Fifty Plus (50+) - Leg warmers or full-length bibs?

As the weather cools (yes, it really does cool down in winter in San Diego) I'm debating once again the pros and cons of picking up some leg warmers or springing for full-length bibs. Warmers are cheaper, but I seem to remember trying them a year or two ago and having problems keeping them up over my knees.

Your opinions?

I live in San Diego also, but I only wear knee warmers. Leg warmers are too much coverage for me. I don't have any problems with knee warmers staying up as long as pull them up over my thighs. I wear the Belgian style (cloth not lycra) shoe covers when it gets cold also.

Bib shorts till it gets to around 35F- then Knickers to about 20F then it is a Good bottle of cognac and forget about riding till spring.

I live in San Diego also, but I only wear knee warmers. Leg warmers are too much coverage for me. I don't have any problems with knee warmers staying up as long as pull them up over my thighs. I wear the Belgian style (cloth not lycra) shoe covers when it gets cold also.

+1 Knee warmers in SD but in NorCal, I use leg warmers and knee warmers. I do not have a problem with them falling down. Full length bib tights would be extremely warm.

The other day the average temp on my ride was 46°; I used leg warmers under my bib shorts and felt great. I also have knickers, but they were still drying from the day before. My rule of thumb is lower that 40°, winter bib tights (I use Pearl Izumi Gavia bib tights - they are awesome); lower forties, leg warmers + bib shorts, upper forties to high 50's, knickers, low to mid sixties, knee warmers + bib shorts.

Both the leg warmers and knee warmers (both Pearl Izumi) stay up under my bib shorts (Assos Mille).

Just so everybody can keep things in prespective,the lowest temperature on record that I could find for San Diego on this date is 48F set in 1886.Coldest day on record is 25F on Jan 7,1913, with only nine days of below freezing temperatures in January since 1872. They would probably shut the town down if they got frost on their windshields.As far as snow goes there is mention of it happening on THREE days in history with it lasting almost an hour on the ground in some locales.
http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/sgx/climate/san-san-month.htm

Just so everybody can keep things in prespective,the lowest temperature on record that I could find for San Diego on this date is 48F set in 1886.Coldest day on record is 25F on Jan 7,1913, with only nine days of below freezing temperatures in January since 1872. They would probably shut the town down if they got frost on their windshields.

That last sentence is particularly true. When we get so much as a "mist" of rain, we get "team coverage" on the local news.

As the weather cools (yes, it really does cool down in winter in San Diego) I'm debating once again the pros and cons of picking up some leg warmers or springing for full-length bibs. Warmers are cheaper, but I seem to remember trying them a year or two ago and having problems keeping them up over my knees.

Your opinions?

Couldn't you just stop shaving your legs for the Winter? Anything beyond that sounds like over-kill!!

Well, you did ask for my opinion.:)

Couldn't you just stop shaving your legs for the Winter? Anything beyond that sounds like over-kill!!

Well, you did ask for my opinion.:)

While it IS temperate here, I remember many rides in the high 40s and low 50s in winter time. My legs got cold!

Just so everybody can keep things in prespective,the lowest temperature on record that I could find for San Diego on this date is 48F set in 1886.Coldest day on record is 25F on Jan 7,1913, with only nine days of below freezing temperatures in January since 1872. They would probably shut the town down if they got frost on their windshields.As far as snow goes there is mention of it happening on THREE days in history with it lasting almost an hour on the ground in some locales.
http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/sgx/climate/san-san-month.htm
I always get a chuckle when folks from SD talk about cold, but I guess there are two reasons why. One is that it depends greatly on what you are used to, and two he may ride ride at higher altitudes where it actually gets a bit colder. But If I lived and only rode in SD I wouldn't own leg warmers or tights.

Personally, when it gets chilly (30-40) I wear thin tights over my shorts. When it gets colder, I break out the windproof thicker tights. They are good below zero and that is as cold as it usually gets here.

Just as with those who live in Florida, residents of SD will probably need winter gear at temps below 50.

I suspect that leg or knee warmers are what you need DG.........along with the legs to keep them up. I understand that the better warmers are pre-shaped with a built in knee bend that reduces the pull downward.

