Utility Cycling - Yuba Mundo V3

bbaker22 I am curious if you had to do it over again would you get the complete build of the Yuba Mundo v3, or just the frame? I am debating at the moment between the Yuba Mundo v3 frame and the surly big dummy frame. Although I am very much leaning towards the Yuba Mundo v3.
Sam

I just discovered this thread and had a lot of fun reading it.

The design is intriguing, though hearing that both of you guys who bought this had serious defects is disconcerting. I hope they work these problems out.

I'm nowhere near justifying spending that much on this type of bike, but I'm increasing my utility riding now, so maybe I can, one day.

bbaker22 I am curious if you had to do it over again would you get the complete build of the Yuba Mundo v3, or just the frame? I am debating at the moment between the Yuba Mundo v3 frame and the surly big dummy frame. Although I am very much leaning towards the Yuba Mundo v3.
Sam

No doubt I'd go the frame route again. For about the same $$$ as the fully built 21-spd, I have a bike tailored to my own needs with the components I want (versus some pretty generic components) Then again, I've built, from the frame up, about 6 out of my last 7 bikes. I enjoy the process...

The Big Dummy looks pretty sweet. I would have considered that frame if I could have built up the entire bike for just under a grand, like I did w/ the Mundo. Keep in mind, I kept it at that cost by reusing some older components (like the wheelset, crankset, cassette, etc) and by some fairly patient clearance shopping. I also already have all the necessary tools, which some people may not.

baker

Thanks for the great info baker. I am for sure going the frame route. I live in a really flat town in northern California. So I am debating going with a single speed rear freewheel type hub. I found a neat hub that DMR makes.

http://www.petracycles.co.uk/product_info.php?language=en&currency=USD&products_id=27299&source=googleus
I have been unable to find a hub like this with a cassette.

I suppose my question is would a single speed Yuba Mundo work out well in a flat town or is it just to heavy of a bike and needs gears of some sort.

That depends entirely on which gear ratio you choose. If you choose a gear low enough to accelerate your heaviest load, you'll be fine. You may have to coast on whatever slight downhills you have, but that's not bad. Remember, in many countries, people pedal gigantic loads with only one speed. And they've been doing this for almost as long as bicycles have existed.

That hub looks excellent. At that price, it ought to be. If you build it with 48 spokes, you can have fun seeing what kind of punishment it can take.

Which is lighter, the big dummy or the yuba?

Which is lighter, the big dummy or the yuba?

The Big Dummy, by a large margin. My Yuba frame and fork came to 30.6 lbs. I've seen the Big Dummy frame/fork weight spec'd at 6.78kg (~15 lbs). Another point of reference. My Yuba build comes to around 57 lbs. I've seen references to the Big Dummy build coming in at just under 40 lbs.

@SamOah - I would want gears on my cargo bike even if I lived somewhere flat. But, if you are stubborn and patient enough, it could be done. (btw, I've done tons of singlespeed mountain biking, commuting, fixie riding, etc).

baker

So with that weight difference, what is the difference in hauling ability? I don't think I would choose a Yuba over a Big Dummy unless I was hauling at least 100 lbs.

And I agree with baker: you ought to be able to find a stout hub that can take a multi-speed freewheel.

From Mundo Owner's Manual:
Maximum payloads
For the carrier: 200kg/ 440lbs
Behind axle: 50kg/ 110 lbs
Side platform: 50kg/ 110lbs (each side)
Kickstand: 50 kg

From Big Dummy website:
upper limit of 400 pounds (180kg) total rider and cargo weight

baker

Dilemna...how do I let the kids ride on the back deck, while keeping their feet outta the wheels and give them a little something for support and stability.

Potential solution...install an accessory rail below the main deck and attach the grocery bag panniers that I happen to have sitting around. The rail height will hopefully put the bottom of the panniers at just the right height for their short legs, giving them a bit of support and keep their feet outta the spokes. Also, the grocery bag setup could be quite handy for shopping.

Accessory rail:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2638/4166413613_d4aa75b2c9_o.jpg

Grocery bag panniers attached:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2607/4166413667_b17ae8e4ae_o.jpg

Still trying to resolve my issue. I ended up asking for a refund minus all shipping costs due to the high cost of shipping. I thought that was more than fair on my part. All-in-all I wanted to just move on, but they keep sucking me back in. I may end up with a new-in-box satin black Mundo for sale soon...my disgust is your gain, I guess. We'll see.

