Advocacy & Safety - Stopped by the law!

Ok, ok. We all know that it is illegal to go through red lights, and something no cyclist should take any particular pride in doing. Equal rights! Equal responsibilities!

Still, here's my account of blowing through an empty intersection at 1:00 am -- and being stopped by a Seattle policeman. If he had asked I could have offered three locations within three blocks where he could have bought meth or cocaine from dangerous men, right on the street.

OUTLAW BIKER (http://www.bluejack.com/blog/index.html#0722)

Are you looking for sympathy? Always puzzles me why people post things like this.

Guess I always figure if you break the law, be a grownup and accept that there may be consequences.

Paul

Still, here's my account of blowing through an empty intersection at 1:00 am -- and being stopped by a Seattle policeman. If he had asked I could have offered three locations within three blocks where he could have bought meth or cocaine from dangerous men, right on the street.

OUTLAW BIKER (http://www.bluejack.com/blog/index.html#0722)


I had a HS Sociology teacher that told a story of being in college and routinely turning left at an empty intersection at 12:30. It was one of those intersections that had turn lights on both sides and you could only turn on the "turn green."

He too was stopped and ticketed. He explained that it took 5 full minutes if he missed the light for it to come back. No sympathy received and the cop was there for the next few nights. Ling story short, he stopped making the illegal turn.

Stop complaining. Like you said "Equal responsibility." You could have also just said thank you then let him know about the deals just down the street. I am sure he would have been appreciative of the positive attitude and tip.

BTW, I have received my fair share of tickets in my car, all of which were deserved, and have always said thank you and been sincere. I was not driving safely and they were only doing their job. All the tickets were also reduced by the officer due to my attitude, or lack thereof. I have also complimented an officer when I paid the ticket. I know so often they are complained about and this guy was really nice. I felt he really deserved to be praised for doing his job professionally and being nice--no attitude.

Jebus, what a bunch of sanctimonious, self-righteous prigs.

It was an amusing story. That's it.

And yes, harrasing a cyclist running a red at 1am is a little silly. Legally valid, but still silly.

That's a cool giant metal bug.

Finally he turns aside, heads back to town. I blow every subsequent red light on the ride home, with my hands in the air, cheering my victory over the law as though I were Lance Armstrong.

Best part of the story ... haha!

The reason you were stopped was so the cop could run you out to see if you have any outstanding warrants. Running a light is just a "reasonable suspicion" to detain you under the 4th Amendment. Cops could care less if you run a red light at 1am.

Eh... personally I applaud the cop. And yes you can perform a decent trackstand on a freewheel. Also, as the cop rightly pointed out, you do have brakes. Stop trying to justify breaking the law and just accept what you did. I'm actually quite happy to see that the cop knew something about cycling and was trying to get someone else to recognise that bicycles are road vehicles too and are subject to the same traffic laws.

I recently met someone who claims to have been an experienced cyclist. We rode together for a couple of rides. It quickly became obvious that she was either ignorant of traffic laws or simply held them in contempt (I believe the latter) as she blew through stoplights/stopsigns, cut off cars, cut across traffic to ride on the wrong side of the road, went through crosswalks that had pedestrians in them, etc... I made up my mind after the second ride to never ride with her again.

what bugs me is lights that don't activate for cyclists, then you get nabbed by the cop who watched you stand there for 20 minutes when you give up and just go through it.

what bugs me is lights that don't activate for cyclists, then you get nabbed by the cop who watched you stand there for 20 minutes when you give up and just go through it.

In that case, you have a proper defence and can argue your way out of a ticket. Most laws allow you to consider the light defective in such a case but you must still stop and clear traffic. If the cop just sees you running the light then there's little recourse.

Right or wrong, you have to give the cop his props for knowing what a trackstand is.

If he had asked I could have offered three locations within three blocks where he could have bought meth or cocaine from dangerous men, right on the street.