Having lived in Key West for a couple of years, I can assure you that at 60 deg you will think you are going to die............at the same time that tourists are diving into the swimming pools.

Rode today - 34F starting out, very foggy. Usual knee length bibs plus thin tights. As it warms up, I usually take off tights at about 45F, but did not today - just didn't get around to it.

I just use leg warmers and shorts all winter here in the Phoenix, AZ area. If it's too cold for leg warmers, it's to cold to ride. I don't have any trouble keeping the leg warmers up. I just pull them up at least to mid-thigh. I wear arm warmers, too. If it's below 55 I will also wear a jacket. I also need a skull cap to wear under my helmet to keep the cold air off my head.

I just use leg warmers and shorts all winter here in the Phoenix, AZ area. If it's too cold for leg warmers, it's to cold to ride. I don't have any trouble keeping the leg warmers up. I just pull them up at least to mid-thigh. I wear arm warmers, too. If it's below 55 I will also wear a jacket. I also need a skull cap to wear under my helmet to keep the cold air off my head.

At what temp do you put the leg and arm warmers on? Somewhere above 55, I assume? That seems like overkill to me. I put on a long sleeved underlayer below 60 but otherwise I'm fine down to the high 40's, where I'll put on leg warmers and a jacket. (And yes, I've lived here long enough to be acclimated.)

But maybe I misunderstood what you wrote.

Here in Northern CA I use knee warmers in addition to my regular bibs. I also sometimes add shoe covers if my warm socks are not enough to keep my feet comfortable. In extreme cold (CA style) I add XC skiing tights over my shorts.
For the top I use a Craft windproof short sleeves base layer, arm warmers, and a regular short sleeves jersey. When it's really cold I use a windproof PI Barrier jacket over a Craft long sleeve base layer.
I like to have versatility in my equipment. That's what warmers do with your Summer shorts/bibs and jerseys. The XC tights (no chamois pad), the base layers, and the jacket are used for skiing, hiking, running, and biking.

While it IS temperate here, I remember many rides in the high 40s and low 50s in winter time. My legs got cold!

Allow me to assist...... We lived and cycled in SD for 16 years. We were in SD last week cycling. Although SD is a temperate climate, it, as with most of California, has microclimates that are highly influenced by the Pacific Ocean, the desert and mountains. Within 5 miles of the coast, the ocean dominates the weather providing fog, haze and wind moderating temperatures in the summer and winter.

My wife's father, who lived in Cleveland, would visit us in the winter. He would complain that it felt cooler in SD than Cleveland and we would laugh at him about the comment. However, what is different is the moisture content of the air. If one is in the fog with an air temperature of 55 and it is windy. It is hard to keep warm. Cycling the coast in the winter with brisk winds off the ocean on a cloudy day can be cold. I wear knee warmers all the time.

If you travel inland 20 miles, the winter temperatures are much colder. If you go on to the desert, it is very cold at night but warms in the day. The mountains have snow, it is cold and the descents, via a bicycle, very cold.

There is logic to warming up your knees quickly. It is about knee pain. Pro racers cover their knees. It is a bad idea to produce a lot of power through your knees until they are warmed up. When I was in SD last weekend, I had knee warmers on for the climb up Soledad. I took them off later in the ride.

I always wear bib shorts and in cold temps add a pair of non-chamois tights over top. I have a cool weather pair and a cold weather pair(flocked with wind panels) and vary them for the tempurature. Then again, Toronto isn't San Diego.

I was riding last winter in shorts and jersey while visiting Scottsdale. Got lots of funny looks from the locals in tights and jackets.:)

I love my knee warmers and leg warmers.
The DeFeet knee warmers are really nice. They feel good, and are stretchy, unlike Performance brand ones.
I also have leg warmers from Voler. I like them, but their chart is off. I usually get medium, their chart said small, but they were unwearable. The mediums are perfect, fit well and feel good. They are warmer than the DeFeet knee warmers.

I also have bib tights with a chamois, and pair i wear over regular bibs when it gets close to freezing.

The warmers are nice in the morning when you know it will warm up. You can stuff them in a pocket.
The bibs are nice when it's just really freakin' cold, and is going to sty that way.

