Fifty Plus (50+) - Talk me out of n+1!

I already have two complete bikes and one project bike that will be finished soon.

My quiver of bike provides a mixture of new and old models and my modern bike supports several thousand miles a year of fitness & long distance riding.

My modern bike is a steel framed Cylocross bike that is comfortable & reliable as a century bike.

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/Somka2x2009.jpg

I'm finishing a 1987 Trek 400D that will have a modern Shimano 2x10 drivetrain and fenders, this will be my wet pavement bike.

I also have a 1974 Schwinn Paramount that is in as new condition. This bike is sentimental to me, I'm the original owner.

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/IMG_1414.jpg

I've really wanted a bike for fast group rides. My Cyclocross bike requires a lot of effort once the pace gets above 20mph. I've been dropped by faster groups. Part of the problem is my age and level of fitness, which is good, but not great.

I've found a new Titanium frame for half price and I could build up a nice bike for $1500 to $2000.

The problem is that I really don't need another bike and should use what I have. Or... will I ride more and improve further with a good road bike?

Michael

Of course you don't need another bike! But I would build the Ti bike just to see how it rode. Need is relative build the bike and if you really need the
money you can sell one. Not talking you out of it - sorry.

Joe
:beer:

I just can't understand some people. All bikes are different and for different uses. OK- you have a century bike that is comfortable- You have a wet ride bike- or will have- and you have the Classic Schwinn for posing and showing that you care about bikes.

But there are other bikes around that you do not have. You have already stated that the Cyclocross will not stay with the fast boys and you obviously enjoy riding with that group otherwise you would not worry about being dropped by them.

If I were you- I would be questioning my sanity. The chance is there of getting a NEW Ti frame and building it up into a bike that would give you a new experience of showing the fast boys how it should be done.

Don't dither- the Chance is there of building a bike you would be proud of. And if you can still not stay with the fast boys- Then Ti is a compliant material and will do for the double centuries that you will be doing later in the summer. Believe me you will be. If only to get away from the moans from the wife that you don't need another bike and she needs a new washing machine- diswasher or Freezer.

Nope, I'm not going to talk you out of it either. There is ALWAYS a need for N+1, always something that a new bike will do that your current ones can't. Go for it, and if you don't like it then sell it on :)

Ya see, Michael, this is what happens when you ask choir members to help you stop your singing habit ^^^.

I just can't understand some people. All bikes are different and for different uses. OK- you have a century bike that is comfortable- You have a wet ride bike- or will have- and you have the Classic Schwinn for posing and showing that you care about bikes.

But there are other bikes around that you do not have. You have already stated that the Cyclocross will not stay with the fast boys and you obviously enjoy riding with that group otherwise you would not worry about being dropped by them.

If I were you- I would be questioning my sanity. The chance is there of getting a NEW Ti frame and building it up into a bike that would give you a new experience of showing the fast boys how it should be done.

Don't dither- the Chance is there of building a bike you would be proud of. And if you can still not stay with the fast boys- Then Ti is a compliant material and will do for the double centuries that you will be doing later in the summer. Believe me you will be. If only to get away from the moans from the wife that you don't need another bike and she needs a new washing machine- diswasher or Freezer.

I really would benefit from the addition of a faster road bike. Increasing my pace is the final frontier for me. I ride often and I can ride all-day, but my pace is stuck below 19mph no matter how hard I try.

The psychological boost provided by a new bike plus the 5% real benefit of a better road bike could be worthwhile.

I should sell the Schwinn or the Cyclocross bike if the Ti bike fulfills it's promise. The 1987 Trek is an equal of the CX bike in performance... and it's vintage too!

Michael

Ya see, Michael, this is what happens when you ask choir members to help you stop your singing habit ^^^.

LOL, It's a not much of an compulsion support group!

I think you should go for the new Ti bike.