OUTLAW BIKER (http://www.bluejack.com/blog/index.html#0722)

In the Seattle metro, bikers are easy targets and safer to apprehend than a real crook. Let's be careful out there! ;)

Are you looking for sympathy? Always puzzles me why people post things like this.

Guess I always figure if you break the law, be a grownup and accept that there may be consequences.

Paul


it's called making conversation. if you get tired of reading the posts then don't - because i can say it gets old reading "why did you post this?" or "what's the point?". it's just an interesting story, that's it. try to lighten up a bit. the forum would get pretty dull if people didn't share their stories.

what bugs me is lights that don't activate for cyclists, then you get nabbed by the cop who watched you stand there for 20 minutes when you give up and just go through it.

Very annoying indeed. It's one of the bigger gripes I have. What's even more (gay) or interesting is that if cars had stopped in your lane to turn right and it was there long enough to trigger the *activate lights* function, watching the pedestrian signals for the opposiing set of lights, it goes from flashing to walk signal. Meaning the light was going to turn red but then decided not to because there were no cars there.

This is even more annoying than having to run up on the sidewalk and hit the big ol - push to cross button. Which I almost always end up doing.

Where can I get the crank?

Ok, ok. We all know that it is illegal to go through red lights, and something no cyclist should take any particular pride in doing. Equal rights! Equal responsibilities!

Still, here's my account of blowing through an empty intersection at 1:00 am -- and being stopped by a Seattle policeman. If he had asked I could have offered three locations within three blocks where he could have bought meth or cocaine from dangerous men, right on the street.

OUTLAW BIKER (http://www.bluejack.com/blog/index.html#0722)

I hate when people say that, why didn't you stop him or you could be doing this.. Your the one who got stopped so stop whining and take the consequences for what you did wrong.

I wasn't complaining... I know I was in the wrong. Heck, I was glad he didn't ticket me. But I still think it's an amusing story. I forgot to mention that I didn't see the police car because he was waiting at the red light right behind an SUV. However, to turn around and stop me, he had to pull around the SUV just as the light turned green, flash all his lights, cut in front of the SUV to make a U-turn in the intersection.

Again: I'm not complaining... I just think the whole thing is funny.

As for the crank, hang around outside the dance clubs along Pike. There's always something changing hands.

what bugs me is lights that don't activate for cyclists, then you get nabbed by the cop who watched you stand there for 20 minutes when you give up and just go through it.


I saw a device on ebay that you can carry on your bike that trips the traffic sensors. I have searched, but now i can't find it. Anyone else?

I guess i am self righteous too. I blow plenty of stoplights and stop signs but always figure if i get caught i will keep my mouth shut and pay the price. I know i am doing something illegal when i do it. There are no degrees of legality. It is either legal or illegal.

Trying to inject degrees of legality would eventually destroy every law on the books. That is why they can fine you $5000 for throwing an empty M & M package out the window. Not to mention $250,000 for downloading a stupid song over the internet.

I wasn't complaining... I know I was in the wrong. Heck, I was glad he didn't ticket me. But I still think it's an amusing story. I forgot to mention that I didn't see the police car because he was waiting at the red light right behind an SUV. However, to turn around and stop me, he had to pull around the SUV just as the light turned green, flash all his lights, cut in front of the SUV to make a U-turn in the intersection.

Again: I'm not complaining... I just think the whole thing is funny.

As for the crank, hang around outside the dance clubs along Pike. There's always something changing hands.

Don't worry about ryan, all he does is go around braggin about his dad and generally making a nuisance of himself. He should change arguing member to troll above his avatar.


I saw a device on ebay that you can carry on your bike that trips the traffic sensors. I have searched, but now i can't find it. Anyone else?

Hmm that's interesting, any idea of the name?

Time to break out that Judas Priest lp and crank up "breakin the law"

I saw a device on ebay that you can carry on your bike that trips the traffic sensors. I have searched, but now i can't find it. Anyone else?

I guess i am self righteous too. I blow plenty of stoplights and stop signs but always figure if i get caught i will keep my mouth shut and pay the price. I know i am doing something illegal when i do it. There are no degrees of legality. It is either legal or illegal.