Bib shorts with knee warmers below ~60F. Bib shorts with leg warmers below ~45F.

Allow me to assist...... We lived and cycled in SD for 16 years. We were in SD last week cycling. Although SD is a temperate climate, it, as with most of California, has microclimates that are highly influenced by the Pacific Ocean, the desert and mountains. Within 5 miles of the coast, the ocean dominates the weather providing fog, haze and wind moderating temperatures in the summer and winter.

My wife's father, who lived in Cleveland, would visit us in the winter. He would complain that it felt cooler in SD than Cleveland and we would laugh at him about the comment. However, what is different is the moisture content of the air. If one is in the fog with an air temperature of 55 and it is windy. It is hard to keep warm. Cycling the coast in the winter with brisk winds off the ocean on a cloudy day can be cold. I wear knee warmers all the time.

If you travel inland 20 miles, the winter temperatures are much colder. If you go on to the desert, it is very cold at night but warms in the day. The mountains have snow, it is cold and the descents, via a bicycle, very cold.

There is logic to warming up your knees quickly. It is about knee pain. Pro racers cover their knees. It is a bad idea to produce a lot of power through your knees until they are warmed up. When I was in SD last weekend, I had knee warmers on for the climb up Soledad. I took them off later in the ride.

Every word of this description rings true for me. And I live just a few miles from the coast (near the zoo, for those familiar). And I was born and raised in Cleveland! But I became an expat Indians / Browns fan over thirty years ago.

While it IS temperate here, I remember many rides in the high 40s and low 50s in winter time. My legs got cold!

you just have to pump harder... just saying. :D

Bib shorts till it gets to around 35F- then Knickers to about 20F then it is a Good bottle of cognac and forget about riding till spring.

Sounds about right. I use long tights below about 55F and add fleece tights and balaclava at around 35F. I've also got long-sleeve jerseys of varying thicknesses that I mix & match with silk undershirts.

Much below 30F I hop on the trainer and throw in a video.

I put on leg warmers the other day and my legs were fine, problem was, my groin/butt area was then cold from the wind hitting there. I went into my LBS and asked about a set of full length Bib's and was recommended the full length unpadded pants (these are Specialized) that allow me to put on over my bib-shorts. His thinking was that I can wear or carry my leg warmers and the pants and can mix and match on the ride depending on how cold it is. Whatever I'm not wearing will fit into the jersey or jacket pocket.

Layering seems to be the hot set-up.

And I was born and raised in Cleveland! But I became an expat Indians / Browns fan over thirty years ago.

You made a good choice. Just think of the stress and despair that you would have endured.:D

About the bibs/leg warmer discussion. I say leg warmers, it's easier to take the leg warmers off and continue to ride than to take the bibs off and ride.

As the weather cools (yes, it really does cool down in winter in San Diego) I'm debating once again the pros and cons of picking up some leg warmers or springing for full-length bibs. Warmers are cheaper, but I seem to remember trying them a year or two ago and having problems keeping them up over my knees.

Louis Garneau pictured below are $194 and those are with out the chamois. Is this what you mean or did you mean tights that pull over your cycling shorts?

[QUOTE=HIPCHIP;9862211]I put on leg warmers the other day and my legs were fine, problem was, my groin/butt area was then cold from the wind hitting there. I went into my LBS and asked about a set of full length Bib's and was recommended the full length unpadded pants (these are Specialized) that allow me to put on over my bib-shorts. His thinking was that I can wear or carry my leg warmers and the pants and can mix and match on the ride depending on how cold it is. Whatever I'm not wearing will fit into the jersey or jacket pocket.

Layering seems to be the hot set-up.

I find it hard to believe that you could stuff the Louis Garneau full length bibs (or any other) into a jersey pocket. My wind vest just fits in mine. I would try fitting those in a jersey pocket. Check what your LBS is smoking.:D


You made a good choice. Just think of the stress and despair that you would have endured.:D

About the bibs/leg warmer discussion. I say leg warmers, it's easier to take the leg warmers off and continue to ride than to take the bibs off and ride.

That would be funny to see on the road while others are waiting.:D

I assume this is what we are discussing versus tights that pull up to the waist over cycling shorts.

