Framebuilders - Curtlo

Thanks Allen G, now if I only knew how to use it all. I am a miserable photographer but the good news is that when my customers receive their frames they always tell me that the photos don't do it justice so I come out ahead in the long run.

To whoever may be interested, I have started making some changes to my blog to make it easier to contact me. Part of my problem is that I am as miserable with computers as I am with cameras. Something about things with lots of buttons makes my life a little more complicated, it runs in my family. I am getting better. Thanks for the patience.http://meechcustombikes.blogspot.com/

Terrific a very nice start! A bit hard to see the contact info though.

I think we ought to start a new thread and title it: "Let's All Help Dimitri Get His Website Up And Running To Start Meech Bicycles On The Road To Success!"

I understand your frustration. That said if you had done a wee bit of googling you would have found out that Doug is "lacking" in the communications dept.

I got my Curtlo in September and it was well worth the wait. It took 13 months from the time I ordered it until it was complete. Part of the reason it took so long is that I didn't want to make the trek over the mountains to pick it up in the winter so I asked Doug to delay it until spring.

I also designed my own graphics for the bike and had to have the frame sent to me in Portland to get it powdercoated, painted then sealed and sent back to Doug for the build.

I went to pick it up in Winthrop partly because I wanted to meet the man who made my bike. Doug is an affable guy and in my opinion a hell of a craftsman. His frames are a true bargain. I got an extremely well made custom frame that fits me like a tailored suit AND I got it for $1050. I've looked you can't get that anywhere else.

As for the guy with the beef with Doug, he has been *****ing about it for 20 years and perhaps for good reason...however I would ask are any of us the same people we were 20 years ago?

I assure you he still is in business and you will hear from him eventually. I am also sure if you can wait for it you will love it.

I wrote a summary of my experience with the Curtlo process here if you are interested. There are pics of the finished bike as well.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?590473-My-new-bike&highlight=

Ride safe.

After reading this thread, and the rest of the framebuilder's forum, and reading some of Dmitry's stuff...I think I'm going to request my deposit back.

Not because of anything personally related to Doug, but because I've been inspired to build my own frame.

I'm pondering going to Koichi Yamaguchi's school, or maybe just trying to teach myself.

See what you guys have done now?

I wasn't going to say anything else on this thread but now you are talking. Building your own frame is a great experience and it will be worth your time. Going to Yamaguchi will make it just that much better. Just do it!

I second building your own. I'm in the early stages of the learning process right now, and hope to have a rideable frame before next winter. If nothing else, you'll only have yourself to complain to about the build taking too long, and when you're all done, you'll be left with the tools and jig to do more of them.


meech: if you need help setting up a self-hosted Wordpress-based website/blog, let me know. No charge, it's pretty easy to do, and you could do a lot better than Blogspot.

I'm researching the equipment needed, and classes.

I've also requested my deposit back from Curtlo. Again, no reply. I requested it back when I started asking all the questions on this board, and on frameforum, about making my own frame, and classes vs self-instruction, etc.

I paid with Paypal, but I'm outside of Paypal's dispute window...unless the window is within 45 days of product receipt, rather than 45 days of payment. Since I haven't received the product, I may still be inside of it.

I second building your own. I'm in the early stages of the learning process right now, and hope to have a rideable frame before next winter. If nothing else, you'll only have yourself to complain to about the build taking too long, and when you're all done, you'll be left with the tools and jig to do more of them.


meech: if you need help setting up a self-hosted Wordpress-based website/blog, let me know. No charge, it's pretty easy to do, and you could do a lot better than Blogspot.

and a piggy bank that will at least be 11K lighter

and a piggy bank that will at least be 11K lighter

It doesn't cost $11k to build a jig and buy a torch and some files.

It doesn't cost $11k to build a jig and buy a torch and some files.
my bad.. i thought you said you wanted something ridable.

You really don't need a fixture to build a ridable frame, I built my tandem and touring bike without using a full jig, and both ride fine. A fixture isn't going to save you if you don't know what you are doing. It's certainly insane to be in business without good fixturing. Different subject entirely.

I've done some research, and I think I can build a very basic jig for around $300 ish. In fact, probably more of a jig than I need, given that I'm not interested in rapid/large scale production capability. $400 or so for a torch, and then other supplies...Yep, maybe $1200-$1500 in the end, after all is said and done; or about what I would have paid for a frame.

On topic - I've written and left a message concerning my deposit, and the disposition of this order.

No reply.

I paid via Paypal, but I'm WELL outside of Paypal's dispute window now. I don't know what avenues I have to reclaim my $600.