Trying to inject degrees of legality would eventually destroy every law on the books. That is why they can fine you $5000 for throwing an empty M & M package out the window. Not to mention $250,000 for downloading a stupid song over the internet.

I'd rather not go to that point....if I have to use devices that put me in the wrong to get the light to act properly, then that proves nothing....now...every time I get harassed over treating that intersection like a stop sign after getitng angry over it....that makes a point....what we need is a mass of cyclists in that intersaction who are willing to stand firm until it turns green....that would get the point across.

Don't worry about ryan, all he does is go around braggin about his dad and generally making a nuisance of himself. He should change arguing member to troll above his avatar.



Hmm that's interesting, any idea of the name?

Why don't you shut the hell up and stop following me around on forums, starting **** that has no concern to you.

I said that because you made the comment about "I could have shown him 5 crack dealers" and generally when people say stuff like that its because there angry and wanna try to justified being stopped.

I saw a device on ebay that you can carry on your bike that trips the traffic sensors. I have searched, but now i can't find it. Anyone else?

I guess i am self righteous too. I blow plenty of stoplights and stop signs but always figure if i get caught i will keep my mouth shut and pay the price. I know i am doing something illegal when i do it. There are no degrees of legality. It is either legal or illegal.

Trying to inject degrees of legality would eventually destroy every law on the books. That is why they can fine you $5000 for throwing an empty M & M package out the window. Not to mention $250,000 for downloading a stupid song over the internet.

Yes the device is a certain light emergency vehicles are also equip with.. If you ever look in the center of a light bar some have a clear light that kinda wags back and fourth or a strobe type effects, those trips the light. If you look at a redlight some time you see that sensor that hangs down next to it...

I'd rather not go to that point....if I have to use devices that put me in the wrong to get the light to act properly, then that proves nothing....now...every time I get harassed over treating that intersection like a stop sign after getitng angry over it....that makes a point....what we need is a mass of cyclists in that intersaction who are willing to stand firm until it turns green....that would get the point across.

Kind of like critical mass? That would just get people more peeved.


starting **** that has no concern to you.

No need to swear my young padawan.

Gentlemen, lets be careful out there and
lets not descend into name calling, mud slinging etc.
Consider this fair warning.

Marty

Cops could care less if you run a red light at 1am.


If they could care less, why don't they? :rolleyes:

If they could care less, why don't they? :rolleyes:

Like I said, cops find reasons to stop "suspects" to run checks. It could be a broken taillight on a car, not signaling to make a turn, or even throwing out a cigarette bud. Once there's reasonable suspeicion to make a stop, they'll stop you. If you have a searchable warrant or on parole/probation, they can then search you for drugs. This way, they are not violating your 4th Amendment rights.

Like I said, cops find reasons to stop "suspects" to run checks. It could be a broken taillight on a car, not signaling to make a turn, or even throwing out a cigarette bud. Once there's reasonable suspeicion to make a stop, they'll stop you. If you have a searchable warrant or on parole/probation, they can then search you for drugs. This way, they are not violating your 4th Amendment rights.


You missed my jab. It was more about a pet-peeve of mine, which is totally off-topic. If someone could care less about something, then they must care to some degree. If on the other hand they couldn't care less, then they are at their lowest point of caring. :p

If they could care less, why don't they? :rolleyes:

A-freakin-men. I finally met someone that gets it. This is my number one pet peeve. Why is it that hard to get??????? :rolleyes:

I'm guessing people here haven't heard of the term 'figure of speech'.

I'm guessing people here haven't heard of the term 'figure of speech'.

Irregardless, lets get back on topic. :p

I saw a device on ebay that you can carry on your bike that trips the traffic sensors. I have searched, but now i can't find it. Anyone else?