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u250/rallen94402/lgbibs1069060_020_xlarge_f.jpg

I made a boo boo. In my OP, I talked about leg warmers, when I really meant to say knee warmers. Here's the product I looked at in my LBS:

http://www.performancebike.com/bikes//Product_10052_10551_1053880_-1___

Get these. Really
Kneekers (http://www.defeet.com/prodline.php?line=Kneeker&type=w) from DeFeet. Soft, comfy. Stuffable. And less $$.


http://www.defeet.com/images/products/image/151-1249788819-2008-03-25.jpg

Get these. Really
Kneekers (http://www.defeet.com/prodline.php?line=Kneeker&type=w) from DeFeet. Soft, comfy. Stuffable. And less $$.


http://www.defeet.com/images/products/image/151-1249788819-2008-03-25.jpg

Wow...never heard of these guys. Great website (check out the film section). Thanks!

I still have a good layer of blubber to keep me warm on a cold fall or winter day - but it is diminishing as the miles accumulate. However, I have leg warmers and tights to keep the knees warm and the synovial fluid thin.

My "trick" to keep the leg warmers up is to put them on first and then pull my shorts on over them. The pressure of the tights and the sticky bands around the cuffs keep the leg warmers from working their way down my leg with every stroke, which they would otherwise do.

Get these. Really
Kneekers (http://www.defeet.com/prodline.php?line=Kneeker&type=w) from DeFeet. Soft, comfy. Stuffable. And less $$.


http://www.defeet.com/images/products/image/151-1249788819-2008-03-25.jpg

I have these as well. They are nice but the material against the skin versus the PI fleece lined knee warmers, IMO, is not as soft or warm. Also, mine shrunk a little and if your quads are bigger, they will not stay up as well.

I am still not understanding why the warmers and tights come out at just 60 degrees. I have seen other threads where folks claim that knees need to be "kept warm" but aren't they confusing body temperature with wind chill? After all, body temperature is 98.6 no matter what.

The rule of thumb for bike racers out training is knees covered below 20 deg C (68 deg F - room temperature). Here in Vancouver, Canada, you see young guys out riding in shorts at 10 deg C (about 50F). You want to tell them that they'll have knee problems when they're older (if they ride that long), but it's useless, they never listen. Sometimes I'm the only one with knees covered in spring and fall when the temperature is around 15C (low 60's), but I think it's better to have legs too warm than too cold. You really want to protect the knees.

For SD, I would use knee or leg warmers just because you can take them off during the ride if it gets too hot. In Vancouver, I'll use leg warmers on formal rides (with others) so that team advertising on the shorts is visible. But otherwise it's tights held up with suspenders (braces). And I use two weights of tights, heavy and light depending on time of year.

When I was actually in a race, I never wore knee coverings. Just lots of liniment, and if it was raining, then it was vaseline over the legs along with the liniment. My first coach recommended knee plasters, but I think knee warmers have replaced those. Remember when knee warmers first appeared in the Belgian spring classics back in the 80's? They initially looked like cut-off long underwear, made of that white quilted material! Man, we've come a long way in technical clothing...

Luis

I am still not understanding why the warmers and tights come out at just 60 degrees. I have seen other threads where folks claim that knees need to be "kept warm" but aren't they confusing body temperature with wind chill? After all, body temperature is 98.6 no matter what.

Core temperature may well be 98.6 F (37C), but when the external temperature drops, the first thing the body does to maintain core heat is to constrict the peripheral blood vessels to conserve that precious set point. The limbs cool off pretty quickly and the synovial fluid that lubricates our knees becomes thicker. The limbs are warmed by muscle activity and mechanical movement which thins the fluid and facilitates flexion. Until they warm up, they are more susceptible to strain and other injury. Until the fluid warms up, vigorous and strenuous movement is more difficult, even if not dangerous. Additionally, the chemical reactions that constitute muscular activity also operate better within a narrow range.

We react to temperature differently, depending on our adaptation (and subcutaneous adipose tissue). Therefore, we should all provide additional external insulation at some point, but the set point will be different for each person.

I am the walrus...