I think N+1 is fine as long as you're buying "different" bikes, and seems to me that you are. You'd have:

- commuter
- go-fast bike
- vintage bike


The only problem is when you're buying multiple bikes that are all pretty much the same as one you own. Then you're kind of like a "cat lady" hoarding cats (only hoarding bicycles). Come back and see us when you own 10 or so.

Maybe you need to change your training regime to increase your average speed?

Having recently evaluated my stable, I realized I don't need a collection. Just two to handle the riding I do. I will be finishing my Lynskey build on Tuesday and it will be my primary road bike.
I will then change my Cross bike cassette to an 11-36 and a new RD. That coupled with the compact crank will give me a pretty capable cross/single track bike.

Buy what you need and will use, but I don't have or see a need to have a museum.

Why stop at n+1? Did you really expect anyone to say stick with what you have? lol

Well, I was outbid: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260539427143

I didn't want to overbid, a Ti & Ultegra 6700 bike can be had from Bikesdirect for $1700.

I also decided that I should sell my Paramount if I spent significant money on another bike.

Michael

Since you were outbid and still have your money in hand, don't waste it on something foolish like food, shelter or clothing.:D

Since you were outbid and still have your money in hand, don't waste it on something foolish like food, shelter or clothing.:D

Or my two kids college education!

Or my two kids college education!

Spend your kids inheritance before they can get their grubby mits on it.

Sometimes you need to do a N-1 before you can continue with an N+1. Send me the Paramount for safe keeping and you'll get the go ahead.

Keep the Paramount. You will never stop kicking you own butt if you let her go for another.:cry: The bike would most likely allow you to ride with the fast group in the Chicago area unless there are a lot of hills or tight turns taken at race speed. I've taken my Raleigh Super Course TT on club rides and didn't have any problems staying with the group. Attacking rollers while riding within the group took some planning to anticipate shifting the 10 speed drive train.

N+1 is always good, however I don't think you will suddenly begin riding 20+ mph on rides unless you step up and do some specific training. Riding @ 19 mph is typically a Z3 effort that most strong riders can maintain for several hours as long as they eat and drink. To be able to ride faster you need to do some zone 4 and above riding on a regular basis to raise the Z3 wattage, and to allow the body to work at a higher workload and to accept the uncomfortable feelings while your body recovers while riding with the group.

Well, I was outbidl
Hey, too bad... it's nice to dream, isn't it? Especially when you envision a boost to your competitiveness. Ti is on my wish list too, but it'll probably remain there, 'cause I don't really like CF forks.

Hi AJ,

It really is all about gaining some speed with my group ride. Most of these guys (and a few gals) are not much faster than me over 60 miles, but they can hold 22+mph for several miles, something that is difficult for me. I'm a 6 foot, 205 lbs, 53 year old. I feel like a large SUV mixing up with the Corvettes.

I'm using my Soma on these rides.

I know that if I sell the Paramount, I'll miss it. But I'm not riding it much and don't really have any serious plans to do so.

Michael

Michael

N+1 is a natural extension of a cyclist’s life. Don’t fight it, resistance is futile.

"Talk me out of n+1! "

OK - N+2

You came here to be talked out of buying a new bike? :lol: :roflmao::roflmao2:

No chance. But I will try to talk you out of selling the Paramount. Your reasoning for doing it may seem rational, but you will hate yourself if you do it.

I would only get a new bike if you wanted one.

Well, my opinion - I think you could get a big improvement with a new wheel set and suggest you try that first. That should give you some improvement and you can always use them if you decide to build up a new bike with a new frame. Get a set of tubulars and just use them for the club rides. Not only are they faster but they handle better.

Those who would be talked out of N+1 really need to contemplate N+2.

If you look closely at my avatar you can guess how much help I'll be in talking you out of it... absolutely none! In my bike shed I have vintage steel, modern steel, carbon/steel, full carbon, aluminum and titanium. My titanium bike gets more miles that all the others put together, and it's not because it's the prettiest.

