Just read that Lances Time Trial bike for L'Alpe D'Huez did not pass
the weight limit for bikes by .020 Kg. His bike weighed 6.780kg and
minimum weight is 6.8 kg.
They had to add weight to the bike so he could ride it.
I'm not surprized as this was the subject of one of the
Lance Chronicles episodes.
You'd have thought that Bruyneel et al would have it figured
out and ensure that it passed the weight checks.

Marty

I found this a little surprising.

I'm not sure why it's a big deal. As long as it is legal to just add a touch of weight to make it legal why not bring it in a few grams under? This is pretty standard procedure in most competitions where there is a minimum or maximum weight, as long as last minute adjustments are allowed. Some pieces of sporting equipment come standard with easily adjustable weighting for this very purpose so if you change a component you can easily add or remove little weights to compensate. It is different if failure to meet weight requirement absolutely disqualifies that equipment, but I am not aware of a sport where that is the case.

Maybe where to add it is what the problem is. I mean, it's not like you're gonna be able to stick a brick on the front handlebars and not mess with the performance... ;)

Koffee

could just come down to a difference in scale calibration too. in that Lance chronicle episode they were concerned about that. it was pretty squirlley the way they were trying to wiegh the thing in that episode too, they really didnt have the proper type of scale. i figured they'd come up with one at some point before the race, but who knows. atleast they wieghed it before the TT instead of after, which also seemed to be a bit of a concern.

I was wondering what effect it would have too. If Lance has been training on this bike how can the added weight now be felt. He is supposedly so in tune with the bikes he will notice it.

0.02 is nothing for most people, but for a pro rider it could feel like a 1/2 pound. I am taking a guess on that one.

You also have to wonder about the difference in scales. If one or the other is not checked for balance between weighings it could be off. I would be supprised if the team or the tour did not double check balance before weighing each time.

Maybe I'm a little cynical, but I think this is all a PR stunt by Trek. Kinda like Cannondale had their "Legalize my Cannondale" campaign, Trek is just doing the same thing, so that when people go out and want the lightest bike they can find - of course it is going to be the Trek SL.... "Did you hear they had to add weight to it just to make it legal" PLEASE... This is nonsense. :rolleyes:

could just come down to a difference in scale calibration too. in that Lance chronicle episode they were concerned about that. it was pretty squirlley the way they were trying to wiegh the thing in that episode too, they really didnt have the proper type of scale. i figured they'd come up with one at some point before the race, but who knows. atleast they wieghed it before the TT instead of after, which also seemed to be a bit of a concern.

I work in the Quality dept and we have many critical measurements that are done on extremely sensitive scales. They have to be calibrated all the time. Hopefully, they are checking the calibration all the time before they are weighing the bikes. If the scale were to get bumped or jarred it could throw everything off. Plus, most scales have an margin of error.

calibrate...that's the word. I couldn't think of it.

.02 kg = 20 grams or about 0.7 ounce, about like an energy gel. He would carry more than that if he hadn't peed for a few minutes and will sweat that much off in a couple hundred meters. A 20-gram bit of lead tape added to the rear of the seat tube or something is not going to affect either balance or aerodynamics.

Maybe I'm a little cynical, but I think this is all a PR stunt by Trek. Kinda like Cannondale had their "Legalize my Cannondale" campaign, Trek is just doing the same thing, so that when people go out and want the lightest bike they can find - of course it is going to be the Trek SL.... "Did you hear they had to add weight to it just to make it legal" PLEASE... This is nonsense. :rolleyes:

You might have a good point, except they showed this on the TDF coverage this morning. About an hour before he started they were weighing his bike and there was some controversy. I can't imagine that the Tour organizers were acting in concert with Trek and USPS to give them some publicity.

I was wondering what effect it would have too. If Lance has been training on this bike how can the added weight now be felt. He is supposedly so in tune with the bikes he will notice it.

0.02 is nothing for most people, but for a pro rider it could feel like a 1/2 pound I dunno, but I DID see Basso squirting water out of his bottle onto the course, not into his mouth. I can only assume he did this to gain a few grams. I guess 20 grams can make a bit of a difference.

I didn't see it in the thread, but what happens if his bike officially fails? Is it a fine or time or both? Not that losing a few seconds is gonna have any impact now :)

In keeping with the 0.7 oz analogy...a tablespoon of water weighs 0.5 oz. I don't care how sensitive LA is...he ain't gonna care about .02 kg weight differential.

I dunno, but I DID see Basso squirting water out of his bottle onto the course, not into his mouth. I can only assume he did this to gain a few grams. I guess 20 grams can make a bit of a difference.

I didn't see it in the thread, but what happens if his bike officially fails? Is it a fine or time or both? Not that losing a few seconds is gonna have any impact now :)

If you use illegal equipment they can kick you out of the Tour.

Well THAT wouldn't do at all!

Didn't he have areobars on that bike in the Lance Chronicles? I didn't notice them on his bike today. Could that have had something to do with it?

You might have a good point, except they showed this on the TDF coverage this morning. About an hour before he started they were weighing his bike and there was some controversy. I can't imagine that the Tour organizers were acting in concert with Trek and USPS to give them some publicity.

The Tour organizers wouldn't have to be in on it. Trek and the team would decide to make the bike a little light. I could see this happening just because it gets people talking. Any publicity is good. People I know that don't follow the tour or cycling in general know that Lance is riding a Trek. When they go to their LBS and see the Trek alongside another brand it's name recognition.

The referee that made the call was American.

OK, so was the bike too light BEFORE the TT or AFTER? Couldn't they just add a few weights if they caught it before the trail? They obviously let him ride and I didn't hear anything about it during the coverage of his actual run...

Why didn't Jan use lighter wheels?

OK, so was the bike too light BEFORE the TT or AFTER? Couldn't they just add a few weights if they caught it before the trail? They obviously let him ride and I didn't hear anything about it during the coverage of his actual run...

It sounds like it was before from cycling news:

16:08 CEST
Lance Armstrong's bike is reported to be 20 grams too light. It weighed in at 6.78 kg instead of the mandatory 6.8 kg. He'll have to put O3 in the tyres or something.

He started at 16:58, so they probably added some weight.

Jan, OTOH, was reported to have the heaviest bike of the day @ 7.2 kg. Had aerobars.

The referee that made the call was American.

Yeah, they said he was the first American referee the TDF has had. I guess they figured that since an American has won 8 of the past 18 Tours it was only fair.

Jan, OTOH, was reported to have the heaviest bike of the day @ 7.2 kg. Had aerobars.

I wonder if the added weight, plus the possible inefficiency of the TT position cost him much time.

Could difference in altitude account for the .02 Maybe the bike was legal before they took into the alps?

.020 kilograms = 0.705479239 ounces

You could tape a bag of peanuts to the top tube to bring the bike into spec.

A bit of mud on the pedals weighs this much.

One shoe weighs about 6 times this much.

I too would be concerned with scale calibration when dealing with margins this small. This seems like an ordinary last minute adjustment to me.

Dan

This amount is so minute, it is nearly negligable. The team must have weighed the bike with their own scale and it differed from the official scale by this small amount. It's nothing.

Maybe it's because he wasn't wearing a helmet? HAR HAR :) Just kiddin', bad joke from another thread I started.

Maybe it's because he wasn't wearing a helmet? HAR HAR :) Just kiddin', bad joke from another thread I started.Why go there man? Why go there?

I was just kidding. C'mon, if you can't laugh at yourself, everyone else will.

So, no one has an answered an earlier question of mine. Did they penalize Lance in any way or was all this taken care of before he rode?

So, no one has an answered an earlier question of mine. Did they penalize Lance in any way or was all this taken care of before he rode?

No, they won't penalize beforehand, only afterward. They can, but do not always, weigh any bike after a stage. If it's too light they can ban the rider from the tour. They just made him come up to specs by weighing it before the race. Probably cost him the record time on l'Alpe d'Huez. :)

20 grams is NOTHING and it would be solved by applying some lead tape to the top tube or stem or seat or using a heavier water bottle cage

I just think it's funny that they spent all that time working on the aero position for the TT and he just rode a straight bike in the end.

No man, that windtunnel time, the fancy new helmet and the million dollar skinsuit will be for Saturday. Not today.

So, no one has an answered an earlier question of mine. Did they penalize Lance in any way or was all this taken care of before he rode?

Check my post. It was weighed beforehand and thats where the fault was found. I think there would be a big uproar a this point if he was penalized in any way.

No man, that windtunnel time, the fancy new helmet and the million dollar skinsuit will be for Saturday. Not today.

right, i understand that. I was refering to the episode where they were rigging up those two different types of aero bars and went on a ride with the uphill TT position.

No man, that windtunnel time, the fancy new helmet and the million dollar skinsuit will be for Saturday. Not today.
yeah but if you recall the episode lance kept saying he wanted the
same setup he rode 2 years ago, they (deda) told him it wasn't available.
Given Lance's finickiness (is that a word?) I'm not surprised he used his
regular climbing bike, afterall this guy used the old Shimano pedals forever.
I think his performance pretty much ensured that for future mountain time
trials we won't be seeing aerobars.

Marty

I don't think it was a top priority for Lance, there was what, less than 2km of flat today? In the Dauphine he rode them, but that stage had a bit more flat to it than today.

Andrew

"What too light...really? Our bad...."[teams turns and laughs] ;)

Jan was the only one that I saw using aero bars for the ITT. Even Phil Liggett was commenting about what a poor decision it was.

I don't remember him saying it was a poor decision. What I remember him saying was that Jan had an unusual riding style, and he should try to keep his arms open so he can get more air in his lungs. Of course, as Jan got closer to the finish, they quit saying that.

Weren't they saying something last year about Jan's TT bike because the handlebars were so low too? Seriously, if he's more comfortable there, leave the boy alone! He did well in the time trial today, and probably in part because he rode in the manner which he felt worked best for him. Kudos to Jan. He really clawed his way back up there.

Koffee

They took the computer off Lance's bike, That would be an ounce or two.

Weren't they saying something last year about Jan's TT bike because the handlebars were so low too?

And it turns out that that, along with other things on Jan's bike, was a big-time innovation that many other riders/bike companies are trying to imitate right now (i.e. Lance's "secret TT weapon" from the Lance Chronicles that he ended up ditching).

In vandevelde's diary on velonews, he was commenting heras' bike was 300 grams too light, 454 is a pound so that could be fairly noticable. Of course that didn't help him at all so he might as well ridden whatever bike he had been the two weeks prior.

They should have attached a bob trailer to lances bike and and make Lance tow Robin Williams up the mountain.

Could difference in altitude account for the .02 Maybe the bike was legal before they took into the alps?

Nope. Little over 3 grams (.003 kg) at the top if using spring scales.
If they are measuring with balance scales rather than spring scales, any gravitational effect on the bike would be offset by the same amount on the reference weights.

No man, that windtunnel time, the fancy new helmet and the million dollar skinsuit will be for Saturday. Not today.

I think he's talking about the episode when they were trying to make a custom climbing/aero combo bar for today's time trial. the whole episode was about that, and then today it was just a normal bar. My guess is he didn't like it.

They probably remedied the whole situation anyway before the start of the stage. I rewatched the stage 2 times, and they said before the weighing in that Lance removed his bike computer to save weight.... so maybe they just put it back on? :D

Koffee

I think he's talking about the episode when they were trying to make a custom climbing/aero combo bar for today's time trial. the whole episode was about that, and then today it was just a normal bar. My guess is he didn't like it.

Carmichael commented that Lance was worried about the fans and using the bars, both from the limited amount of bike handling you get while in the aero position and worried about snagging something with those two bars hanging out there. That along with the limited benefits led them to drop the bars.

Also there were a few riders with bars out there, Basso had them, Mancebo had a funky looking extension, etc.

Andrew

They probably remedied the whole situation anyway before the start of the stage. I rewatched the stage 2 times, and they said before the weighing in that Lance removed his bike computer to save weight.... so maybe they just put it back on? :D

Koffee

from article by By Christian Vande Velde
Liberty-Seguros Professional Cycling
http://www.velonews.com/tour2004/diaries/articles/6636.0.html


Counting grams
Prior to the start Roberto had to change his rear wheel as his bike was 100 grams under the legal weight. The climbers on the team have bikes with small wheels as well. Lance had a weight problem before the start as well and the Postal mechanics had to throw a couple of computers, or something, on his bike to bring it to 6.8 kg. I was pleasantly surprised that my stock race bike came in at 6.9.