Advocacy & Safety - Hand Signals (for asking, announcing, or both?)

I know hand signals for use in traffic (left turn, both versions for right turn, and slowing down) but am wondering for which circumstances they are to be used. I normally only use the turn signals but plan on signaling stops and slowing down as well. I check my mirror to see if traffic is clear, do a final check with a turned head, swing my arm out to display the turn signal for about a couple of seconds, and proceed with the maneuver with both hands back on my handlebars to control the bike. It seems others keep one hand displaying the signal for the duration of the maneuver (for example, until the turn's over). Others also seem to hold up a hand signal (or point at the desired destination) before starting the maneuver to 'ask' for the opportunity to turn. I've read someone's post on these forums explaining that hand signals aren't for 'asking' but 'announcing'. My example uses the 'announcing' hand signal. With my traffic environment, I can usually just slow down or even stop for a short while for the opportunity to present itself for a safe turn or lane change. However, other cyclists deal with vastly different traffic conditions.

So with that out of the way, I'd like to know whether you guys use hand signals to show you want to turn soon and are waiting for the opportunity (asking), you are going to turn right after the signal (announcing), or both. Which do you guys recommend?

Firstly I just flash the hand signal for a second or two and never maintain them for the duration of the maneuverer.

Secondly, when turning I'm always announcing an intention to turn. Asking would (imho) indicate you don't have the right of way. You signal your intention, and proceed when clear to do so.

The one situation in which I use hand signals in an "asking" fashion is when changing lanes in advance of a left turn. An example would be a busy two lane street, normally the left lane will be piled up with vehicles passing. I move to the left of the right lane and signal my intention to change lanes. In so doing a motorist (God love em) will invariably slow down and courteously let me in thereby reaffirming my faith in humanity. he he, i guess a true VC'er would say this is controlling and not asking.

Have both methods been proven to produce the same results? If so, the manner utilized is irrelevant.

-Kurt

ISo with that out of the way, I'd like to know whether you guys use hand signals to show you want to turn soon and are waiting for the opportunity (asking), you are going to turn right after the signal (announcing), or both. Which do you guys recommend?
If you clearly have the right of way, signalling is a courtesy (the other person has to wait whatever you do). Example: you are in the middle of a lane in front of a car.

If you don't have the right of way, the signalling is both a annoucement of your intent and a request for the other person to yield the right of way. Example: you want to move into the middle of the lane from the right side of the roadway (maybe, to get into a left turn lane). Note that the idea is that you have to give sufficient advance warning for the signalling to reasonable.

(Note that, you might have the right of way but, still, the other person might not yield. The real point isn't who has the right of way but to avoid collisions.)

Ideally, the signal should be done with enough time before the action to allow other people sufficient time to respond.

One does not typically need to maintain the signal through the maneuver because it's generally obvious what you are doing.

Both. If you have the right of way (or a large gap in the case of lane changes) you are announcing. If not, you are asking.

I do both, for announcing my intention and asking for space in the lane. Sometimes, when I'm sitting on the left side of the travel lane waiting to turn left with my left hand out, I'll get drivers who stop to let me turn, but I don't ask for that. I pull in my hand once its clear that I am turning.

I rarely use the slow down signal. I do however use it when I'm pulling up to my house. There's a ton of street parking and we don't have a driveway. So when someone's following me, I indicate I'm slowing/stopping as I have to stop in the right edge of traffic and dismount my bike. If there's a space between cars in front of my house, I pull into that.

One point w/r/t the stop/slow signal:

Most drivers don't recognize it as a signal that you, the cyclist, are about to stop; they think it's a command to them to stop.

On my daily commute, I make a left turn from a four-lane road onto a multi-use path; when there's traffic in the oncoming lanes I signal that I'm going to stop (in the left lane), way ahead of the turn, then slow down (or stop) and wait for an opening with my arm extended for a left-turn signal. Even when there's no traffic in the right lane going my direction, the drivers behind me almost always stop and wait, rather than passing me on the right as they definitely would pass a car that was waiting for a similar left turn. That's fine with me -- but be aware of it.

Firstly I just flash the hand signal for a second or two and never maintain them for the duration of the maneuverer.Me too. When I'm actually turning, I usually want both hands on the handlebars, and keeping my bike stable trumps any need to signal. (And if the road is bumpy or something, I may not signal at all (or might signal only with a nod of my head) because I want both hands on the bars.)

As for asking or announcing, it's some of both. When I signal (car or bike, doesn't matter), I'm telling them I want to turn and I intend to turn, but it's also an implied request that people not interfere with this.

A one second flash of a hand signal takes the risk that people will be looking away for that second, and won't see intention to turn being indicated. At least two seconds in most cases, to avoid that happening. Three is better, and even four or sometimes more is good.

Technically, here in Oregon, people running motor vehicles are supposed to initiate their turn signals 100' feet from the turn; well, you know about the liberties people take with that law...but still, as a rough guideline, I'm thinking the amount of time it would take at say, 15 mph, to travel that 100' in preparation for a turn might be around 3-4 seconds; long enough that people will see, I'm always hoping.

A one second flash of a hand signal takes the risk that people will be looking away for that second, and won't see intention to turn being indicated. At least two seconds in most cases, to avoid that happening. Three is better, and even four or sometimes more is good.

Technically, here in Oregon, people running motor vehicles are supposed to initiate their turn signals 100' feet from the turn; well, you know about the liberties people take with that law...but still, as a rough guideline, I'm thinking the amount of time it would take at say, 15 mph, to travel that 100' in preparation for a turn might be around 3-4 seconds; long enough that people will see, I'm always hoping.

15 mph = 22 feet per second

So a minimum of four seconds before the turn would be legal.

In Colorado, bicyclists have to signal 100' in advance of a turn if it is safe to signal. So if you don't feel its safe to remove a hand from the bars, you don't have to.

Like most folks here, if I am making a turn with the right of way I use a signal as an announcement of my intention. For lane changes, it seems to me that I am only ever asking permission if the car traffic is fast and I have to wait for someone to slow down in order to avoid getting hit.

I never signal a slow/stop to cars. I don't think the driver is very likely to quickly and correctly interpret this signal. They don't see it often, even here in bicycleland, and it doesn't really mimic the brakelights that they are used to, because they would only see it before the braking begins, as I will not apply a brake with only one hand on the bars. If I am stopping for a traffic control, I must assume that the driver behind me will be stopping for the same reason, and if I am stopping without a traffic control, for example, to deal with a mechanical issue, I just pull to the far right and out of the way before stopping.

I do signal stops to cyclists following closely if I can do so safely, but I don't use the silly bent-elbow gesture; I use the opening-fist at my waist instead.

15 mph = 22 feet per second

So a minimum of four seconds before the turn would be legal.

In Colorado, bicyclists have to signal 100' in advance of a turn if it is safe to signal. So if you don't feel its safe to remove a hand from the bars, you don't have to.

I think that that is how most states laws on signaling for bicycles are written.

Thanks for sharing, guys. I guess I'll try using it both to ask and announce too, especially when changing lanes in preparation for a left turn at a traffic light.

I wish there was a hand signal for: "just drive your car and stop staring at me trying to figure out what you should do with the rest of your sit-on-your-ass-in-a-big-suv-while-talking-on-your-cell-phone life"

I wish there was a hand signal for: "just drive your car and stop staring at me trying to figure out what you should do with the rest of your sit-on-your-ass-in-a-big-suv-while-talking-on-your-cell-phone life"

Stop judging people by the way they live.

Judge them by the way they drive.

-Kurt

that's what I did - they way they drive their car is with their cell phone and they don't drive their car because they are in shock that someone is riding a bicycle. they are stunned into not knowing what to do. all they have to do is drive their car normally. instead they do weird things like sit in the middle of intersections, or stay put even though a light has turned green.

This A.M. it was -15C and I broke out the pogies.

No hand signals today kids. I just kind of looked back at them and wobbled, and they backed off and let me merge.

that's what I did - they way they drive their car is with their cell phone and they don't drive their car because they are in shock that someone is riding a bicycle. they are stunned into not knowing what to do. all they have to do is drive their car normally. instead they do weird things like sit in the middle of intersections, or stay put even though a light has turned green.

Phoenix wouldn't be the fine city it is if I didn't encounter this behavior at least twice a day from motorists at intersections. We really do need a hand signal for this over here.

I vote for the shocker (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shocker_%28hand_gesture%29).

"...I never signal a slow/stop to cars. I don't think the driver is very likely to quickly and correctly interpret this signal. They don't see it often, even here in bicycleland, and it doesn't really mimic the brakelights that they are used to, because they would only see it before the braking begins, as I will not apply a brake with only one hand on the bars. ..." Boyd Reynolds

I use the hand stop signal (left arm down, 45 degree angle to the body), not always, but in some situations such as, for example, one street I commonly use. It's a slow, rather narrow two lane, two-way cross-street that approaches a major one-way thoroughfare. It's controlled by a stop sign. Road users...that is motor vehicle operators...are inclined to rush up to the intersection hoping they can catch a break in the wave of traffic on the one-way street at the light signal regulated intersection a block or so away.

So what I do is slowly cruise up to the intersection with the one-way at about 10mph, using the stop hand signal. I don't hold the arm in one position...I move it up and down a few times around the 45 degree angle point, finally holding it at 45. At least in this situation, I'm fairly sure people are seeing the signal and making an additional effort to slow down and keep a distance away from me. I've tried it both ways...that's how I know. If I don't give this signal, some MV operators want to get a little too close to me with the bumper....which I'd really rather they not do.