Don't buy it.

Nope, I'm not going to talk you out of it either. There is ALWAYS a need for N+1, always something that a new bike will do that your current ones can't. Go for it, and if you don't like it then sell it on :)

I haven't read the rest of the posts yet, but I agree with the above. Besides, you DO NOT have a lot of bikes there! With only two in the stable I would almost call you "bike deprived". IMO if N<6, then the need for N+1 is just assumed as a matter of course. Build your new bike.

I think you should go for the new Ti bike.

I think N+1 is fine as long as you're buying "different" bikes, and seems to me that you are. You'd have:

- commuter
- go-fast bike
- vintage bike


The only problem is when you're buying multiple bikes that are all pretty much the same as one you own. Then you're kind of like a "cat lady" hoarding cats (only hoarding bicycles). Come back and see us when you own 10 or so.

On the other hand, when you find the the one you love it is good to keep a spare or two. Something might happen to it. Besides, there is always different gearing....:innocent: And what about different colors?

It really is all about gaining some speed with my group ride. Most of these guys (and a few gals) are not much faster than me over 60 miles, but they can hold 22+mph for several miles, something that is difficult for me. I'm a 6 foot, 205 lbs, 53 year old. I feel like a large SUV mixing up with the Corvettes. Michael

I'm 6'1" 210 and 58 years, my solo rides avg 16 - 17mph on flat routes. A few years ago I had a summer without the family and was able to ride both before and after work, getting my weight down to 185. With the extra saddle time and at that weight I could ride 18 mph for 2+ hours with bursts to 24mph. Transforming an SUV into a Corvette is tough at our age - although we have all read the bike performance success stories of 50+ members.

If the new Ti bike motivates you to ride harder/faster then don't let us talk you out of it.

I'm 6'1" 210 and 58 years, my solo rides avg 16 - 17mph on flat routes. A few years ago I had a summer without the family and was able to ride both before and after work, getting my weight down to 185. With the extra saddle time and at that weight I could ride 18 mph for 2+ hours with bursts to 24mph. Transforming an SUV into a Corvette is tough at our age - although we have all read the bike performance success stories of 50+ members.

If the new Ti bike motivates you to ride harder/faster then don't let us talk you out of it.

Yes, that’s been my experience. 2009 was my first year of result oriented cycling. I rode 5000 miles and could average 17 to 18.5 on my solo fitness rides. These rides are 36 to 60 miles.

I joined a group ride to increase my speed and to enjoy some new friends. These guys average 17 to 19 mph, but will hold faster speeds for 30 minutes or more.

I should research better training methods and investigate working with a trainer/coach. I would like to complete a century in six hours, including 3 sag stops. My best result in 2009 was 200k in 7 hours and 15 minutes of saddle time.

Michael

So it looks as though the bike's gone. Still another way that may be more effective on improving performance on the bike.

Wheels and tyres. I don't know what you run right now but lighter better wheels and lighter better running tyres can improve some bikes. I have several bikes and each has its own uses. My main road bike is a 15lbs + a bit lightweight bike that has Ultegra wheels and Michelin PR2 tyres in 23 fitted. They have proved to be the ideal set up on this bike for less rolling resistance. Change the wheels- otr tyres and the bike does not work as easily. And I do have enough wheels to be able to compare with.

So what tyres do you run and in what size and what wheels?

This is a Bicycle Forum. Do you seriously expect us to talk you OUT of N+1?

So it looks as though the bike's gone. Still another way that may be more effective on improving performance on the bike.

Wheels and tyres. I don't know what you run right now but lighter better wheels and lighter better running tyres can improve some bikes. I have several bikes and each has its own uses. My main road bike is a 15lbs + a bit lightweight bike that has Ultegra wheels and Michelin PR2 tyres in 23 fitted. They have proved to be the ideal set up on this bike for less rolling resistance. Change the wheels- otr tyres and the bike does not work as easily. And I do have enough wheels to be able to compare with.