I saw something on ebay that supposedly trips older stoplights. It was marketed as for motorcycles and bicycles, but the thing looked like nothing more than an 18" iron bar! I thought it was a joke. :)

I saw something on ebay that supposedly trips older stoplights. It was marketed as for motorcycles and bicycles, but the thing looked like nothing more than an 18" iron bar! I thought it was a joke. :)

No, it's not a joke. The weight of the bar combined with the iron would probably trip most sensors -- although carrying one around probably is not worth the effort. Especially in view of the fact that most juridictions have a law which allows any vehicle (including a bicycle) to proceed through a non-responsive light after stopping and ascertaining that it is, in fact, non-responsive.

You missed my jab. It was more about a pet-peeve of mine, which is totally off-topic. If someone could care less about something, then they must care to some degree. If on the other hand they couldn't care less, then they are at their lowest point of caring. :p


OK...got it...I just gotta read closely.

The more interesting question is whether or not this violation goes on his driver's license and is his auto insurance company informed. I am assuming that he also has a driver's license and an insured car? Does anyone know the answer to that question?

The more interesting question is whether or not this violation goes on his driver's license and is his auto insurance company informed. I am assuming that he also has a driver's license and an insured car? Does anyone know the answer to that question?


Any ticket you get using your driver's license number will probably end up on your record.

The more interesting question is whether or not this violation goes on his driver's license and is his auto insurance company informed. I am assuming that he also has a driver's license and an insured car? Does anyone know the answer to that question?

I know the answer: I do not have a driver's license. In my little write up I note that my only ID was a driver's permit that expired four years ago when I couldn't pass the driver's test. I have never had a driver's license in my life (pretty sad for a 37 year old guy, but I've lived in cities all my life-- no need for a car, really-- and don't get me going about the injustices of my efforts to pass the driving test).

I doubt anything goes on any record for a warning, but it would be interesting to know what would have happened if he had ticketed me.

I know the answer: I do not have a driver's license. In my little write up I note that my only ID was a driver's permit that expired four years ago when I couldn't pass the driver's test. I have never had a driver's license in my life (pretty sad for a 37 year old guy, but I've lived in cities all my life-- no need for a car, really-- and don't get me going about the injustices of my efforts to pass the driving test).

I doubt anything goes on any record for a warning, but it would be interesting to know what would have happened if he had ticketed me.

If you had been ticketed it would be no different than for an auto driver. You would be required to either pay the fine or go to court to contest the charge. If you don't pay or do not respond at all, then there would be a warrant issued for your arrest. The next time (if any) a cop stops you, you get a free ride to jail.

Of course, not having a drivers license, there would be no 'driving record' nor any increase in insurance, etc. There would be a record of a conviction, just like there would be for anyone else.

It would be interesting to know, had you received a ticket, if you could take a defensive driving class in order to get the ticket dismissed. That would be a hoot!

At the times I ride through that part of town, there is probably ;ess than 4 cars an hour going through that area...most of them on the crossroad, the roadd I ride (which is teh safest one, bad neighborhood) seems to have defective lights for about 6 miles.

If you ever want to skip a red light when no one is around you can cut left to the sidewalk (if you're allowed on the sidewalk) or corner parking lot and once you are parallel to the cross street hang a hard right onto it and then make a left turn on the hopefully still green light.

Also, part of the reason for obeying annoying laws on a bike is so as to not make a bad impression on others, but if there are no others around then it a grey area.

Of course, in your case there was someone around - the cop. You should have at least slowed down enough to see if there truly was anyone coming because obviously there was. It's like drivers who don't use a turn signal b/c no one is there and they don't see me on my bike and almost hit me since I didn't know they were turning. Those people are always surprised when they get a ticket from the cop who "wasn't around" and appeared out of nowhere. If you are going to do something illegal make sure NO ONE is around. If you are right, no one is the wiser. But if you are wrong you get hurt, ticketed, or just annoy others.

I think the cop was perfectly fair and professional. He stopped you. Checked you for warrants. Lectured you. And let you go with a warning.