Small claims court may be your only route, but you'll have to file in the same state as Curtlo, then travel there to go to court. Even if you win, you'll still have to go to the trouble of collecting.

Banzai,

Your reply will be a check in the mail.

Ride safe

Really poor customer support by Curtlo. That guy should be out of business and hopefully he will be. There are tons of other great builders that out there that don't steal people's money.

Small claims court may be your only route, but you'll have to file in the same state as Curtlo, then travel there to go to court. Even if you win, you'll still have to go to the trouble of collecting.

I hope it doesn't come to that. If it does...Mrs Banzai's family lives in that state. She would love to make a trip home, even if the purpose was less than pleasant.


Banzai,

Your reply will be a check in the mail.

Ride safe

I'm curious how you know this, and hope it is true.

looks like he lives nearby

On the one hand I feel bad that this has fallen through...on the other hand I'm excited about starting a new hobby.

The only "snag" may be the fact that I'm potentially going to be on a VML soon...and if I get sent remote (a distinct possibility) I may be putting off this adventure for a year and a half.

Oh well...I can still turn the money into tools now, and just see if the timing works out to actually start using them immediately.

I'm curious how you know this, and hope it is true.[/QUOTE]

When I did my research on Doug a year and a half ago I came across a situ similar to yours on a mountain biking forum. The guy couldn't get a response from Doug and requested his money back. He posted that he got a check in the mail and that was it. I recently looked for the posting but could find it. I don't frequent the mountainbike forums and have no idea where I saw it.

I do live close by if you can call an 8 hour drive one way close by!

Ride safe

I was following that thread and it didn't take anywhere near this long. It's in the MTBR framebuilding forum

Specifically, it took from 3/23/09 to 4/07/09 in internet forum time.
Here's the thread (http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=502890&highlight=curtlo)

Well, I'll give him another week. Then I'm sending a letter via certified mail.

After that, we'll see.

It was December 22nd when I requested my deposit back. With allowances for the holidays, it was January 16th when I inquired whether he'd even received my message of the 22nd. No reply to either.

(Not to keep dragging this thread along...I know no one here really cares that much about what is starting to turn into a dispute. Can it even be a "dispute" if one side is simply not participating?)

(Not to keep dragging this thread along...I know no one here really cares that much about what is starting to turn into a dispute. Can it even be a "dispute" if one side is simply not participating?)
Actually, I think this will help quite a few people make up their minds BEFORE sending him a deposit for a bike they may or may not ever receive. Keeps us informed on how it ends.

As long as this thread has been going on it makes me wonder if maybe Curtlo is sick or something happened. I wonder if out of all the frame builders on this forum if anyone knows Curtlo. Its kinda odd that after all the time that has passed, just the time of this thread alone is months, not to mention all the prior time Banzai has in that he has not heard anything. Should one of us call to see if he is around? Not sure what to say to him, "Hello Curtlo, all of us from the frame forum just wanted to make sure you are OK. Take it easy. Chao."

Deposit was pay-pal'd back to me yesterday.

I feel a bit embarrassed about the fact that I eventually went into "bill collector" mode last week, making a phone call a day. I figured I might have trouble with a certified letter going to a PO box though, and felt I was running out of options. It just looked worse and worse in my mind: A few e-mails, always prompt, in the initial inquiry. Then, a request for a deposit, and a deposit paid. After that, a statement of being unable to forecast anything, whatsoever (heck...even a 4 month window would be better than nothing, even if that window is in the distant future). And finally, the stone wall to my limited and honestly polite inquiries, followed by the stone wall to my requests for my deposit back. Those requests started very polite...and as stated above, became a little more terse.

His brief message made me feel a little guilty about the whole thing...simply apologized for the delay. However, I don't think I asked for too much, especially since he had $600 of mine.

Now I'm going to start shopping tools with that deposit money.

Don't let him make you feel guilty. Had he been more responsive from the start, you'd still be a paying customer.

Don't let him make you feel guilty. Had he been more responsive from the start, you'd still be a paying customer.

Absolutely. You showed admirable restraint and did what you had to do, hell, what he forced you to do.
I'm glad it worked out, good luck on your first build!

After reading this thread, and the rest of the framebuilder's forum, and reading some of Dmitry's stuff...I think I'm going to request my deposit back.

Not because of anything personally related to Doug, but because I've been inspired to build my own frame.

I'm pondering going to Koichi Yamaguchi's school, or maybe just trying to teach myself.

See what you guys have done now?

I'm going to Yamaguchi's school at the end of April. I'll post about it in this forum with my experiences.