I have done a fair bit of cold weather riding. I used to live in MI and I rode during the winter. At about 15 degrees or below, the wind resistance makes riding too nasty to really get a work out. If you ride slow, you can do it and not freeze.

I live in Central FL. I used to ride most days a week predawn. One day it was in the high 20s and my water bottles froze.

I wear tights and jerseys in cold weather. If it gets really cold, I put on a wind shell.

The hard parts to keep warm are the feet (neoprene boots for really cold), face (neoprene mask for really cold) and hands (mittens).

At what temp do you put the leg and arm warmers on? Somewhere above 55, I assume? That seems like overkill to me. I put on a long sleeved underlayer below 60 but otherwise I'm fine down to the high 40's, where I'll put on leg warmers and a jacket. (And yes, I've lived here long enough to be acclimated.)

But maybe I misunderstood what you wrote.

I think we're about the same. I tend to put arm warmers on between 60 & 65 degrees and add leg warmers below 60. You use a long sleeve base layer, I use arm and leg warmers. The jacket below 55 is to break the wind. You've probably been here longer than me. Moved here in 2006.

I am still not understanding why the warmers and tights come out at just 60 degrees. I have seen other threads where folks claim that knees need to be "kept warm" but aren't they confusing body temperature with wind chill? After all, body temperature is 98.6 no matter what.

We hope body temperature is always 98.6 (37c). When it gets below 95 (35c) it's called hypothermia. We all try to avoid that! When it's cold your body reduces the blood supply to the extremities to keep heat in the core. I put on arm and leg warmers to keep my extremities warm without having to put on a heave jacket or something. Putting on a hat can really go a long way toward keeping the rest of you body warm, too. When I was a Ski Patroller in Utah we told people with cold fingers to put on a hat. Your body will shunt warm blood to the head and take if from the arms a legs in order to keep the brain functioning. That's why I said I need to get a skull cap (or a helmet cover).

The rule of thumb for bike racers out training is knees covered below 20 deg C (68 deg F - room temperature). Here in Vancouver, Canada, you see young guys out riding in shorts at 10 deg C (about 50F). You want to tell them that they'll have knee problems when they're older (if they ride that long), but it's useless, they never listen. Sometimes I'm the only one with knees covered in spring and fall when the temperature is around 15C (low 60's), but I think it's better to have legs too warm than too cold. You really want to protect the knees.

For SD, I would use knee or leg warmers just because you can take them off during the ride if it gets too hot. In Vancouver, I'll use leg warmers on formal rides (with others) so that team advertising on the shorts is visible. But otherwise it's tights held up with suspenders (braces). And I use two weights of tights, heavy and light depending on time of year.

When I was actually in a race, I never wore knee coverings. Just lots of liniment, and if it was raining, then it was vaseline over the legs along with the liniment. My first coach recommended knee plasters, but I think knee warmers have replaced those. Remember when knee warmers first appeared in the Belgian spring classics back in the 80's? They initially looked like cut-off long underwear, made of that white quilted material! Man, we've come a long way in technical clothing...

Luis

At the track, we start with knees covered for the 30 lap warmup and start out very slowly and build up speed until the warmup turns into a scratch race with 3 to go. Typically, we start out slow and one of the younger guys gets the lead for a lap and jacks up the pace a couple of mph. It is not really a problem just too much too soon. Some are not coachable. The warmup is not an effort and is designed to get the body and the knees ready for an effort. As we go around the track lap after lap, blood is channeled and flow optimized for power production. The muscles begin to loosen and the cadence increases with each lap. Right after the warmup while the muscles are at optimum, we do the 100 meter all out neuromuscular jumps. It would be painful to roll onto a track and do a 100 meter jump with cold legs.

I have used the Freddies' Warmup Cream and like it. The active ingredient is pepper in a mixture of oils. However, it seems to draw more blood faster to the legs.

I have lived and work in San Diego since 1977 I also bicycle commute to work at 0500 (that’s AM). That being said I will tell you that it is not uncommon for the winter nighttime temperatures can be in the low 40’s high 30’s and rarely even freezing.
What I do, I layer, I wear bib shorts year round, in the 50’s I start with a Performance illumiNITE Commuter Jacket and Performance illumiNITE Tights without a chamois. When it dips below 48+/- I add my fleece jacket and rain pants, and below 40 I drop the tights add fleece pants. And I’m not going into hats and gloves.
I can tell you I have a small fortune tied up in clothing mostly from Performance Bike Store.
I have leg warmers but I don’t like them.