I, too, sometimes don't stop at red lights, but only because so many of them are run by sensors that my bike won't trip. This is especially true at night. If you had truthfully told the cop this story, he probably would have let you go with even less hassle.

what bugs me is lights that don't activate for cyclists, then you get nabbed by the cop who watched you stand there for 20 minutes when you give up and just go through it.

Motorcycles have the same problem. I've been thinking of getting something to get the sensors in the roads to react to my bicycle and motorcycle.

I'm guessing people here haven't heard of the term 'figure of speech'.

sure they have... the "figure of speech" is "couldn't care less" -- I'm guessing some people are just too lazy to say n't and would rather sound a little ignorant...

I have to go with whomever cited reasonable suspicion as the reason you got pulled over. Maybe you were in a sketchy neighborhood, etc? The cop is just checking things out, when he's bored and its late, he just needs a reason to pull you over.

If any cop knew what a trackstand was and called me on not doing one, i would immediately dismout and ask him to demonstrate. Those things are hard. I just need more practice.

I always figured when someone "could care less" it was because they were so disdainful of the subject that it was worth the effort to care even less than they did previously, even if they thought they "couldn't care less" before.

hooking this street is impossible, its a 6-lane road with a concrete divider.

I'm also on a 6-lane when I'm stopped as well.

and the crossroad has rather heavy semi traffic, even at 3 am.

I had a HS Sociology teacher that told a story of being in college and routinely turning left at an empty intersection at 12:30. It was one of those intersections that had turn lights on both sides and you could only turn on the "turn green."

He too was stopped and ticketed. He explained that it took 5 full minutes if he missed the light for it to come back. No sympathy received and the cop was there for the next few nights. Ling story short, he stopped making the illegal turn.

Stop complaining. Like you said "Equal responsibility." You could have also just said thank you then let him know about the deals just down the street. I am sure he would have been appreciative of the positive attitude and tip.

BTW, I have received my fair share of tickets in my car, all of which were deserved, and have always said thank you and been sincere. I was not driving safely and they were only doing their job. All the tickets were also reduced by the officer due to my attitude, or lack thereof. I have also complimented an officer when I paid the ticket. I know so often they are complained about and this guy was really nice. I felt he really deserved to be praised for doing his job professionally and being nice--no attitude.

What is the logic of this kind of mindless law enforcement? The purpose of traffic laws and lights is to proved clear right of way. When the streets are deserted and it is evident that no one is around, I can not see how any harm is being done to the spirit of the law. The law breaker in your example was behaving in a responsible and safe manner. It seems to me that in this case the officer was on a power trip.

At the times I ride through that part of town, there is probably ;ess than 4 cars an hour going through that area...most of them on the crossroad, the roadd I ride (which is teh safest one, bad neighborhood) seems to have defective lights for about 6 miles.

Which part of town are you talking about?

north first down near gish. Lots of shady folks running around there...plus I'm only riding through there if I was coming home late...so it's about 2-3am.

Second time someone tried to bikejack me was on that road...the first time was a block south of my house, on the south side of 280 by SJSU. Really the entire SJSU area is a bad place to own a nice bike.

well not sure but would about bet it would be like geting a J-Walking Ticket
that dont go againt your driving record but is noted in your personal records at the Police Station
and if I was you all I would hope a Police Officer isnt readin these post or befoer we know it we'll have to have a "Bike Driver's License"
be taking Bike Driving Test and then they will have a Bikeing School to take points off
lol the future lol

if I was you all I would hope a Police Officer isnt readin these post or befoer we know it we'll have to have a "Bike Driver's License"
be taking Bike Driving Test and then they will have a Bikeing School to take points off
lol the future lol

That will never happen. Basic economics. It works for car drivers because people are sufficiently addicted to driving to pay a "registration fee" to cover the costs of administering such a system. If someone attepted to levy such a charge against cyclists (and yes, it has been looked into), the number of people cycling would decrease, thus erroding the revenue base to such an extent that the system would certainly run at a loss. Hence, it hasn't and won't be done.