So what tyres do you run and in what size and what wheels?

I have been using 700x28 wire bead Conti Gatorskins on Mavic Open Pro/Shimano 105 wheels

I have a set of folding 700x25 Conti Gatorskins waiting to be installed.

I've been jonesing for a set of these: http://www.hedcycling.com/wheels/ardennes_c2.asp

Michael

I am another bad one to ask... I don't own a car, but have a moderate sized stable of bikes. When my wife comes home with a repair bill, or insurance bill for her car, I just comment 'you could get a nice bike for that. It works too - last time we were in a bike shop, she was looking at shoes, and asking me if I needed new shoes - commenting that with the sale that was going on, a pair of decent bike shoes cost less than a tank of gas!

There is always room for N+1!

I've gotten over the leap in terms of adding a bike. How?

I want and could use a true road bike. My cyclocross bike is a good long-distance bike, but it will never allow me to keep up with a equally strong rider on a road bike.

The cyclocross bike is still needed. I'll keep a triple crankset on the cyclocross bike and use it for hilly rides with climbs greater than 5%. It's also a bike that I know I can finish a 200k on.

The new-to-me 1987 Trek 400D will be a great wet road bike and commuter. It will feature fenders and racks and will help me ride 3 days a week come rain or shine.

The 1974 Schwinn Paramount might, or might not, need to be sold. Let's see how the year goes...

Michael

I have been using 700x28 wire bead Conti Gatorskins on Mavic Open Pro/Shimano 105 wheels

I have a set of folding 700x25 Conti Gatorskins waiting to be installed.

I've been jonesing for a set of these: http://www.hedcycling.com/wheels/ardennes_c2.asp

Michael

Gatorskins are not the lightest tyre around but the wheels are not bad. I have a set of 105 hubs with CXP33 rins so they are comparable.

Rotating weight is what it is all about. Cut that and although you may not gain speed- Acceleration is better and less energy used in the process.- I'd try the Folders to see if they have an effect.

If you look closely at my avatar you can guess how much help I'll be in talking you out of it... absolutely none! In my bike shed I have vintage steel, modern steel, carbon/steel, full carbon, aluminum and titanium. My titanium bike gets more miles that all the others put together, and it's not because it's the prettiest.

There may be a Ti bike frame in my future soon ;).

Details to follow...

Michael

There may be a Ti bike frame in my future soon ;).

Details to follow...

Michael

I eagerly await the details. :thumb:

tease :(

"Talk me out of n+1! "

OK - N+2

Good one.

MY advice. Don't do it man. Soon your garage will be filled with bikes of every frame material and envisioned use. Your life will revolve around finding that obscure frame no one in your group has never even heard of let alone actually own. Your family will disown you and you will end up living on the street in a cardboard box with your bike collection housed in rent a shed place.

Just sayin.

tease :(

I just want to make sure it's been shipped.

It will be worth the wait (I hope).

Michael

There may be a Ti bike frame in my future soon ;).

Details to follow...

Michael
Maybe I'll get to see it if we can hook up for another ride?:)

Two things I always regret selling, bikes and firearms. I have more than I need of both and fewer than i want.

My Titanium Planet frame (made by Lynskey) shipped yesterday. The same frame that I bid on, but did not win last weekend was offered to me on a "second chance" basis.

The top bidder turned out to be an international buyer who did not want to pay the shipping costs. So the seller contacted me and offer to sell at my $666.66 bid price.

I'm thrilled to get a new Lynskey built frame at that price. The size is right and the bike should offer a tangable improvement over my steel CX bike.

My 1978 Trek 400D rain commuter & touring bike is ready. I'll post pictures this weekend. This bike will be equiped with a modern Shimano 2X10 drivetrain, new Mavic Open Pro wheels with a Dura Ace 36 spoke hub on the back and a 32 spoke 105 hub on the front.