Still trying to resolve my issue. I ended up asking for a refund minus all shipping costs due to the high cost of shipping. I thought that was more than fair on my part. All-in-all I wanted to just move on, but they keep sucking me back in. I may end up with a new-in-box satin black Mundo for sale soon...my disgust is your gain, I guess. We'll see.

Bummer! I hope it all works out for the best, even if that means you going with another bike/frame.

I'm going to head out shortly and pick my daughter up from the bus stop with my Mundo. A bit chilly, but there is no wind and it's all uphill. First real test of the pannier/stoker combo.

baker

That is a bummer about your bike....Good luck with that... hrmm That makes me a little wary of buying from yubaride. I am still waiting for them to get a black frame of the Yuba mundo in. Recently I was thinking I might buy a phil wood tandem 135mm 3/8mm 48h rear hub for the yuba frame. But I started thinking about it and it I reliezed it almost cost as much as the frame... I still might , but that might be a little out of my range.

Has anyone thought of building a Yuba with an internally geared hub (IGH)?

I've been looking into getting a Dutch bike, specifically the WorkCycles Fr8 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesbondsv/4043704125/). However, that bike costs about $2,400 after tax (Chicago = 10.25%). I was thinking the Yuba Mundo can do all the same things, and provide me a similar, comfortable ride.

My plan now is to buy the frame and build the bike using Shimano Nexus or Alfine parts, or the SRAM i-MOTION 9. I would ask a local bike shop to order all the parts and build it for me. I figure it wouldn't cost more than $1,800 to match the features of a Dutch bike (that is, internal hubs, including a dynamo for the front, dynamo-powered lights, tall stem, Brooks saddle, large sweep handlebars, etc...).

My concern right now is if the IGH can handle the weight going up a bridge over a railroad track. The SRAM i-MOTION 9 has the ability to shift under load, unlike the Nexus. I don't know about the Alfine. But what about a 200 lb load going up a low-grade hill?
I haven't yet figured out what I want for brakes: Roller rear, disc front. Roller rear, roller front. Disc rear, disc front. Roller rear, roller front.

Ive read that people have done it with a NuVinci IGH. That is probally the hub I would use if I was going to do it. Problem it poses for me is it is only 36h rear hub. I am looking for something with 48h and strong.

Ive read that people have done it with a NuVinci IGH. That is probally the hub I would use if I was going to do it. Problem it poses for me is it is only 36h rear hub. I am looking for something with 48h and strong.

Where have you read this/do you have any links?

The bike I linked (specs on the Fr8 here (http://www.workcycles.com/workbike/bicycles/fr8-freight/fr8-uni-frame-city-bike.html)) is rated to hold as much weight as the Yuba Mundo, and it uses the Nexus 8, with either 32h or 36h (I don't remember). It also has double-walled aluminum rims and 13 gauge spokes. The Nuvinci costs almost twice as much as the Nexus.

scroll down and it will talk about the hub


http://longwalktogreen.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-11-01T00%3A00%3A00-07%3A00&updated-max=2009-12-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&max-results=2







The bike I linked (specs on the Fr8 here (http://www.workcycles.com/workbike/bicycles/fr8-freight/fr8-uni-frame-city-bike.html)) is rated to hold as much weight as the Yuba Mundo, and it uses the Nexus 8, with either 32h or 36h (I don't remember). It also has double-walled aluminum rims and 13 gauge spokes. The Nuvinci costs almost twice as much as the Nexus.[/QUOTE]

That was an interesting read. The NuVinci is intriguing but expensive.

I don't know if the other IGH's are stronger than the old Sturmey Archer AW, but I wouldn't use them unless I knew they are. The AW can't handle a heavy workload. Don't get me wrong. They're great for nearly every rider, but there is a limit.

That was an interesting read. The NuVinci is intriguing but expensive.

I don't know if the other IGH's are stronger than the old Sturmey Archer AW, but I wouldn't use them unless I knew they are. The AW can't handle a heavy workload. Don't get me wrong. They're great for nearly every rider, but there is a limit.

