mm)
come in 113 and 116mm
True, they might work if they're long enough, and you can find one and are willing to pay the price. XTR is the only V1 MTB octalink, XT and lower models use the V2.

Shimano still makes triple bb's for octalink...

They're 118.5. I'm running one on a cross bike right now.

Zen and everyone else, thanks for all the great info. Some different options it seems.

I've done some searching but haven't found too many specific responses on bb spindle length although...I did find someone else stating they ran/run a 118 ultegra bb with Ritchey Cross cranks for instance. I think eventually I will have some wheels built using mtn hubs which would help any chainline issues too.

Btw the Origin 8 chainring is drilled for both 110 and 130.