Once the Planet X bike is built, the CX bike will get crowded out by the Trek on damp days and the Ti bike on dry days.

I might just box it and put it in storage if the new bikes meet my needs.

Cheers,

Michael

My Frame arrived and It's a better than expected!

A requested help in selecting a fork over at the Road Bike section, and a BF member sent me a Alpha Q fork for free! A bit shocked, I have pleaded to pay for the fork, but the individual refuses payment. As an alternative, I will be donating funds to the Red Cross Haiti fund. Bikeforums can use more of this kind of support and good-will. I've sent some vintage Shimano parts to a BF friend, at no-charge, this week. Sending a donation to the Red Cross will feel good also.

The fork is perfect for my needs. I even found a matching Alpha Q stem for $25. The bike will look super-sharp.

I'm going with a Shimano Ultegra SL 6600 "Ice Grey" groupset, including crankset, brakes, shifters, deraillaurs, BB, chain, & cassette for about $650. The bike will have Look Keo pedals, a Cane Creek S-3 headset and FSA compact handlebars & seatpost. I should be well under $1600 total.




http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/PlanetX1003.jpg

My Frame arrived and It's a better than expected!

A requested help in selecting a fork over at the Road Bike section, and a BF member sent me a Alpha Q fork for free! A bit shocked, I have pleaded to pay for the fork, but the individual refuses payment. As an alternative, I will be donating funds to the Red Cross Haiti fund. Bikeforums can use more of this kind of support and good-will. I've sent some vintage Shimano parts to a BF friend, at no-charge, this week. Sending a donation to the Red Cross will feel good also.

The fork is perfect for my needs. I even found a matching Alpha Q stem for $25. The bike will look super-sharp.

I'm going with a Shimano Ultegra SL 6600 "Ice Grey" groupset, including crankset, brakes, shifters, deraillaurs, BB, chain, & cassette for about $650. The bike will have Look Keo pedals, a Cane Creek S-3 headset and FSA compact handlebars & seatpost. I should be well under $1600 total.




http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/PlanetX1003.jpg

Recommendation: If you haven't already got the Ultegra brakes, newer 2010 SRAM Force are a good match for the Ice Gray and they work super IMO... just a thought. Look forward to pics of the assembly.

Recommendation: If you haven't already got the Ultegra brakes, newer 2010 SRAM Force are a good match for the Ice Gray and they work super IMO... just a thought. Look forward to pics of the assembly.

Are you now using this combination?

Are you now using this combination?

Yes I am. SRAM= great brakes IMO. Even the old style Rival polished are excellent. 2010 Force and 09 and 2010 Red are a new design and the Force are the dark color. Sorry, it is hard to capture the colors in these pics for some reason.

My Frame arrived and It's a better than expected!

A requested help in selecting a fork over at the Road Bike section, and a BF member sent me a Alpha Q fork for free! A bit shocked, I have pleaded to pay for the fork, but the individual refuses payment. As an alternative, I will be donating funds to the Red Cross Haiti fund. Bikeforums can use more of this kind of support and good-will. I've sent some vintage Shimano parts to a BF friend, at no-charge, this week. Sending a donation to the Red Cross will feel good also.

The fork is perfect for my needs. I even found a matching Alpha Q stem for $25. The bike will look super-sharp.

I'm going with a Shimano Ultegra SL 6600 "Ice Grey" groupset, including crankset, brakes, shifters, deraillaurs, BB, chain, & cassette for about $650. The bike will have Look Keo pedals, a Cane Creek S-3 headset and FSA compact handlebars & seatpost. I should be well under $1600 total.




http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/PlanetX1003.jpg

:thumb::thumb: Aces.

A few pictures of the final product...

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/2010bikepictures009.jpg

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/2010bikepictures013.jpg

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/2010bikepictures012.jpg

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll210/wildcat-bucket/2010bikepictures011.jpg