I believe (but am not sure) that the AW is weak compared to the newer Alfine/Nexus/SRAM offerings. I can tell you that my Alfine and Nexus hubs have been put through some serious mountain biking abuse and held up fine. So, not heavy loads, but mud, snow, ice, hamfisted shifting, 18 hour races, etc.

baker

OK, that's good to know. The new Sturmey Archer three speed hub looks like a good value, too, for those who need only three speeds.

Another point... The 14mm dropout on the Mundo presents some challenges to hubs like the Alfine and Nexus, which use non-turn washers designed for regular sized (10mm) dropouts. In some thread, I saw an adapter design but I don't think anything is commericially available.

baker

Problem it poses for me is it is only 36h rear hub. I am looking for something with 48h and strong.

You can build a very strong wheel with only 36 spokes. Many touring, mountain, and even cargo bikes use 36 spoked wheels.

I suggest a Sun CR-18 rim laced 3-cross. Should be plenty strong if it's well built (properly trued and tensioned).

Another point... The 14mm dropout on the Mundo presents some challenges to hubs like the Alfine and Nexus, which use non-turn washers designed for regular sized (10mm) dropouts. In some thread, I saw an adapter design but I don't think anything is commericially available.

Rock The Bike, a Mundo reseller, talks about this situation and the simple solution: an axle adaptor. Read about it here (http://rockthebike.com/how-do-i-use-internally-geared-hub-or-cross-countr).

Rock The Bike, a Mundo reseller, talks about this situation and the simple solution: an axle adaptor. Read about it here (http://rockthebike.com/how-do-i-use-internally-geared-hub-or-cross-countr).

I'm using these for my regular Shimano hubs. I don't see how these would work with the non-turn washers and a Nexus or Alfine, but I'd like them to.

baker

I is has question. anyone have one of these shipped to canada? like frame and fork? I have all kinds of parts but want a frame, if so what was the total cost?

Has anyone thought of building a Yuba with an internally geared hub (IGH)?

My concern right now is if the IGH can handle the weight going up a bridge over a railroad track. The SRAM i-MOTION 9 has the ability to shift under load, unlike the Nexus. I don't know about the Alfine. But what about a 200 lb load going up a low-grade hill?

The I9 does not shift under load.
I've got one, with many thousand miles on it. I love it, it's a great piece of machinery, but if you shift under load, you'll grind the gears - you'll hear it skip and catch as the ring gears crash into the sun gear in the wrong way, and it'll freewheel as the gears fail to mesh right. This can't be good for it. Yes, i know that the SRAM manual says that it's "load shiftable," but someone made a poor translation, or some marketeer wasn't listening to the engineer.
I use mine every day, commuting, camping, light off-road, recreational road riding. It's a good hub, and I've hauled big loads with it, but not 400 pound loads. I don't know if you can or should haul 400 pound loads. The manual says "not for tandem or delivery bikes," so keep that in mind.

I have a friend with an alfine, and I believe that you can shift that under load (though I haven't ridden it). He also has a Rohloff, which shifts under load okay.
Keep in mind that the i9 has a pretty high minimum input ratio (I9: 1.73 = 34x20 = 23.9" low gear with 165 cranks on 26x2.125 tires).
I love my I9, but I don't think you should use it to haul a 'fridge up a modest hill. Look at the rohloff for that.

Originally Posted by stevevance
Rock The Bike, a Mundo reseller, talks about this situation and the simple solution: an axle adaptor. Read about it here (http://go.bikeforums.net/?id=42X129555&url=http%3A%2F%2Frockthebike.com%2Fhow-do-i-use-internally-geared-hub-or-cross-countr).

I'm using these for my regular Shimano hubs. I don't see how these would work with the non-turn washers and a Nexus or Alfine, but I'd like them to.

baker

Use gear hub with a coaster-brake or roller (drum) brake. These require a friction connection between the hub and the frame, making the no-turn washers redundant. This is the little reaction arm you see on these hubs. The axle can't turn with these when the arm is clamped down right. Also possible is the non-oem version of the rohloff which uses a similar arm even though it has no built-in brake.

The xtracycle site says that the radish will do for anyone up to 6"0". Yuba implies that things are all good for up to 6'1", but isn't really clear. Anyone have anything more specific about the Mundo for tall guys like me (6'4")?

Use gear hub with a coaster-brake or roller (drum) brake. These require a friction connection between the hub and the frame, making the no-turn washers redundant. This is the little reaction arm you see on these hubs. The axle can't turn with these when the arm is clamped down right. Also possible is the non-oem version of the rohloff which uses a similar arm even though it has no built-in brake.

Well, I have a couple roller-brake equipped Nexus hubs. I'll have to check this idea out.

Thanks!

Well, I have a couple roller-brake equipped Nexus hubs. I'll have to check this idea out.

Thanks!

Okay. Don't forget to make a thread with your experiences (pics!) later on. Or at least PM me. I'm interested in the Yuba, and I love gearhubs, so....

The xtracycle site says that the radish will do for anyone up to 6"0". Yuba implies that things are all good for up to 6'1", but isn't really clear. Anyone have anything more specific about the Mundo for tall guys like me (6'4")?

I'd get a regular bike that fit well, then buy an xtracycle longtail kit. The Radish is a fine bike, but the standard xtracycle conversion kit is very good at adapting to any "donor" bike.

The xtracycle site says that the radish will do for anyone up to 6"0". Yuba implies that things are all good for up to 6'1", but isn't really clear. Anyone have anything more specific about the Mundo for tall guys like me (6'4")?

Bob on this E-Bike forum says he's 6'4" and he likes his Yuba Mundo (http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=15037).

First post on the forums aside from my intro post!

I just bought a blue Mundo V3 from http://rockthebike.com/ right before Christmas. I had no problems getting it assembled and working, aside from having to improvise a bit on tightening the pedals due to not owning a pedal wrench, and the brakes feeling a bit "mushy" despite my best tweaking efforts. There's a spot where the paint got dinged up during shipping, but it's not enough for me to worry about. I also picked up a pair of GoGetter bags for carrying groceries and such.

I've done a few shopping trips since then, and am quite impressed. It's not fast by any stretch of the imagination, but it's stable, predictable, and comfortable. I haven't really loaded it down weight-wise (maybe 75 lbs tops so far), but it handled this unbalanced, mildly sail-like, and slightly springy load with aplomb: http://www.shackpics.com/viewer.x?file=17474_615788742505_24407843_35_iixpl0kv1vtsjc639bc7.jpg
That's a 6' long folding table (folded in half), a box of 4 folding chairs, and miscellaneous tools and such in the GoGetter. Getting started was a little weird as something (the box?) started bouncy rocking back and forth, but everything was fine once that settled down, even with a stiff cross-wind.
The fact that is stores like this is a nice bonus: http://www.shackpics.com/viewer.x?file=IMG_0101JPG_djf67wgsyjajbys8ravy.jpg :)

I'm thinking I want to upgrade at least one of the brakes (probably rear) to a disk system. Aside from the possible bracket problem someone mentioned in this thread, are there any other potential problems I should know about?

[QUOTE=Arcanum;10223879
I'm thinking I want to upgrade at least one of the brakes (probably rear) to a disk system. Aside from the possible bracket problem someone mentioned in this thread, are there any other potential problems I should know about?[/QUOTE]

Not a problem, but a heads up...you'll prob need a new wheel with a disc capable hub if you wanna go that route. I believe the supplied wheelset is not disc compatible.

baker

Not a problem, but a heads up...you'll prob need a new wheel with a disc capable hub if you wanna go that route. I believe the supplied wheelset is not disc compatible.

Yeah, I was doing some research and that seemed to be the case. Getting a ~14mm axle, 48 spoke, disc-and-freewheel capable wheel seems to be a nontrivial exercise. I'd probably go with a front disc brake rather than go with a weaker rear wheel. It would still require a new wheel, but finding a disc-capable clone of the front wheel should be easier.

The fact that is stores like this is a nice bonus: http://www.shackpics.com/viewer.x?file=IMG_0101JPG_djf67wgsyjajbys8ravy.jpg :)


That's awesome. You're the first person (that I know of) to point out this hidden feature of the bike's cargo frame. I don't have a Yuba (yet), but living in apartments (some large, some small) means I have to consider how to store it, and standing the bike on its rear end seems like a great idea.

You should take another picture (one without the table blocking our view) and send it in to Yuba. Perhaps they'll start marketing that "feature."

That's awesome. You're the first person (that I know of) to point out this hidden feature of the bike's cargo frame. I don't have a Yuba (yet), but living in apartments (some large, some small) means I have to consider how to store it, and standing the bike on its rear end seems like a great idea.

You should take another picture (one without the table blocking our view) and send it in to Yuba. Perhaps they'll start marketing that "feature."

I'll probably include a picture like that, but I'm hardly the first person to do it. I got the idea from someone else, probably a picture like this one (http://www.flickr.com/photos/koshi/4165928828/in/pool-758540@N23).

That picture pool also has pictures of people carrying all kinds of crazy things on their Mundos. :)

I'll probably include a picture like that, but I'm hardly the first person to do it. I got the idea from someone else, probably a picture like this one (http://www.flickr.com/photos/koshi/4165928828/in/pool-758540@N23).


I found this picture taken at the same time and place (http://www.flickr.com/photos/leifcycle/4167186235/) and then immediately came here to show it to you.

I like to occasionally search Flickr for photos of Yuba Mundos and WorkCycles Fr8 bikes to see what's new.

Having read the full thread it sounds like Yuba's manufacturer has some unacceptable quality control problems with their frame manufacturer as well as inadequate packaging so damage is happening during individual bike shipping. From a buyers standpoint, and that of an ex QA engineer, I find that unacceptable. Where is the Yuba frame made and the bikes assembled? I read that Yuba is a German company but expect that their bikes are made somewhere in Asia. If made in Europe they would almost certainly be a LOT more expensive.

Reading this thread I am glad that I decided to get the Surly Big Dummy. It may not have the theoretical maximum carrying capacity of the Yuba Mundo but is a lot lighter and I was able to special orde it through my LBS. I just picked it up Saturday and was surprised how light and nimble feeling it is turning out to be. I hauled home 4 bags of groceries and did not even notice the effect of the load on the handling and feel of the bike. Much better than 2 bags of groceries on my regular wheelbase prior grocery getter.

My decision was helped by the current sale price of the Surly, $1900 + local tax. I paid more than for the Yuba but got a lighter and more nimble bike with a very well constructed frame. Per the mechanic no problems or surprises during assembly and adjustment.

Surly is a QBP owned company and QBP distributes the bikes. This means that virtually any bike shop in the U.S. with a QBP account, the vast majority, can obtain Surly bikes. Buying through my LBS I got professional assembly and fit adjustment, a year of free adjustments if necessary and the LBS to handle any potential warranty issues. The fit included FREE swapping of the grips and saddle for ones that fit me better.

Having read the full thread it sounds like Yuba's manufacturer has some unacceptable quality control problems with their frame manufacturer as well as inadequate packaging so damage is happening during individual bike shipping.
...
My decision was helped by the current sale price of the Surly, $1900 + local tax. I paid more than for the Yuba but got a lighter and more nimble bike with a very well constructed frame. Per the mechanic no problems or surprises during assembly and adjustment.
...
Buying through my LBS I got professional assembly and fit adjustment, a year of free adjustments if necessary and the LBS to handle any potential warranty issues. The fit included FREE swapping of the grips and saddle for ones that fit me better.

There are definite QC probs, which need to be sorted out for long term viability of the company. On the other hand, I'd expect a nicer bike for twice the price (even on sale, the BD is expensive).

Your point about buying from an LBS is valid. The advantages of buying from an LBS can be a big advantage for many buyers, regardless of what bike you are buying.

My Mundo (http://monumentallyafflicted.blogspot.com/2010/01/yuba-mundo-v3-upgrades.html) has been working out well. I've continued to tweak the build a bit. I replaced the big ring w/ a BBG bashguard (http://www.bbgbashguard.com/). I added a front rack (http://www.nashbar.com/bikes//Product_10053_10052_167593_-1___). I added a bipod kickstand (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000AO9Z7K/ref=ox_ya_oh_product) (much easier to deal with the bike now, especially when loading and unloading kids). Regarding the 185mm rear disc, Ben from Yuba advised me to use a 203mm rear adapter. This did work out fine, so now I have 185mm rotors front and rear.

I'm using Transit grocery panniers (http://www.performancebike.com/bikes//Product_10052_10551_1023647_-1___) to give the little munchkins a safe place to put/keep their feet. Riding with two little kids on the back can be interesting, especially when they start moving around looking at stuff while riding. Taking the kids up the last 12% hill to the house is very slow!

baker