Adidas makes so wind blocking but pretty light weight bib tights. They are prefect for the in-between cold days, no heavy fleece lining.

Get these. Really
Kneekers (http://www.defeet.com/prodline.php?line=Kneeker&type=w) from DeFeet. Soft, comfy. Stuffable. And less $$.


http://www.defeet.com/images/products/image/151-1249788819-2008-03-25.jpg

One size fits all never works for me. Otherwise, that would be attractive.

I live in the interior of BC.

We actually get winter, as opposed to what SD gets.

I go the whole winter with 3/4 length knickers and a pair of knee high wool socks under them.

All I need to stay warm.

When it turned colder, I went to my lightweight stretch blue jeans for riding on my bent. Very comfy and warm.

Hey, if Wranglers are good enough for Brett Favre, then they are good enough for Tom Bombadil! :)

Guess temps are what your acclimatized to.I read about some of you wearing all this stuff at 60F.If it was 60F here id be wearing t-shirt and shorts only.I used to truck down to Texas and in what they call winter i would be wearing t_shirt and jeans.They always guessed i must be from northern US or Canada.
A friend now lives in Africa and after becoming acclimatized they now have to at nite wear coats,seems so unreal.Drops to 80F!

I'll wear leg warmers for morning or evening temps of 45F - 60F --- that is if i expect the temps to be close to 60F or warmer on the other end of the commute. Around here in Spring and Fall we can have a 40F swing between early morning and late afternoon. With the warmers I can switch back to plain shorts. If its going to just stay chilly I start wearing tights or bib/tights.

If you want to make sure the leg or knee warmers stay put, then get garters. Is there such a thing at the local bike shop? Or do we have to go to Victoria's Secret?

In regards to Digital Gee ...... how can anyone tell you what you should wear? Isn't it like asking ... should I eat and apple or a pear?:lol:

The point is we don't know your reaction to various temps and air masses ..... only you know that. Some people can wear certain bib tights at 45-50 degrees .... while others would be roasting.

That said ..... there are various weights of fabrics for bib tights.... some are brushed inside, some are a basic nylon/lycra..... some fabric is heavier weight than others. The only way I found out what to wear is trial and error. I have both Defeet Kneekers and some midweight bib tights from Nashbar. I live in the Northern US .... but if I lived in SD I'd still have them both. Neither was expensive.... and it just makes sense to have them both.

Come those few damp January mornings, you'll likely need bibs.. I'd say considering the way Calif temps can vary , you 'll want both.. Leg warmers can be a pain in that , as they wear it gets to be pain, keeping them tucked under your shorts. But, come Noon bibs might be too hot.. Go to Performance . Leg warmers are not that expensive. Get the warmers a size smaller than your normal purchase.. Because they will stay up easier.

Full length bibs?

I shudder to think about how far in advance I'd have to plan to go to the bathroom. Not for me.

I just wear shorts until the temperature drops below 50. I pull a on a pair of tights over my shorts below that. If it drops below 40 I start losing enthuiasm for bicycling and my enthuiasm is pretty much all gone below 30.

..^...Try UnderArmour's base layers.. It makes the temps from 32 to 40 far more agreeable.. YOu'd be surprised.. The Packers can play Green Bay Jan 1 below 0 degrees in UnderArmour : I'll try cycling at 33 degrees or above....../....Below freezing, not sure about that. I have a fear of black ice and that effect on two wheeled vehicles.

To quote the OP "When we get so much as a"mist"of rain,we get "team coverage"on the local news." My local seven day forecast is saying that there is a possiblity of getting almost 60mm of rain in the next week with one day being 25-30 mm.I can see it now,an e-mail from the Mayor to the state disater co-ordinator"After getting the horrible news from the weather bureau of a possible INCH!to an INCH! and a Half of rain!, I just want to ensure that the states emergency supply of "brollies,sou'westers and galoshes" are available for us in case of need! :lol: :roflmao2: